Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[DaybreakHorizon]

Hey that's my line

My character arc over this speculation cycle has been becoming a jaded, cynical, and old speculator who sticks around to counter the blind idealism and inane logic often adopted by the fanbase.

Kinda like you

see look its you and me

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

If you own Murasame's Castle you're either A. Japanese. In which case, congrats. Or B. You got it MUCH later. In which case, I don't think it qualifies as nostalgia.

You seem very accusatory and I’m not sure why but I’ll answer your inquiry.
1. My dad bought the NES before I was born and I grew up in the 90s playing Zelda, Mario, Punch-Out and Mach Rider - yes it was the weakest of the group but I still remember it fondly and love the music.
2. Yes I got Murasame Castle a few years ago on the 3DS eshop. But I’ve known for years it’s the sister game to Zelda like Kid Icarus is to Metroid and I’ve wanted to play it myself for years and years before it was available to me.

So there’s a healthy bit of nostalgia for me on both accounts. I very much enjoy the legacy titles in Nintendo’s libraries and I know I’m in the minority.

 

[N3ON]

The double-edged sword about Miyamoto is he's way more miss than hit these days (though I think these days he's just moved on to IP guardianship/advising with stuff like movies and theme parks) but he's also a big reason IPs like Star Fox and Pikmin keep getting attempted in the first place, and not left to wallow like F-Zero, Golden Sun, and probably Rhythm Heaven.

Of course I think if your attempts at a series aren't striking a chord but you still see potential in it, that's the time to really start fielding pitches from outside studios, and maybe they do that and just turn most down, but some shakeup is needed, and it can't always be waiting on having a eureka moment with new tech.

My character arc over this speculation cycle has been becoming a jaded, cynical, and old speculator who sticks around to counter the blind idealism and inane logic often adopted by the fanbase.

Kinda like you
View attachment 333912
see look its you and me

Speculation... speculation never changes...

 

[spicynun]

I mean, considering Disney literally owns everything about Kingdom Hearts (even though SE makes the games themselves), there clearly had to be some kind of cooperation.

I dont think they own the Utada Hikaru songs, not sure who owns the orchestra version of Hikari that was in the trailer

 

[Dinoman96]

I dont think they own the Utada Hikaru songs, not sure who owns the orchestra version of Hikari that was in the trailer

Oh sure, I just mean basically the rest of KH's soundtrack composed by Yoko Shimomura, that's pretty obviously owned by Disney. If SE owned it themselves, then we'd probably gotten remixes instead of just a handful of rips.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

So who do you think are the next big 3 or 4 in the smash community for the next game?
I would say Geno, Crash, Waluigi, Doom slayer
I think in japan it will be different probably.

It would be SUPER different in Japan bit idk any JP people I could ask lol

 

[Opossum]

Or...what?

"here me out" is normally used as a prelude to saying something crazy.

That's a perfectly reasonable suggestion.

Hayabusa, Hayabusa, Bill Rizer, Hayabusa.

I think it'll have less to do with who wants what than it does who owns what.

As with Ultimate, base game will be mostly 1st party, while DLC is mostly 3rd.

I'm gonna call BS on that. Because nostalgia requires one to have, ya know, played the thing.

Mach Rider and Murasame Castle are old games, but they're old games nobody played or liked even at the time.

It's like someone claiming they're nostalgic for Ice Climbers. No, no they are not. Nobody would remember that game if not for Smash. And anyone that did, would remember that it sucked.

If Takamaru wasn't an AT, nobody would be asking for him.

Except Takamaru had a pretty big following in the lead up to his Assist reveal in 4, and his disconfirmation was one of the bigger ones of that cycle. Just because he wasn't on the one random magazine cover you uphold so much doesn't mean he didn't have fans. Shocking, I know.

 

[AlphaSSB]

Star Fox? I have been summoned.

Krystal being free from Wolf’s shadow before being immediately put in the trophy cage is a sad set of circumstances

I will say I'm glad she at least made it in as an Assist Trophy. Goes to show that she did well enough in the Ballot to be given some attention. Hopefully Nintendo will take note of how some of their characters did in the Ballot and consider bringing them back. Krystal in a new Star Fox, King K. Rool in a new Donkey Kong, etc.

Yeah, that's exactly my point. Crystal would've been feasible had Brawl had more development time. Since it didn't, she didn't get in.

I'm not saying she would've definitely been in, but she never had a fighting chance due to the tight timeline Brawl was on.

Probably raw bias speaking, but I've always had the theory that if Krystal did make it in Brawl, we could have gotten Wolf in Smash 4 instead of Corrin as DLC. Star Fox Zero was still being promoted around that time, and unlike Corrin, Wolf would've still had years of support/demand. Granted Corrin was chosen after Sakurai was convinced by his team, not directly by Nintendo, but there's a possibility things could have been different.

Considering Krystal ain't happening until she returns to that series, and the series itself returns, and she hasn't been part of it since... pre-Brawl? It was nice to see what likely got her added as an AT was the fact that she has retained enough popularity to probably do decently on the ballot.

Too bad Nintendo can't find their footing for possibly their most mismanaged series ever, Star Fox, and give it a direction to let it not stumble through the years on a wing and a prayer. The series kept adding new elements which weren't entirely refined but were a good foundation to build something better off of, then scrapping them each game for something different.

Give this series to someone who can figure it out, please. It's not inherently unworkable, and it's not without untapped potential. It's a sci-fi space opera with flying and shooting and a cast of characters people like, there are so many directions you can take that in.

More like, occasionally being dragged out where Nintendo thinks they can work with another wacky technical/controller idea Miyamoto thought of.

https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2020/12/feature_the_making_of_star_fox_command







Miyamoto just seems to view Star Fox as a wacky tech demo franchise to do whatever with, and as Cuthbert mentions above he doesn't really care about what the fans want.

Its ironic. Miyamoto is one of the key figures keeping the series alive, yet he's also the one holding it back. Past developers Dylan Cuthbert and Giles Goddard both have ideas for new games, and PlatinumGames have said they're up to bring Zero over to Switch. What Star Fox needs is freedom and funding. Release the series from Miyamoto's influence and give it to a dev team with an idea to really revive the series. Then give them the funding to do it.

Asking for a lot, sure, but looking at series like Metroid and Fire Emblem gives me hope. Fire Emblem was a failure of a series but kept getting its chances until Awakening happened. Metroid had been dormant for years, then they announce Metroid Prime 4 and later revisit Metroid Dread. Hopefully Star Fox will get to join these franchises in the "back from the brink" club.

But consider:

More Mario, Legend of Zelda, Animal Crossing, and Fire Emblem.

Star Fox will forever be consigned to vault of dead series, occasionally being dragged out where Nintendo thinks they can cash in on nostalgia.

No. Star Fox has actually gotten decent attention over the years after Zero.

• Profile icons on Switch at launch, when larger series didn't have any
• Star Fox content in Starlink: Battle for Atlas along with a physical Arwing
• Star Fox DLC content added to Starlink, with three pilots and a second storyline
• Krystal making it in Ultimate as an Assist Trophy thanks to the Ballot
• Wolf's amiibo being reverse-compatible with Star Fox Zero
• Star Fox getting its own page on Nintendo's Amazon Store
• Star Fox Zero being the only non-Switch game to have wallpapers featured on Nintendo's site
• Star Fox 2 being finished and released on the SNES Classic, which generated a ton of hype

Some may be pretty minor, sure, but it's the little things that show Nintendo still remembers the series.

 

[N3ON]

It would be SUPER different in Japan bit idk any JP people I could ask lol

Japan is probably gonna be a mix of Dante, BWD, Arle, 2B, Monster Hunter, Reimu, and new Xenoblade, Pokemon and FE characters filtering in and out.

That's not just three or four but the west isn't just gonna have three or four either.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Japan is probably gonna be a mix of Dante, BWD, Arle, 2B, Monster Hunter, Reimu, and new Xenoblade, Pokemon and FE characters filtering in and out.

That's not just three or four but the west isn't just gonna have three or four either.

I hope one of those characters is Ammy. I may have gotten my baby boy Sora, but id love my goddess dog

 

[MarioKartRenderOwner]

smash 6 we're gonna see the return of the smash 4 early days support for non-specific action figure

 

[DarthEnderX]

Except Takamaru had a pretty big following in the lead up to his Assist reveal in 4

A. You're definition of "pretty big" is ridiculous. And B. But even that is only because he was a regular trophy in earlier games.

Smash fanbase in a nutshell:
1. Is shown a thing they've never heard of.
2. "That needs to be a character in Smash!"

If Coach from X was a Trophy, there'd be a Coach from X request thread...

 

[ForsakenM]

pops in

WE TALKING ABOUT THE BOI!? AND I DIDN'T START THE CONVERSATION SO I CAN'T GET FLAMED FOR IT?!

So before I dive into anyone else's opinions, we all know the lovely Geno Support Thread has been like as a community over Smash's development. By the end of it all, we were honestly just constantly baited by the whole development of Ultimate. People can argue on either side, but the facts are that things constantly looked good for Geno up until his costume's return, and even then since it was a recycled asset and not a brand-new costume it could have been argued that he still had some sort of chance, especially after Kazuya. However, most of our support had a meltdown or gave up between the reveal of Sephiroth and the showing of the Mii Costume. Hell, I even gave up for a bit because of the costume, but came back because giving up isn't how you get what you want in life.

Geno fans have been waiting at a 50/50 split: half of them since Brawl, and the other half since 1996. I don't think there is an issue with waiting, it's just like any other fan for Ridley or K. Rool who had to wait for 6 games in the franchise for it to happen that irks people. Then, when you see characters from the same company get in before the one you want and have waited for so long to get in, sometimes you get a bit nasty. People don't like being ignored, nor slapped in the face, and lots of folks felt that way in Dec of 2020.

My god, what a meltdown it was, though there were many of us who recovered and just decided to keep going and wait it out, but some got vicious and many just gave up. I can't tell you how so many Geno fans came and insulted me just because I didn't want to give up after this, it was stunning.

The worst part was how the staff here addressed the whole situation. Rather than just addressing those who were being toxic on a case by case basis and then letting us speculate until Ultimate's DLC was over, they decided to not only lock the thread forever without a lot of time for people to recover and move past it to talk about the future, but they also used the chaos as a perfect time to ban a certain janitor because they had personal bias against him and he was actually getting more consistent information over time about things not even tied to Smash because he was TOTALLY and evil dude that was leading a cult or something and trying to whip Geno fans into doing...something, I guess. Dude was just an excited Geno fan himself that got a mix real stuff and fake news and mixed that in with his hopes and thoughts. Not a bad guy, but DEFINITELY not always reliable, that's for sure.

Regardless, it had the effect they wanted, but it also hurt the site massively: as much as you may have thought Geno fans wouldn't shut up or they were toxic or delusional or whatnot, it was the most active Support Thread on this site during Ultimate's run BY MILES. There was no competition. Sure, it kinda turned into a second general thread because Geno is a character from 1996 and we basically said all we could about him without talking about fan projects when they popped up, but it was still filled with major activity and support for the character even at that point. However, at a huge low point, the made it so Geno fans couldn't talk to each other on such a big thread, so we all separated. I remember when a second thread was attempted, it get nuked, and then a Mallow Thread was made where people still talked about Geno but made it more about Mallow, and that got nuked as well I think.

Finally, staff thinks that 'You know, maybe we should let people speculate about Smash characters in the speculation thread' and we get a new Geno Thread, one that is staff-approved this time. Two days before Pyra/Mythra reveal at the February Direct, Geno fans get to hang out and talk about him again. The thread had closed on Dec 22nd, and the new one opened on Feb 15th. The current Geno Thread has 53 pages as of yesterday/today, so what does that tell you? It says that for locking the thread and waiting that long to change their mind, most Geno fans there either moved somewhere else or just gave up and moved on. Many of them on other sites gave up and moved on as well. This is where I move to Dinoman's quote.

Geno is kind of an odd duck because he technically did "die" before. Just look at his Smash 4 thread over here

Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior #Geno4Smash - Everyone's gotta do their part! Vote Geno

“I serve… a higher authority…” This will be the main topic for discussion the character potential of Geno, one of the main characters from the game "Mario RPG" for the Super Nintendo. I'll update as I think up more information or people post something good. For those interested, his...

smashboards.com

His thread didn't even crack 100 pages. Compare that to the absolute kings that were Ridley and K. Rool during that period. Or well, compare it to Geno's thread for this game, at least the first one from before December 2020.

Geno had a lot of fortunate circumstances that brought him and his fandom back into the limelight after seemingly petering out after Brawl. The character was directly acknowledged by Smash and Sakurai for the first time with the Mii outfit released alongside Cloud, and Sakurai then said in an interview released shortly afterward that he actually wanted to make Geno playable. Of course, Ultimate then gets announced a few years later and begins to start fufilling a whole slew of long standing character requests like Ridley, K. Rool and Banjo & Kazooie, which gave hope to Geno (and Isaac) fans that they were next in line.

But now Ultimate and come and gone, despite it again fufilling tons of dream requests like and yet the most Geno could get was just the return of his Mii outfit with barely any changes. With the Smash series heading towards an unknown future after Ultimate and considering what already had happened to Geno's fanbase after Brawl and before Cloud's DLC pack, one has to wonder how much the fandom is gonna hold up. After everything that happened during Ultimate it kinda made sense to support him again, but I dunno. Are people still gonna be clinging onto a several year old interview that amounted to basically absolutely nothing the very next game?

Support for Geno never 'died' it just fell very silent for a time. It was low between Brawl and Smash 4 up until the ballot showed up, and never forget his support got so big during brawl speculation because he initially had support from people who thought other Square Enix characters couldn't get in, but over time it blew up into SMRPG finding out people were talking about him and a bit of band-wagoning. There is a difference between the community being quiet and the community being dead, and I feel as though you could very well see that distinction in the future. This was a major blow to a lot of fans, and now Geno fans are both diminished and not nearly as conjoined. This weakens our support greatly, although oddly enough talented people keep putting Geno into things like Friday Night Funkin and Mario Kart 8, and we are STILL getting remixes and covers of Beware The Forest's Mushrooms.

If Deluxe happens I think that's obviously much better for Geno fans because it would just be adding on to what we already have, and what we already have has the biggest names that he had to compete with already in the game. If we have to wait for a long time for the next Smash game, I think you will see a similar thing to the period between Brawl and Smash 4, though a bit different and ESPECIALLY if SMRPG gets no official acknowledgement on the Switch. If we at least get a game like we've ALSO been asking for, like a remake or something, that changes everything for a lot of people. However, if it's just mostly silence like it has been, I think people will move on to just asking Nintendo and Square to make a new game in the series or a remake more than they talk about Smash. It's already starting to happen a bit, and I think some Geno fans have become disillusioned with Smash and Sakurai's words, perhaps now believing Sakurai is full of crap and that he doesn't care.

Of course, many of us know that Geno isn't as big a deal as Cloud or DQ or Sephy or Sora, and I hope Geno fans can band together again with this information that Sakurai was trying to so hard to get that #1 request that Geno just had to sit out this time around. Considering Sakurai felt the need to point out how much support Geno got in the ballot, I really think that he could have beaten out a lot more popular names, but this whole ride was thinking that he had a better chance than three our of four of those above for various reasons (some valid at the time, some not so much) and just being wrong about it.

What it boils down to, in my opinion, is what Geno's numbers were in the ballot. Where they really as substantial as Sakurai claimed? Or was it substantial in comparison to how niche he is as a character? If they were substantial, which I think they were since Sakurai felt the need to talk about it in such length, then it's quite possible he could have performed better than some other names like Lara Croft or Crono, but I still wonder how he compared to other FF characters like Tidus or Terra. One thing to note is that 2B's rise happened in 2017, in a post-ballot Smash community, so while she obviously would have had next to no numbers on the ballot she's placed high in fan polls, and thus Geno may have to deal with that in the future.

I honestly still think his chances are great, but of course are better for a Deluxe with no cuts. It would also just feel better if it was a Deluxe with no cuts, because if your most wanted gets in but all the big names your friends love get cut, it's way too bittersweet to be seen as a pure victory.

Geno fans, if and when you do regroup please just be a bit more discerning in your theorizing next time, it's exhausting for the rest of us.

Thank you.

See, I get what you mean and we know that I've fluctuated with getting carried away as well as trying to make other more realistic over the course of this, but I actually miss the crazy blind 'EVERYTHING FAVORS GENO!' support we used to have.

Now it's just this sad wasteland of depression and disillusionment. Like, we may have been insanely gung ho to the point of being hated by the community at times, but at least we had amazing spirit. People would come in and heat-seeking missile hate us just by the notion that Geno is niche and yet his support was so big, and we could band together and swat them like antibodies or some ****. Now it's just kinda like 'Yeah, your probably right, not sure why we keep going. Maybe I should give up.'

Like, I actually think Deluxe could get announced and have all the characters return and announce more are coming and have like the first reveal be Waluigi or something crazy willed in by PURE fan support over time much like Ridley or K. Rool, and many Geno fans would be like 'That's cool for Waluigi fans. Too bad Geno will never get that treatment.'

I hope the support for Geno on social media I don't use is massive and just growing like crazy, but I already know that isn't the case. If Geno does get in, it's not because of our current support: it will be because of our voices during Ultimate's run and the ballot.

 

[7NATOR]

There are Multiple things I was thinking of

-----I could honestly see a good amount of the Base Roster of Smash 6 Dedicated to Assist Promotions

-Waluigi
-Isaac
-Shadow and/or Knuckles
-Skull Kid and/or Midna
-Bomberman
-Shovel Knight
-Zero
-Alucard
-Ashley
-Lyn
-Krystal


This would especially be true if Smash 6 is pretty Much Ultimate 2 (Even if it requires DLC to bring back all the characters if it came down to it). I think the reactions to Assists showed that too many Popular characters are locked behind the Snowglobe.

Granted I don't think every Assist would get in or anything, but I see at least 5 characters at least

-----For Bringing Back the 3rd party Characters, I feel like the Main Issue is gonna be Royalties. I'm not sure if Upfront Costs or Fees are that huge of a Factor since Imagine Smash would make it's Money Back definitely, especially if they were able to bring every character back again

Stuff like Companies wanting a Share of the Base game Profits, or Music Royalties messing things up I think are gonna be the Biggest Killers. I think for the Former, I think Nintendo would be able to find Incentives that will benefit Both Nintendo and the Company in Question without having to resort to the Company having a big share of Royalties, such as

-Guaranteed DLC Character for Smash 6, where the Company will have good share of the DLC Profits
-More Mass Exposure due to Base game (The Base game is what gets the Most Exposure in terms of Audience. as an example, I'm sure only a Certain percentage of the Smash Playerbase pays attention to DLC)
-Game Advertisement, whether through the Presentations, Ingame, etc
-Funding of Projects for Nintendo Platform, or perhaps Early Access to the New Nintendo Platform after the Switch

I think Nintendo will find a way to appeal to the Companies wanting their characters to stay in the Base Roster of Smash 6. I also think that every potential reason listed above will also Benefit Nintendo, whether in Boosting Appeal of Smash 6 itself, or Boosting Appeal of the Console Smash 6 will be on

I also think Part of the reason Sakurai and/or Nintendo want to keep the characters only to the Video Game Industry is I think People in the Gaming industry much more relate to gaming as a whole than other Industries, and that's actually a Big Factor. Gaming Companies can more easily see the Big Deal in a Gaming Crossover like Smash compared to other Companies in other Industries

The Music Royalties could honestly be the Biggest Issue. Though to be honest, I think that's why some of the Music Selection for the 3rd party characters, even the DLC ones, are the way they are. I think they build the Music Selection to as unaffected by Music Royalties as Possible, which is why there's lack of Vocal Themes, or certain songs, or whatever

-----Hot Take coming up, but I actually think 3rd Parties are gonna make up the Majority of the Base Game Newcomers, and a Majority of the New Amount of Content in Smash 6

I feel like the Direction that Smash 6 is gonna go in, whether every Character comes back or not, is the Focus on the General Gaming Crossover. Smash Ultimate DLC (and Smash 4 also to a Lesser extent) have already went in this Direction, but I think it's gonna be taken to the Next Level with Smash 6

I think Nintendo knows that the Next Answer is to start appealing to Audiences outside of Smash, and even Nintendo. Their Main DLC Choices (Hero, Steve, Kazuya) have went in this Direction. The Biggest Responses Smash has gotten has been in response to Characters outside of Nintendo Ownership

Nintendo already has alot of Companies in Smash's Pocket at this point. I do think it's a Case of might as well use it now to it's full effect, and not just in Character choices, but for other Subsidiary content, which would work with Choices Sakurai might feel might not have the best Potential as an Actual Fighter

I think the More 3rd Party Franchises Involved in Smash, the More that it's not only going to make Smash Appealing as a Game, a System Seller, Appealer to Many Audiences, and Representation of the Full Content present on the Switch, not just 1st Party content (or even not), but I also think It's gonna Increase Smash Ability as a bridge to Make More and Better relationships with 3rd Parties, which in the end is gonna have a Great Benefit in terms of Nintendo's Consoles, Hardware, Software, etc.

I still do think that 1st Parties will have good representation in terms of Newcomers and New Subsidiary content, Both on the Side of Showcasing the Switch Era of games, and also Fan Requests and such, but I think we are getting to the Point where the Appeal of 1st Party content is starting to dwindle.

-----I think Smash 6's Base roster is gonna Surpass 100 Characters. That's going to be a huge Selling Point


-----Sora Lack of Music from Games other than KH1 Reminds me of the Lack of Music from Street Fighter Games other than SF2.

What makes it weird like that Case is that content is that Like with Street Fighter, Content from the Other KH Games is represented through Costumes and Spirits, but the Music and Stage is limited to KH1

One thing I've been thinking is whether the omission of these Tracks is deliberate, perhaps to make Future Content more Appealing. We kind of did see this with something like Alot of the FF7 Music coming with Sephiroth

in the Case of Street Fighter, Perhaps there was and/or Still is plans for Another Character to come with Content outside of SF2. Chun-li is an Obvious Candidate for this Potential, and there were rumors that there were plans to Include her but they were dropped. Perhaps the Same thing could be True of Kingdom Hearts in the future, with maybe getting another Character like Riku, Roxas, or any of the Versions of Xehanort


-----If there was ever to be a Non-Video Game character in Smash's Playable roster, it's Most Likely Mickey Mouse

I remember that there was that rumor that the reason Sora was Denied Intially (Perhaps more than once), was that Disney wanted Mickey Mouse to tie in, and whether because of keeping Smash video Game origin, the Licensing Costs tied to Disney Created characters, or the Knowledge that Disney is gonna be so over Nintendo in the Process of Creating Mickey as a Fighter, that it would make Sora's Creation look like Cakewalk, Nintendo refused the offer

I think the more "Realistic Outcome" for why Sora was finally able to be greenlit was that Disney Interactive kind of got Overhauled and now seems to be more willing to Licensing out characters to Games. The same thing can be seen with Pirates of the Carribean

If the Mickey rumor is true though, then I think the other Possibility as to why Sora was finally Greenlit as a Fighter, (and maybe also a way to keep Sora for Smash 6 Base) was that Nintendo and/or Sakurai agreed to Make Mickey as a Fighter...in Smash 6.

I think due to how much time it would take to meet all of Disney's Demands, along with the knowledge that Disney would maybe want alot of royalties, I Imagine Mickey would be Smash 6 DLC rather than Base, if this were to be the Case

The Lack of Disney Content in Sora's Fighter Pack is probably because they didn't want to deal with the Costs or Cooperation of Disney Og Characters...for Right now at least, but might have to do it Later

I also think Both Nintendo and Disney know that Mickey being in Smash would be a Huge Deal. Sakurai would probably be the most Worried since he and his Team would be the ones to bring it to Life


-----Smash 6 I think will Come sooner rather than Later

I Imagine Smash 6 would come around 2024, with maybe 2025 being the Latest, rather than something like 2028 or even 2030. The reasons I believe so is

-I Imagine the New Nintendo Console is being prepped to come within the next 2-4 Years. This would especially be true since the Chip that Powers the Switch is scheduled to have it's development be discontinued, Meaning there's only so many Switches that are possible to Sell now. I heard somewhere around 30 Million more Switches being possible

There's also the fact that by the time of 2023-2024, the Switch will approach the usual end cycle of Consoles

-Smash is a System Seller, and Nintendo Knows this, which Is why I expect Nintendo to try and Scheduled Smash to release within 0-2 years of the New Consoles's Launch

Many people bought a Switch just to Play Smash, Me Included. I also think because Smash is the game that most appeals to People that might not care about Nintendo's First Party Selection (due to the 3rd parties), and with the Speculation that Smash 6 will start adding more and more content to breach outside of Nintendo's Audience, that Smash 6 releasing soon after the New Console launches is Vital

-The Longer Smash 6 takes to come out, the more potential there is for there to be changes in Relationships with 3rd party Companies, and that could be a risk since Relationships can turn Sour. 2-4 Years is more reasonable to maintain Relationships compared to 5-10 Years.

-There's also the Factor in Changes in Gaming, whether it be Technological or in terms of Trends. I think waiting something like 6 or more years is gonna be more Risky in terms of possibly dismissing Smash's Appeal

Waiting 5-10 years give more time for things like Graphical developments, VR Technology, Faster ways of Development, New Engines, etc to start to take shape, and those things start to take off in Gaming within those years, Smash 6 can start to look more Obsolete

I Imagine whatever Graphics Smash 6 will have, will look more Impressive within 2-4 years rather than in something like 5-10 years, and that's gonna negatively impact the game if they decide to wait too long. If VR Games now start becoming the Norm, that's gonna either negatively impact Smash 6's Development (since I Imagine they aren't going into it making it primarily VR), or it's gonna make Smash 6 obsolete

I also think the more time they wait, the More Gaming trends Smash 6 might have to adopt in terms of New I.Ps or certain Gaming practices, and it might be too much when there's still alot Smash 6 has potential to adopt as of now

Smash 7 I think should be the game to transform Smash into Something completely different, but when Smash 6 still has grounds to Develop the Series in the Direction Smash Ultimate as Set, I think they should take that now rather than later, when they Assets they have, and the Appeal they have from being the Best Selling fighting game in the World is more Guaranteed now rather than Later

In terms of the New Nintendo Console, I know the Chip Shortages does put a damper on things, and I'm unsure how much. Perhaps Nintendo can still go with the plans they settled, but we have to see

 

[DarthEnderX]

As far as Geno is concerned, if they decided again that he's NOT gonna be a Fighter in Smash 6, I hope they at least reveal his Mii right away(with a new head), instead of torturing people for 2 years again.

 

[ForsakenM]

As far as Geno is concerned, if they decided again that he's NOT gonna be a Fighter in Smash 6, I hope they at least reveal his Mii right away(with a new head), instead of torturing people for 2 years again.

I really think his chances just go up with time and bigger reveals, but honestly I feel this big time.

It's not even about me personally as I can take it fairly well, but I think the Geno community as a whole either needs a win or to just give it to us straight, hard and fast.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I mean I'm a Geno fan that would love to see him come back, but if I'm being forthright I'm looking more towards workshop and mod oriented Smash inspired games like Rivals of Aether in terms of really getting him (or the Another Crusade kickstarted game if I want a Mario RPG fix).

That's not to say he won't show up in Smash some day, but the past few years have made more and more aware of how much the indie scene is really filling the niche with the kind of games I want that Nintendo either isn't making, not making with any consistency, or is doing so with dubious execution.

 

[DarthEnderX]

He should be in Super Smash Flash 2 already...

They gave Sora fans their fix for all those years. Now give Geno fans some relief.

 

[N3ON]

Its ironic. Miyamoto is one of the key figures keeping the series alive, yet he's also the one holding it back. Past developers Dylan Cuthbert and Giles Goddard both have ideas for new games, and PlatinumGames have said they're up to bring Zero over to Switch. What Star Fox needs is freedom and funding. Release the series from Miyamoto's influence and give it to a dev team with an idea to really revive the series. Then give them the funding to do it.

Asking for a lot, sure, but looking at series like Metroid and Fire Emblem gives me hope. Fire Emblem was a failure of a series but kept getting its chances until Awakening happened. Metroid had been dormant for years, then they announce Metroid Prime 4 and later revisit Metroid Dread. Hopefully Star Fox will get to join these franchises in the "back from the brink" club.

Star Fox needs its OoT/BotW or Prime moment. Or even Uprising. Not that I'm expecting it to be considered among the greatest games of all time, just that it needs to evolve into a new direction. Everything so far has been dipping its toe in the water but then getting back out again.

And Nintendo doesn't seem like they know which direction that should be, so, like with Prime and Uprising, I think it's going to necessitate new eyes on the property. Like you said, I'm sure lots of devs would love to get a crack at it. Someone has to finally stick the landing though, because while some genres you can always return to, they can't just keep putting out rail-shooters in 2021 and beyond as full games.

See, I get what you mean and we know that I've fluctuated with getting carried away as well as trying to make other more realistic over the course of this, but I actually miss the crazy blind 'EVERYTHING FAVORS GENO!' support we used to have.

Now it's just this sad wasteland of depression and disillusionment. Like, we may have been insanely gung ho to the point of being hated by the community at times, but at least we had amazing spirit. People would come in and heat-seeking missile hate us just by the notion that Geno is niche and yet his support was so big, and we could band together and swat them like antibodies or some ****. Now it's just kinda like 'Yeah, your probably right, not sure why we keep going. Maybe I should give up.'

Like, I actually think Deluxe could get announced and have all the characters return and announce more are coming and have like the first reveal be Waluigi or something crazy willed in by PURE fan support over time much like Ridley or K. Rool, and many Geno fans would be like 'That's cool for Waluigi fans. Too bad Geno will never get that treatment.'

I hope the support for Geno on social media I don't use is massive and just growing like crazy, but I already know that isn't the case. If Geno does get in, it's not because of our current support: it will be because of our voices during Ultimate's run and the ballot.

There can be a middle-ground, you know. It doesn't have to be 0 or 100. Neither feeling things are hopeless nor reading Geno in every little thing is a good idea for the state of the fanbase, frankly. Just... keep pushing ahead, but without losing your head. That's how Geno fans did it prior to like two years ago, and it was working well enough.

And not to be blunt, but what do you have to show for it that wouldn't have happened anyway? Fanbases don't need to turn into what the Geno fanbase turned into to be heard and be successful. With the Ridley, K. Rool, Isaac and eventually Banjo camps out of the way, you guys would've been uncontested in the diehard favourite space, and would've continued to gain popularity solely on that basis.

What happened instead was mania, from which hostility bled, and I'm not sure if it actually did more good than harm.

 

[Momotsuki]

To reiterate, I think Geno's chances for the next Smash depend entirely on whether it's an Ultimate port or not, something far from certain.
If it has to be between him and bringing back Cloud, Hero, Sora, or whoever else... he's pretty much DOA. I don't think that cuts and potential fighters like Geno could coexist, the priorities just wouldn't line up for him. And unfortunately for him, this is an entirely plausible, perhaps most likely scenario.

But if it doesn't... I think the demand might be able to finally pay off. We're getting pretty far down the list of hot Square requests and it's not like they don't know the demand is there.

 

[Speed Weed]

A. You're definition of "pretty big" is ridiculous. And B. But even that is only because he was a regular trophy in earlier games.

Smash fanbase in a nutshell:
1. Is shown a thing they've never heard of.
2. "That needs to be a character in Smash!"

If Coach from X was a Trophy, there'd be a Coach from X request thread...

For the record, Takamaru was never a trophy before Smash 4 - the most he got was a Sticker in Brawl, and there were countless other misc. Nintendo characters who also got stickers but never caught on like Takamaru did.

Even then, you can go to the Brawl-era boards on this site and already see a pretty notable show of Takamaru support, so his fanbase goes all the way back to the Brawl days (although he did get a lot more popular in the Smash 4 era), and that was a point where up until then, Murasame Castle had still gotten no content in Smash whatsoever.

This is to say that no I do not believe Takamaru's support was arbitrarily spawned by any number of trophies

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

What happened instead was mania, from which hostility bled, and I'm not sure if it actually did more good than harm.

It didn't.

Those within the Geno fanbase surely remember those times of mania well, but everyone else recognized the instability and volatility of the fanbase. It's that same instability and volatility that allowed fake leakers to prey on them and that created so much drama within the fanbase, ultimately leading to Smashboards staff cracking down on them.

As someone who's been part of a group that got cracked down on by staff here (any vets of the site can tell you that the 2019 Social Thread was WILDIN' before Staff came in–I would even say it was more of a big deal than the Geno Thread's drama due to how central it was to the site at the time, and how the issue bled over into NintenZone and even the main Speculation Thread) and has since had time to grow past the intense feelings of the time, it's more often than not for a good reason, and it ultimately doesn't do much to impact the site. After all, Smashboards is still here throughout it all, and here we all are still using it even now that DLC for Smash Ultimate is over.

I'm sure that with time the Geno fanbase from Smash Ultimate will be remembered for the unique conditions it was raised in and its intense rise before falling from grace, but for now I genuinely hope we don't see a reprisal of the toxicity that came out of the Geno fanbase during its height this speculation cycle.

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

smash 6 we're gonna see the return of the smash 4 early days support for non-specific action figure
View attachment 333916

Not Reckless Wii Safety Man, 0/10.

 

[Momotsuki]

...Would...
...Would Madotsuki qualify as a WTF pick? In the one singular alternate timeline where we got her in Ultimate.

 

[Idon]

...Would...
...Would Madotsuki qualify as a WTF pick? In the one singular alternate timeline where we got her in Ultimate.

Well considering WTF is generally the expression people get from playing her game, I would imagine so.

 

[Geno Boost]

oh no we are in page 2666 something bad might happen
Cacomallow will come at you

 

[Dinoman96]

oh no we are in page 2666 something bad might happen
Cacomallow will come at you

Cacomallow is so 2019

It's Geno Slayer now

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

oh no we are in page 2666 something bad might happen
Cacomallow will come at you

Cacomallow was technically right, it did predict DOOM and SMRPG costumes.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Cacomallow was technically right, it did predict DOOM and SMRPG costumes.

"I wish cacomallow would be real and Geno and Doomslayer would be in the game!"

a finger of the monkey's paw curls

 

[N3ON]

It didn't.

Those within the Geno fanbase surely remember those times of mania well, but everyone else recognized the instability and volatility of the fanbase. It's that same instability and volatility that allowed fake leakers to prey on them and that created so much drama within the fanbase, ultimately leading to Smashboards staff cracking down on them.

As someone who's been part of a group that got cracked down on by staff here (any vets of the site can tell you that the 2019 Social Thread was WILDIN') and has since had time to grow past the intense feelings of the time, it's more often than not for a good reason, and it ultimately doesn't do much to impact the site. After all, Smashboards is still here throughout it all, and here we all art still using it even now that DLC for Smash Ultimate is over.

I'm sure that with time the Geno fanbase from Smash Ultimate will be remembered for the unique conditions it was raised in and its intense rise before falling from grace, but for now I genuinely hope we don't see a reprisal of the toxicity that came out of the Geno fanbase during its height this speculation cycle.

I agree with all of that. It wasn't a good situation. I'm just trying to be measured when talking about the fanbase because they already don't like me and I want to actually get in some earnest dialogue instead of being brushed off as a hater, just for the sake of keeping things sane next time. Even without my presence.

Not that I'm saying you're a hater or anything, I just have a history of going in there and being contentious and challenging a lot of what was said, or disagreeing with Geno supporters when he was broached here, so I don't want to propagate the idea that I'm innately biased against Geno or his fanbase.

I've always maintained I'd be perfectly content seeing Geno included, and I've gone on record as saying SMRPG is my favourite SNES game. I just didn't walk away from playing it with the burning desire to see Geno in Smash, nor is he really on my list. But I certainly wouldn't be mad about it, I do think he's a cool character. It's just some of the reasoning employed in making his case, and the pretence from which theories are launched are often flawed or skewed, so there just ends up being a lot with which to disagree.

My real imparting advice for not just Geno, but every fanbase, is not to believe something just because you want it to be true. Keep your expectations that a character is out until proven in, and not vice versa, and then you won't be swept up by rhetoric and turned into an aggressive, baying acolyte.

 

[ForsakenM]

There can be a middle-ground, you know. It doesn't have to be 0 or 100. Neither feeling things are hopeless nor reading Geno in every little thing is a good idea for the state of the fanbase, frankly. Just... keep pushing ahead, but without losing your head. That's how Geno fans did it prior to like two years ago, and it was working well enough.

And not to be blunt, but what do you have to show for it that wouldn't have happened anyway? Fanbases don't need to turn into what the Geno fanbase turned into to be heard and be successful. With the Ridley, K. Rool, Isaac and eventually Banjo camps out of the way, you guys would've been uncontested in the diehard favourite space, and would've continued to gain popularity solely on that basis.

What happened instead was mania, from which hostility bled, and I'm not sure if it actually did more good than harm.

I never really saw it as mania, just as people who really felt the character had a good shot. I also know there were a lot of jokes mixed in with all of it that a lot of people took as Geno fans really thinking some things that were said. I just remember us memeing certain things that happened and saying that means Geno was in but then clarifying that it really doesn't mean anything and that they were joking, and then people outside the thread started taking even the things that were actually good for the character that we talked about and acting as if we were saying **** like saying the day being less cloudy today was good for Geno's chances. In other words, we made our own meme that kinda poked fun at us but not really, and then people outside of that took it incorrectly and changed the meme to just make fun of Geno fans no matter what. I know some small things we got overhyped for to be sure, but it really wasn't as crazy as people thought it was, and it was less of an echo chamber than it was made out to be...though not by too much, xD.

If you want the real mania, it was how often people came into the thread unprovoked just to **** on us. I get that people don't like to talk about victim mentality and stuff, but I think we can admit that people were kinda awful to each other just because they wanted a different character than themselves. Geno fans really felt the brunt of this at the time for a multitude of reasons, but to boil it all down, it was because we were numerous and supportive of a niche character. People felt like they were obligated to show up and say 'You're character is a nobody, don't you know that?' multiple times a week like half of us haven't wanted the character since 1996 and somehow magically forgot he only had one game that mattered. When you see this almost daily, you start to get defensive. Basically, people hated just like they always do for Smash, but because we were high in numbers and supported a niche character, they felt the need to bother us. This in turn made us defensive, thinking that people who meant no harm were trying to be asshats.

When you combine that with Geno being a character a lot of people can't get behind because of SMRPG very much being a product of it's time, lot of y'all in this thread got hella annoyed with us just being positive and always talking about the only character we want. This tends to happen when they get brought up all the time, but I gotta say I miss the days when people talked about his chances just in general. Sure, we are right now, but it was much more frequent and I know that sentiment won't be shared but as a Geno fan, people talking about him (even if it's straight hate) is still good because that means he's a part of popular discussion.

Also, if you are implying that the whole of the Geno fan base turned into something awful while others didn't, I gotta say I don't think that's fair presentation. Ridley fans got meme'd to hell to the point where they just gave up and then they finally got what they wanted long after. K. Rool fans did nothing but talk about and support him with tons of fan art and propaganda for the ballot, so I bet that could have gotten annoying when that propaganda undoubtedly got posted where it wasn't welcome. Banjo fans had more public support because it was more successful as a series with it's characters.

I just disagree with the fact that we would have been viewed well or that the Geno Thread did major harm about that. We already had the support for outsiders that we were gonna get and we haven't lost much of that support either, with people still hoping we get it next time around. Facts are facts, and if people think you don't know your place and that they know better, they will use the anonymity of the internet to drill it into you. We had groups from other websites that wanted our support to die out well before things got bad within out own group, and those people are partially responsible for that happening.

 

[Sucumbio]

And here I thought no one would notice.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

As someone who spent time in a support thread where much controversy occurred in Geno's and one where virtually none did in Dixie Kong's, I think I can give some perspective on how things managed to spiral in the former.

While the tendency of passions to override healthy skepticism and trusting far too much in wish fulfillment rumors was at the center of a lot of it, part of the issue was that there was a growing toxic dynamic between that thread and the newcomer one. Many times the latter were getting exposed to the worst elements of Geno's thread (often from misguided supporters) and as a result the overall impression became increasingly negative. Thus, there were more pointed remarks towards them and those in the support thread feeling (fairly or unfairly) targeted became more defensive, leading to appearances in the newcomer thread again to state their case, and the cycle began anew.

CacoMallow is a prototypical case of it, certainly clung to far past the point of credibility by certain fans, but also brought up here by others to make either a joke or some flimsy point, which then inflamed tensions even more, even when no actual person who believed it would be the one that mentioned it to begin with.

It's reminiscent of how some Adventure Era Sonic fans became increasingly sensitive about the endless criticism of that period of Sonic titles by reviewers, let's players, and Genesis era fans to the point where many of them in turn lashed out at Modern Sonic games and their fans, ironically echoing the kind of excess attacks that a certain subset of Classic fans once did about the Dreamcast releases.

 

[ForsakenM]

It didn't.

Those within the Geno fanbase surely remember those times of mania well, but everyone else recognized the instability and volatility of the fanbase. It's that same instability and volatility that allowed fake leakers to prey on them and that created so much drama within the fanbase, ultimately leading to Smashboards staff cracking down on them.

As someone who's been part of a group that got cracked down on by staff here (any vets of the site can tell you that the 2019 Social Thread was WILDIN' before Staff came in–I would even say it was more of a big deal than the Geno Thread's drama due to how central it was to the site at the time, and how the issue bled over into NintenZone and even the main Speculation Thread) and has since had time to grow past the intense feelings of the time, it's more often than not for a good reason, and it ultimately doesn't do much to impact the site. After all, Smashboards is still here throughout it all, and here we all art still using it even now that DLC for Smash Ultimate is over.

I'm sure that with time the Geno fanbase from Smash Ultimate will be remembered for the unique conditions it was raised in and its intense rise before falling from grace, but for now I genuinely hope we don't see a reprisal of the toxicity that came out of the Geno fanbase during its height this speculation cycle.

I really don't think Geno fans were that toxic until we were heavily trashed and provoked. Most of us just have a character we love who's chances are kinda low to return unless, like with Megaman and others, they see a revival through Smash so that people realize how cool they are and companies can see they are with supporting with new games.

Now, if you want to talk about toxic Geno fans, HOOO BOY Dec 2020 was just a floodgate. I didn't agree with it at all, but man I could understand it.

I mean, when you push so hard with the big wave you are riding only to basically lose it that hard, it's not just about that loss. Now the asshats who were mocking you all this time get to come back and be justified that the character didn't get in, even if it's not for the reasons they ever even claimed. It doesn't matter to them though nor to those who were neutral because you were wrong and they were right, so they will hold it over your head and make you feel worse than you already do. It's not like we could just peacefully say 'Yeah, it didn't happen, that's unfortunate.' and then eventually regroup: the Geno Thread and Geno support was at such a height that multiple websites had places dedicated to just flat-out mocking us over anything and everything. We don't get to have a peaceful acceptance of loss. For a war analogy, that would be like an army who was strong and, while a bit over-zealous for their cause, was capable and had everything going for it to win...only to lose at the most unlikely moment in what is mostly a very sound defeat. But, you don't get to take what is left of you to go home peacefully: you get mocked by over Tom, **** and Harry on the way back as if they all knew all along that you would lose when in reality neither them nor the army knew the context of the battlefield the entire time.

I really couldn't care less what people say about me. I'm okay with getting excited over what I love and accepting disappointment when things don't turn out exactly how I wished. I'm okay with being wrong and having that wrong statement on the internet forever. I can take those blows because I know I can't be right even half the time. Sure, I brag sometimes when I am right, but when I did that in here it was because I felt like I was viewed as some idiot trash panda who wanted to hug his puppet a bit too much then a person who strives to get as close to what we will actually get through speculation. When you feel like people already hate you from the get go, you probably will address them differently.

As someone who spent time in a support thread where much controversy occurred in Geno's and one where virtually none did in Dixie Kong's, I think I give some perspective on how things managed to spiral in the former.

While the tendency of passions to override healthy skepticism and trusting far too much in wish fulfillment rumors was at the center of a lot of it, part of the issue was that there was a growing toxic dynamic between that thread and the newcomer one. Many times the latter were getting exposed to the worst elements of Geno's thread (often from misguided supporters) and as a result the overall impression became increasingly negative. Thus there were more pointed remarks towards them and those in the support thread feeling (fairly or unfairly) targeted became more defensive, leading to appearances in the newcomer thread again to state their case, and the cycle began anew.

CacoMallow is a prototypical case of it, certainly clung to far past the point of credibility by fans, but also brought up here by others to make either a joke or some flimsy point, which then inflamed tensions even more, even when no actual person whom believed it was the one that mentioned it to begin with.

It's reminiscent of how some Adventure Era Sonic fans became increasingly sensitive about the endless criticism of that period of Sonic titles by reviewers, let's players, and Genesis era fans to the point where many of them in turn became unnecessarily hostile to Modern Sonic games and their fans, ironically echoing the kind of excess attacks that a certain subset of Classic fans once did about the Dreamcast releases.

I think this puts a bit too much blame on Geno fans, acting as if we instigated things from the beginning when it was really just us pushing a character people can't relate with and people got tired of us constantly popping in to say why X thing could work for Geno. I don't think we can blame people for being hype about the character as much as we can blame people who started being aggressive against them due to what they deemed over-exposure.

The rest I agree with though, and Geno fans aren't 100% innocent at all. We could have judged people on a case by case basis instead of at a certain point assuming people were out to treat us like crap. We could have toned things down whenever something came up sure, but I really don't place blame on that. I also can't blame much on the Ultimate train because things just really did look good for him until Sephiroth, and Geno fans basically hit reality after that. I suppose this is what happens when things look really good for you and you've been starving for something for 20 years or so: you get a little delirious and ride that high as long as you can.

EDIT: Speaking about feeling like being hated from the get-go, I just want to add that the Geno Thread often said never to come here because of how negative they were to Geno Fans. I did so anyway and man, the backlash was real. When I had popped in, you guys were already so ****ing sick of hearing about the puppet that it felt like a mosh pit of mockery. So, that was MY first experience with you all, basically walking in and talking about Geno but also other things and getting the massive 'Oh boy, looky here, another stupid ****ing Geno fan. God, can these guys just disappear already?!' vibes was definitely not the best first impression, and it made what the Geno Thread said ring true in this weird sort of self-fulfilling prophecy that I honestly do think it wasn't anyone's fault directly outside of trolls and haters.

 

[Powerman293]

TBH I could see a path for Geno in a Smash reboot. If Nintendo wanted to shake things up with character choice without resorting to bringing in the biggest third party characters, Geno would be a decent fit. It'd feel a bit too much like a repeat if we just got Cloud again in a Smash reboot as our 1 Square Enix character.

 

[Dan Quixote]

To reiterate, I think Geno's chances for the next Smash depend entirely on whether it's an Ultimate port or not, something far from certain.
If it has to be between him and bringing back Cloud, Hero, Sora, or whoever else... he's pretty much DOA. I don't think that cuts and potential fighters like Geno could coexist, the priorities just wouldn't line up for him. And unfortunately for him, this is an entirely plausible, perhaps most likely scenario.

But if it doesn't... I think the demand might be able to finally pay off. We're getting pretty far down the list of hot Square requests and it's not like they don't know the demand is there.

Picture this scenario instead: Smash becomes like other fighting games and has a sort of rotating roster so stuff like Geno being in Smash 6 without Sora happens, followed by Sora being back in Smash 7 without Geno.

Bet that would make everyone unhappy looool

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

To be fair, if one is asking for people in the newcomer thread not to judge Geno supporters by the actions of a few, then it seems only right to ask them not to necessarily view a few pointed posts in the former thread as indicative of all the regulars here or that every criticism/doubt about his inclusion was/is an attack.

Call this my experience as a Sonic fan (whose in fandom fights often makes the flamewars here seem tame by comparison) but one of the best things to do is being able to step back and realize that even when feeling you or your preferences are being hit, that very often it's just particularly loud people and/or those who aren't even trying to be negative. They could be the kind of passionate and dedicated fan you are of something else, but has just reached the point of frustration that a few words about Geno or whomever else is just them (albeit in not the most ideal fashion) blowing off steam about a topic they feel they've talked about to death or that no one is listening to them about

That's not to say one should roll over and embrace every critical thing said, just both that the motives and even intensity of such criticism can actually be very different when it's removed from the inflamed or emotional mood one encounters it in.

 

[ForsakenM]

Since Cacomallow has been brought up yet again and it wasn't by me, I'd just like to say that while I argued for it and then neither against nor for it for a while, it's such a weird thing to come back to. Like, by all means, I still don't regret my opinions on it at all, but thinking about it now is so surreal because it just never really ended up being anything at all. It seemed like such a big deal, but it never was, and it's just strange going over that upon reflection.

I have friends who spin theories about it even now, and the biggest one I hear at all is that if Deluxe is real Cacomallow still can be due to timing and work on an enhanced port having to start early enough for the Switch Pro, but I just can't be bothered with it anymore. Whether it ends up just a stupid mod prank or somehow actually real for a Deluxe, I just don't ****ing care anymore.

As a Geno fan and a Geno supporter, it just doesn't matter anymore one way or the other and I'd rather move on to things that mean more for speculation, both for Geno and for other characters, than this.

 

[BlondeLombax]

All this talk scares me about the possibility of Geno not just being shafted again next game, but being one of the new Assist Trophies, if not the absolute last revealed. I know how passionate his fans are, so something like that would ruffle more than all the feathers, and then some.

 

[Shroob]

Still blows me away that in 8 days, it'll be Sora time.