Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I'd legit feel terrible for the Zelda fanbase.


"Congrats, you finally got a new character! It's another Zelda and yet another Triforce user. You're never getting stuff like Midna or Skull Kid now."

They were getting that before?

 

[pupNapoleon]

To some extent sure, but not nearly to the same extent as RPGs. Like, 2D and 3D platfomrers are pretty different due to the nature of the Z-axis, but at their core they're still about running and jumping around.

RPG's on the on the other hand can be turn based, tactical, real time, basically a hack n' slash, or Dark Souls. Since the bar for what constitutes an RPG is that the game's mechanics are stat driven, it's really become so diverse that I question why it's so broad in the first place. You may not like a handful of the major RPG categories, but I still don't think they should be grouped together in terms of appeal.

Maybe not all genres are as diverse- but some certainly are.
"Sports" can fall into any category of the sport.
"Simulators" can be a large variety- that take elements from many other genres.
"Action-Adventure" (where I would put Hack n Slash) goes in many directions.
"Party" can literally be a million things- I'd consider it the most diverse genre.

 

[Peripuff]

Speaking of Zelda, I had a dream the other day that the final fighter was Lana from Hyrule Warriors. I wonder what that would be like if it actually happened.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

What would your reaction be if Breath of the Wild Zelda was the last DLC fighter?

I mean. I love The Legend of Zelda.

More content is always a plus.

But a third form of Zelda would be... lame.

Like... Sheik is at least distinct enough that she's a fun addition. If more Zelda additions were like her, we'd be golden. She's grandfathered in as well.

I'll even defend Toon Link as an important and beloved part of the franchise.

But I really don't want ANOTHER Zelda.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I standby- the best thing for Zelda would be getting each of the Champions as separate characters. This would show how colorful Hyrule actually happens to be.

But I really don't want ANOTHER Zelda.

To all: What about Tetra?
I was actually hoping that she and echo Impa would have been in Ultimate as base additions (if not what I suggested above with the Champions).

 

[Swamp Sensei]

To all: What about Tetra?

Tetra is cool as she'd sting less than BotW Zelda but...

It's still another Zelda.

 

[FreeFox]

I standby- the best thing for Zelda would be getting each of the Champions as separate characters. This would show how colorful Hyrule actually happens to be.

To all: What about Tetra?
I was actually hoping that she and echo Impa would have been in Ultimate as base additions (if not what I suggested above with the Champions).

Agreed. It would not only show different combat styles but also different prominent races of the Zelda universe.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Maybe not all genres are as diverse- but some certainly are.
"Sports" can fall into any category of the sport.
"Action-Adventure" (where I would put Hack n Slash) goes in many directions.
"Party" can literally be a million things- I'd consider it the most diverse genre.

Some of these are because they're not meant to categorize gameplay, but rather, what they're about or what they're for. For example:

• Simulation games can be about literally anything. The genre is just to group together games that are made to be somewhat accurate to a real life thing while also being fun.
• The party genre is full of games that are easy to pick up and play, don't require much skill to succeed in, and allow for multiple players; in other words, they're good for parties where not everyone is a gamer.
• The sports genre is a lot like the simulation genre, but for sports. The game is the sport, though how accurate it is varies from game to game.

The Action-Adventure genre is the mother of all meaningless genres though. Like, what denotes an Action-Adventure game? The fact that there's action and adventure? That's practically everything! With a sports game you know it's going to be a sport. With a Party game, you'll probably assume it's a board game or a trivia game or some arcade style multiplayer game everyone can play, but action-adventure? Uncharted and Tomb Raider come to mind, but I could also be talking about Resident Evil, Darksiders, Paper Mario, Psychonauts, Bayonetta, Assassin's Creed, Ori and the Blind Forest...

OK. Genre rant over.

EDIT: Just to be clear, this post ceased to be a counterargument the moment I started ranting about the action-adventure genre. I just...really don't like that genre. lol

 

[Ivander]

Tetra is cool as she'd sting less than BotW Zelda but...

It's still another Zelda.

But she's a pirate. And you can't go wrong with pirates. And she'd be our first pirate character that isn't K. Rool's hat swap or Ridley being a "space pirate".

Edit: And yeah, she would be another Zelda, but one, I love Wind Waker, two, Tetra was very enjoyable and is one of my favorite versions of Zelda.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

And she'd be our first pirate character that isn't K. Rool's hat swap or Ridley being a "space pirate"

Isn't King K. Rool a pirate even when not in his Captain K. Rool persona?

 

[Ivander]

Isn't King K. Rool a pirate even when not in his Captain K. Rool persona?

I mean, yes he has a boat, but boats aren't exclusive to pirates. Nor was conquering and pillaging exclusive to pirates either.

 

[Inferno7]

I mean. I love The Legend of Zelda.

More content is always a plus.

But a third form of Zelda would be... lame.

Like... Sheik is at least distinct enough that she's a fun addition. If more Zelda additions were like her, we'd be golden. She's grandfathered in as well.

I'll even defend Toon Link as an important and beloved part of the franchise.

But I really don't want ANOTHER Zelda.

I feel the same way. When you also consider the sheer variety that they could pick from (Tingle, Skull Kid, Ghirahim, Midna, Impa, etc.) only to choose another Zelda (that is also aesthetically samey) would be lame

 

[DarthEnderX]

MegaTen isn't the same thing as Shin Megami Tensei.

It's the Mega Man to Mega Man X.

Are both considered RPGs despite having basically no gameplay similarities.

Dark Souls is about as much an RPG as God of War...

The collection will be beyond irrelevant by the time the final character is revealed.

Oh...like Arms? Or Xenoblade 2?

 

[Captain Shwampy]

I unironically want House of the Dead in Smash.

Series is rad.

Best option will always be Busujima, have him use all the weapons you can find in Zombie Revenge like the Drill, Machine Guns, Flame Thrower, etc. he can use several Martial Arts techniques and summon random Zombies from HOTD like Ebitan, Johnny, Bob, etc or go a step further and have the Mummies from Maze of Kings, KillerMan from Illbleed, or Jack from Deep Fear pop up too.

Howard and his daughter as a echo are a decent alternatives.

 

[Ivander]

Dark Souls is about as much an RPG as God of War...

Remember when getting numbers of something and getting stats or skills for your character for reaching the required number was simply called "Levelling Up"? Like getting 10 EXP Points to get a couple points in ATK, DEF and whatnot, sometimes even a skill? Or getting 100 Souls in one stat to increase it? Or getting 4 Heart Pieces to get 4 extra hit points?

But nah, all 3 of them are totally different from each other. Only real RPG use Level-Up, cause they say Level-Up or have Levels. The others look the same, but it's obviously not levelling up cause they don't use Level-Up or Levels.

 

[Merengue]

1989年のきょう『MOTHER』発売!! pic.twitter.com/AQbUCqnbQm

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) July 27, 2020

This was the tweet he shared last year for those curious.

damn. he didn't make a new one? what the hell

 

[DarthEnderX]

Oh man, has it already been six months since I last filled out this card?

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

It only just now hit me that the next Mr. Sakurai Presents will likely be the last time we see the man himself until the next Smash game in at least a decade, assuming he even comes back.

I mean he can always work on a sequel to Kid Icarus: Uprising or maybe work on another series in that time but like...

This is depressing.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Some of these are because they're not meant to categorize gameplay, but rather, what they're about or what they're for. For example:

• Simulation games can be about literally anything. The genre is just to group together games that are made to be somewhat accurate to a real life thing while also being fun.
• The party genre is full of games that are easy to pick up and play, don't require much skill to succeed in, and allow for multiple players; in other words, they're good for parties where not everyone is a gamer.
• The sports genre is a lot like the simulation genre, but for sports. The game is the sport, though how accurate it is varies from game to game.

The Action-Adventure genre is the mother of all meaningless genres though. Like, what denotes an Action-Adventure game? The fact that there's action and adventure? That's practically everything! With a sports game you know it's going to be a sport. With a Party game, you'll probably assume it's a board game or a trivia game or some arcade style multiplayer game everyone can play, but action-adventure? Uncharted and Tomb Raider come to mind, but I could also be talking about Resident Evil, Darksiders, Paper Mario, Psychonauts, Bayonetta, Assassin's Creed, Ori and the Blind Forest...

OK. Genre rant over.

EDIT: Just to be clear, this post ceased to be a counterargument the moment I started ranting about the action-adventure genre. I just...really don't like that genre. lol

Honestly, that's true with any genre.
A shooter is just a game that triggers the reward of point and target (theres a better phrase for this, but I'm not googling).
Simulators reward organization and micromanagement.
Platforms reward spacial awareness.
Party games reward real world interactions.
Action Adventure rewards exhilarance.
RPGs reward story and character investment.

 

[GoodGrief741]

To some extent sure, but not nearly to the same extent as RPGs. Like, 2D and 3D platfomrers are pretty different due to the nature of the Z-axis, but at their core they're still about running and jumping around.

RPG's on the on the other hand can be turn based, tactical, real time, basically a hack n' slash, or Dark Souls. Since the bar for what constitutes an RPG is that the game's mechanics are stat driven, it's really become so diverse that I question why it's so broad in the first place. You may not like a handful of the major RPG categories, but I still don't think they should be grouped together in terms of appeal.

That's because technically platformers are a subgenre of the action genre. Action games can mean anything from platformers to shooters to fighting games.

There is an argument to be made that all videogames can be placed in a three-way spectrum between action, RPG, and adventure (which also can encompass games as disparate as Breath of the Wild and Professor Layton). Game genre classification is fascinating.

 

[Super Devon]

I had this chart lying around on me PC for quite some time now that shows each company's fighter representation
So I decided to update it with the latest DLC, including the 1st party DLC

Spoiler: Big

Not great at photo editing, but yeah.

 

[zumaddy]

It only just now hit me that the next Mr. Sakurai Presents will likely be the last time we see the man himself until the next Smash game in at least a decade, assuming he even comes back.

I mean he can always work on a sequel to Kid Icarus: Uprising or maybe work on another series in that time but like...

This is depressing.

I'm gonna miss the Sakurai presents for sure. Each one had at least one good Sakurai meme and some had tons

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

It only just now hit me that the next Mr. Sakurai Presents will likely be the last time we see the man himself until the next Smash game in at least a decade, assuming he even comes back.

I mean he can always work on a sequel to Kid Icarus: Uprising or maybe work on another series in that time but like...

This is depressing.

I don’t know if the next game will be a decade out to be honest. As long as he doesn’t retire, I think we can expect to see him again in the next 4-5 years.

 

[Theguy123]

I had this chart lying around on me PC for quite some time now that shows each company's fighter representation
So I decided to update it with the latest DLC, including the 1st party DLC

Spoiler: Big

View attachment 324371

Not great at photo editing, but yeah.

Still can’t believe out of all the possible 1st party reps they could’ve gone with they went with byleth and min min.

 

[Willbuysmash4mw]

Oh...like Arms? Or Xenoblade 2?

They were meant to be in the base roster according to Sakurai himself.

You say my arguments for Nahobino are weak but this is just pathetic.

 

[RileyXY1]

They were meant to be in the base roster according to Sakurai himself.

You say my arguments for Nahobino are weak but this is just pathetic.

Yep. Pretty much. I don't expect them to add a character from a game that's not even out yet.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

It only just now hit me that the next Mr. Sakurai Presents will likely be the last time we see the man himself until the next Smash game in at least a decade, assuming he even comes back.

I mean he can always work on a sequel to Kid Icarus: Uprising or maybe work on another series in that time but like...

This is depressing.

This hits harder than it should.
Darn.

 

[Speed Weed]

View attachment 324367
Best option will always be Busujima, have him use all the weapons you can find in Zombie Revenge like the Drill, Machine Guns, Flame Thrower, etc. he can use several Martial Arts techniques and summon random Zombies from HOTD like Ebitan, Johnny, Bob, etc or go a step further and have the Mummies from Maze of Kings, KillerMan from Illbleed, or Jack from Deep Fear pop up too.

Howard and his daughter as a echo are a decent alternatives.

the virgin putting zobio and zobiko as the HotD rep in your SEGA fighting game roster cause they were in all-stars racing i guess vs. the CHAD putting busujima as the HotD rep in your SEGA fighting game roster

People who put Agent G as the rep are somewhere in the middle and people who have Isaac Washington as the rep are on a higher plane of existence

 

[Willbuysmash4mw]

Yep. Pretty much. I don't expect them to add a character from a game that's not even out yet.

It will be out before we get the final character.

“It will come out before the end of the year” doesn’t translate to September or October. This is November at the earliest.

 

[RileyXY1]

It will be out before we get the final character.

“It will come out before the end of the year” doesn’t translate to September or October. This is November at the earliest.

I don't expect the new character that late unless they specifically save the reveal for TGA, which I highly doubt unless the final fighter is on Steve levels of complexity.

 

[Mamboo07]

Still can’t believe out of all the possible 1st party reps they could’ve gone with they went with byleth and min min.

For Min-Min, ARMS was gonna get a fighter but was too late for base roster.
(Same thing with Xenoblade 2)

 

[Theguy123]

It will be out before we get the final character.

“It will come out before the end of the year” doesn’t translate to September or October. This is November at the earliest.

I’m assuming we’re on about SMT 5 being the final spot.

SMT 5 has a release date of November 12th.

According to samus Hunter who you may or may not believe in, is confident the next direct will be in the first week or 2 of September which is where we’ll probably see our next character.

September being 2 months off November there’s no way we’re getting the SMT 5 protag as the last character.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

I don't expect the new character that late unless they specifically save the reveal for TGA, which I highly doubt unless the final fighter is on Steve levels of complexity.

Or, just a super big name character that would be big enough to pull more non-Nintendo folks into smash or something...
Not saying that's likely at all, just saying it's another possibility.

 

[RileyXY1]

Or, just a super big name character that would be big enough to pull more non-Nintendo folks into smash or something...
Not saying that's likely at all, just saying it's another possibility.

They've never made us wait that long between releases in the same pass.

 

[Willbuysmash4mw]

I don't expect the new character that late unless they specifically save the reveal for TGA, which I highly doubt unless the final fighter is on Steve levels of complexity.

Considering this is the end of Smash Ultimate and the 3rd anniversary is during that time I kind of expected December anyway. Ending it in September or October or even November is just killing the hype of the game before it can reach that milestone for really no reason.

There is literally no reason to expect a character in September or October other than impatience or falsely believing every character release has to follow a pattern.

The only thing we could get earlier than November is an announcement similar to Min Min where they say the series the character is from during the fall Nintendo direct before the character is revealed later, and that would make the character obvious before it comes out.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

They've never made us wait that long between releases in the same pass.

If I understand what you're saying, then yes you're right.
I was thinking more on the lines of the reveals themselves.
In Pass 1, there was a 6 month gap between knowing that Joker was Cp1 (December 2018) and knowing that Hero was Cp2 (June 2019). Yes, we did get both Plant and Joker released within that gap, but my point still stands.

The biggest FP2 gap I can think of was the gap between knowing that Pythra was Cp9 (February 2021) and knowing that Kazuya was Cp10 (June 2021), which was 4 months.

Though a 6 month gap or something is still possible for Cp11.

Maybe we could get surprised bonus content out of nowhere like a surprise random stage (like Small Battlefield) along said gap.

 

[Willbuysmash4mw]

I’m assuming we’re on about SMT 5 being the final spot.

SMT 5 has a release date of November 12th.

According to samus Hunter who you may or may not believe in, is confident the next direct will be in the first week or 2 of September which is where we’ll probably see our next character.

September being 2 months off November there’s no way we’re getting the SMT 5 protag as the last character.

September isn’t “before the end of the year” and it certainly doesn’t warrant Sakurai saying “it will take a while”, that is literally the average length between fighters.

We are not getting the character in September even if we get a direct(which will feature SMT V more heavily than just about any other game btw).

They've never made us wait that long between releases in the same pass.

That literally doesn’t matter.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Considering this is the end of Smash Ultimate and the 3rd anniversary is during that time I kind of expected December anyway. Ending it in September or October or even November is just killing the hype of the game before it can reach that milestone for really no reason.

There is literally no reason to expect a character in September or October other than impatience or falsely believing every character release has to follow a pattern.

There’s also no reason to believe that Nintendo is going to wait for an anniversary of the game when they’ve had a dramatic tendency to ignore anniversaries entirely. It’s all baseless speculation but one thing we do know is that, in Nintendo’s near 10-year tenure of doing Nintendo Directs, late August to early October has always been a busy period for Directs and the characters so far in this pass have been revealed and released within a 2-3 month period of each other. Even in the Pandemic Year of 2020 we got, what, 4 directs in that same time period?

It seems more likely for them to reveal and release the last character within an August-October time period than for them to hold off a well finished character for an arbitrary date or event in December.

 

[Theguy123]

September isn’t “before the end of the year” and it certainly doesn’t warrant Sakurai saying “it will take a while”, that is literally the average length between fighters.

We are not getting the character in September even if we get a direct(which will feature SMT V more heavily than just about any other game btw).

That literally doesn’t matter.

You’re basing the last character being announced towards the end of the year based on a statement said by sakurai that doesn’t even give a timeframe.

When he said “it will take a while” he said that in June. By the time we hit September it’ll have been over 3 months since he said that.

I don’t understand how 3 months isn’t awhile.

We ain’t waiting till around December or November for an announcement there’s no evidence for that whatsoever, only a statement you seem to be taking well out of context.

 

[RileyXY1]

There’s also no reason to believe that Nintendo is going to wait for an anniversary of the game when they’ve had a dramatic tendency to ignore anniversaries entirely. It’s all baseless speculation but one thing we do know is that, in Nintendo’s near 10-year tenure of doing Nintendo Directs, late August to early October has always been a busy period for Directs and the characters so far in this pass have been revealed and released within a 2-3 month period of each other. Even in the Pandemic Year of 2020 we got, what, 4 directs in that same time period?

It seems more likely for them to reveal and release the last character within an August-October time period than for them to hold off a well finished character for an arbitrary date or event in December.

Yep. It would be weird if Smash was completely absent from the expected September direct.