Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Þe 1 → Way]

The way I see it, Sans chances next Smash depend entirely on when the new Smash happens and if Undertale/Deltarune are still relevant.

 

[Ivander]

Can't believe speculating about Phantasy Star earlier got me thinking and I didn't think I'd find more reason why a Phantasy Star Online character would be so fitting. Get ready for Lots of images and a few videos.

Spoiler: Very often the first boss you face

Know any other dragons?

Spoiler: Very often the mid-game/second/third boss you face

Remind you of anyone?

Spoiler: One of the main antagonists and often the final boss

Most fittingly, Dark Falz or The Profound Darkness. Sound familiar, right?

The Profound Darkness in PSO2 more resembles Galeem with it's bright colors, but Dark Falz/Profound Darkness in Phantasy Star 4 really turns up the body horror and tendrils like Dharkon.

And to think that's not the only similarities between them.

Tons of hands surrounding the main body that you fight before fighting the main body?

Appears from an otherwordly dimension and even has an intro where it appears by breaking the space around it in a broken glass-like manner? Seem familiar?

And the way Galeem and Dharkon have their fighters possessed? By placing a different personality over the main body's personality while also changing their color scheme?

Once again, pretty similar to how Dark Falz corrupts or possesses people in PSO2.

Heck, doesn't help that one of Phantasy Star's early RPG characters looks so much like Marth.

Spoiler

This is Rhys, who came out first before Rhys of Path of Radiance did, but that aside, he pretty much looks like when you put Marth and Sigurd together.

And if you ever wondered what Marth would look like a moustache, this is probably it.

Heck, even their updated look of Rhys still looks like Marth.

And it would be another JPRG character to go with the trend of JRPG characters in the DLC. But if Phantasy Star were to get into Smash, it'd be our first playable JRPG character from a Sci-fi Space setting. Xenoblade is Sci-fi and the first Xenoblade does have a space at the end of the game, but Shulk and Pyra/Mythra's games are primarily Sci-fi Fantasy...compared to Xenosaga and another Xenoblade game, whereas Phantasy Star Online 2 is Sci-fi and does take place primarily in a space setting. This is mostly just me hoping for a non-green grass stage and hoping the stage is a Space stage or Spaceship stage.

 

[chocolatejr9]

The way I see it, Sans chances next Smash depend entirely on when the new Smash happens and if Undertale/Deltarune are still relevant.

For what it's worth, I STILL see people talking about how great Undertale is, so that might not be TOO big of an issue...

 

[SKX31]

Well, every video game franchise will get a big anniversary every 5 years, so in average 1/5 of every video game ever released will have an anniversary this year.

It's worth noting that it will take a long time for video games to start reaching the triple digit territory (2047-2052 for anyone curious, depending on how one counts it), but Pong will celebrate its 50th birthday next year. I'm saying this since video games as an industry might not be that old, but it's slowly but surely inching up there.

Also, in miscellaneous news:

Here is the PR for Nintendo's Indie World Direct.

Indie games featured in the showcase include Road 96, OXENFREE II: Lost Signals, OlliOlli World, a pair of new games from celebrated publisher Annapurna Interactive and The Longing.https://t.co/wtcsOQW9tU

— Daniel Ahmad (@ZhugeEX) April 14, 2021

 

[Louie G.]

For what it's worth, I STILL see people talking about how great Undertale is, so that might not be TOO big of an issue...

It's definitely not an issue - Sans in particular has remained relevant from the moment Undertale released to today. He's outright one of the most iconic video game characters in recent memory. Four years after the game's release he still received that level of excitement for simply showing up as a Mii Costume - you could argue that Deltarune's first chapter helped with this, but as everyone is well aware by now Sans' role in that is pretty minor (and was met with a similar amount of excitement when people saw him in-game).

Not to mention, in general, how much positive buzz a short demo for Undertale's sequel received in the first place.

I think Undertale remains relevant as long as it remains a fantastic game, which it will. It's been five and a half years now and we're still talking about it after all.

 

[Deleted member]

Indie Direct ranged from Underwhelming to Meh for me. Then again, aside from Hades, there hasn't been an Indie that really caught my eye in years. Hopefully we get at least a teaser for a big E3 direct next week just to tide us over.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Okay, so this is really optimistic and I don’t believe it. Buuuut, we could potentially get a Smash Reveal late this month in order to keep the 2 month cycle going, and then finish the pass with a reveal at E3 in June. There isn’t any evidence for this, just a crackpot thought to keep our cycle.

Seems fitting that my 1000 post here be a glorified conspiracy theory based in no facts.

For what it's worth, I STILL see people talking about how great Undertale is, so that might not be TOO big of an issue...

Fair point, Sans will probably still be popular by the time Smash 6/Ultimate Deluxe comes around. At least enough to be worth mentioning.

 

[Commander_Alph]

Even if Undertale is guaranteed a fighter, wouldn't that be Frisk out of all people? I mean Sans an easy target to point finger because "haha, funny skeleton man Megalovania plays " but he's only a boss in the Genocide Route and an NPC in other places, it wouldn't really effective considering what makes Undertale interesting is the different route that you can take and the interaction you have with the monster which resonate to the player.

 

[Deleted member]

Okay, so this is really optimistic and I don’t believe it. Buuuut, we could potentially get a Smash Reveal late this month in order to keep the 2 month cycle going, and then finish the pass with a reveal at E3 in June. There isn’t any evidence for this, just a crackpot thought to keep our cycle.

Seems fitting that my 1000 post here be a glorified conspiracy theory based in no facts.


Fair point, Sans will probably still be popular by the time Smash 6/Ultimate Deluxe comes around. At least enough to be worth mentioning.

I mean I don't think its impossible. If E3 weren't around the corner, I'd have a decent amount of faith in a teaser at the end of this month advertising either a Direct or a Sakurai Presents for the first week of May.

Decent chance, though, that Sakurai knows we've come to expect this 2 month release of info schedule and his announcement the other day to 'wait a bit longer' (paraphrasing) actually means we'll have to wait slightly longer than 2 months.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Even if Undertale is guaranteed a fighter, wouldn't that be Frisk out of all people? I mean Sans an easy target to point finger because "haha, funny skeleton man Megalovania plays"but he's only a boss in the Genocide Route, it wouldn't really effective considering what makes Undertale interesting is the different route that you can take and the interaction you have with the monster which resonate to the player.

Yes, but Sans was our choice for the Mii Costume and is Undertales most popular character.
Its basically a Hero VS Slime situation. Do they go with the protagonist that represents gameplay? Or do they pick the Mascot?
While Hero did win out, Sakurai did say he would be fine with adding Slime.

 

[Louie G.]

Even if Undertale is guaranteed a fighter, wouldn't that be Frisk out of all people? I mean Sans an easy target to point finger because "haha, funny skeleton man Megalovania plays " but he's only a boss in the Genocide Route and an NPC in other places, it wouldn't really effective considering what makes Undertale interesting is the different route that you can take and the interaction you have with the monster which resonate to the player.

I think they're both plenty viable. You're drastically underselling how significant Sans is to the general story and as more or less the game's mascot, and how much more popular he is than practically everyone else in the game.

Frisk is obviously a fine choice since they're the player character, and would probably embody the core mechanics of the game better? I've considered how alternate routes could be represented through a fighter but I'm unsure if that sort of thing can feasibly be represented through a playable character. Maybe something about a MERCY mechanic or your stats adjusting to whether you play violently or carefully? Certainly if it could be I think that would be really great too - although I'd argue the dynamic and lovable monsters in Undertale are just as significant in establishing its charm and creativity.

Bottom line it's not so clear cut. When a character is as overwhelmingly popular as Sans, does he really have to wait his turn for the self-insert silent protagonist? In a game that prides itself on interactions with such a dynamic and fun cast of weird monsters, Frisk doesn't quite represent that on their own either.

 

[Commander_Alph]

Yes, but Sans was our choice for the Mii Costume and is Undertales most popular character.
Its basically a Hero VS Slime situation. Do they go with the protagonist that represents gameplay? Or do they pick the Mascot?
While Hero did win out, Sakurai did say he would be fine with adding Slime.

I don't really think a Mii Costume is a good candidate to pick really, I mean Undertale exist beyond just the game itself so adding Sans is already a mind bending event in itself considering. And regarding Slime, I think that's just Sakurai's second choice in all honesty because he knows how much a hassle to work with Square Enix and considering DQ is an icon it's not worth giving up and afterall, Toby is such an easy person to work with, remember how did we get Sans in the first place?

In a game that prides itself on interactions with such a dynamic and fun cast of weird monsters,

I think that's the opposite really, Frisk embodied that (the interaction part) throughout the whole game, you feel happiness and sorrow all the way in and considering Smash consist of misfits it would actually be inline for Frisk to "befriend" them like those wacky monsters in their game.

 

[Louie G.]

I think that's the opposite really, Frisk embodied that (the interaction part) throughout the whole game, you feel happiness and sorrow all the way in and considering Smash consist of misfits it would actually be inline for Frisk to "befriend" them like those wacky monsters in their game.

I respect that perspective, although I haven't seen many people explain how that would really work. Not saying that it definitely couldn't, but it's easy to suggest that one thing might technically represent the series in a perfect way but gloss over the feasibility of the concept. I'd love to see how Sakurai would attempt to pull that off in any case, and I'd be happy to get either Frisk or Sans.

Even though I'd prefer Sans I can't really say that one or the other are outright a better representative of Undertale, I think they both have strong arguments. I just didn't really like the undermining of Sans as "funny skeleton" when, beyond his role as a bit of a meme across social media, he's a very active force in the game and his battle in Genocide route is arguably the true final boss of the entire game and the culmination of everything it's been building up to.

 

[SpectreJordan]

In positive news, I actually think the Deluxe Miis we got this go around (Sans, Cuphead, Vault Boy, and Bomberman) are all priority picks for the next Smash.

I think an Undertale character has a really good chance at getting in eventually. The Sans Mii Costume has to be the highest selling Mii Costume ever. I’m not sure if it’d be Sans himself though. I could see them going with Frisk, Kris, Papyrus or Undyne. They could joke about Sans being invited but giving his invite away because he was too lazy lol

Bomberman could happen. But he has good competition from Bill Rizer & Alucard when it comes to Konami stuff.

I’m not too confident in Cuphead. & Vault Boy’s just a marketing character in the Fallout games, so they wouldn’t choose him. They’d probably choose someone using the Power Armor. I also think Fallout would be in competition with Elder Scrolls.

 

[cothero]

Huh. This guy's armor kinda reminds me of that first one Vegeta used.

 

[Firox]

The Sans Mii Costume has to be the highest selling Mii Costume ever.

Would you happen to have any data to source to support that? Just curious because I'd be really interested to see the financial breakdown of Mii Costume sales. I'm wondering if it will hold any water at predicting future characters.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

So, did anything interesting get shown off at Indie World for those who bothered watching it?

 

[SneakyLink]

So, did anything interesting get shown off at Indie World for those who bothered watching it?

I watched it, there's some interesting Indie games (one that caught my attention was There is No Game: Wrong Dimension, which contrary to the name, is a variety game). Also new House of the Dead, Getsu Fuma Den, and Ninja Turtles titles were announced during the presentation.

And Fez. I remember Fez was popular around 2011? Never thought it would come to Switch.

 

[chocolatejr9]

I respect that perspective, although I haven't seen many people explain how that would really work. Not saying that it definitely couldn't, but it's easy to suggest that one thing might technically represent the series in a perfect way but gloss over the feasibility of the concept. I'd love to see how Sakurai would attempt to pull that off in any case, and I'd be happy to get either Frisk or Sans.

Even though I'd prefer Sans I can't really say that one or the other are outright a better representative of Undertale, I think they both have strong arguments. I just didn't really like the undermining of Sans as "funny skeleton" when, beyond his role as a bit of a meme across social media, he's a very active force in the game and his battle in Genocide route is arguably the true final boss of the entire game and the culmination of everything it's been building up to.

I remember BrawlFan1 made a moveset for Frisk (he's made movesets for a LOT of Undertale characters), so maybe see what he had to suggest?

 

[Golden Icarus]

And then Vault Boy doesn't really strike me as someone who ought to be playable in the first place. He makes a great mascot Mii Costume, but nobody is begging for him to get promoted.

As a huge Fallout fan, I think that the Vault Boy Mii costume is fantastic. He’s easily the most recognizable “character” in the series, but he is quite literally just a poster boy. He doesn’t really do anything, so they’d have to be really creative with his moveset. He would probably have something that’s either full of random Fallout references (akin to Game and Watch), or he would basically be a “Smash original” (like R.O.B.).

The Mii costume is perfect for him. The Mii Gunner moveset fits him extremely well, and imho is the best looking Mii costume so far. I certainly don’t have any desire to see him “promoted” when they pretty much nailed it with the costume. At most, it would be cool to have a taunt with his signature thumbs up.

The Sans, Cuphead, and Bomberman costumes all leave plenty to be desired, but the Vault Boy costume is so on point that I find it hard to complain.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So, did anything interesting get shown off at Indie World for those who bothered watching it?

Konami brought back CastleVania!

...

's sister series.


In all seriousness, Getsu Fuma Den looks damn cool and may be Konami's way of seeing if people still want CastleVania

 

[Ivander]

Huh. This guy's armor kinda reminds me of that first one Vegeta used.

View attachment 311277

Well, it's Phantasy Star and sci-fi, so it wouldn't be surprising if the armor took some Sci-fi notes.

But like I said, it's practically Phantasy Star's version of Marth/Sigurd.

I watched it, there's some interesting Indie games (one that caught my attention was There is No Game: Wrong Dimension, which contrary to the name, is a variety game). Also new House of the Dead, Getsu Fuma Den, and Ninja Turtles titles were announced during the presentation.

Excuse me, what?!
goes to video
.........Omg, it actually is getting a new game. And it actually looks interesting.

 

[PeridotGX]

Frisk is my most wanted Undertale rep, but I don't know if they're the one Sakurai and Toby would go with. I've spent hours working on how a Pacifist gimmick would work, and the current version is still a bit of a mess (it doesn't work in anything more than a 1v1, items break it and a ditto between two Pasifrisks is unwinnable). Even if I think of ways to fix those issues, there's still no guarantee it'll actually be fun to play. But you can't ignore pacifism, a moveset where Frisk has no choice but to fight would be a massive contradiction of Undertale. Sakurai might just think it easier to add Papyrus or Susie, who would be perfectly logical additions.

 

[SharkLord]

So, did anything interesting get shown off at Indie World for those who bothered watching it?

• CrisTales, an RPG that looks pretty well animated. Think I'll check it out at some point
• Surprise surprise, Getsu Fuma's back
• Aztech, which is pretty much high-tech Aztec-inspired action adventure
• Skul, where you play as the bad guy and also the Beheaded from Dead Cells makes a cameo

Funnily enough, everything I was interested in was pretty much all in a row

 

[CapitaineCrash]

I’m not too confident in Cuphead. & Vault Boy’s just a marketing character in the Fallout games, so they wouldn’t choose him. They’d probably choose someone using the Power Armor. I also think Fallout would be in competition with Elder Scrolls.

Don't forget that now Fallout is a Microsoft ip, so not only it might be harder to get it in the future, it's now need to compete against Master chief, Doom, Battletoads and Killer instinct among others.

So, did anything interesting get shown off at Indie World for those who bothered watching it?

I liked Aerial knights, Cris tales, House of the dead remake and Aztech: forgotten worlds. The Konami game also looks good, but it's only coming in 2022.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Don't forget that now Fallout is a Microsoft ip, so not only it might be harder to get it in the future, it's now need to compete against Master chief, Doom, Battletoads and Killer instinct among others.




I liked Aerial knights, Cris tales, House of the dead remake and Aztech: forgotten worlds. The Konami game also looks good, but it's only coming in 2022.

Iirc we're getting an beta version of Getsu Fuma Den, people who play it will get the original as a thank you gift

 

[Deleted member]

Indie World was pretty good, but I really wanted a Fisti-Fluffs release date. Move over Smash, there’s a new pawrty fighter in town!

 

[Ivander]

Iirc we're getting an beta version of Getsu Fuma Den, people who play it will get the original as a thank you gift

By what I found when I looked it up, it will launch on Steam Early Access on May 14th and it comes with a digital copy of the Famicom game. Don't know if the same will apply for the Switch version when it comes out next year.

Really want to try out the original Famicom version, as it looks like Zelda II: Adventure of Link done right. That or the players I've seen played it make it look much easier than it looks.

 

[ZelDan]

As a Castlevania fan, I think this is my first time ever hearing about Getsu Fuma. It's supposed to be a roguelite though, so unless the game gets Hades-level acclaim and widespread adoration I don't know if I'll even bother with it.

The game that interested me most is CrisTales. That looks like it could be cool.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

As a Castlevania fan, I think this is my first time ever hearing about Getsu Fuma. It's supposed to be a roguelite though, so unless the game gets Hades-level acclaim and widespread adoration I don't know if I'll even bother with it.

The game that interested me most is CrisTales. That looks like it could be cool.

It’s more of a Castlevania sister series. The first one was very Simon’s Quest-like. This ones more supposed to be like Symphony of the Night and newer MetroidVanias with fast travel. It has roguelike elements in this one apparently but it’s supposedly much more inline with Castlevania.

 

[Technomage]

Hey, I got another topic to discuss: Since Gen 8 has no Pokeball Mons, and especially if a Gen 8 Mon were to be added to the roster, what eight Gen 8 Mons would you want/think should be added as DLC Pokeball summons?

My picks:
1) Sirfetch'd
2) Regieleki
3) Regidrago
4) Mr. Rime
5) Runerigus
6) Rillaboom
7) Cinderace
8) Inteleon

 

[TheCJBrine]

The games I remember most from Indie World are that 400-day game (The Longing, I think) and the one where everyone in the chat started freaking out over “Sans” (Skul? Scul? one of those spellings; even I typed “orange sans” since it was a similar-looking skeleton reminding me of some fan depictions of Underswap Sans, just of course a lot different (mainly just the skull reminded me of him) and with orange eyes).

 

[Ace C.R.O.S.S.]

We got Getsu Fuuma Den. ...Now it would be a good time for Bandai to do something with Genpei Toumaden, right?

 

[CapitaineCrash]

Hey, I got another topic to discuss: Since Gen 8 has no Pokeball Mons, and especially if a Gen 8 Mon were to be added to the roster, what eight Gen 8 Mons would you want/think should be added as DLC Pokeball summons?

My picks:
1) Sirfetch'd
2) Regieleki
3) Regidrago
4) Mr. Rime
5) Runerigus
6) Rillaboom
7) Cinderace
8) Inteleon

-Galar stunfisk could act like a trap and when someone steps on it, he bites them.
-Wooloo just rolling and hitting others
-Toxtricity playing guitar and have the same effect as Barbara the bat assist trophy in Brawl
-Cramorant throwing fish at other players

 

[Eldrake]

I was surprised to see a Konami title and TMNT in Indie World.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey, I got another topic to discuss: Since Gen 8 has no Pokeball Mons, and especially if a Gen 8 Mon were to be added to the roster, what eight Gen 8 Mons would you want/think should be added as DLC Pokeball summons?

My picks:
1) Sirfetch'd
2) Regieleki
3) Regidrago
4) Mr. Rime
5) Runerigus
6) Rillaboom
7) Cinderace
8) Inteleon

I'm bored and have too much time left at work, so I'll do one better. I'll write out what I'd like each Pokemon to do. Also, nice choice; making 8 pokeball pokemon for Gen 8.

1) Rillaboom - Appears & jumps between 2 different locations and starts drumming, letting out damaging soundwaves like DK's old Final Smash

2) Soble - Upon summoning, starts crying tears. If the player who summoned it stands under/in the tears, they gain the 'Invisibility' status

3) Raboot - Runs around and does flaming, flying jump kicks at opponents

4) Eternatus - Appears in its Crazy boss form and fires high damage, high knockback laser beams everywhere. Narrow hitbox, but random, quick spread

5) Obstagoon - Chooses one opponent to chase down and use Throat Chop on (high damage, low knockback & prevents use of Final Smash for set time)

6) Calyrex - Follows player who summoned it for a set time, healing them repeatedly for a fixed %

7) Dragapault - Locks on to an opponent and fire two sets of two fast Dreepy that do damage on impact, then explode for extra fire damage

8) Galarian Slowbro - Aims shell arm and fires off a series of explosive poison bombs (explode and leave cloud of Poison like Piranha Plant's side special)

 

[Technomage]

-Galar stunfisk could act like a trap and when someone steps on it, he bites them.

8) Galarian Slowbro - Aims shell arm and fires off a series of explosive poison bombs (explode and leave cloud of Poison like Piranha Plant's side special)

Ah, I totally forgot that Galarian forms, especially since I've been using just the Gen 8 part of the National Dex to check out the list of Gen 8-ers. ^^;

 

[Deleted member]

Ah, I totally forgot that Galarian forms, especially since I've been using just the Gen 8 part of the National Dex to check out the list of Gen 8-ers. ^^;

Since regional variants were introduced in Gen 7 and we already some repped with Eggexutor & Raichu, I'd argue that the regional Evolutions (like Runigrigus or Perrserker) are more important, but I wanted to make sure I repped the two expansions too (Galarian Slowbro for Isle of Armor & Calyrex for Crown Tundra).

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Actually there’s a GetsuFumaDen song in Smash. Huh, I forgot about that.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I only watched the Indie World out of disbelief when I heard about a new Getsu Fuma Den. You done good this time Konami.

Other than that, the new TMNT looks really good, the "wait around for 400 days real-time" game looks interesting (but nobody's ever gonna buy it with that pitch lmao) and nothing else really.