Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Firox]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

We don't currently have any gunner-type characters from the DLC. I'd love to see a mobile gunner-type character, a zoner that isn't too overly spammy but capable of scrapping at long range or close range.

For risk of heavy archetype fatigue, I really don't want to see another swordie unless they are vastly different from the rest. Maybe something more magic based, or a combination of multiple weapons like guns/melee weapons.

 

[Technomage]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

Oh, and I'd also be interested in a close-range fighter that specializes in countering projectile-users.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Well, I don't want anymore Marth or Link archtypes.

I don't really care for any sword archtypes, but I would like a vibroblade-user. We got all other kinds of mechanical melee weapons (buzzsaws, chainsaws, drills, rocket hammers, and lightsabers); now all that's missing are vibroblades (yeah, I know that Gray Fox uses a vibroblade, but he's not playable).

If you don’t mind me asking, what is a Vibroblade? I looked it up and keeps telling me about Star Wars. Is it a vibration blade?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.

At first I read "Raging Demons" so I was very confused.

Oh, and I'd also be interested in a close-range fighter that specializes in countering projectile-users.

So...literally all rush-down characters not named Little Mac?

If you don’t mind me asking, what is a Vibroblade? I looked it up and keeps telling me about Star Wars. Is it a vibration blade?

Probably just a sword that vibrates to cut better or something, which is funny because that wouldn't translate to any mechanical difference whatsoever. Doesn't even look different if Grey Fox is any indication.

EDIT: Hmm...I feel like I'm being unnecessarily snarky here.

 

[Firox]

Probably just a sword that vibrates to cut better or something, which is funny because that wouldn't translate to any mechanical difference whatsoever. Doesn't even look different if Grey Fox is any indication.

EDIT: Hmm...I feel like I'm being unnecessarily snarky here.

No, your point is pretty valid. I was thinking the same thing. At the end of the day, a long, disjointed metal cutting tool is a long, disjointed metal cutting tool. Regardless of the mechanism, it translates to a moveset that we've generally seen at least 18 times before. There's really only so much that can be done to give uniqueness to swinging a sword around.

 

[RoboFist]

Nintendo just wants their brands to be safe and marketable, especially since they're planning on opening a bunch of theme park areas at Universal and making movies and what not.

It's sad, but it's clear to me the company views the weird/experimental area of the GCN as their edgy teenage years that they've been trying to move away from for some time now.

Spoiler: Rant unrelated to the topic at hand

Their Gamecube era really hit them hard, sure, but I think they swung the pendulum way too hard in the other direction with the Fisher Price Wii era, defined by ultra-safe family games and an emphasis on cuteness and accessibility. Yeah, the Wii was a runaway success with families, but it really damaged their reputation with both older gamers and third-party publishers alike. The WiiU proved how bad the Wii branding really was in the long run.

They've just shed that branding and it's miraculous that the Switch ended up being such a phenomenal successor. And you can see that Nintendo is trying to recapture a wider audience with the Switch's marketing and even the games they're pushing (Witcher 3 and Doom Eternal getting such clean ports, initially pushing Splatoon as this enormous esport, etc).

I think the Switch is the perfect console for them to chase that "as wide an audience as possible" dream, but to then insist on your biggest in-house games to be as bizarrely safe as Nintendo wants them to be just doesn't make sense. Why can't we have a lighthearted platforming Mario like in Odyssey and a more white-knuckle Mario in Strikers?

Or, if you want to keep Mario your safe Mickey Mouse mascot, why are they depriving older fans of alternatives? Why refuse to make another F-Zero and make Mario Kart our only racing option? Why not extend the Splatoon license and make more hardcore sport titles out of that universe instead of exclusively developing easy mode versions of tennis and soccer?

Especially, as people have mentioned, since Ultimate's Mario walks with a menacing hunch and is always portrayed as borderline bloodthirsty haha. I just don't get it...

BUT this is not the thread for this talk! Here's my biggest question: I think we'll get one PC rep before Smash Ultimate is wrapped up. The global appeal is too huge for Nintendo to ignore. Who do you think they'd go with?

My money's on either Thrall from WoW or Chell from Portal. One is arguably one of the biggest faces in MMO history, the other is the most Nintendo-friendly icon from one of PC's most iconic developers. Discuss!

 

[GreninjaMarth]

Call me crazy, but maybe Silent Hill.

Edit: Okay, Okay, I'll elaborate. The town of Silent Hill is a key part of the games, so obviously, it's somewhere there. My personal thought has always been a stage taking place on some street in Silent Hill, with the stage switching between a foggy "normal" (but not really) version and a metal, dark, rusty even-freakier version. In any case, I can't really see the stage being called anything other than Silent Hill.

Like I said ~ I have little knowledge of Silent Hill. I was more so asking what could work as a stage. I do think that’s a neat idea.

 

[Shovel Knight]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

We are kind of missing rushdown characters in this FP, so I could definitely go for that.

 

[SharkLord]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

A dedicated grappler would be nice. Smash doesn't seem to have too many of those, so it would help shake things up a bit.
Not necessarily an archetype, but I'd like another more simple character in this pass, without any crazy gimmicks slapped on. Sephiroth was nice because he didn't have any gauges or unique inputs, and even with his Winged Form I usually die before I get to use it. Still, some more simpler characters would be nice, especially seeing as Sephiroth has that crazy range on his sword.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

No, your point is pretty valid. I was thinking the same thing. At the end of the day, a long, disjointed metal cutting tool is a long, disjointed metal cutting tool. Regardless of the mechanism, it translates to a moveset that we've generally seen at least 18 times before. There's really only so much that can be done to give uniqueness to swinging a sword around.

I didn't doubt the validity of my point, I just think that I could have been nicer about it in conjunction with my previous statement.

 

[SvartWolf]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

I want a shoto character :D... particulary one that have bat wings, from a cult clasic dead franchise and is also a succubus.

 

[Firox]

I didn't doubt the validity of my point, I just think that I could have been nicer about it in conjunction with my previous statement.

Ah, I see. Well, it's always nice to sound nicer.

 

[PeridotGX]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

this isn't a gameplay archetype, but I think it's about time for us to get a magic user. Not Zelda/Hero type magic, but spells and staffs and stuff.

give us kamek

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Spoiler: Rant unrelated to the topic at hand

Their Gamecube era really hit them hard, sure, but I think they swung the pendulum way too hard in the other direction with the Fisher Price Wii era, defined by ultra-safe family games and an emphasis on cuteness and accessibility. Yeah, the Wii was a runaway success with families, but it really damaged their reputation with both older gamers and third-party publishers alike. The WiiU proved how bad the Wii branding really was in the long run.

They've just shed that branding and it's miraculous that the Switch ended up being such a phenomenal successor. And you can see that Nintendo is trying to recapture a wider audience with the Switch's marketing and even the games they're pushing (Witcher 3 and Doom Eternal getting such clean ports, initially pushing Splatoon as this enormous esport, etc).

I think the Switch is the perfect console for them to chase that "as wide an audience as possible" dream, but to then insist on your biggest in-house games to be as bizarrely safe as Nintendo wants them to be just doesn't make sense. Why can't we have a lighthearted platforming Mario like in Odyssey and a more white-knuckle Mario in Strikers?

Or, if you want to keep Mario your safe Mickey Mouse mascot, why are they depriving older fans of alternatives? Why refuse to make another F-Zero and make Mario Kart our only racing option? Why not extend the Splatoon license and make more hardcore sport titles out of that universe instead of exclusively developing easy mode versions of tennis and soccer?

Especially, as people have mentioned, since Ultimate's Mario walks with a menacing hunch and is always portrayed as borderline bloodthirsty haha. I just don't get it...

BUT this is not the thread for this talk! Here's my biggest question: I think we'll get one PC rep before Smash Ultimate is wrapped up. The global appeal is too huge for Nintendo to ignore. Who do you think they'd go with?

My money's on either Thrall from WoW or Chell from Portal. One is arguably one of the biggest faces in MMO history, the other is the most Nintendo-friendly icon from one of PC's most iconic developers. Discuss!

If we got a PC rep, it’d be a TF2 character (Probably Heavy), Gordon Freeman, or a WoW character (Don’t know enough to talk about it)
I can’t see Chell working, shes a problem solver moreso than a fighter.
But, since Portal and Half Life are in the same universe, Gordon Freeman with an Aperture Science stage?
I really want a Portal stage, Sentry turrets blocking off with line of sight, Portals strewn everywhere to make insane launches, all whilst GladOS could be in the background insulting you. There could even be a Palutenas Guidance or Snakes Codecs thing where she talks about each fighter.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Hey Sakurai, if you like redesigning Wolf so much, how about you make a Star Fox game..?

He already made a Star Fox game, it's called Kid Icarus Uprising.

 

[pupNapoleon]

You know, some people claim Ryu Hayabusa is the last NES All Star MIA from the roster. But most people in this community forget about Bill Rizer/Lance Bean from Contra, Arthur from Ghost 'N Goblins, Jimmy Lee/Billy Lee from Double Dragon, and Rash, Zitz, and Pimple from Battletoads. It's surreal these iconic characters don't have a big or notable support base in the Smash community with how big their games were on the NES. Literally, these guys along with Ryu Hayabusa are the last remaining big NES All Stars.

What about

• Excite Bike
• Balloon Fight
• Clu Clu Land
• Bubble Bobble
• Mach Rider

etc

 

[3BitSaurus]

BUT this is not the thread for this talk! Here's my biggest question: I think we'll get one PC rep before Smash Ultimate is wrapped up. The global appeal is too huge for Nintendo to ignore. Who do you think they'd go with?

Why, hello there. May I interest you in taking a peek at the threads in my sig?

...If not, just to give a quick TLDR: I think a League rep is more likely than people give it credit for. Tencent (Riot Games, and thus LoL's owner) is really buddy-buddy with Nintendo as of now, both helping the Switch's Chinese lauch and developing Pokémon Unite; we know people at Riot like Smash enough to make an internal Brawl mod starring League characters; then there's Riot trying to branch out into different genres and playerbases, which includes at least one game confirmed for the Switch.

Now that I did the obligatory thread-plugging, I gotta say that I'm unsure about the chances of a Blizzard or Valve rep. I say unsure as in I literally have no idea where they stand. But I do know that Gordon Freeman and/or a WoW rep would please a lot of people.

EDIT: Gotta add a Dota 2 rep and the other Blizzard powerhouses to that boat too, of course.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

A dedicated grappler would be nice. Smash doesn't seem to have too many of those, so it would help shake things up a bit.

Super Smash Bros.'s grapplers are kinda weird. We have about 10 of them, but I'm sure most people would argue that we only have 1 or 2 pure grapplers, as Donkey Kong and Bowser are really the only one with a grab as thier win conditions, albeit not their only ones. It's probably why they're usually refered to as super heavyweights instead. They also tend to have really wonky balancing across their movesets, like with King Dedede, Bowser Jr., and Ridley having odd cohesion issues, and King K. Rool having a few moves that are weirdly undertuned.

We've seen what DLC zoners and balanced characters can do, so it would be interesting to see a DLC rush-down and grappler would be like.

 

[SharkLord]

Super Smash Bros.'s grapplers are kinda weird. We have about 10 of them, but I'm sure most people would argue that we only have 1 or 2 pure grapplers, as Donkey Kong and Bowser are really the only one with a grab as thier win conditions, albeit not their only ones. It's probably why they're usually refered to as super heavyweights instead. They also tend to have really wonky balancing across their movesets, like with King Dedede, Bowser Jr., and Ridley having odd cohesion issues, and King K. Rool having a few moves that are weirdly undertuned.

We've seen what DLC zoners and balanced characters can do, so it would be interesting to see a DLC rush-down and grappler would be like.

And Incineroar, he was touted as having stronger throws because of him being a wrestler. Pretty sure he counts too.

 

[Technomage]

If you don’t mind me asking, what is a Vibroblade? I looked it up and keeps telling me about Star Wars. Is it a vibration blade?

Yeah, it is a Star Wars thing, but not exclusively. It also refers to things like the gunblades from Final Fantasy 8 and Drive Blades from Etrian Odyssey 4. For more info on what they are, check out this page:

Vibroweapon - TV Tropes

A futuristic bladed weapon that has Absurd Cutting Power because it vibrates. The idea is that high-frequency vibrations in the blade allow the weapon to cut through nearly anything, essentially making it an electric turkey carver turned Up to …

tvtropes.org

So...literally all rush-down characters not named Little Mac?

Yeah, I guess. The fighter could also come with a reflector like the Hero's Bounce spell.

No, your point is pretty valid. I was thinking the same thing. At the end of the day, a long, disjointed metal cutting tool is a long, disjointed metal cutting tool. Regardless of the mechanism, it translates to a moveset that we've generally seen at least 18 times before. There's really only so much that can be done to give uniqueness to swinging a sword around.

Well, there is the exception of the Drive Blades, which deal a LOT of damage while they vibrate, but it also renders them overheated, making their engines unusable for a while (they can also use cartridges that charge their blades with elemental energy while they vibrate). Here's how different a Drive Blade would be from a normal sword:

Imperial

Loyal knights who use a unique drive blade. Attacks with it can be devastating, but place a heavy burden on its inner workings. —Imperial description, Etrian Odyssey IV The Imperial centers on mastery of the unique properties of the Drive Blade. These are large and heavy two-handed swords with...

etrian.fandom.com

Drive Blade

The Drive Blade is the favored weapon of the Imperial Class in Etrian Odyssey IV: Legends of the Titan. It is a heavy, 2-handed weapon with a powerful motor built into the blade and the ability to utilize cartridges to boost its damage output or allow for elemental strikes. Though the weapon...

etrian.fandom.com

But you and your friend are right about the other kinds of vibroblades.

 

[SharkLord]

If you don’t mind me asking, what is a Vibroblade? I looked it up and keeps telling me about Star Wars. Is it a vibration blade?

Pretty much any weapon that vibrates to increase cutting power. Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance has a lot of them, so if anyone wants a vibroblade in Smash start supporting Raiden

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Pretty much any weapon that vibrates to increase cutting power. Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance has a lot of them, so if anyone wants a vibroblade in Smash start supporting Raiden

Later...

31ε Raiden

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Meanwhile SEGA don't really have any other highly requested characters.

Source

 

[chocolatejr9]

Source

I don't know, only one of those Puyos looks mad...

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

A summoner that battles by bringing her paintings to life!

Alternatively, just a summoner. We don't have anybody with a strong focus on that style. Dedede came the closest in Brawl, but has since lost the niche of his Side B. Since then, Zelda has been the only one with the basics of a potential summoner for the last two games. With other characters like Pokémon Trainer and the Mario princesses having gimmicks or caveats that don't make them count. Basically, we've only had two simple summoners that never paralleled. There's certainly room for more.

As for archetypes I don't want, it would be nice if they never repeated Marth's niche or aesthetic ever again. But that's because they've been doing so a lot, which is also why it's fruitless to object to it.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Alternatively, just a summoner. We don't have anybody with a strong focus on that style. Dedede came the closest in Brawl, but has since lost the niche of his Side B. Since then, Zelda has been the only one with the basics of a potential summoner for the last two games. With other characters like Pokémon Trainer and the Mario princesses having gimmicks or caveats that don't make them count. Basically, we've only had two simple summoners that never paralleled. There's certainly room for more.

Hmm...Isn't Olimar technically a summoner?

 

[JOJONumber691]

A character as Brutal as Doomguy would be hilarious lol.

 

[pupNapoleon]

A character as Brutal as Doomguy would be hilarious lol.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

We need more gunner characters.
are all we have.
And that is something that my dude Cortez can bring to this Fighters Pass!

Time to Split!

 

[JOJONumber691]

haha laugh.

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

Hmm...Isn't Olimar technically a summoner?

Although he has some summoning elements to his Neutral B, I would overall count him more as a puppeteer, in the same vein as Rosalina. The Pikmin are bound to his commands. But there's also some truth to the fact that I forgot about him.

I also somehow forgot to bring up that Sakurai seemed adamant about simplifying summoning elements in Smash 4. But that was 7 years ago, surely this idea can change... right??

 

[JOJONumber691]

Although he has some summoning elements to his Neutral B, I would overall count him more as a puppeteer, in the same vein as Rosalina. The Pikmin are bound to his commands. But there's also some truth to the fact that I forgot about him.

I also somehow forgot to bring up that Sakurai seemed adamant about simplifying summoning elements in Smash 4. But that was 7 years ago, surely this idea can change... right??

Olimar NEEDS a Redesign animation wise on an objective level.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Not like Chun Li showing up and doing the Kikoken, Lightning Kick and Spinning Bird Kick (CERO willing) wouldn't have made sense either for an AT.

True, but she'd be a more generic "jump-around-and-do-one-of-three-random-attacks" AT than one that references a campy playstyle.

FP2 is fully or partially based around character who missed their shot

In Sephiroth's case, I don't think it's him who missed the shot, but the music and spirits he came with.

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

I hope at least one rushdown character makes it in.

 

[CapitaineCrash]

Nintendo just wants their brands to be safe and marketable, especially since they're planning on opening a bunch of theme park areas at Universal and making movies and what not.

It's sad, but it's clear to me the company views the weird/experimental area of the GCN as their edgy teenage years that they've been trying to move away from for some time now.

To be fair with the cost of video game development being way higher than ever before it's way harder for developpers to try more experimental stuff. This isn't a Nintendo specific problem but many other studio. If you look at Sony ps1, ps2 and psp games you have Parappa the rapper, Ape escape, Locoroco, Patapon, Wild arms, Amplitude, Vib ribbon, War of the monsters etc. But now with the cost of game being extremely high, they need to make saffer project, which is why most of their ps4 exclusive are Action/adventure game.

A summoner that battles by bringing her paintings to life!

Alternatively, just a summoner. We don't have anybody with a strong focus on that style. Dedede came the closest in Brawl, but has since lost the niche of his Side B. Since then, Zelda has been the only one with the basics of a potential summoner for the last two games. With other characters like Pokémon Trainer and the Mario princesses having gimmicks or caveats that don't make them count. Basically, we've only had two simple summoners that never paralleled. There's certainly room for more.

As for archetypes I don't want, it would be nice if they never repeated Marth's niche or aesthetic ever again. But that's because they've been doing so a lot, which is also why it's fruitless to object to it.

A great summoner would be Andy from Advance wars. He would be a more defense type character who's pretty weak at first, but can summon tanks and infantry to help him.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Although he has some summoning elements to his Neutral B, I would overall count him more as a puppeteer, in the same vein as Rosalina. The Pikmin are bound to his commands. But there's also some truth to the fact that I forgot about him.

I also somehow forgot to bring up that Sakurai seemed adamant about simplifying summoning elements in Smash 4. But that was 7 years ago, surely this idea can change... right??

Oh you meant characters like Dizzy. I understand now.

Olimar NEEDS a Redesign animation wise on an objective level.

Honestly he probably doesn't need that many changes. The problem mostly lies in his Smash Attacks, Side Special, Grab, and Dash Grab, So I think they can be solved by:

• Having him lean out on his point for his Grab and Dash Grab, with him skidding to a stop with his dash grab. Alternitively could use a different whistle animation.
• Having a ton of overshoot on his Forward Smash animation. Like, so much he almost falls over. EDIT: Actually that'd probably be more follow-through but you know what I mean.
• Having his Up Smash be an underhand throw rather than just a point upward. Makes more logical sense that way too.
• Having him hop at the start of his Down Smash animation.
• After that, the Side Special animation can be left unchanged.

 

[JOJONumber691]

What character archetypes would you want and not want?
I’m kinda done with Range Demons, Sephiroth is just right for me and I despise Min Min.
I could go for another projectile zoner, we don’t have any of those for DLC (I don’t think).

I really hope we get another Rushdown Character, or a Gun based character like . Or a mix of both, like a Certain Lover of Isabelle I know.

Rip and Tear Mother!#@#@!#$@##$!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I really hope we get another Rushdown Character, or a Gun based character like . Or a mix of both, like a Certain Lover of Isabelle I know.

I would so love to see his Glory Kill be a command grab where he beats up his opponent with a semi-character specific animation. I wanna see him yeet Bowser Jr. out of his Jr. Clown Car, and then shoot him with its cannon ball attachment, swing Ridley and Bowser by the tail, dribble Kirby and Meta Knight like a basket ball, and stab the swordfighters with their own blade.

 

[Gengar84]

My favorite types of characters to play in Smash are the slow powerhouse characters. Ganondorf has been my main since Melee and it would be cool to get some other heavy characters. I know Ganondorf is considered bad but I'm a purely casual player and I enjoy using him.

 

[blackghost]

It wouldn't be accurate to say that no one was talking about Simon before Vergeben.

But there's also been some revision as to how much people had talked about him, or how popular a candidate he was.

He was never a staple of conversation as the most popular characters generally are. He was more an intermittent topic, somewhat closer to the dark horses. I know Sakurai has stated his inclusion was due to the ballot, and I don't doubt that, but I also think the following "plus there were limited options" did some of the lifting as well.

but smash speculation does this ALOT. we sit here and argue about lower-tier popular characters like reimu when all of smash DLC is either major videogame legends or Nintendo corporate picks. like now people are trying to push back against pokemon being a possible DLC character.

in terms of popularity, the least popular character I could see getting in (in terms of sales of their series not arbitrary fan polls) is someone like Ori or hollow knight. Characters like ahri, someone from blizzard, or a pokemon ARE very likely its mostly denial that causes people to ignore them. that and many people here only play games on one system made by a handful of companies they don't really get the landscape of gaming.

i say Ori because I think he fits better in smash than master chief and its an IP that Microsoft actually really loves.
Ahri is the mascot of one of the most popular games in the world and has been for more than a decade at this point.

So let me get this straight

Mario can:

• Get his skull crushed by Ridley
• GET VAPORIZED BY GALEEM
• and narrowly avoid Sephiroth’s sword by his overalls

Bu

the sephrioth

I mean, Smash cameos are something, I guess, but I don't personally feel that being owned by another company is a make or break for a character, especially when it comes to smash. After all, we have likes of Banjo, Steve and Sephiroth for cripes sake. I'm fairly convinced that Geno's exclusion, and basically the exclusion of all extended Mario universe characters, is the result of the stubborn, senile old farts running Nintendo and their proven unwillingness to accept anything outside their tiny comfort zone. This would also explain why Nintendo's online capabilities are still almost a full decade behind their competitors.

no geno isnt here because compared to sephiroth he's not even an ant. thats just reality. considering the effort and negotiation it takes to get major third party characters Nintendo would never go for like the 30th best option it could.

also Nintendo has definitely stepped outside its comfort zone recently. breathe of the wild is a major change on zelda, age of calamity/ hyrule warrios, mario rabbids (they let another company give mario a gun), splatoon is a third-person shooter, and more. like idk what some people want from nintendo the full brand is never gonna change but they are steppiong outside thier comfort zone. when metroid prime 4 has online multiplayer versus people will be shocked as well.

 

[Firox]

no geno isnt here because compared to sephiroth he's not even an ant. thats just reality. considering the effort and negotiation it takes to get major third party characters Nintendo would never go for like the 30th best option it could.

While I agree that Geno really doesn't compare to Sephiroth with regards to general notoriety, I think there was a lot more at play here with regards to the character choice considering the sizeable demand for Geno and the fact that he was given a Mii costume in the first place while other choices like Chrono, 2B and every other FF game are completely non-existent. To say Geno was the 30th best option is to flagrantly disregard the recognition he was able to garner despite being a 20+ year old side character from a 3rd party Mario spinoff.

We really don't have any idea how much or how little it takes to get third party characters into Smash so I would greatly appreciate it if people would stop pretending to be omniscient and simply acknowledge the fact that they don't really have a clue. Obviously, Nintendo didn't care enough about someone like Geno to prioritize him over Sephiroth, and that's totally understandable. I have to say, if anyone had to kill Geno, I honestly hoped it would be Sephiroth. That said, I won't pretend to know all of Nintendo's intentions, but their own actions have demonstrated that the reluctance to explore Mario's extended universe of characters is very real.

Also, sidebar, how was Breath of the Wild such a major change to the franchise? Pretty much every Zelda ever has included an open world sandbox to explore. Granted, BotW has a more seamless world structure, but it's still basically just a big enclosed sandbox. The only things it did differently is add breakable weapons, sub-par dungeons (if that's what you want to call them) and scrap the whole kill-bosses-for-special-items-to-progress mechanic. If that's revolutionary, I don't see it as a step up. Good game, but heavily overrated. Also, Age of Calamity is fun and all, but it's pretty much identical to the original hyrule warriors but with a reskinned aesthetic and map system with a different set of characters. So edgy. The story is OK, but like any prequel, it can't really change the source material in any meaningful way. Not sure it counts as Nintendo getting out of their comfort zone.