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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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SharkLord

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Well, the ZSS case was less a "lie", more just him joking around. meanwhile Ken & Incineroar were indeed the last fighters announced in the November 2018 direct... that were present in the base game, so it might've just been a case of translation weirdness.
Yeah, I'd suspect that's the case. You could say "Well, it could be the same for FP2!", but he's been a lot more direct and up-front about this. He's said it so much and in a lot of different ways, and there's much less room for interpretation. Usually I'd let people believe what they want, but when Sakurai himself has stated otherwise on many different occasions, it feels like any sort of bonus fighter is a major stretch at this point.
 

Technomage

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While we're on the topic of DLC characters having echoes, what pairings would be great ideas? My ideas:

Real Crash with Fake Crash
Dr. Eggman with Big the Cat (both piloting the Eggwalker like in Sonic Adventure 2)
Nightmare witrhg Siegfried
Sophitia with Cassandra
Kasumi with Ayane
Morrigan with Lilith
Sub-Zero with Scorpion
Kitana with Mileena/Jade
Sora with Roxas/Xion/Ventus/Vanitas
KOS-MOS with T-elos
Filia with Fukua
Ms. Fortune with Robo-Fortune
Sol Badguy with Order Sol
Ky Kiske with Robo-Ky
Freddy Fazbear with Bonnie/Chica?
Saki Amamiya with Isa Jo
Marco Rossi with Tarma Roving
A combination of Bravely Default/Second characters
Zacian with Zamazenta

Also, would Solaire with Chosen Undead work, or are their fighting styles too different?
 

Rie Sonomura

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While we're on the topic of DLC characters having echoes, what pairings would be great ideas? My ideas:

Real Crash with Fake Crash
Dr. Eggman with Big the Cat (both piloting the Eggwalker like in Sonic Adventure 2)
Nightmare witrhg Siegfried
Sophitia with Cassandra
Kasumi with Ayane
Morrigan with Lilith
Sub-Zero with Scorpion
Kitana with Mileena/Jade
Sora with Roxas/Xion/Ventus/Vanitas
KOS-MOS with T-elos
Filia with Fukua
Ms. Fortune with Robo-Fortune
Sol Badguy with Order Sol
Ky Kiske with Robo-Ky
Freddy Fazbear with Bonnie/Chica?
Saki Amamiya with Isa Jo
Marco Rossi with Tarma Roving
A combination of Bravely Default/Second characters
Zacian with Zamazenta

Also, would Solaire with Chosen Undead work, or are their fighting styles too different?
Arle with either Ringo, Amitie or Tee?
 

Cutie Gwen

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While we're on the topic of DLC characters having echoes, what pairings would be great ideas? My ideas:

Real Crash with Fake Crash
Dr. Eggman with Big the Cat (both piloting the Eggwalker like in Sonic Adventure 2)
Nightmare witrhg Siegfried
Sophitia with Cassandra
Kasumi with Ayane
Morrigan with Lilith
Sub-Zero with Scorpion
Kitana with Mileena/Jade
Sora with Roxas/Xion/Ventus/Vanitas
KOS-MOS with T-elos
Filia with Fukua
Ms. Fortune with Robo-Fortune
Sol Badguy with Order Sol
Ky Kiske with Robo-Ky
Freddy Fazbear with Bonnie/Chica?
Saki Amamiya with Isa Jo
Marco Rossi with Tarma Roving
A combination of Bravely Default/Second characters
Zacian with Zamazenta

Also, would Solaire with Chosen Undead work, or are their fighting styles too different?
I'm sorry, but Big in a mech? That's not how I remembered SA2, Order Sol's popularity comes from his different mechanics and Robo Ky?

Swear warning

Robo Ky as a Ky echo would be an insult to perhaps the greatest ****post known to man
 

Technomage

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I'm sorry, but Big in a mech? That's not how I remembered SA2, Order Sol's popularity comes from his different mechanics and Robo Ky?

Swear warning

Robo Ky as a Ky echo would be an insult to perhaps the greatest ****post known to man
Here's a video showing Big the Cat in a mech (at the 24:00 mark):


See, I wasn't lying/joking/hallucinating.

But you are right about the Guilty Gear characters.
 
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Guynamednelson

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While we're on the topic of DLC characters having echoes, what pairings would be great ideas? My ideas:

Real Crash with Fake Crash
Dr. Eggman with Big the Cat (both piloting the Eggwalker like in Sonic Adventure 2)
Nightmare with Siegfried
Sophitia with Cassandra
Kasumi with Ayane
Morrigan with Lilith
Sub-Zero with Scorpion
Kitana with Mileena/Jade
Sora with Roxas/Xion/Ventus/Vanitas
KOS-MOS with T-elos
Filia with Fukua
Ms. Fortune with Robo-Fortune
Sol Badguy with Order Sol
Ky Kiske with Robo-Ky
Freddy Fazbear with Bonnie/Chica?
Saki Amamiya with Isa Jo
Marco Rossi with Tarma Roving
A combination of Bravely Default/Second characters
Zacian with Zamazenta

Also, would Solaire with Chosen Undead work, or are their fighting styles too different?
Isaac with Felix
Jin with Kazuya/Devil Jin (if they use Jin's T3 moveset)
Gordon Freeman with Adrian Shephard
 

Cutie Gwen

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Here's a video showing Big the Cat in a mech (at the 24:00 mark):


See, I wasn't lying/joking/hallucinating.

But you are right about the Guilty Gear characters.
That has to be a mod, not even a full 100% playthrough has shown that before and I've never seen this on a wiki or Sonic Retro
 

Technomage

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That has to be a mod, not even a full 100% playthrough has shown that before and I've never seen this on a wiki or Sonic Retro
Not sure how to prove that's not a mod, but I'll try:

Check out the "User(s)" part of this wiki article's infobox:


There's also this:

 
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Twilord

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Honestly it's so fascinating seeing people want a dual reveal having the same trailer. Demifiend and Dante crossed over before which explains the overlap, but it's so rare to suggest 2 characters from different franchises share a trailer and even more rare when it's about franchises owned by seperate companies
I mean the main two floated in this thread recently were:

Dante x Demifiend - two franchises that have crossed over in the past, both of which have 'related' series already in Smash Bros (Persona and Bayonetta) which gives room for some really fun crossover madness.

Pokémon x Digimon - because even while I could fill an A4 page with why Digimon makes sense without mentioning Pokémon... that crossover finally happening would still be the news story
 

YeppersPeppers

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That has to be a mod, not even a full 100% playthrough has shown that before and I've never seen this on a wiki or Sonic Retro
.

" He can also be unlocked as a playable character for the two-player mech-shooting battle, where he humorously replaces Eggman in his Egg Walker and uses Froggy to punch the opposing player."

Pretty sure it was exclusive to the Dreamcast version.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Not sure how to prove that's not a mod, but I'll try:

Check out the "User(s)" part of this wiki article's infobox:


There's also this:

That's weird, they cut out more than I thiught for the ports then
 

Technomage

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That's weird, they cut out more than I thiught for the ports then
IKR That addition was hilarious. XD

Anyways, would Big the Cat in an Eggwalker work as an alt or echo of Eggman in an Eggwalker?

Edit: Nevermind; I checked both of their models and remembered their legs aren't the same length.
 
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venomthebest

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Do you guys think a Dante and Waluigi would get more hype than Dante/Demi-fiend? Call me crazy but that's what im personally putting my chips on at this point.
 

Captain Shwampy

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Shin Megami Tensei featuring Sonic the Hedgehog from The Sonic the Hedgehog series


EDIT: Im late
 
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Twilord

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I will admit; as a Bayonetta fan seeing her fight Dante would be awesome... but the last time we had a character-action spectacle-combat hack-and-slash fighter she took a full game to get somewhat balanced.

Anyone else worried about that? I mean, he's kinda Nontendo Swordfighter Bayonetta...
 

Guynamednelson

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Sub-Zero and Scorpion have completely different fighting styles.
BRO

If anything, bring em both as unique fighters.
Pull an Injustice 2
In the original games, they had the same normal moves, just different specials. Technically the same is true for all Kombatants in 1-3 but Liu Kang doesn't "echo" Scorpion the way Sub-Zero does.
 

Gengar84

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Sub-Zero and Scorpion have completely different fighting styles.
BRO

If anything, bring em both as unique fighters.
Pull an Injustice 2
It’s been a long time since I’ve played Mortal Kombat so I don’t really remember. Did Sub-Zeroand Scorpion share normal attacks in the SNES games and only had different specials or were their movesets completely different even then? If they were similar, you could always base their moveset on the classic games and make them semiclones with different specials.
 

Momotsuki

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I will admit; as a Bayonetta fan seeing her fight Dante would be awesome... but the last time we had a character-action spectacle-combat hack-and-slash fighter she took a full game to get somewhat balanced.

Anyone else worried about that? I mean, he's kinda Nontendo Swordfighter Bayonetta...
They've clearly learned their lesson with Smash for's DLC, so no, I'm not. Much like the base game, the DLC's balancing - while not perfect - is very, very good. There's been a handful of very good fighters to come of it, such as Joker, but as is the case with the roster as a whole, nobody is so good as to be problematic nor so bad as to be downright unusable. It's extremely impressive for such a large roster and I don't think they'd ruin it right at the finish line. Smash for's balancing had its issues well before the witch came along.
 
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Garteam

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Do you guys think a Dante and Waluigi would get more hype than Dante/Demi-fiend? Call me crazy but that's what im personally putting my chips on at this point.
Honestly, if you want a big reaction for an E3 Smash reveal, it's tough to top Waluigi.

He's more recognizable to a general audience than 95% of Smash options simply because he's a Mario mainstay. Top it off with his seemingly infinite meme potential and the fact he's a popular request both inside and outside the hardcore speculation scene, I don't really see anyone aside from Crash, Master Chief, or Kratos making the splash he does.

I think ironic exposure to the character has led a lot of Smash Speculators to discount the genuine merits he brings. Which is odd, especially since so many people seem drawn to the biggest names possible when considering candidates.
 

Guynamednelson

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OK I see.
Then again, MK has a ton of other games that Smash moves can be pulled from.

Obvious example, MK11 Scorpion and Sub-Zero; you get the idea.
Sakurai seems to be more biased towards 90s fighters though. Ryu and Ken are based mostly off Super SFII Turbo while Terry is based mainly on Fatal Fury Special where you have to wait until you're almost dead to pull off supers rather than filling a super meter up.
 

osby

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I will admit; as a Bayonetta fan seeing her fight Dante would be awesome... but the last time we had a character-action spectacle-combat hack-and-slash fighter she took a full game to get somewhat balanced.

Anyone else worried about that? I mean, he's kinda Nontendo Swordfighter Bayonetta...
Not really.

It's not like the genre you are from automatically decides your tier placement, not every platform character after Meta Knight was broken. Also, DLC characters all have clear-cut weaknesses so far even without balance patches.
 

Twilord

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They've clearly learned their lesson with Smash for's DLC, so no, I'm not. Much like the base game, the DLC's balancing - while not perfect - is very, very good. There's been a handful of very good fighters to come of it, such as Joker, but as is the case with the roster as a whole, nobody is so good as to be problematic nor so bad as to be downright unusable. It's extremely impressive for such a large roster and I don't think they'd ruin it right at the finish line. Smash for's balancing had its issues well before the witch came along.
Good point; well made! Thank you!
 

GilTheGreat19

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Sakurai seems to be more biased towards 90s fighters though. Ryu and Ken are based mostly off Super SFII Turbo while Terry is based mainly on Fatal Fury Special where you have to wait until you're almost dead to pull off supers rather than filling a super meter up.
That's a good point. Makes me think IF Scorpion (minimum) were to ever happen, we might get one of his oldest looks as his default skin.

Speaking of older and newer designs...

What Crash Bandicoot design would they hypothetically use? His N. Sane one?
 

Hydreigonfan01

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I will admit; as a Bayonetta fan seeing her fight Dante would be awesome... but the last time we had a character-action spectacle-combat hack-and-slash fighter she took a full game to get somewhat balanced.

Anyone else worried about that? I mean, he's kinda Nontendo Swordfighter Bayonetta...
Smash Ultimate was much better balanced than Smash 4 was and Dante wasn’t top tier in either MvC3 or UMvC3. Vergil on the other hand...
 

Twilord

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Not really.

It's not like the genre you are from automatically decides your tier placement, not every platform character after Meta Knight was broken. Also, DLC characters all have clear-cut weaknesses so far even without balance patches.
To be fair, platformers aren't based around their combat.

Dante and Bayo kinda live-and-breath stylish combo energy with gimmicks to help you style on your victims.
 

DarthEnderX

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But how about a network card/chip that doesn't comes from the 2008 while ALSO giving us the ****ing Lan spot right on the dock?
It's funny how Capcom basically forced Nintendo to update their 20+ year old internet architecture for Rise.

I wonder what other online issues they may have been able to force...

Juri from SF would be better.

I wish we had gotten a few cross-series echoes. It's silly and stupid and people would be pissed off, but there's a lot of neat characters who would suddenly have a fighting chance in the form of such a thing.
Hard pass.

I regret reading this thread tbh
And we regret having you here!
 
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CureParfait

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Do you guys think a Dante and Waluigi would get more hype than Dante/Demi-fiend? Call me crazy but that's what im personally putting my chips on at this point.
Yes, I do think so. Since Waluigi is huge enough he might generate hype big as Steve's reveal potentially.
 

MBRedboy31

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That's weird, they cut out more than I thiught for the ports then
They, like, completely nuked Big out of existence in the Gamecube version of SA2B. They removed all of his background cameos, and replaced him with the Chao Walker in the multiplayer mode. IIRC the background cameos returned in later ports of SA2B, but his multiplayer mech didn’t return.
 

Cutie Gwen

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To be fair, platformers aren't based around their combat.

Dante and Bayo kinda live-and-breath stylish combo energy with gimmicks to help you style on your victims.
There's plenty to do to balance Dante, MvC gave him the largest set of moves of any character but his biggest flaw was pitiful damage output without meter, so if Dante doesn't hit hard then bam, problem solved. You can even have it be in character considering Dante's status as a goddamn clown, it even works with the disturbing interpretation fans have read into the series' subtle narrative
So what you’re saying is if Smash adds Vergil all hell will break loose
You're the Project X Zone stan here, you KNOW that game called him King of the Cheap Moves
 

Rie Sonomura

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There's plenty to do to balance Dante, MvC gave him the largest set of moves of any character but his biggest flaw was pitiful damage output without meter, so if Dante doesn't hit hard then bam, problem solved. You can even have it be in character considering Dante's status as a goddamn clown, it even works with the disturbing interpretation fans have read into the series' subtle narrative
You're the Project X Zone stan here, you KNOW that game called him King of the Cheap Moves
It’s been years, I may have forgotten some of the dialogue

which is also why we NEED another PXZ game
 
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