Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Perkilator]

After Steve and Sephiroth. Do you guys think we'll get at least one more "big" character or do you think the rest will be in the "small" or "middle"?

I’m guessing somewhere close to big, be it a spiky-haired boy with an over-sized key or an orange hairy marsupial.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

See this is what I love about Speculation

You got your ideas, I got mine. You do you, I do me

But I don't know, Personally it would just feel kind of wrong if Sephiroth's Trailer came in the timeline before Hero's Trailer. It's like this

Hero's Trailer made it seem like Hero came out of nowhere. He's here to save the day from Dharkon's Army. he was getting bodied, but thanks to the other Heroes, they were able to free the other Dharkon clones

But you go to Sephiroth's Trailer, the same Hero (Erdrick/Arusu) that was the legendary reveal in the 2nd act of Hero's Trailer, is out there getting mopped by Galeem, and is about to get erased, before Sephiroth Slashes Galeem like Butter. He's also destroying everyone until Cloud does damage to him, and even then he turns into Safer Sephiroth in the end

This way you got the stakes going higher. It's pretty much the Shonen Anime Power creep build that those show uses

But if you reverse it the other way, It's like the opposite of the Power creep, it's like a Downgrade in power. Sephiroth just killed Galeem, destroyed everyone but Cloud, and even when Cloud did a number on him, he goes to his Final Form, meanwhile Dharkon is nowehere to be seen

Sephiroth gets warn off somehow, Dharkon then now decides to show his Hand, and among all the fighters, All the Heroes and Link seem to be the only ones left? Not Cloud or anything like that. That's why I think that order is weird, and it raises alot of questions to be honest, like how were only Hero and Link able to be the survivors, why was Hero so far back when saving link, and other stuff like that

That works. I personally see the Hero reveal as more evidence towards it taking place after Sephiroth.
The big reveal was 11, a character not seen before. The second act happens with the other 2 new ones, and then the reveal storywise that Erdrick survived.
I always just kinda assumed Sephiroth was beat anyway, considering Cloud defeating his OG form. A team up from the other fighters who weaken Sephiroth, before he then gets finished by Dharkon works better for me. Kinda like what happened with Galeem in the OG timeline.

 

[7NATOR]

After Steve and Sephiroth. Do you guys think we'll get at least one more "big" character or do you think the rest will be in the "small" or "middle"?

I think 2021 can't be Barren of Huge reveals, so we'll at least get one

Personally I Predict we get Two. Shadow and Scorpion

That works. I personally see the Hero reveal as more evidence towards it taking place after Sephiroth.
The big reveal was 11, a character not seen before. The second act happens with the other 2 new ones, and then the reveal storywise that Erdrick survived.

I guess that could work to be honest. I mean I wonder how, but Since there was only one Hero in Sephiroth's Trailer, it would make sense that way

I still think the order goes Hero > Sephiroth, but Sephiroth > Hero has it's merits perhaps. Honestly I'm just wondering how the next 3 Trailer will tie into the timeline

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Our of curiosity, who were your guys favorite Smash cutscene? Like a reveal trailer or Brawl cutscene. Could even be that old 64 commercial with suits.
My Personal Favorite is this Smash Ultimate Commercial

Has everything I want out of a Smash Battle Royal, Unlikely alliances, 1v1s and free for alls. And characters who really just don’t wanna fight. (Also Ridley fighting Pit is the most fitting thing ever)

First off, the name of the cutscene is probably the coolest one they gave to ALL of the Subspace Emissary; It's a song and dance done before and will continue until the end of Nintendo.
Plus the sheer brutality of the attack is what first got me thinking about turning Ridley from a boss to a fighter.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

After Steve and Sephiroth. Do you guys think we'll get at least one more "big" character or do you think the rest will be in the "small" or "middle"?

I’d say it’s certainly a possibility. I know a lot of Sonic fans wanted Eggman or Tails as the second rep but you just can’t deny his popularity and importance to the franchise.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

After Steve and Sephiroth. Do you guys think we'll get at least one more "big" character or do you think the rest will be in the "small" or "middle"?

If Crash isn't big, idk who the hell is

 

[osby]

I’d say it’s certainly a possibility. I know a lot of Sonic fans wanted Eggman or Tails as the second rep but you just can’t deny his popularity and importance to the franchise.

View attachment 299439

Unironically would love this. Team Rose is the best team and Big is one of the most underrated characters in the Sonic franchise.

 

[SSBCandidates]

Truth is, I wanted Tifa in Smash way before Cloud or Sephiroth as yeah she actually seems as someone who fights, while the others are swordmen, but this is before the whole "sword user" thing which I believe is silly. THis because maybe Clould and Sephy would be too high profile for the game back in the old days, and Tifa would be more of a close combat fighter.

But aside her for a female close combat fighter, I only see Chun Li. And both FF and SF have already 2 reps.

Not a figther exactly but Marina from Msichief Makers is in legal limbo. And I cannot think of someone else but I am sure there are more out there. Talim fromSoul Calibur? But I would rather have SOphitia.

 

[Slime Master]

Yeah, FF7 again.
Because that's the only FF the general gaming sphere even remotely cares about.
Not that Tifa wouldn't be sick, I actually do kinda want a female Brawler here, and I can't think of any other person that'd fit that description.

Why hello there

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I guess we are approaching the 1 year discovery of cacomallow too i guess. So i changed my profile pic to eternally haunt people that yes, Cacomallow is/was real.

It will never be a memory

What are you talking about that already happened 2 months ago

I’d say it’s certainly a possibility. I know a lot of Sonic fans wanted Eggman or Tails as the second rep but you just can’t deny his popularity and importance to the franchise.

View attachment 299439

Hey, he's better than modern Shadow at the very least, y'know, the "You're weak because you have friends" Shadow that Sega insists is what he always was

 

[ZelDan]

How to say no to someone with a gun as a hand

I mean, Sakurai seemed to have no issue doing that last month.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Why hello there
View attachment 299440

Absolute queen.

Among absolute star power heavy hitters, I can think of:

Rayman
Crash
Ryu Hayabusa
Doomguy
Sora
Master Chief
Lara Croft

---

Btw off topic but for $5 I can't choose between getting:

• Blaster Master Zero 2
• Contra Anniversary Collection

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Hey, he's better than modern Shadow at the very least, y'know, the "You're weak because you have friends" Shadow that Sega insists is what he always was

Sega's decision to characterize Shadow as thus despite his friendship with Maria being the basis of his evildoing/redemption arc and his friendship with Team Dark will forever be the second-most baffling thing they've ever done.
Number one is them hyping up Omega through the entirety of Sonic Forces only for him to do absolutely nothing.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Sega's decision to characterize Shadow as thus despite his friendship with Maria being the basis of his evildoing/redemption arc and his friendship with Team Dark will forever be the second-most baffling thing they've ever done.
Number one is them hyping up Omega through the entirety of Sonic Forces only for him to do absolutely nothing.

A friend of mine said it best when I recently made a ****ing essay on why Shadow used to be a good character and concluded by saying he's a lot like Cloud Strife in that they're both hyped up as absolute badasses but are very emotionally fragile while going through severe trauma.

"And then subsequent official material completely misses the point with them"

Now I hate video game and declare that I should be in charge of the industry. I'm ok with crunch, all these scandals about the workplace and exploiting those with addictive personalities, but I draw the line at ruining Shadow

 

[7NATOR]

Shadow's Characterzion is Inconsistent...but not as bad as People make it out to be

His Personality is intact in the Mainline Games like Forces, and in the Japanese sub of the Sonic games, his personality is fine

Where he gets unreasonably edgy is in the Side Material. Team Sonic Racing, Sonic Boom, and the IDW Comics are examples

But he's actually represented well in other Side content like the Twitter Takedowns, and Lego Dimensions

I think the biggest problem is that Shadow doesn't appear in Main material that much anymore. Even in Forces he wasn't there for very long.

I didn't like that statement that talked about Team Dark not being friends. Hopefully that was just a joke or something like that, but I think Sega does know how to write Shadow well...when they want to

 

[MeteoRain]

Ryu and Ryu Hayabusa aren't the same, and neither are Roy and Roy. But Ganon and Ganon are the same ****ing guy, there are no shortcuts around this. I'm not saying there can't be two Ganons, I'm saying the Ganon you're asking for is already a boss.

The Ocarina of Time transformation is a far cry from the traditional Ganon, in both design and even character. It'd be pretty hard to confuse the two.

You're overlooking the real reason behind the comparison.

They're both gatekeeping that's entirely hinged on nitpicky OCD.

 

[SharkLord]

Have they now, hmm? Care to share?

Alrighty then. A bit late, but here's my (Somewhat divisive) opinions.

• Reimu - Still clinging to the indie rep idea. Aside from that, Touhou is also dummy huge in Japan, has a cult following in the West that, while small, I believe is strong enough to pull through the "Not recognizable to global audiences" thing. Usually I'd be a bit more hesitant with her lack of Nintendo connections, but ZUN is just really lax with the copyright and he's like the one guy they have to go through for Touhou. I mean, just look at this guy.
  
  
  
  The dude's probably just gonna ask Nintendo to pay for his beer for the next couple months.
• Lloyd - You guys are probably getting sick of the guy now, but I'm fairly confident in him. He's a fairly popular request for Smash, Tales is huge in Japan, and Bandai-Namco's close enough for some easy access. Aside from that, something I find highly suspect is the complete and utter lack of Tales content in the base game. All the returning costumes have been Spirits, Assist Trophies, shown up in Mega Man's Final Smash, been a part of the Namco Roulette, or at least had someone else from their series shown up in some form. Tales just has absolutely nothing, which seems incredibly fishy to me.
• Isaac - We've all heard this one before. Very popular request, potential new game coming up, ATs aren't a hard deconfirm and are judged on a case-by-case basis, etc. You should know this one already.
• Euden - Ah yes, Shulk Jr. This guy's a recent addition to my list, for a similar reason as Lloyd's last point: Absolutely nothing in the base game at all. Dragalia's had a decent amount of crossovers and is their first original mobile title; Even if he's not a fighter, you'd think it'd at least get a Spirit or a Mii. But nope, nothing. I can't help but notice that.
  
  As for the banned-in-Europe thing... Is it all of Europe that has the anti-gacha laws or just Belgium? I'm actually kinda curious about that; We might have accidentally gotten some facts wrong along the way. Either way, I'm still expecting it to get something at the end of the day.

So there you have it. Reimu, and some combination of the JRPG trio. Maybe it's not quite 100% solid, but it's still a lot more solid than what I had after Steve.

 

[Ben Holt]

I severely doubt Reimu. She'sa step above a meme pick.
If Takamaru was denied in Smash 4 for not being recognizable outside of Japan, then Reimu is in the same boat.
Smash isn't what it was in 2001 back when Smash 64 was planned as a Japan exclusive. It's a juggernaut worldwide IP. Even though most characters are Japanese, so are MOST MAJOR VIDEO GAME MASCOTS. Japan basically owns the video game industry, as it's where gaming was first popularized.
Sakurai is on record saying that Little Mac, Bayonetta, K. Rool, Ridley, Simon, and Banjo were all picks from the Western audience. And it's heavily speculated that Terry was picked for the Latin American audience.

I have nothing against Japanese people or their character requests, but I feel like we grossly overestimate their influence when it comes to DLC.

 

[Commander_Alph]

If Takamaru was denied in Smash 4 for not being recognizable outside of Japan, then Reimu is in the same boat.

If you're going to play that game at least mentioned that his last appearance is in Famicom, if he's that popular in Japan I'm not going to be surprised when Nintendo made another Mysterious Murasame Castle game right now. That's a big leap between Takamaru and Reimu and you just generalized them in a broad way. There's a big different between "being denied because he's only recognizable in Japan while also never made a modern appearance and is stuck in a Japan only console that's decade old" and "being denied because she's only recognizable in Japan but still relevant to this day and even built a big fandom that lasted decades".

 

[Ben Holt]

If you're going to play that game at least mentioned that his last appearance is in Famicom, if he's that popular in Japan I'm not going to be surprised when Nintendo made another Mysterious Murasame Castle game right now. That's a big leap between Takamaru and Reimu and you just generalized them in a broad way.

You totally missed the point.
The point is that Sakurai is on record denying characters for lacking international recognition.
Hell, even back in Melee, Roy was nearly cut in the International version of the game until Sakurai was adamant on having the same roster in every version of the game.

 

[Commander_Alph]

You totally missed the point.
The point is that Sakurai is on record denying characters for lacking international recognition.
Hell, even back in Melee, Roy was nearly cut in the International version of the game until Sakurai was adamant on having the same roster in every version of the game.

I mean getting a character that is popular in Latin America and Europe is much rare than getting a character that is popular in Japan which is one step below from getting a character that is popular in worldwide (in this case Japan and the whole continent of Europe and America) cause he at least know what's popular in his home country which he can heavily benefit it's not like Sakurai is going to research on what game is popular in Asia, Australia and China and pick that to spread a message of "Hey! Smash is worldwide game, look at these roster who's game is popular in different places around the world!" . It's just that even Japan needs a representation than just Hero and Marth.



And even then putting Reimu in the same boat as Takamaru just because they're only popular in Japan is kinda unfair when Reimu achieve much more than Takamaru and that that achievement even slowly bleed out to the entire world, I mean you don't get to see a Mysterious Murasame Castle fans in Europe but you at least have bump into a Touhou fan on the internet who speaks English fluently.

 

[Speed Weed]

Oooh, now I get it! Can’t believe I didn’t sooner.

Anyways, back onto character speculation:

On a similar note, HWYR if the last 3 characters after were Ashely, Takamaru and Mimikyu?

**** man I'd be down for this timeline

 

[Cutie Gwen]

If you're going to play that game at least mentioned that his last appearance is in Famicom, if he's that popular in Japan I'm not going to be surprised when Nintendo made another Mysterious Murasame Castle game right now. That's a big leap between Takamaru and Reimu and you just generalized them in a broad way. There's a big different between "being denied because he's only recognizable in Japan while also never made a modern appearance and is stuck in a Japan only console that's decade old" and "being denied because she's only recognizable in Japan but still relevant to this day and even built a big fandom that lasted decades".

Ignore him, for some reason people really try to pretend Reimu has no precense outside Japan despite multiple worldwide releases and a dedicated fanbase to the point ZUN considers hiring a localization team a waste of time and money, not to mention how Touhou made a huge impact on internet culture and how I could go to my local gaming store and buy multiple Touhou games pre-lockdown

 

[Commander_Alph]

Ignore him, for some reason people really try to pretend Reimu has no precense outside Japan despite multiple worldwide releases and a dedicated fanbase to the point ZUN considers hiring a localization team a waste of time and money, not to mention how Touhou made a huge impact on internet culture and how I could go to my local gaming store and buy multiple Touhou games pre-lockdown

To add that there's an absolutely logical reason behind ZUN putting the recent Touhou game on Steam, a prominently english speaking platform. Unrelated but I'm just going to wait when the Switch's eShop is filled with Touhou games that Nintendo have no choice than to put a filter on them lmao.

 

[Ayumi Tachibana]

After Reimu actually joins Smash, I can already see people justifie her inclusion saying somewhat understandable and not far-fetched choice since she was picked for the Chinese audience.

 

[Commander_Alph]

After Reimu actually joins Smash, I can already see people justifies her inclusion saying somewhat understandable and not far-fetched choice since she was picked for the Chinese audience.

I thought League of Legends fits that bill perfectly more than Touhou for the chinese audience imo.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

I will point out that the relative "star power" of reps peaked in the middle/first half of FP1. Hero printed Japanese hype and money like the US federal reserve, and Banjo himself was a huge fan request for the longest time. After that, we got Terry (who's influential to be sure, and a good character all around who came with an assload of content, but ur avg consoomer probably knew Hero and Banjo in their respective regions better) and... Byleth, who got lots of hate, whether you think it was deserved or not.

 

[Ben Holt]

I will point out that the relative "star power" of reps peaked in the middle/first half of FP1. Hero printed Japanese hype and money like the US federal reserve, and Banjo himself was a huge fan request for the longest time. After that, we got Terry (who's influential to be sure, and a good character all around who came with an assload of content, but ur avg consoomer probably knew Hero and Banjo in their respective regions better) and... Byleth, who got lots of hate, whether you think it was deserved or not.

Dude. Steve exists. Like, he probably sold more than Hero and Banjo combined.

 

[Deleted member]

Euden - Ah yes, Shulk Jr. This guy's a recent addition to my list, for a similar reason as Lloyd's last point: Absolutely nothing in the base game at all. Dragalia's had a decent amount of crossovers and is their first original mobile title; Even if he's not a fighter, you'd think it'd at least get a Spirit or a Mii. But nope, nothing. I can't help but notice that.

• Euden - Ah yes, Shulk Jr. This guy's a recent addition to my list, for a similar reason as Lloyd's last point: Absolutely nothing in the base game at all. Dragalia's had a decent amount of crossovers and is their first original mobile title; Even if he's not a fighter, you'd think it'd at least get a Spirit or a Mii. But nope, nothing. I can't help but notice that.
  
  As for the banned-in-Europe thing... Is it all of Europe that has the anti-gacha laws or just Belgium? I'm actually kinda curious about that; We might have accidentally gotten some facts wrong along the way. Either way, I'm still expecting it to get something at the end of the day.

Dragalia doesn’t have a European release. There are other gachas in Europe but the main point against Euden is that if you live in Europe his game isn’t going to be on the App Store. Gachas aren’t banned entirely in the region but there are much more laws restricting loot boxes which is likely why Nintendo and Cygames haven’t bothered publishing it there.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I thought League of Legends fits that bill perfectly more than Touhou for the chinese audience imo.

Well, if a LoL rep gets in, I kinda doubt that would have been the only factor, despite all the Nintendo-Tencent dealings. League is popular worldwide, after all.

Then again, I can certainly see people trying to justify it that way.

 

[ForsakenM]

I’m guessing somewhere close to big, be it a spiky-haired boy with an orange key or an orange hairy marsupial.

Wait, does Sora have an orange Keyblade?

googles some searches

Well, he does, but none of them are iconic to him or anyone other than perhaps Axel/Lea.

Also, just gonna put this here real quick, but if people can openly root for Sora despite us getting a Square character in the pass already and all the talk about Disney Japan shutting down his chances and not get targeted, I feel like Geno fans can too considering even with a returning Mii Costume he's honestly int he same position if not better.

That feels really weird to say, but somehow it's true.

Man, can we get both by any chance, Sakurai?

 

[Idon]

Wait, does Sora have an orange Keyblade?

googles some searches

Well, he does, but none of them are iconic to him or anyone other than perhaps Axel/Lea.

Also, just gonna put this here real quick, but if people can openly root for Sora despite us getting a Square character in the pass already and all the talk about Disney Japan shutting down his chances and not get targeted, I feel like Geno fans can too considering even with a returning Mii Costume he's honestly int he same position if not better.

That feels really weird to say, but somehow it's true.

Man, can we get both by any chance, Sakurai?

You can do whatever you personally want. It doesn't mean people will entertain the thought with you. It especially doesn't mean because one person has a farfetched desire or prediction, that others are entertaining it or similarly farfetched ideas.

 

[ForsakenM]

You can do whatever you personally want. It doesn't mean people will entertain the thought with you. It especially doesn't mean because one person has a farfetched desire or prediction, that others are entertaining it or similarly farfetched ideas.

Far-fetched is an opinion. My point is simply that, if one group is allowed to talk about something considered 'far-fetched' without being targeted, so should another. We currently do not have said equality, but I appreciate that you reciprocate it yourself.

Speaking of perhaps being far-fetched, Frankly, I have this weird suspicion that we could be getting another Mario character. It just kinda feels weird that we get this big anniversary, a Mario-only tournament, three smaller tournaments that tie heavily to Mario (Mushrooms, Stars and facial hair) and now Nintendo is extending their anniversary celebration with a 'Wave 2' and yet no character in Smash? I mean, Geno aside, characters like Waluigi, Wart, Captain Toad and others exist.

Obviously they don't have to, but specifically this anniversary extension has me pondering.

 

[Ayumi Tachibana]

I thought League of Legends fits that bill perfectly more than Touhou for the chinese audience imo.

LoL is massive worldwide unlike Touhou so I don't think there's need for regional popularity justification.
Titles like super popular or legendary in Japan by far but still has prominent presence in certain region other than America fit that bill.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Fierce Deity or nothing.

Nothing would be the status quo

Ah but if he does that, then he wouldn't have damaged them in the future, but then they couldn't have been thrown into their damage percent, but then he could have damaged them in the future since the attack didn't work, he could throw them into their future damage, but then...

Okay. He summons Epona with the Ocarina. And Epona , indestructible, flees off stage with an opponent or two. then comes back on stage and eats a carrot.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Oooh, now I get it! Can’t believe I didn’t sooner.

Anyways, back onto character speculation:

On a similar note, HWYR if the last 3 characters after were Ashely, Takamaru and Mimikyu?

Almost replied with a dumb comment but I re-read what you said I can reply with something even dumber.

S'alright, gonna miss Ken though.

 

[Mr. Robotto]

View attachment 299414
Oh god is this what traditional fighting games are like

Looks like someone here needs to learn how to do a ****ING INFINITE

I should probably mention as well here that there's some heavy swearing in this video...

A true classic within the FGC

As for the banned-in-Europe thing... Is it all of Europe that has the anti-gacha laws or just Belgium? I'm actually kinda curious about that; We might have accidentally gotten some facts wrong along the way. Either way, I'm still expecting it to get something at the end of the day.

Gachas are indeed banned here in Belgium. I cannot download Fire Emblem Heroes, Pokémon Masters and even Animal Crossing Pocket Camp here legally, though luckily there are simple workarounds to this (I have a Japanese phone anyway). But even though these anti-lootbox and anti-gacha laws are only really a thing in Belgium and the Netherlands, Dragalia Lost isn't really available anywhere in Europe for some weird reason. All other Nintendo Gacha games are still available for download in the rest of Europe.

 

[osby]

Looks like someone here needs to learn how to do a ****ING INFINITE

I should probably mention as well here that there's some heavy swearing in this video...

A true classic within the FGC

some heavy swearing

some

Anyway, that's why we need a Capcom character with stupid combos in Smash, my vote is Nero.

 

[Metal Shop X]

"Man I hate this cinematic it takes out the flow give us back transformations" folks really do forget that those always resulted in running away for 10 seconds because none of the transformations are very mobile meaning it was just 10 seconds that could be cut from the match with no changes beyond where the players are standing. At least cinematics guarantee something happening as they're more interesting to look at than watching a snail try to catch up to a racecar

Have you forgot my man, Wario Man?

If anything, he was too fast for his own good at time, especially in Brawl if you used his side-B. It's always hilarious to see peoples die because they underestimated how far it goes.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Anyway, that's why we need a Capcom character with stupid combos in Smash, my vote is Nero.

Heh. Perhaps the most foulmouthed Capcom character is your choice after seeing that. Funny.

Have you forgot my man, Wario Man?

If anything, he was too fast for his own good at time, especially in Brawl if you used his side-B. It's always hilarious to see peoples die because they underestimated how far it goes.

Honestly? Yeah, none of my irls play Wario who just so happened to be the only one with mobility