Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Karen6969]

The lead into the last character is really interesting because it feels like we have no guidelines or ideas as to what to expect anymore. That being said, I’m going all in for Waluigi. Not just because he’s my most wanted but also because putting him in as the last character just feels right. It’s just my gut feeling I guess.

 

[Momotsuki]

Porting Smash Ultimate basically means the eventual next gen version would be the same with less characters than now at launch. That just seems to be the legal reality.

If a character for some reason had to be cut, as unfortunate as it is, surely somebody could take their place? Of course, there'd go Everyone Is Here, but even still.
If Ultimate was ported, I think less focus on expanding the roster (beyond making up for any potential cuts that might unfortunately have to happen), and more on expanding the modes and single-player content would be ideal. With it being a port, there'd be more resources to do so!

 

[Idon]

With SMTV apparently being a major JRPG Nintendo appears to be pushing going into 2021, I can at least be confident that SMT will actually get content in the next Smash game if not Ultimate, so that's nice.

Hurts to think I'll be waiting on seeing whether SMT's ever gonna get a character or some sort of side-content like, 5 years down the line from now.

 

[Momotsuki]

I know nothing about SMT but I do know that the protagonist of SMTV is a real cutie; I need a sip of that gender fluid.
I don't care if it's a shill finale, I'd take them as CP11, haha. But I doubt it. The timing makes no sense for it, sadly. At least, it wouldn't unless they plan to keep us waitin' for five bloody months.

 

[SNEKeater]

I'm pretty sure we'll at least get a spirit event for SMTV. Maybe a Mii Costume alongside Kazuya or CP11, if we're lucky enough.

That is assuming that CP11 isn't a SMT character.

 

[Technomage]

If a character for some reason had to be cut, as unfortunate as it is, surely somebody could take their place? Of course, there'd go Everyone Is Here, but even still.
If Ultimate was ported, I think less focus on expanding the roster (beyond making up for any potential cuts that might unfortunately have to happen), and more on expanding the modes and single-player content would be ideal. With it being a port, there'd be more resources to do so!

Still wouldn't be a good port if it means cuts; that's for sequels only.

Now rereleasing Ultimate years later in a retro collection, I think that'd be doable (while keeping all characters in the game).

 

[PeridotGX]

If a character for some reason had to be cut, as unfortunate as it is, surely somebody could take their place? Of course, there'd go Everyone Is Here, but even still.
If Ultimate was ported, I think less focus on expanding the roster (beyond making up for any potential cuts that might unfortunately have to happen), and more on expanding the modes and single-player content would be ideal. With it being a port, there'd be more resources to do so!

"a smash game with cuts and a bunch of new content" doesn't really sound like a port to me.

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

They can no longer own a property, like the Rare stuff, but it can't be owned by them and be third-party at the same time. The closest would be if they own certain aspects of a a third-party, like how they potentially own Bayo's Bayo 2 design, but the IP itself is not owned by Nintendo.

Fwiw though Battletoads was never owned by Nintendo.

I never said they still owned it? And since Nintendo owned 49% of Rareware and Battletoads was a Rareware property then ipsofacto Nintendo owned 49% of Battletoads

 

[Twilord]

Hi

If a character for some reason had to be cut, as unfortunate as it is, surely somebody could take their place? Of course, there'd go Everyone Is Here, but even still.
If Ultimate was ported, I think less focus on expanding the roster (beyond making up for any potential cuts that might unfortunately have to happen), and more on expanding the modes and single-player content would be ideal. With it being a port, there'd be more resources to do so!

If they have to promote the game as "Smash Ultimate with more modes, and Jin from Xenoblade replacing Sephiroth despite the fact he doesn't typically fight that way" I don't see that ending well.

With SMTV apparently being a major JRPG Nintendo appears to be pushing going into 2021, I can at least be confident that SMT will actually get content in the next Smash game if not Ultimate, so that's nice.

Hurts to think I'll be waiting on seeing whether SMT's ever gonna get a character or some sort of side-content like, 5 years down the line from now.

If it's worth anything, SEGA seems like one of the two companies most likely to end up happily working with Smash Bros even if it ends up being a post Sakurai Smash Bros.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Saw a funny comment on an IG post
"FP1 began with a student and ended with a teacher... FP2 started with ARMS and could end with no arms"
Yep, it's time

 

[Twilord]

Hi

My phone randomly inserted this and I find that hilarious...

 

[RGFS]

Because GTA wasn't made using materials they borrowed from other Publishers and Developers.

Sakurai told us this project involved calling in a lot of his favours in the industry and probably can't be repeated.

Porting Smash Ultimate basically means the eventual next gen version would be the same with less characters than now at launch. That just seems to be the legal reality.

GTA has hundreds of songs from licensed record labels in the game's radio stations. They've had to cut songs when re-releasing GTA games in the past. Some great, iconic songs... it is what it is. It shouldn't stop the rest of the game from getting a re-release.

Whoever doesn't want to play ball anymore can leave Smash the same way a few radio songs had to be cut. Sure fighters are more integral than radio music but the same logic applies to what to do about it. A reboot doesn't seem like a good enough excuse to throw everything that could still be here out the window. You're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. You know what I mean? It would suck to not see some characters, music, stages, or spirits, but if some companies don't want to negotiate well anymore, it's them missing out on being included and looking like the bad guy.

If they add enough characters to replace any few cut ones, we'd certainly have more characters at launch too.

On the bright side, it would be a good excuse to trim the fat a little, even if I do like having it.

 

[Paraster]

I'm still banking on Shadow the Hedgehog. Though actually I think Kazuya's Mii wave could tell us alot

One of the type of candidates I'd be paying attention to are Indie Characters. Indie games as a medium have grown to heights that weren't seen even during the Smash 4 era, and it's also a medium that Nintendo is in full support of

One of the things I've noticed is that there haven't been Indie Costumes for FP2 at all. I guess the closet thing would be Travis if you consider Grasshopper games indie, and Steve was an indie character at one point (and Mojiang uses the name they had when they were Indie in the copyright) however I don't think people consider Minecraft indie anymore

So I think the lack of Indie Costumes in Kazuya's Mii Wave might give more credence towards an Indie character being the final character. It would especially make sense for Indie characters to be the last character since

-Indie characters are on average smaller characters than characters from more established companies
-Indie characters need more work done on the 3D Assets. All the FP2 characters we've have been in games with 3D Assets before, but Indie games are typically in 2D Style, with no 3D Assets. FNAF is an exception to the rule

Another thing to consider is the theming of Kazuya's Pack. Kazuya comes from Tekken, which is a fighting game, so I'd expect Fighting game Mii Costumes in this pack, and he's also a Namco character so I'd expect that too. However another important theme is that Kazuya has Devil Influence with his Devil Gene/Devil Form, so it's possible for characters like Dante and Shin Megami Tensi characters to show up also

So besides Namco, there's the good chance of other Companies, like Capcom and Sega showing up, and Indies should be kept on the lookout

Fully agreed. I've felt for a long time that an indie character is a great idea to the point of "why WOULDN'T you go for this?" from both a practical and a symbolic viewpoint.

I think the most likely ones are Frisk, Papyrus, Reimu, Shantae, Cadence, Quote, Madeline, and the Knight. Add Shovel Knight if AT promotions are possible.

 

[Technomage]

Say, if Waluigi gets added to Smash, who'll be the next super-ultra-mega-hype meme character request (just like Ridley and Waluigi)? Would it be Isaac?

 

[PeridotGX]

Saw a funny comment on an IG post
"FP1 began with a student and ended with a teacher... FP2 started with ARMS and could end with no arms"
Yep, it's time

I know this isn't funny, but 'm contractually obliged.

when the swindler was not born yesterday on the lookout!

 

[Twilord]

GTA has hundreds of songs from licensed record labels in the game's radio stations. They've had to cut songs when re-releasing GTA games in the past. Some great, iconic songs... it is what it is. It shouldn't stop the rest of the game from getting a re-release.

Whoever doesn't want to play ball anymore can leave Smash the same way a few radio songs had to be cut. Sure fighters are more integral than radio music but the same logic applies to what to do about it. A reboot doesn't seem like a good enough excuse to throw everything that could still be here out the window. You're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. You know what I mean? It would suck to not see some characters, music, stages, or spirits, but if some companies don't want to negotiate well anymore, it's them missing out on being included and looking like the bad guy.

On the bright side, it would be a good excuse to trim the fat a little, even if I do like having it.

By fat do you mean "probably all the Square and Konami content"?

SEGA are probably more case-by-case. Bayonetta is probably an easy keep (and it probably helps Nintendo have some rights to two of her three games) and currently Sonic is being put everywhere but if that backfires it could really hurt his odds. Joker might be more awkward.


I have no clue with Capcom.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

I know this isn't funny, but 'm contractually obliged.

when the swindler was not born yesterday on the lookout!

I have a better red character in mind...

 

[Twilord]

Say, if Waluigi gets added to Smash, who'll be the next super-ultra-mega-hype meme character request (just like Ridley and Waluigi)? Would it be Isaac?

I have plans to sow the seeds for Mametchi for the next game.

Then the big debate won't be "do V-Pets count" but rather "shouldn't it be Agumon"...

And whoever loses, I still win.

 

[N3ON]

I never said they still owned it?

No but your evidence against a comment that stated a property can't be first and third party simultaneously was an example that indeed wasn't first and third party ownership simultaneously. Rare's IPs were third-party, then they made some that were first-party, then they all became third-party.

And since Nintendo owned 49% of Rareware and Battletoads was a Rareware property then ipsofacto Nintendo owned 49% of Battletoads

That's not how it works. Acquiring a partial percent of the company, especially a minority stake, doesn't inherently mean you acquire a commensurate percent of their properties. Nintendo owns a small percent of Namco, but you're not going to see them credited in any first-party Namco titles like Tekken or Tales on like the Playstation or something because ownership of properties is different than ownership of shares. Fully acquiring a company normally means you acquire their proprietary IP, but partial ownership is a case-by-case basis wherein prior ownership often remains unchanged.

Battletoads was created previous to Nintendo acquiring any of Rare, and it remained fully owned by Rare until they were bought by Microsoft.

 

[Aerospherology]

Not my analysis

 

[ZelDan]

Say, if Waluigi gets added to Smash, who'll be the next super-ultra-mega-hype meme character request (just like Ridley and Waluigi)? Would it be Isaac?

Isaac isn't purple, so no.

Everyone knows purple is the color of memes.

 

[Twilord]

Isaac isn't purple, so no.

Everyone knows purple is the color of memes.

Purple is the colour of Royalty, so they will end on King Mickey as a Shadow Drop.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Purple is the colour of Royalty, so they will end on King Mickey as a Shadow Drop.

Purple is also the color of corruption, so our final fighter will be the Eater of Worlds from Terraria.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Isaac isn't purple, so no.

Everyone knows purple is the color of memes.

Ah, but his outfit is full of red and blue, and when you mix the two colors, you get...?

 

[Twilord]

Still can't believe we got a Bandai Namco character from the Digimon Multiverse who can turn into Devimon, and it's still not a Digimon.

 

[SpectreJordan]

I don't know if they'd be salty
But how salty would Rayman fans be if we got Ezio?

Probably insanely salty. The Rayman for Smash Twitter always punches down on Ezio/AC even though it’s not a common request amongst Smash fans.

I think if we were to get Ezio then Rayman would follow. It’d be like Steve/Banjo where Nintendo wants Steve/Ezio & the parent company agrees but also pushes Banjo/Rayman because they’ve heard the fan demand.

 

[N3ON]

Purple is the colour of Royalty.

Purple is also the color of corruption.

These continue to strengthen the case for Waluigi.

 

[Technomage]

Isaac isn't purple, so no.

Everyone knows purple is the color of memes.

In that case, what about Rayman? He's purple, and his Iceberg theory could make a great meme.

Yeah, I know everyone's getting tired of me talking about the iceberg meme, but...

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Even though he wasn't really there to begin with, it would be hilarious if Rayman's reveal trailer had him break out of the ice.

RAYMAN BREAKS THE ICE!!!

 

[Shroob]

Is "Rayman's in the ice" the new "Ridley's in the clouds"?

 

[Technomage]

Is "Rayman's in the ice" the new "Ridley's in the clouds"?

LOL Probably.

Though what clouds are you talking about?

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Sup
After watching this video, uploaded on YouTube after Pythra but before Kazuya, I used this person's formulas and excluded incorrect factors.

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

This YouTuber, Backseat Game Development, came up with the Classic, Fashion, and Finger formulas respectively to mathematically predict the last two fighters. You're probably wondering how Kazuya stood up against his formulas.
Well, here you go:

The Classic Formula:
Platformer - NO
East Origin - YES
Returning pub - YES
New series - YES
So minus missing the platform genre, this theory nearly held up 100%.

The Fashion Formula:
No hat - YES
No top - YES (default skin)
Pants - YES
No shoes - YES
No gloves - NO
So minus Kazuya actually wearing gloves, this theory nearly held up 100% as well.

The Fingers Theory:
Five - YES
I kinda find this particular theory to be extremely broad, though. This theory does, however, hold 100% true still

So...
Let's assume that theories that didn't hold up 100% can be neglected. That means only the fingers theory remains.
According to Backseat, the other character may statistically have 4 fingers.
Doesn't really narrow down the possibilities lmao.
Rayman is the first character I thought of.. He's got 4 fingers.
So does Shovel Knight
And Jack Frost from SMT

Thought I'd share this just for fun.

 

[Twilord]

Is "Rayman's in the ice" the new "Ridley's in the clouds"?

Wasn't it "Pac-Man is in the clouds"?

And then Pac-Man was actually in the base-game?

 

[SharkLord]

It's kinda fun that Ubi's getting a surge of discussion now that we're tossing out indirect deconfirmations for the most part. Anyone from the company - Usually Rayman - Would get shot down because of those Miis, so I never really got to see any discussion surrounding them.

While it's still going, I'm curious about Ezio and his weaponry. Any Assassin's Creed fans able to explain his weaponry?

 

[Inferno7]

If we get a parallel to Piranha Plant, imagine if we get a Waddle Dee.

Not even Bandana Waddle Dee, just some generic Waddle Dee who can use everything they're known for except Bandana Dee's spear.

Some other options:

• Goomba
• Koopa Troopa
• Shy Guy
• Thwomp
• Deku Baba (Piranha Plant echo???)
• Deku Scrub
• Lizalfos, Dinolfos and Stalfos (I made a thread for them but it didn't get much attention :>)
• Octorok
• Bronto Burt
• Waddle Doo
• Knuckle Joe
• Bulborb
• Bulbmin
• Creeper (made a thread for it too, would be awesome if Steve, Alex, etc. came back in the next game and Creeper was added too)
• Slime
• Primid (I know a lot of people don't like the idea of a Smash-original character, but I'd personally love it)

is it weird that I would actually want this to happen instead of B. Dee?

I'm still banking on Shadow the Hedgehog. Though actually I think Kazuya's Mii wave could tell us alot

One of the type of candidates I'd be paying attention to are Indie Characters. Indie games as a medium have grown to heights that weren't seen even during the Smash 4 era, and it's also a medium that Nintendo is in full support of

One of the things I've noticed is that there haven't been Indie Costumes for FP2 at all. I guess the closet thing would be Travis if you consider Grasshopper games indie, and Steve was an indie character at one point (and Mojiang uses the name they had when they were Indie in the copyright) however I don't think people consider Minecraft indie anymore

So I think the lack of Indie Costumes in Kazuya's Mii Wave might give more credence towards an Indie character being the final character. It would especially make sense for Indie characters to be the last character since

-Indie characters are on average smaller characters than characters from more established companies
-Indie characters need more work done on the 3D Assets. All the FP2 characters we've have been in games with 3D Assets before, but Indie games are typically in 2D Style, with no 3D Assets. FNAF is an exception to the rule

Another thing to consider is the theming of Kazuya's Pack. Kazuya comes from Tekken, which is a fighting game, so I'd expect Fighting game Mii Costumes in this pack, and he's also a Namco character so I'd expect that too. However another important theme is that Kazuya has Devil Influence with his Devil Gene/Devil Form, so it's possible for characters like Dante and Shin Megami Tensi characters to show up also

So besides Namco, there's the good chance of other Companies, like Capcom and Sega showing up, and Indies should be kept on the lookout

Shadow's the dream, he's been my lifetime MW and the one character that would make this game a timeless 10/10 for me, I find it incredibly weird he's not in yet.

Given that I predicted Namco & Sega for the last two spots, something tells me the lattrr has a real shot this time, since there are no signs of Sega mii costumes in FP2 and Sonic has been starving for another rep since base game.

Capcom it's a close 2nd, I feel. With a RE rep being an even stronger possibility than before due to precedents being broken left and right.

The one indie I think has a chance is Undertale, since it didn't have a spirit event and is massive enough to warrant an inclusion. Personally, I wouldn't like Sans at all but Frisk can come first.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Smash 4 DLC ended on the results of a fan voted ballot

No it didn't. It ended on ONE result, which was almost certainly not true. They didn't show us ANYTHING about the actual ballot results.

This means that indeed, the little theory about how the recent fire themed tournament indicates that our last fighters may not be fire users seems to have worked. It’s possible that this could apply to CP11 as well, but we’ll see.

Except the tournament that came out just this week was for fighter's whose father is a Spirit. Since Heihachi is pretty much guaranteed to have a Spirit, this proves that tournaments don't mean a goddamn thing in regards to unreleased characters.

 

[Louie G.]

No it didn't. It ended on ONE result, which was almost certainly not true. They didn't show us ANYTHING about the actual ballot results.

Ok, that doesn’t really contradict my point at all.

Which is just that Bayonetta was a fairly popular character to end on and (apparently) one that fans voted for. For what it’s worth I was disappointed in Bayonetta’s reveal but I know my own tastes don’t reflect the generally positive reception barring the eventual gameplay / competitive concerns.

But bottom line, not a “low note”. We didn’t end on Corrin.

 

[Megadoomer]

LOL Probably.

Though what clouds are you talking about?

Wasn't it "Pac-Man is in the clouds"?

And then Pac-Man was actually in the base-game?

In one of the early Subspace Emissary cutscenes back in Brawl, some people thought that one of the clouds that appeared when the Halberd showed up at the start of the game looked like Ridley, so it was a sign that Ridley was going to be playable along with Bowser and Ganondorf.

The one on the far right.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Over the past few months, I've daydreaming by writing down ideas for the characters from who I would like to see changes of the most. Some are just cosmetic changes but the moveset modifications wouldn't even completely change the character's gameplay for the most part:

What other characters or ideas for the mentioned characters do you all have?

Changes to existing characters I hope to see in the next game:

-Give Ganondorf a completely unique moveset based on Hyrule Warriors Trident Ganondorf. Make Black Shadow Captain Falcon's echo and give him Ganondorf's old moveset.
-Replace Mario's FLUDD with Cappy.
-Make each of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon a separate Fighter, give every Pokemon except Mewtwo a trainer.
-Give Chrom a new unique moveset. Make Lucina his Echo. Make Roy Marth's Echo.
-Make Mythra into Pyra’s Echo.
-Give Young Link and Toon Link different subweapons so they aren't just using the same Bow/Bomb/Boomerang combo as Adult Link.
-Give Falco the Sniper Rifle and Wolf the Machine Gun from StarFox Assault.
-Expand the definition of Echo to include Dr. Mario and Pichu.

 

[Noipoi]

Rayman’s series is on ice.