Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[HYRULESHERO42]

I think it'd be pretty anticlimactic for Sakurai to insist that Ultimate is going to be the grand end to a decades worth of development for Smash beginning with Smash 4...only for them to immediately start working on a new Smash game right after.

Don’t forget that Melee was supposed to be the last one. Then Brawl. Then Smash 4. I’m all for long waiting periods between releases but to say it’s over forever makes no sense from a company standpoint

 

[Dinoman96]

Don’t forget that Melee was supposed to be the last one. Then Brawl. Then Smash 4. I’m all for long waiting periods between releases but to say it’s over forever makes no sense from a company standpoint

This is a bit of a misconception. Sakurai has never said those games were "the last ones", he just means that he treats every game as if it were the last one.

I didn't really mean "it's over forever". I just think it's possible that they could give Smash a break for a good 5+ years and perhaps let Sakurai work on other projects in the mean time. Remember that in between Melee and Brawl, Sakurai made Kirby Air Ride and Meteos, and in-between Brawl and Smash 4, he made KI Uprising. 64 -> Melee and now Smash 4 -> Ultimate have been the only times where he jumped straight into a new Smash game right away after the last.

Though a lot of this depends on how much life the Switch has left in it.

 

[Sucumbio]

This is what I envision when I imagine this place... 50 Merovingians uttering "no, wrong" over and over again and in the most nasally voice possible. Carry on!

 

[CannonStreak]

About the Nintendo Direct that many are hoping that will happen this week, is it a bit strange for it to end up happening on the first day of September, as in, that early in September?

 

[Jondolio]

Nobody has to say anything, ever.

We're here to say things.

But all you're doing is shaming someone for liking certain things... I just don't see the point in that.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

I’ll give this a shot

• Who I want: Neku, Elma, Octoling or Off the Hook, Reimu, Ahri, Gunvolt, KOS-MOS, Phoenix, Yuri Lowell
• Who I think it’ll be: Octoling or someone totally left field that absolutely NOBODY predicted
• Who would be possible: ???
• Who’s unlikely: Neku, Elma, an Echo, an indie playable character (look at Sans, Cuphead and Shantae), another Namco character, another fighting game character, anyone outright explicitly deconfirmed
• Who would be funny: Off the Hook. Hear me out: we got Pyra/Mythra long after the Rex costume (they’re all part of a team); we got Kazuya long after the Heihachi costume (both Mishimas with Kazuya being arguably the cooler and hotter Mishima) AND we got Squid Sisters Miis last year. What if we got a different cephalopod idol duo as playable?? I prefer OtH to Squid Sisters anyway don’t @ me
• Who I don’t want: Bubsy, Jonesy, Ryu Hayabusa, Nahobino. The former two are self-explanatory and the latter two were ruined for me. And also Tracer cuz **** current day ActiBlizz (Crash is ActiBlizz too but Tracer and OW are more tied to the more problematic half of ActiBlizz)

 

[Wunderwaft]

About the Nintendo Direct that many are hoping that will happen this week, is it a bit strange for it to end up happening on the first day of September, as in, that early in September?

It's possible, though personally I think it'll happen next week.

With that said, I fully believe we'll get the Nintendo Direct before WarioWare releases in September 10 to give a last promotion to the game before it releases. It just makes sense from a marketing perspective.

 

[CannonStreak]

It's possible, though personally I think it'll happen next week.
View attachment 328346

With that said, I fully believe we'll get the Nintendo Direct before WarioWare releases in September 10 to give a last promotion to the game before it releases. It just makes sense from a marketing perspective.

Makes too much sense to deny. I can wait a bit longer for the Direct.

 

[PeridotGX]

I think Sakurai's going to work on something new after Ultimate, since he's been doing the series and only the series for three games. That game will start development in early 2022, and at the most optimistic will release in 2025 (development would only takes 3 years in this case, but would likely take longer). This means that unless Sakurai lets someone else work on Smash, we won't be seeing a new one until late this decade.

 

[Momotsuki]

Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

I totally get not thinking it's gonna happen - it probably isn't, but this is such a bizarre thing to be actively opposed to.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

I totally get not thinking it's gonna happen - it probably isn't, but this is such a bizarre thing to be actively opposed to.

I mean, an opinion's an opinion ig shrugs

 

[Jondolio]

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

Aight I'll try

• Who I want (separate of chance): Decidueye, Phoenix, Rayman, Isaac, Geno, Dixie Kong
• Who I think it'll be: Cinderace or any other Gen 8 Pokémon
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has a Mii Costume, Most non-promotional 1st parties, Decidueye
• Who would be funny: Master Chief. It'd be so funny since everyone expects the DLC to end on a whimper and then we get the biggest gaming icon not yet in Smash. It'd also be hype as ****
• Who I don't want: Any Gen 8 starter, Jonesy, Any Retro character. Most of them would just kind of irk me rather than outright anger me, I think. I don't believe in getting angry over character inclusions.

 

[Ivander]

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

• Who I want: Chosen Undead, Phantasy Star character, Wander, Monster Hunter
• Who I think it'll be: Phantasy Star character, Master Chief
• Who would be possible: Gordan Freeman, Saber, Master Chief, Jonesy
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone with a Mii Costume or who's series or 3rd Party company got a character this pass.
• Who would be funny: Kiran or Reginn from Fire Emblem Heroes.
• Who I don't want: Don't really have this for anybody aside from Jonesy, who's showing needs to do some good convincing on my part.

 

[Sucumbio]

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

Who I want: Jill Valentine
Who I think it'll be: A gen 8 Pokemon
Who would be possible: Geno
Who I feel is unlikely: also Geno
Who would be funny: Geno
Who I don't want: Geno

 

[SKX31]

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

• Who I want: Dota 2, Master Chief. But I'd be happy with most other choices.
• Who I think it'll be: If I was forced to answer I'd say Arle or Adol still. But it's open for practically anyone.
• Who I feel is unlikely: Outside of my first MW (and others that are completely obscure in Japan and / or the West)? Characters that give Sakurai "moveset trouble" - as vague as that is, he likes to see characters dance in his head remember - so something like Space Invader or other really atypical fighters (might be what Dante ran into). Also characters more complex than (which is likely where the Rex + Pyra / Mythra idea was scrapped) given the console's and game's limitations.
• Who would be funny: Any character that truely and utterly breaks the "WTF-o-meter". Like Dota 2.
• Who I don't want: Any actively trollish character, really. That leaves characters like Bubsy, which... yeah. Also, I'm confident that Sakurai won't go this route thankfully.

Also, well:

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

• Who I want: Sgt. Cortez and Axel Stone
• Who I think it'll be: Sgt. Cortez, Sora or Nahobino
• Who would be possible: Sol Badguy, Arle Nadja
• Who I feel is unlikely: Rayman, Waluigi. Master Chief, Phoenix Wright,
• Who would be funny: Yooka Laylee
• Who I don't want: Fortnite Guy, Reimu, Sabre, Frisk, Chosen Undead

 

[Garteam]

I don't think Smash is going ice for the better part of a decade if Sakurai decides he'd rather work on something else after Ultimate concludes development. Furukawa has said time and time again that Nintendo's competitive advantage lies in its IPs and Smash is one of their biggest. There's a reason why every Nintendo console since the Gamecube has had a Smash game on store shelves by end of the second year of its life. Smash moves hardware.

The series is too important to the suits and bean counters at the top to just go on an indefinite hiatus out of nowhere. Sakurai has a lot of clout in both Nintendo and the games industry as a whole, but even he couldn't convince Nintendo to basically sabotage the sales of their next console before it is even released. The show will go on, even if that means Sakurai only has an advisory role or no role at all.

 

[Theguy123]

If we get through September with no smash announcement where does speculation go from here.

Do we just start listing off fighters with basic movesets and just assume the last character would be as complicated as Steve was and needed a stage rework of some sorts.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

If we get through September with no smash announcement where does speculation go from here.

Do we just start listing off fighters with basic movesets and just assume the last character would be as complicated as Steve was and needed a stage rework of some sorts.

Problem is, there's no way of knowing who would or wouldn't be complex with their own mechanics

 

[Dan Quixote]

I totally get not thinking it's gonna happen - it probably isn't, but this is such a bizarre thing to be actively opposed to.

I don't get the point of being actively opposed to any new character tbh, it's new content

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I don't get the point of being actively opposed to any new character tbh, it's new content

I mean, that doesn't mean the new content is good per se

 

[Theguy123]

Problem is, there's no way of knowing who would or wouldn't be complex with their own mechanics

I guess but there’s gotta be some sort off fighters out there that either have complicated movesets in their original games or have a gimmick mechanic that’s not been done in smash yet and would be tricky to implement.

 

[MattX20]

Looks like we potentially have some major maintenance planned for next week. Big updates like this usually happen after a Direct https://twitter.com/NinStatusBot/status/1431111786783182851

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I guess but there’s gotta be some sort off fighters out there that either have complicated movesets in their original games or have a gimmick mechanic that’s not been done in smash yet and would be tricky to implement.

Idk man, Banjo and K.Rool have a gimmick yet everyone who wanted them said that they wouldn't have any gimmicks and a lot of people who wanted Ridley in the Smash 4 days thought of a flight gimmick yet Ridley has no gimmick

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Looks like we potentially have some major maintenance planned for next week. Big updates like this usually happen after a Direct https://twitter.com/NinStatusBot/status/1431111786783182851

And there’s maintenance THIS week too. Calling it; General Direct this week that has a teaser for the Smash Ultimate Final Video Presentation next week

CP11 will be revealed next week, not this week

 

[Dr. Jojo Phantasma]

Maybe they will finally add N64 or GBA titles.. Well one can hope.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Maybe they will finally add N64 or GBA titles.. Well one can hope.

I want GameCube…

 

[WeirdChillFever]

If we get through September with no smash announcement where does speculation go from here.

Do we just start listing off fighters with basic movesets and just assume the last character would be as complicated as Steve was and needed a stage rework of some sorts.

As said before, you can make anything and anyone as complex or basic as you want them to. My guesses however would be two-fold: A balancing/programming nightmare (of which I believe either a rhythm character or a duo character can be a culprit) or a new release that they couldn’t or didn’t want to start working on before the game was finalized or far enough in development.

Idk man, Banjo and K.Rool have a gimmick yet everyone who wanted them said that they wouldn't have any gimmicks and a lot of people who wanted Ridley in the Smash 4 days thought of a flight gimmick yet Ridley has no gimmick

The thing with K. Rool is even that people thought of plenty of gimmicks, especially when it comes to the noxious gasses or spiked cannonballs he shot from the Blunderbuss in DKC2. Sakurai just went with a different gimmick. He and Rosalina the Puppet Master are my favorite examples of why you cannot predict a fighter based on moveset, even aside from the plenty examples of Sakurai pulling a moveset out of his reset bomb forest for characters that didn’t have much to work with before.

 

[Theguy123]

Idk man, Banjo and K.Rool have a gimmick yet everyone who wanted them said that they wouldn't have any gimmicks and a lot of people who wanted Ridley in the Smash 4 days thought of a flight gimmick yet Ridley has no gimmick

to be fair with them though, k rool was base roster with dlc on the way and wasn’t the last character in the roster

and banjo wasn’t the last character in pass 1, he was the middle character and we had more dlc on the way

this is probably the last character with no more dlc on the way. Assuming we get through September with no update whatsoever on fp11 you gotta wonder if the character is as complicated as Steve was due to having a new mechanic or something that’s not been done in smash yet

 

[Dan Quixote]

I mean, that doesn't mean the new content is good per se

While true--I'd be opposed to a new fighter that's not fun to play as or against or a new stage that's not fun to play on, which we've definitely gotten from time to time lol--it's being opposed to the concept of new content separate from quality that I doubt I'll ever agree with.

 

[Dinoman96]

Banjo doesn't really have a "gimmick" as much as he has one gimmicky move. Wonderwing isn't really a universal gimmick the entire moveset is built around like K. Rool's belly armor, Sephiroth's one winged mode or Rosalina's luma partner.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

to be fair with them though, k rool was base roster with dlc on the way and wasn’t the last character in the roster

and banjo wasn’t the last character in pass 1, he was the middle character and we had more dlc on the way

this is probably the last character with no more dlc on the way. Assuming we get through September with no update whatsoever on fp11 you gotta wonder if the character is as complicated as Steve was due to having a new mechanic or something that’s not been done in smash yet

As far as I can remember the last character in pass 1 wasn’t exactly a game-breaker either, despite time travel reset shenanigans being a core part of their character in their source game.

 

[FreeFox]

I have a genuine question
View attachment 328339
How do we feel about the timeline where this happens and Metroid gets the same treatment as Kirby, Star Fox, Kid Icarus and FE, going from seen as underrepped to overrepped after a single game adding quite a bit of content?

More metroid. Give me EMMI, Mother Brain, Anthony Higgs, General Chozo, and Sylux.

Here's a thing I did for speculation on the last character:

• Who I want: Sora, Eggman, BWD (I'm more torn on Crash)
• Who I think it'll be: Anyone who hasn't been deconfirmed yet
• Who would be possible: No idea
• Who I feel is unlikely: Anyone who has been deconfirmed or otherwise may not make it
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright
• Who I don't want: Any Assist Trophy

• Who I want: Paper Mario and Isaac
• Who I think it'll be: Phoenix Wirght, New pokemon, Nahobino, another character with a relatively recent game on the switch
• Who would be possible: Master Chief
• Who I feel is unlikely: Asisst trophy upgrades. (I am sorry.)
• Who would be funny: Phoenix Wright/Rhythm Heaven Rep
• Who I don't want: Not into cellphone characters (due to stuff like microtransactions, dont like the business model).

 

[Theguy123]

As far as I can remember the last character in pass 1 wasn’t exactly a game-breaker either, despite time travel reset shenanigans being a core part of their character in their source game.

yeah but byleth didn’t take months and months to be announced. Terry was announced in November and then byleth was announced in January. The e difference there is 2 months as usual.

kazuya was released just before July and assuming we get through September without an update whatsoever it’ll be 4 months between the 2 at the minimum so you could probably start to wonder if the last character is as complicated as Steve was.

 

[CommanderZaktan]

Looks like we potentially have some major maintenance planned for next week. Big updates like this usually happen after a Direct https://twitter.com/NinStatusBot/status/1431111786783182851

Yep, we're getting a direct this week of the first days of September.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

yeah but byleth didn’t take months and months to be announced. Terry was announced in November and then byleth was announced in January. The e difference there is 2 months as usual.

kazuya was released just before July and assuming we get through September without an update whatsoever it’ll be 4 months between the 2 at the minimum so you could probably start to wonder if the last character is as complicated as Steve was.

Or it means development slowed down due to a smaller team with almost no work left, COVID spiking in Japan, etc

Banjo doesn't really have a "gimmick" as much as he has one gimmicky move. Wonderwing isn't really a universal gimmick the entire moveset is built around like K. Rool's belly armor, Sephiroth's one winged mode or Rosalina's luma partner.

It's still a mechanic that actively changes how he plays in a rather significant way, I don't get why this magically makes him gimmickless

 

[Eldrake]

I have a genuine question
View attachment 328339
How do we feel about the timeline where this happens and Metroid gets the same treatment as Kirby, Star Fox, Kid Icarus and FE, going from seen as underrepped to overrepped after a single game adding quite a bit of content?

I'd be completely okay with this.

 

[FreeFox]

Banjo doesn't really have a "gimmick" as much as he has one gimmicky move. Wonderwing isn't really a universal gimmick the entire moveset is built around like K. Rool's belly armor, Sephiroth's one winged mode or Rosalina's luma partner.

There is also the unique mechanic of Egg firing/Breegull Blaster. So, technically speaking, it would be two gimmicky moves rather than one.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

yeah but byleth didn’t take months and months to be announced. Terry was announced in November and then byleth was announced in January. The e difference there is 2 months as usual.

kazuya was released just before July and assuming we get through September without an update whatsoever it’ll be 4 months between the 2 at the minimum so you could probably start to wonder if the last character is as complicated as Steve was.

Yes, but first off there would be other possible scenarios other than balancing or development issues pertaining to the character. Recency, hype-draw-out, a general dwindling of resources, COVID spikes can all act up, seperately or together.

Secondly, who does and doesn’t have a moveset that derails development is not only hard to predict on a character-level (Hence the discussion on K. Rool having an unpredicted gimmick despite the biggest and brightest minds churning out fan movesets for years) but on a gimmick-level itself (Steve launched quite neatly within schedule, but it was Min Min who was delayed due to balancing issues, even though Steve needed a reprogram of the entire stage roster)

There’d be too many factors involved to turn a non-September release into a Nahobino vs Chorus Kids flame war in the trenches.

 

[MattX20]

And there’s maintenance THIS week too. Calling it; General Direct this week that has a teaser for the Smash Ultimate Final Video Presentation next week

CP11 will be revealed next week, not this week

Well, I'm not sure we're getting a final presentation like we did for 4. However, the possibility of FP11 not releasing in September does exist. There were 3 characters in particular that waited 2+months between reveals and releases. Joker was revealed on December 6th 2018 at the Game Awards that year, and it wouldn't be until April 17th of the following year. Banjo was revealed on June 11 2019, but wouldn't release until September 4th of that year. Finally, Terry was revealed on September 4th, but wouldn't release until November 6th.