Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Dear Capcom, can Anime crossovers come back to MH Rise please? Thank you

So no Nintendo leaks yet, eh?

Nope, they havent said anything all day yesterday and nothing yet today. It will probably happen when you least expect it lol. I think people talking about them publicly kind of killed it because now they'd be on Nintendo's radar and they won't be able to say anything anyway

 

[rychu_supadude]

I think that the discussion around Skull Kid and other first party non-Switch populars follows the same principle as the discussion around the Champions: People love them, but they might be uneasy only repping one of them. Out of the ATs, Waluigi is seen as the best shot, and out of the popular first party clicque, people are still waiting for a tie-breaking game to pull one of them ahead to frontrunner status. Otherwise, Bandana Dee, Dixie Kong, Waluigi, Skull Kid (Might be missing some) all fall into the same boat and are all interchangeably discussed, which doesn’t help them stand out in speculation

Well, GlobalSmashRoster obviously can't be completely relied upon, but it's one of the best publicised polls we have, so just for kicks I'll pick out the only first party reps in the top 100 (I feel obligated to point out that Karate Joe is next in line with 621 votes):

Pyra technically had a low score but it can be fairly assumed that all votes for Rex implicitly included her. Is this the cream of the crop, then? No Nintendo characters that are being overlooked by the hivemind zeitgeist conglomerate?

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

Well, GlobalSmashRoster obviously can't be completely relied upon, but it's one of the best publicised polls we have, so just for kicks I'll pick out the only first party reps in the top 100 (I feel obligated to point out that Karate Joe is next in line with 621 votes):

Pyra technically had a low score but it can be fairly assumed that all votes for Rex implicitly included her. Is this the cream of the crop, then? No Nintendo characters that are being overlooked by the hivemind zeitgeist conglomerate?

Black Shadow being high surprised me. I see a lot of characters' support go into Smash 6 except maybe King Boo who kinda slowly grew the more time went on without a LM3 spirit event (who knows maybe it will stick) and Cinderace is interchangeable for a Gen 9 or 10 Pokemon by the time Smash 6 comes out.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Black Shadow being high surprised me. I see a lot of characters' support go into Smash 6 except maybe King Boo who kinda slowly grew the more time went on without a LM3 spirit event (who knows maybe it will stick) and Cinderace is interchangeable for a Gen 9 or 10 Pokemon by the time Smash 6 comes out.

I can guarantee Black Shadow's not on there because people want him, they voted him sk he can take Ganon's moveset so Ganon can be remade entirely. No other character gets asked for a reason like this

 

[volbound1700]

One character that is pretty high on that poll that would be a good addition but no one talks about is Marx. Granted he is already represented as a boss so that is probably the main reason.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Wednesday for me in the southern hemisphere.

I don’t think that’s how timezones work.

Well, GlobalSmashRoster obviously can't be completely relied upon, but it's one of the best publicised polls we have, so just for kicks I'll pick out the only first party reps in the top 100 (I feel obligated to point out that Karate Joe is next in line with 621 votes):

Pyra technically had a low score but it can be fairly assumed that all votes for Rex implicitly included her. Is this the cream of the crop, then? No Nintendo characters that are being overlooked by the hivemind zeitgeist conglomerate?

Of course I can’t judge if these are all of the popular first party characters, but I think these are good examples of characters that are wanted but do not fit the fandom-wide criterion for first parties of them being recent. There’s also a good overlap with the sort of character that gets called a base game pick.
Again, I’m sure there’s more and there are characters that do fit the idea of a recency pick (Like Cinderace, Rex) but overall this is the kind of character I am talking about.

Another category this group overlaps with is the AT crowd: Ashley, Krystal, Waluigi, Isaac, Skull Kid could be frontrunners for the next game again based on popularity, although for some the recency argument would return even if the mantra isn’t “Switch or Ditch”

One character that is pretty high on that poll that would be a good addition but no one talks about is Marx. Granted he is already represented as a boss so that is probably the main reason.

Marx also heavily suffers from the discussion point that Iko MattOrr mentioned of the “next-in-line” fallacy. I come across it with Splatoon and Octoling, where discussion kind of ends with “Yes, Splatoon is huge, but will DLC include a semi-clone?“ and the resulting discussion about Octoling’s uniqueness. The discussion barely moves past Octoling and, importance-wise, for good reason, but for DLC the flashier characters might be options as to not circle the discussion around the validity of a perceived Echo as DLC.

I think DK has the same thing, where Dixie is, sadly, seen as moveset-adjacent to Diddy when for example Cranky Kong could step in, and I’d say Ik0 could tell us more about how exactly this goes for the Kirby series.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Well, GlobalSmashRoster obviously can't be completely relied upon, but it's one of the best publicised polls we have, so just for kicks I'll pick out the only first party reps in the top 100 (I feel obligated to point out that Karate Joe is next in line with 621 votes):

Pyra technically had a low score but it can be fairly assumed that all votes for Rex implicitly included her. Is this the cream of the crop, then? No Nintendo characters that are being overlooked by the hivemind zeitgeist conglomerate?

Black Shadow being up there is pretty pog, I'd love to see him in the next Smash, hoping F-Zero makes a comeback by then

that's probably his only hope

 

[volbound1700]

Marx also heavily suffers from the discussion point that Iko MattOrr mentioned of the “next-in-line” fallacy. I come across it with Splatoon and Octoling, where discussion kind of ends with “Yes, Splatoon is huge, but will DLC include a semi-clone?“ and the resulting discussion about Octoling’s uniqueness. The discussion barely moves past Octoling and, importance-wise, for good reason, but for DLC the flashier characters might be options as to not circle the discussion around the validity of a perceived Echo as DLC.

I think DK has the same thing, where Dixie is, sadly, seen as moveset-adjacent to Diddy when for example Cranky Kong could step in, and I’d say Ik0 could tell us more about how exactly this goes for the Kirby series.

Good points although I would say that having similar movesets usually is a plus when it comes to base game addition. It makes it easier for Sakurai to add.

Smash 6 will be an interesting and different turn for the series because I am not sure Sakurai will head it up, at least not in his current role. Also the game will have to distinguish itself a lot to get the attention to replace Ultimate (or it just adds way more characters which I don't see happening).

There is a GREAT chance that we may get a ported Ultimate with more content on the next console instead of a new game.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Good points although I would say that having similar movesets usually is a plus when it comes to base game addition. It makes it easier for Sakurai to add.

Smash 6 will be an interesting and different turn for the series because I am not sure Sakurai will head it up, at least not in his current role. Also the game will have to distinguish itself a lot to get the attention to replace Ultimate (or it just adds way more characters which I don't see happening).

There is a GREAT chance that we may get a ported Ultimate with more content on the next console instead of a new game.

Yeah, though I’m talking about the current speculation cycle for the FP2 DLC. I’m sure once current ATs are “freed”, for example, the speculation will change. I’m not really interested in speculating an eventual next game, because there’s too many things up in the air to make any discussion points other than the ever-dreadful “who will be cut“

 

[rychu_supadude]

I can guarantee Black Shadow's not on there because people want him, they voted him sk he can take Ganon's moveset so Ganon can be remade entirely. No other character gets asked for a reason like this

Yeah, when the next highest F-Zero character has just 84 votes, it's a completely safe bet that more than half of his support comes from people who've never touched an F-Zero game outside of playing it for 5 minutes on the SNES Online App. And the other half is from people who want the Original 10 series to all have a 2nd rep.

 

[Momotsuki]

I love Marx, Kirby Super Star Ultra is one of my favorite games period. But I'm kind of glad he got what he did. I don't think he'd be a waste of a fighter slot, but rather that a fighter slot would be a waste of him. They really did him proper justice with his boss incarnation and while I do enjoy playing as him in Star Allies, it certainly doesn't have the same vibe. He's a much better boss than I think he'd be a fighter, not that I'd mind him being a fighter, quite the contrary.

 

[Brother AJ]

It's more than 24 hours away from the Direct though. The Direct is at 12:00 PM EST. It's 7:00 AM EST now, meaning it's 29 hours away.

Okay Mr. Literal...

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Yeah, when the next highest F-Zero character has just 84 votes, it's a completely safe bet that more than half of his support comes from people who've never touched an F-Zero game outside of playing it for 5 minutes on the SNES Online App. And the other half is from people who want the Original 10 series to all have a 2nd rep.

man

forget GBA/N64 games on NSO, I hope GC is next so people can play F-Zero GX, which is imo the best in the series

still a crime we don't have CF's vocal theme

 

[rychu_supadude]

I love Marx, Kirby Super Star Ultra is one of my favorite games period. But I'm kind of glad he got what he did. I don't think he'd be a waste of a fighter slot, but rather that a fighter slot would be a waste of him. They really did him proper justice with his boss incarnation and while I do enjoy playing as him in Star Allies, it certainly doesn't have the same vibe. He's a much better boss than I think he'd be a fighter, not that I'd mind him being a fighter, quite the contrary.

I feel like Marx support started out as a "anti-Bandana Dee" movement, but it really became its own thing after Star Allies and Ultimate. Most franchises have a lot more competition for the 2nd most popular spot, and he's got it on complete lock.

 

[volbound1700]

I love Marx, Kirby Super Star Ultra is one of my favorite games period. But I'm kind of glad he got what he did. I don't think he'd be a waste of a fighter slot, but rather that a fighter slot would be a waste of him. They really did him proper justice with his boss incarnation and while I do enjoy playing as him in Star Allies, it certainly doesn't have the same vibe. He's a much better boss than I think he'd be a fighter, not that I'd mind him being a fighter, quite the contrary.

Agreed. I wish we had more bosses though. The boss fights were some of the best moments of WOL.

 

[Iko MattOrr]

I love Marx, Kirby Super Star Ultra is one of my favorite games period. But I'm kind of glad he got what he did. I don't think he'd be a waste of a fighter slot, but rather that a fighter slot would be a waste of him. They really did him proper justice with his boss incarnation and while I do enjoy playing as him in Star Allies, it certainly doesn't have the same vibe. He's a much better boss than I think he'd be a fighter, not that I'd mind him being a fighter, quite the contrary.

I'm fine with Marx, he's a cool character with a lot of creative moveset potential. The only issue I see with him is that he has no hands, so it would be hard for him to grab and use items in battle. There are several possible workarounds to bypass this problem, but still.
I agree with you that he's a better fit for a boss, but I wouldn't mind him as playable either.

The characters from the Kirby series that I would like to be added in Smash as fighters the most are (no order except Adeleine at the top):

• Adeleine/Adeleine & Ribbon - my overall most wanted fighter and new main if added, regardless of the tier
• Rick & Kine & Coo - swithcing between characters automatically for each different move like in Star Allies, but all 3 of them are visible all the time
• Chef Kawasaki - Underrated, despite being an assist trophy already, I think he has a lot of personality and moveset potential, and is also very funny
• Dark Matter (swordman form) - because he's cool

The ones that are not really actively wanted but I wouldn't mind are (no order):

• Three Mage Sisters - doing the same as Pyra/Mythra but each character has a different element (fire, ice, thunder) with different properties
• Gooey - Because I like Kirby's Dream Land 3 a lot
• Magolor - Because I think he's now important enough to deserve something in the game
• Marx - Because Ok
• Taranza - I'm ok with him and I liked Triple Deluxe a lot, it's my favorite modern Kirby game
• Daroach - He's kinda cool (but Dark Matter is cooler)
• Susie - Mech riding has some potential even though Bowser Jr. already does that
• regular Waddle Dee (the bandana can be a skin) - I have my own concept of how you could control a group of waddle dees rather than just one
• Prince Fluff - because it would be interesting to have a character built around yarn gimmicks

so basically a lot of Kirby characters.

 

[volbound1700]

I'm fine with Marx, he's a cool character with a lot of creative moveset potential. The only issue I see with him is that he has no hands, so it would be hard for him to grab and use items in battle. There are several possible workarounds to bypass this problem, but still.
I agree with you that he's a better fit for a boss, but I wouldn't mind him as playable either.

The characters from the Kirby series that I would like to be added in Smash as fighters the most are (no order except Adeleine at the top):

• Adeleine/Adeleine & Ribbon - my overall most wanted fighter and new main if added, regardless of the tier
• Rick & Kine & Coo - swithcing between characters automatically for each different move like in Star Allies, but all 3 of them are visible all the time
• Chef Kawasaki - Underrated, despite being an assist trophy already, I think he has a lot of personality and moveset potential, and is also very funny
• Dark Matter (swordman form) - because he's cool

The ones that are not really actively wanted but I wouldn't mind are (no order):

• Three Mage Sisters - doing the same as Pyra/Mythra but each character has a different element (fire, ice, thunder) with different properties
• Gooey - Because I like Kirby's Dream Land 3 a lot
• Magolor - Because I think he's now important enough to deserve something in the game
• Marx - Because Ok
• Taranza - I'm ok with him and I liked Triple Deluxe a lot, it's my favorite modern Kirby game
• Daroach - He's kinda cool (but Dark Matter is cooler)
• Susie - Mech riding has some potential even though Bowser Jr. already does that
• regular Waddle Dee (the bandana can be a skin) - I have my own concept of how you could control a group of waddle dees rather than just one.

so basically a lot of Kirby characters.

My number one (mostly due to moveset potential) would be Prince Fluff with a alt skin for Yarn Kirby.

 

[WahHahaha]

Well, GlobalSmashRoster obviously can't be completely relied upon, but it's one of the best publicised polls we have, so just for kicks I'll pick out the only first party reps in the top 100 (I feel obligated to point out that Karate Joe is next in line with 621 votes):

Pyra technically had a low score but it can be fairly assumed that all votes for Rex implicitly included her. Is this the cream of the crop, then? No Nintendo characters that are being overlooked by the hivemind zeitgeist conglomerate?

I don't trust that poll at all. Just look at it.

It has Heavy as the #1 choice somehow above both Crash and Waluigi even though I never hear people requesting Heavy. It has Hollow Knight as the 5th requested character which can't possibly be true. It almost has the Scout in the top 11 which DEFINITELY isn't true and Dr. Eggman is somehow in the top 10 just because people started talking about him like a few months ago.

There is nothing reliable about this poll, it shouldn't even be looked at as more than a joke. It's just a reddit bandwagon poll.

 

[Technomage]

You can't really just pick one champion over the other 3 when all 4 are equally important and are on equal footing (atleast based on BotW1. Never played AoC but I'm assuming its the same there).

Oh, I got an alternative idea: How about King Rhoam, with the Champions as cameos or even part of his moves? He is a spirit just like the Champs.

 

[GothicSlenderman]

What would be the strangest character(s) from a new never before represented series that you could reasonably see being added to Smash?

For me I'd say
-A League of Legends rep (2009)
-Red from Angry Birds (2009)
-Pico from Pico's School (1999) and NewGrounds
-A Hanafuda character (knowing Nintendo's History)
-Jonesy from Fortnite

 

[Rie Sonomura]

What would be the strangest character(s) from a new never before represented series that you could reasonably see being added to Smash?

For me I'd say
-A League of Legends rep (2009)
-Red from Angry Birds (2009)
-Pico from Pico's School (1999) and NewGrounds
-A Hanafuda character (knowing Nintendo's History)
-Jonesy from Fortnite

I don’t think LoL would be that strange at this point in time especially given how it’s exploded in the eSports scene

 

[Iko MattOrr]

My number one (mostly due to moveset potential) would be Prince Fluff with a alt skin for Yarn Kirby.

Yeah that one too, I forgot. I think he can be given a needle too, even though he never used one in the original game; it would fit the character both because he's made of yarn and the needle is a tool to work the yarn, and because he's a fairy tale prince and it would represent a sword... but more like a foil, so no slashing, only stabbing.

 

[LAA9000]

Got back from school and Brushie hasn't spilled the beans yet. Given that I believe their leaks usually come about 12 hours to less than 1 hour before the announcement in question, it'll likely come tomorrow, which makes it very easy for me to avoid it.

Edit: Changed pronouns. I default to they/them when I'm unsure of one's pronouns.

 

[GothicSlenderman]

I don’t think LoL would be that strange at this point in time especially given how it’s exploded in the eSports scene

True. Guess I was more thinking of the overall reaction to it.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Got back from school and Brushie hasn't spilled the beans yet. Given that I believe his leaks usually come about 12 hours to less than 1 hour before the announcement in question, it'll likely come tomorrow, which makes it very easy for me to avoid it.

I think they’re in a different timezone, the initial list came when I was sleeping (I’m in EST) and they said a day or two of “rest” on June 12. I’m expecting sometime today, or tonight when I’m asleep

 

[volbound1700]

Yeah that one too, I forgot. I think he can be given a needle too, even though he never used one in the original game; it would fit the character both because he's made of yarn and the needle is a tool to work the yarn, and because he's a fairy tale prince and it would represent a sword... but more like a foil, so no slashing, only stabbing.

Yeah but he has no chance as Kirby's Epic Yarn seems like a one-time thing. It was a great game to play with my wife though because she love's cute stuff. (Yoshi Story for N64 is her favorite game).

Yoshi Wooly World replaced Kirby as the Yarn-based game and it fits well into the series. However, Kirby did as well. There should be room for both but Nintendo rarely works that way. They generally just stick with one IP in each category.

This is why the F-Zero series is pretty dormant, IMO. Mario Kart has replaced it as the premier racing game and Nintendo doesn't have the resources to make a spin-off racing game (even if it is significantly different in theme) that would not sale as well as Mario Kart.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

What would be the strangest character(s) from a new never before represented series that you could reasonably see being added to Smash?

For me I'd say
-A League of Legends rep (2009)
-Red from Angry Birds (2009)
-Pico from Pico's School (1999) and NewGrounds
-A Hanafuda character (knowing Nintendo's History)
-Jonesy from Fortnite

I really don’t see Pico being “reasonably added” in terms of chances lol. Kinda different from the other four on that list.

 

[GothicSlenderman]

I really don’t see Pico being “reasonably added” in terms of chances lol. Kinda different from the other four on that list.

I may have added a personal choice. I've just got starry eyes for NewGrounds lol

 

[Iko MattOrr]

Yeah but he has no chance as Kirby's Epic Yarn seems like a one-time thing. It was a great game to play with my wife though because she love's cute stuff. (Yoshi Story for N64 is her favorite game).

Yoshi Wooly World replaced Kirby as the Yarn-based game and it fits well into the series. However, Kirby did as well. There should be room for both but Nintendo rarely works that way. They generally just stick with one IP in each category.

This is why the F-Zero series is pretty dormant, IMO. Mario Kart has replaced it as the premier racing game and Nintendo doesn't have the resources to make a spin-off racing game (even if it is significantly different in theme) that would not sale as well as Mario Kart.

This is sad but true, though never say never...
Prince Fluff has a tiny bit of support in the Smash fanbase, so if you are interested in it, you can start supporting the character and make a support base. It's hard and requires a lot of time, but with some luck, if the voices get heared, something might happen (maybe not a Smash fighter yet, but at least some new Prince Fluff content in the next kirby games...).
Unless there are copyright issues with Good Feel like Geno with Square...

 

[rychu_supadude]

I don't trust that poll at all. Just look at it.

It has Heavy as the #1 choice somehow above both Crash and Waluigi even though I never hear people requesting Heavy. It has Hollow Knight as the 5th requested character which can't possibly be true. It almost has the Scout in the top 11 which DEFINITELY isn't true and Dr. Eggman is somehow in the top 10 just because people started talking about him like a few months ago.

There is nothing reliable about this poll, it shouldn't even be looked at as more than a joke. It's just a reddit bandwagon poll.

Oh, I'm brutally aware of all those things. More concerning than any of those points is the bandwagoned abundance of secondary Danganronpa and Disgaea characters. At one point fraggen Aiai the Monkey and Gex the Gecko were dominating the top 2! But a flawed poll is still a poll, since it's all just yelling into the wind for choices that were already decided anyway. I focused on the Nintendo picks that rose through all that chaff for a reason...

This site does have a blind spot for most characters that aren't on Nintendo systems, though.

 

[volbound1700]

This is sad but true, though never say never...
Prince Fluff has a tiny bit of support in the Smash fanbase, so if you are interested in it, you can start supporting the character and make a support base. It's hard and requires a lot of time, but with some luck, if the voices get heared, something might happen (maybe not a Smash fighter yet, but at least some new Prince Fluff content in the next kirby games...).
Unless there are copyright issues with Good Feel like Geno with Square...

Agree. As stated, three characters that I think have NO SHOT at Smash but would be great picks would be Epic Mickey (or Oswald) from that series, Prince Fluff, and Amaterasu from Okami. All three have amazing move set potential and Mickey Mouse (despite being 4th party) is a great rival to Mario for all time greatest cartoon IP character ever created. The paint brush move set would be very cool.

However, despite that, I would rather see characters that are more popular with the Smash base in general make it like Crash or Rayman over these picks. Great base game options but not good DLC options. Also all three series are arguably dead at the moment.

 

[Garteam]

Really, Kirby should just get a ton of characters next Smash game. I wouldn't mind if Bandana Waddle Dee, Magalor, and Marx all joined at the same time. It's probably the first-party series that is most poorly represented other than Zelda.

 

[CommanderZaktan]

24 hours left. Hype responsibly.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

New Mario Golf trailer.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

So uh, I don't suppose it's safe to show my face around here after a dumb joke I made on Twitter kind of imploded the Smash fandom?

I wish I could say I was confident in Crash's chances but... I'm really not. I just don't see it happening in the slightest. I don't see any other big fan favorites getting in after Steve and Sephiroth were the peak of the pass.

Yet despite my being down on the reveal being any good, I wish all of you a good Smashmas Eve! See you all on the other side!

 

[Michael the Spikester]

It's now just 24 hours.

 

[WahHahaha]

New Mario Golf trailer.

Does anyone find it suspicious that Waluigi seems to be highlighted in the Mario Golf trailers WAY more than he usually gets highlighted in spinoff trailers? They usually don't pay much attention to Waluigi but the announcer specifically talked about him in the trailer.

People are gonna call me crazy for this, but I think he might get revealed tomorrow with how much Nintendo has suddenly started paying attention to him.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I really don’t see Pico being “reasonably added” in terms of chances lol. Kinda different from the other four on that list.

Not only is his debut game inspired by the Columbine Massacre, Friday Night Funkin' (which renewed interest in him) didn't even exist in any form when they were choosing characters for FP2.

 

[Gengar84]

What would be the strangest character(s) from a new never before represented series that you could reasonably see being added to Smash?

For me I'd say
-A League of Legends rep (2009)
-Red from Angry Birds (2009)
-Pico from Pico's School (1999) and NewGrounds
-A Hanafuda character (knowing Nintendo's History)
-Jonesy from Fortnite

I’ll go with

Rash/Pimple/Zitz (Battletoads)
Illidan Stormrage (Warcraft)
Sarah Kerrigan (Starcraft)
Lu Bu (Dynasty Warriors)
Velvet Crowe (Tales of Berseria)
Crono (Chrono Trigger)

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Sad Metroid/Kid Icarus noises.

It's the anniversary of Metroid and Icarus#Nintendo pic.twitter.com/mzs4MaegDg

— Karbuitt (@Karbuitt) June 12, 2021