DK Advancement of Metagame thread |Updated Random ideas 10/28/10!!!

[Luigi player]

I love this thread. Nice job Big O. Although I guess it won't be that easy to have a fresh ftilt/whatever all the time... but really good to know this, this will probably make it easier to fight the tornado. Thank you


And... DK has a jab lock, but I think after 40 % or so it doesn't work anymore, at least it was like that for me, maybe it's because I didn't hit with the right part of the jab? That would make sense.

Jab lock + side B is a great idea.


I can't wait to try all this stuff. ^^

 

[daisho]

If anyone else wouldn't mind doing what I did for a couple of the ATs I would appreciate it.

 

[Big O]

I edited out the typos in my previous post. You should recopy and paste the tornado thing.

Jab locking is basically hitting the opponent with certain weak moves while they are laying on the floor or during a floor bounce. It does not work from a trip. If done correctly you can then repeat the weak move over and over again until you reach the end of the stage or until the move is no longer weak enough to extend the lock. At the end of the lock they will be forced to get up automatically if you started it by hitting them during a floor bounce. Doing so gives you enough time to do the kill move of your choice at the end of the jab lock. If they are already laying on the ground, hitting them with a jab lock move will not make them get up automatically unless you jab lock them for a while (about 4 jabs or more).

The moves DK can jab lock with are his jab (until about 90% for a fresh jab) and Dtilt until it stops tripping (about 50% when fresh). If you hit with the tip of his jab you will break the jab lock at any % because it makes them land on their feet. Stale jabs and Dtilts can jab lock at higher percentages than fresh ones. You can also start a jab lock with the weak part of a Bair or Nair until about 33%. Ftilt at very low %'s work too with downwards Ftilt working a bit longer. Jab or Dtilt to fully charged punch, down b, or side b are both combos if they are laying on the floor within their jab locking %'s since you hit them while they are bouncing. The %'s are approximate and are higher for heavyweights while lower for lightweights.

 

[MasterCheeze]

Oh, add Hyphen USmashing (running and USmashing to slide with it), and whatever it's called when you dash and FSmash right away to get a bit more range.

And maybe Jump>Cargo Dtoss>Jump+Fair could be added since that sometimes psyches people out.

Uhh... Maybe when you connect with the tip of a Jab and your opponent is brought in setting them up for a DSmash could be added. That's getting to be one of my more common KO options since I usually have a hard time landing KO moves, even when 90% of DK's moves are KO-worthy. >.<

 

[Zapp]

I just discovered the awesomeness that is Donkey Kong today. Thanks for the share!
DK's Nair is a great aerial.. SH to Nair to FF works pretty well on Final D.

 

[Darknid]

lol nair....

 

[Ragnar0k]

nair isn't very bad it's a useful aerial.

 

[Jmex]

^ If you are facing the enemy instead of being ready for a back air, N-air should usually always be ready to fire. Unless your high up then up air!

 

[Ripple]

nair isn't very bad it's a useful aerial.

yeah nair is useful. /sarcasm

 

[Big O]

Nair beats Snake's mortars. That's the only time I do it on purpose too. Its usefulness is in its long lasting hitbox. If the hitbox was bigger and had a more horizontal knockback angle it would be five times better at its only two jobs as a projectile breaker and gimping with the weak hit. On most of the good projectiles it's almost random whether you hit them or not thanks to the awkard hitbox.

 

[Ragnar0k]

Nair is good when you're facing them.

 

[Big O]

Uair is better when facing them. It's faster, stronger, does more damage, juggles, has better reach (lol), and is more disjointed. The only thing going for the Nair is that you don't need good timing to hit someone. You just need to be lucky they didn't attack you out of a move with practically negative priority. There isn't a smexy Nair thread for a reason lol.

 

[Ragnar0k]

nair is good offstage and can set up fairs well sometimes. I'm not saying I use the move more than a few times a day though. I'm just saying it's not useless.

 

[Big O]

Yeah I wouldn't say it's garbage. Most of the time it's just a poor substitue for Uair/Bair though. It's okay at gimping and gets the job done. Nair is an okay move in an otherwise amazing moveset. The same goes for his dash attack.

 

[crifer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NedVoC_o3is&feature=channel_page

a lot of nair^^

 

[Big O]

I remember that guy. He used to play Wario and did some epic fart combo on a Snake on frigate.

I think a lot of times we overlook really simple solutions. Like when Olimar starts pikmin toss spamming it would be easier to just jump over the spam as opposed to attacking and moving through it. Another one would be forgetting you don't always have to move or attack right away when on the floor or ledge. A lot of times staying still catches Snake's off guard when doing Dthrow chains. He can't grab you on the floor. If you have a big enough lead it would be best to just wait it out and possibly take the hit than to give them momentum after a couple of successful tech chases. Some things can also be ducked under which can give you a nice element of surprise. When ducking you are a lot smaller and much less likely to get smacked in the face by certain projectiles/aerials.

I hope this brings decent discussion. Things died pretty fast here lol.

 

[daisho]

Thanks Big O... unfortunately, the DK boards are so inactive...

Anyone else try to practice the GFSC... I did for half an hour... my arm hurts.

 

[Ripple]

Thanks Big O... unfortunately, the DK boards are so inactive...

Anyone else try to practice the GFSC... I did for half an hour... my arm hurts.

I don't even bother, I've just memorized what attacks have enough lag or a low enough hit box( MK's d tilt & d smash) for me to jump OOS and side B then or I just grab or d smash.

people at high levels won't attack your shield so recklessly. I barley get d smash OOS anymore

 

[Ragnar0k]

I tried working on GFSC the other day for about 10-15 minutes. I found that it's extremely easy if you set R to jump or whatever trigger you don't use. The key is to footstool them so that you jump towards one direction and then b reverse the headbutt back to them. So it's footstool right b left. I can get it about 90% of the time in training but I've yet to apply it in a real match. It feels weird doing it OoS for me I need to get used to that.

Also if a snake down throws you just stand up and up tilt. You'll usually hit them right before they can grab you.

Ducking is amazing. Use it.

Jumping over an olimar isn't usually a good plan. That's where they want you. Honestly when I play olimars I just ignore their pikmin because dk is so heavy the % they do to you is comparatively less important, the key is to keep the pressure on and approach with down or up b and get them offstage asap. DK is amazing at getting people offstage and gimping.

 

[Big O]

I just meant jumping over the spam. Most Snakes also will hold shield waiting for you to something. That is when my advice really applies. It's more of a mindgame thing.

 

[daisho]

I tried working on GFSC the other day for about 10-15 minutes. I found that it's extremely easy if you set R to jump or whatever trigger you don't use. The key is to footstool them so that you jump towards one direction and then b reverse the headbutt back to them. So it's footstool right b left. I can get it about 90% of the time in training but I've yet to apply it in a real match. It feels weird doing it OoS for me I need to get used to that.

Oh... that could be why it was so hard... i was trying to do Right B Right Left... not as easy as its sounds.

 

[Ragnar0k]

yeah the easiest way to do it is like this. Say they're to your right you just hold right and press jump twice then b then left. That would put you on the other side of them when it's done but it's easier than jumping towards them, footstooling and side b'ing left then pressing right.

 

[Jmex]

I personally will never do the GFSC, too hard for me to even get off. While in a tourney i dont feel its plausible to perform this.

Im going to start ducking more during tournament, especially against Metas since they like to hover above your head and down air repeatedly.

I wonder if up smash will hit the meta out of nado? Does anyone know if this is true?

 

[Jmex]

Sorry for the double post but also, i did double DK this weekend with M7H.

We actually were a little disappointed we only got 9th.

Were assuming we were just having too much fun actually being able to play Double DK.

Does anyone have any suggestions for double DK's?

 

[Ripple]

Sorry for the double post but also, i did double DK this weekend with M7H.

We actually were a little disappointed we only got 9th.

Were assuming we were just having too much fun actually being able to play Double DK.

Does anyone have any suggestions for double DK's?

cargo throw combos

 

[Luigi player]

The GFSC is really easy for me. I changed Y to special and now I can press X to footstool and Y to headbutt.
I could do it about 90% of the time on a standing opponent. My problem is just that the enemy is never on the ground and is standing still to be footstooled, lol. There are really few moments where you can do it, so it seems to not be that useful...

 

[Drizzt6195]

The GFSC is really easy for me. I changed Y to special and now I can press X to footstool and Y to headbutt.
I could do it about 90% of the time on a standing opponent. My problem is just that the enemy is never on the ground and is standing still to be footstooled, lol. There are really few moments where you can do it, so it seems to not be that useful...

Dtilt
Or we need to find another link > Footstool

 

[smashkng]

How can GFSC be useful? For surprising an opponent?

 

[ook]

The GFSC is really easy for me. I changed Y to special and now I can press X to footstool and Y to headbutt.
I could do it about 90% of the time on a standing opponent. My problem is just that the enemy is never on the ground and is standing still to be footstooled, lol. There are really few moments where you can do it, so it seems to not be that useful...

yup... that's the big problem, lol.

Apparently you can footstool someone in the couple frames of lag when they're landing on the ground (I just tested it with someone falling and holding shield. I could footstool them as soon as they hit the ground and they'd go into the stunned animation)

so I guess you could use it for those times when people airdodge into the ground.... Instead of just doing a dsmash or grab or whatever you use to punish that normally.



But most of the time it's better (or equally good) to just do a normal headbutt, like ripple said.
too bad you can't footstool someone out of their attacks

 

[Ragnar0k]

I've started to get a knack for landing regular headbutts. I broke chillin's snake's shield 3 times in one set and ended up beating him with the help of broken shields and snakes ridiculously easy to gimp recovery.

 

[Jmex]

^ I have a big problem with headbutt. It seems when i do it im actually above him, so when i headbutt i miss by a few inches too far to the right or left of them. I really need to stop doing this.

 

[Ragnar0k]

Headbutt is good because it works from that weird angle that's a blind zone for a lot of people. learn to get in there and punish shields or lag with headbutt.

 

[Jmex]

Im def going to start perfecting my spacing with the side b, also OOS short hop side b as well.

But the one i really want to start using is just ducking, lol.

 

[Ragnar0k]

ducking underneath platforms is OP. Normally people like TL and G&W can hit you with dair from above platforms but it's so easy to duck and then upsmash. It helps a lot vs lucario too.

 

[Jmex]

Can you Upsmash instantly from ducking?

Lol thats such a noob question i feel bad for asking it. But seriously, can you?

 

[Ragnar0k]

yeah just c stick. It's really useful.

 

[Jmex]

****, i wish i wasent at work right now, i really want to play smash with someone right now, lol.

 

[thrillagorilla]

Can you Upsmash instantly from ducking?

Lol thats such a noob question i feel bad for asking it. But seriously, can you?

Yup, C-stick or regular. C-stick is easier, though.

Edit: Whoops. Sorry about that, I type slow!

 

[Big O]

To answer Jmex's question Usmash does beat the tornado since it is a ground move that does more than 10 damage. He has to be pretty high to not hit you first though and if he is too high you won't hit him out of it.

You can footstool people during any landing lag, trip state, while they aren't attacking, and during grabs. This is probably known already but the last one is probably overlooked.

 

[Ragnar0k]

I didn't know about during grabs. I just assumed they were like attacks where you still jump off their head but they continue doing their move.