Death Note Mafia - Game Thread - Ovah

[ranmaru]

People who possess the notebook and the composer ability MUST be pro-kira, period. There is no "So long as they continue to hold this notebook".

Yet it states "while they hold this notebook." So it is assumed that they are only seen as pro-kira 'while holding the notebook' and to me it is implied that when they are no longer holding the notebook, that they won't be seen as pro-kira. Unless you think it should have an addition to confirm they won't? I think that would make the morbid composer a red herring, for any investigator to trip up and get a fake scan. So if a morbid composer has the notebook in possession and is scanned, it would be like a miller.

Anyway I don't think voting Red Ryu simply for his claim is good enough. *Cough @adumbrodeus Cough*

 

[ranmaru]

@ DJCrinkleCut Answer Mac's question? Also, vote Alakaslam.

 

[DJCrinkleCut]

To Mac's question, no one in particular stands out to me as egregiously bandwagoning, and I wasn't ignoring, I had the thread open in a tab as I was writing an essay. Sorry about that.
I'd be glad to vote Slam just because he annoys me, but I'll have to catch up on the thread.

 

[ranmaru]

@Damdred Vote Alakaslam? You say you scumread him, here is your chance.

 

[batsnacks]

"I'd be glad to vote Slam just because he annoys me"

see I just can't deal with this

 

[Alakaslam]

Meh. Many cannot deal with me. Think Vivax, he started out calling for my vig, by the end of the game he was basically admiring my "improvement"

And that game is in progress so Ah...

 

[Holder of the Heel]

But when I proposed that Death Notes worked the way you describe Ranmaru, I was argued reductio ad absurdum due to the consequence of every Kira having incentive to pass off their notebooks to someone else to become town and either kill the newborn Kira, if handed off to a morbid composer, or rather not worry at all if the individual can't even use it and possesses no reason as town to pass it away. If mafia doesn't even exist that'd be a "And everyone lived happily ever after" instant ending, and if there is a mafia, our odds as town to win increased greatly due to our numbers increasing and the ex-kiras would still be rewarded.

 

[Alakaslam]

Sson

Damdred speak now or forever hold your peace

 

[Alakaslam]

But when I proposed that Death Notes worked the way you describe Ranmaru, I was argued reductio ad absurdum due to the consequence of every Kira having incentive to pass off their notebooks to someone else to become town and either kill the newborn Kira, if handed off to a morbid composer, or rather not worry at all if the individual can't even use it and possesses no reason as town to pass it away. If mafia doesn't even exist that'd be a "And everyone lived happily ever after" instant ending, and if there is a mafia, our odds as town to win increased greatly due to our numbers increasing and the ex-kiras would still be rewarded.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MindScrew

I have not comprehension

 

[The Real Gamer]

Slam just vote Red with us.

 

[DJCrinkleCut]

"I'd be glad to vote Slam just because he annoys me"

see I just can't deal with this

I was being facetious.
Anyways, Slam seems harmless for now. At least I think, I get nothing from his posts, tbh.
As far as RR and Morbid Composer, he'd have to be given a DN for it to take effect and for him to become Pro-Kira, right?

 

[#HBC | Mac]

@ DJCrinkleCut can you rank your scum reads? I'm having a hard time getting a clear picture of where you stand on people

 

[#HBC | Mac]

why are you convinced ryu is town?

 

[batsnacks]

I was being facetious.
Anyways, Slam seems harmless for now. At least I think, I get nothing from his posts, tbh.
As far as RR and Morbid Composer, he'd have to be given a DN for it to take effect and for him to become Pro-Kira, right?

he's harmless but you get nothing from his posts

and you were being facetious

right

 

[Xivii]

iight any non-constructive criticism towards a player will hence forth result in a mod kill. this includes terms like dumbtown. this hasn't been a huge issue, but we should have more courtesy to our offsite guests. also anyone who hasn't yet seen death note must do so immediately or also face mod kill.

 

[batsnacks]

Slam has the largest filter in the game.

If you think he's useless, or you're getting nothing from his posts, then you think he is harming the game. Like that's just the way it is.

 

[ranmaru]

But when I proposed that Death Notes worked the way you describe Ranmaru, I was argued reductio ad absurdum due to the consequence of every Kira having incentive to pass off their notebooks to someone else to become town and either kill the newborn Kira, if handed off to a morbid composer, or rather not worry at all if the individual can't even use it and possesses no reason as town to pass it away. If mafia doesn't even exist that'd be a "And everyone lived happily ever after" instant ending, and if there is a mafia, our odds as town to win increased greatly due to our numbers increasing and the ex-kiras would still be rewarded.

The morbid composer is 'treated' as pro-kira aligned while holding the notebook. To me, this does not show that they are converted, or that they somehow add to the mafia's numbers (the most important fact here) while holding the notebook. They are 'handled' as mafia-aligned when they may or may not be, and I would think it would be totally different if it were worded like 'They become". Remember that Death Note is about investigators/cops + fbi finding kira. Makes sense for there to be some red herrings to trip them up. I think the incentive to pass it away as town is to not be seen as mafia (miller). Town wants to prove to town that they are town of course. Also if this player doesn't add to mafia's numbers while being treated as one, then it would be ridiculous to consider keeping the notebook when it'd do nothing for them in return.

This also doesn't show that pro-kira would somehow be treated or convert to town after passing their own deathnote. I would assume for balance purposes they would be pro-kira permanently. Meaning, even if they were able to pass around their notebooks, I would assume they'd stay pro-kira. Who argued with you about this? What exactly is the purpose of a morbid composer, or is that also in the image you posted?

No question about mafia existing. We know that to be true.

 

[DJCrinkleCut]

why are you convinced ryu is town?

Yagami was in my chatroom, everything RR has said about the chat was accurate. I don't think there is anything too bad about me revealing that much.

@ DJCrinkleCut can you rank your scum reads? I'm having a hard time getting a clear picture of where you stand on people

I&F's mishap with asking to reveal morbid composer stuck out to me as I said earlier. I think on d1 Garg was too aggressive. Don't think that necessarily makes him scum, but I'm watching him.
Dam is probably just a case of lurking too much same as me.

I definitely think that you are town, and I'm pretty sure that Holder is town.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I promise to start watching Death Note tomorrow.

 

[DJCrinkleCut]

btw I'm also of the mind that the second arc isn't that great .-.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

Yagami was in my chatroom, everything RR has said about the chat was accurate. I don't think there is anything too bad about me revealing that much.

I&F's mishap with asking to reveal morbid composer stuck out to me as I said earlier. I think on d1 Garg was too aggressive. Don't think that necessarily makes him scum, but I'm watching him.
Dam is probably just a case of lurking too much same as me.

I definitely think that you are town, and I'm pretty sure that Holder is town.

ice and fire == mac

just because ryu might be telling the truth about his room means that he's town?

 

[ranmaru]

btw I'm also of the mind that the second arc isn't that great .-.

:thumbsdown: So you aren't going to vote Alakaslam? Who will you vote then?

 

[ranmaru]

Slam has the largest filter in the game.

If you think he's useless, or you're getting nothing from his posts, then you think he is harming the game. Like that's just the way it is.

How are you reading Slam now? Just wondering.

 

[DJCrinkleCut]

ice and fire == mac

just because ryu might be telling the truth about his room means that he's town?

hmm I suppose it doesn't. Man maybe I'm just an idiot or something. ;;

 

[Fire Emblemier]

@ Fire Emblemier : Oh god. I'm on the opposite spectrum. I scumread Alakaslam, and I was the one who asked him to elaborate on that random *** town read he slapped to Alakaslam. This ***** said that because I was asking you for a read on him, to me it was a pseudo-defense. ("Hey some people might have doubts of you, I'll give a random town read to you to support you") I do see them as scum together (I suspect them individually as[/USER]

The morbid composer is 'treated' as pro-kira aligned while holding the notebook. To me, this does not show that they are converted, or that they somehow add to the mafia's numbers (the most important fact here) while holding the notebook. They are 'handled' as mafia-aligned when they may or may not be, and I would think it would be totally different if it were worded like 'They become". Remember that Death Note is about investigators/cops + fbi finding kira. Makes sense for there to be some red herrings to trip them up. I think the incentive to pass it away as town is to not be seen as mafia (miller). Town wants to prove to town that they are town of course. Also if this player doesn't add to mafia's numbers while being treated as one, then it would be ridiculous to consider keeping the notebook when it'd do nothing for them in return.

This also doesn't show that pro-kira would somehow be treated or convert to town after passing their own deathnote. I would assume for balance purposes they would be pro-kira permanently. Meaning, even if they were able to pass around their notebooks, I would assume they'd stay pro-kira. Who argued with you about this? What exactly is the purpose of a morbid composer, or is that also in the image you posted?

No question about mafia existing. We know that to be true.

So it would be a way for mafia to frame others even though they are town. This honestly makes me think we shouldn't vote Ryu. As it makes more sense balance wise for it too work like this rather than just handing the notebook to people to convert soon outnumbering town with deathes added on.

 

[DJCrinkleCut]

:thumbsdown: So you aren't going to vote Alakaslam? Who will you vote then?

gah I'm not sure at this point. Don't think it really matters though, RR seems to be getting lynched no matter what.

 

[Fire Emblemier]

The game I was last in was Gorf's grass and weeds Ramaru

 

[ranmaru]

Ok. Any other ideas of who you'd like to vote/think is scum @ Fire Emblemier ? Did you give any scumreads? If not, give me 2-3.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

The morbid composer is 'treated' as pro-kira aligned while holding the notebook. To me, this does not show that they are converted, or that they somehow add to the mafia's numbers (the most important fact here) while holding the notebook. They are 'handled' as mafia-aligned when they may or may not be, and I would think it would be totally different if it were worded like 'They become". Remember that Death Note is about investigators/cops + fbi finding kira. Makes sense for there to be some red herrings to trip them up. I think the incentive to pass it away as town is to not be seen as mafia (miller). Town wants to prove to town that they are town of course. Also if this player doesn't add to mafia's numbers while being treated as one, then it would be ridiculous to consider keeping the notebook when it'd do nothing for them in return.

Let's say Aoi receives a Death Note and keeps his town win condition. The pro-kira player lost his method to kill and has not given it to someone who will replace him. If I was given a notebook in that situation I'd either give it to someone who can't be converted in terms of majority nor can be millered or use it as a tool against pro-kiras, completely backfiring on them.

This also doesn't show that pro-kira would somehow be treated or convert to town after passing their own deathnote. I would assume for balance purposes they would be pro-kira permanently. Meaning, even if they were able to pass around their notebooks, I would assume they'd stay pro-kira. Who argued with you about this? What exactly is the purpose of a morbid composer, or is that also in the image you posted?

Ironically I brought up this idea myself before but forgot. .__. The ones who start out as pro-kira are probably locked into place, agreed. My apologies. I've a rather poor memory to be honest... No excuse.

No question about mafia existing. We know that to be true.

Is that because of Zenny's Takada post?

 

[Holder of the Heel]

@ #HBC | Mac

If there was a Kira between DJ and Ronike, who would it be?

 

[ranmaru]

Let's say Aoi receives a Death Note and keeps his town win condition. The pro-kira player lost his method to kill and has not given it to someone who will replace him. If I was given a notebook in that situation I'd either give it to someone who can't be converted in terms of majority nor can be millered or use it as a tool against pro-kiras, completely backfiring on them.

That's on the pro-kira player then. If he loses his method to kill, then he should have planned ahead of how to pre-cure a kill while also giving that death note away. Just because it may backfire doesn't mean it won't happen, thus making Red Ryu permanently scum. Plus we know that the pro-kira players can set future dates for people to die, that may be accounted for before passing the death note on. Another thing, is that a pro-kira player may not want to pass a death note willingly without any benefit to themselves. If it clears them, then they happily would do so, as Light did in the series. (He passed it on to clear himself but he intended to get it back after a certain period) Therefore, there may be other ways of aqcuiring a deathnote. Another thing is that there are vigs in town, so there may be other ways for pro-kira players to kill if they are trusted enough.

If you were given a death note from a pro-kira player, and you don't give it to anyone that seems like pro-kira, and they aren't, then it's on them. They might be cleared though so they'd benefit in the long run, no? Otherwise what would be the benefit you them giving it to you? (Willingly)

Ironically I brought up this idea myself before but forgot. .__. The ones who start out as pro-kira are probably locked into place, agreed. My apologies. I've a rather poor memory to be honest... No excuse.

Ok.

Is that because of Zenny's Takada post?

From the op of this game, and the op of the sign up thread.

 

[Ronike]

Rest of note post coming tomorrow. Had some unexpected family stuff come up today, and I'm leaving for work until midnight in a half an hour, so yeah. Need to post my current thoughts, so that y'all have em and hopefully don't yell at me for being really busy before christmas? It'd be appreciated at least

First off, what the ****'s with all the talk about Ryu not being the play over the last day? It'd be one thing if we were lynching him just cause of cult stuffs, but he was rather suspicious yesterday, his reaction today was not really all that townie, and we get tons of connections off of knowing his allignment. My reasons for seeing him as suspicious yesterday were in my notes post, and today, instead of trying to tell us a lot of his thoughts, he just whines that he's getting lynched, asks a few people for reads (most specifically on him), and then decides to stop checking the thread. This is not good play. So even if he isn't culted if given the DN (which for game balance reasons I find unlikely), he is still a great lynch, which is why...

##Vote: Aoi Inu

Not liking Ran(?) today, due to trying to push the lynch all over IIRC. Like TRG and Holder more and more every post. Very much appreciate that Slam is posting normally now, should make things way easier. Really, really dont think we should be lynching inactives in a game where we have so many good connections, at least, not at this point. Should see what a Ryu lynch nets us, and then likely look at Kuz. Which, btw, where the **** has he been?

Again, more coming tomorrow (12/23) as I have work off, and xmas shopping done and everything. Sorry to keep you wainting adum. My apologies if I missed it, but did you re-look at Kuz, @adumbrodeus?

 

[ranmaru]

Not liking Ran(?) today, due to trying to push the lynch all over IIRC.

So? Would you rather I just sit on Ryu and not even try? Plus if scum happens to be inactive what will you do then? I also think lynching Ryu > Kuz is stupid if you are looking at it claim wise.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

That's on the pro-kira player then. If he loses his method to kill, then he should have planned ahead of how to pre-cure a kill while also giving that death note away. Just because it may backfire doesn't mean it won't happen, thus making Red Ryu permanently scum. Plus we know that the pro-kira players can set future dates for people to die, that may be accounted for before passing the death note on. Another thing, is that a pro-kira player may not want to pass a death note willingly without any benefit to themselves. If it clears them, then they happily would do so, as Light did in the series. (He passed it on to clear himself but he intended to get it back after a certain period) Therefore, there may be other ways of aqcuiring a deathnote. Another thing is that there are vigs in town, so there may be other ways for pro-kira players to kill if they are trusted enough.

If you were given a death note from a pro-kira player, and you don't give it to anyone that seems like pro-kira, and they aren't, then it's on them. They might be cleared though so they'd benefit in the long run, no? Otherwise what would be the benefit you them giving it to you? (Willingly)

How would it clear them if we are accepting that they remain pro-kira even without the notebook? And how would they confirm that they'd get it back? That would mean each Kira would probably have the ability to steal items from the living or scavenge from the dead (dropped item list) or else the likelihood of it being passed elsewhere, being stolen, not going anywhere, or the holder dying is much more likely than everything going "Exactly as planned!" It's not like they can "ask" for it, anyone asking for the Death Note would look sketchy as ****. It's true that there are other methods to kill, but this would also either mean they'd probably have to steal or scavenge, otherwise it wouldn't be reliable to do so at all, especially since there is the possibility that some guns aren't even loaded. And among the living it would be difficult to steal what you need because they might be passing that **** around; hell, even trying to take items from that which was dropped might be rough if multiple parties are scrambling over the leftovers. They can set the dates for in the future, sure, but without the eyes not even that can be relied on absolutely. Giving it up can just screw over your use so easily.

Though in typing this, I realize that this isn't a very fruitful thing to discuss right now though, and it'd just be better to observe closely the events that proceed.

From the op of this game, and the op of the sign up thread.

I see. Well, I think it is indeed likely. Someone surely has the eye power, and they probably wrote down a name to die in the future; they can afford to do so anyhow since they needn't fear that they made a mistake on the ID. Rajam's death was an inside job all the more so because of this.

 

[ranmaru]

I'll keep it short. I simply don't see why Pro-kira would send out a deathnote to him, unless there was a benefit to them, because as you say, they would lose the ability to kill. I can see it being sent to them to screw them over, and in that scenario, I'm sure an anti-kira morbid composer would not want to keep it due to reasons already mentioned. We can talk more about this some other time.

@ Fire Emblemier : How are you catching up? I am reading your recent game and have seen you post a bit more than you have here. I know you can conjure up opinions and scumreads, so please do so in a timely manner. If you are having any problems with finding scum, say so. What's taking you so long?

 

[#HBC | Mac]

holder, i been wondering that myself

really lame that kuz went inactive all of today

 

[Xivii]

Vote Count

Alive [15]: Red Ryu (Aoi), Adumbrodeus (ad.), FireEmblemnier, DJCrinkleCut, th3kuzinator, Ronike (Rni), Mac (Mc), The Real Gamer (Trg), Holder of the Heel (Hld), Ranmaru, Alakaslam, Orboknown, Damdred (De.), batsnacks, Gargaglion (Gr.)

[collapse=Vote History]
New Designated Lynch = Red


Pg 25: #997 - #1000
Aoi [1] Ala

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 1 | Alakaslam

Pg 26
Aoi [2] Ala | Gr.
Aoi [3] Ala | Gr. | Mc
Aoi [4] Ala | Gr. | Mc | Hld
Aoi [5] Ala | Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg
Aoi [6] Ala | Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | Aoi

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)

Pg 27
Aoi [7] Ala | Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | Aoi | De.

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 7 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu), Damdred

Pg 28
-

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 7 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu), Damdred

Pg 29
De. [1] DJ
Aoi [6] Ala | Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | De.
De. [2] DJ | Aoi |

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)

Pg 30
-

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)

Pg 31
FE [1] ran

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Ranmaru

Pg 32
-

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Ranmaru

Pg 33
-

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Ranmaru

Pg 34
-

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Ranmaru

Pg 35
kuz [1] bat

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Ranmaru
th3kuzinator | 1 | batsnacks

Pg 36
Aoi [7] Ala | Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | De. | ad.

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 7 | Alakaslam, Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred, Adumbrodeus
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Ranmaru
th3kuzinator | 1 | batsnacks

Pg 37
Aoi [6] Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | De. | ad.
FE [2] ran | Ala
kuz [0]
ad. [1] bat
Ala [1] ran

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 6 | Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred, Adumbrodeus
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
FireEmblemnier (prev. KyryK) | 1 | Alakaslam
Adumbrodeus | 1 | batsnacks
Alakaslam | 1 | Ranmaru

Pg 38
FE [0]
Aoi [7] Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | De. | ad. | Ala

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 7 | Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred, Adumbrodeus, Alakaslam
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
Adumbrodeus | 1 | batsnacks
Alakaslam | 1 | Ranmaru

Pg 39
Aoi [8] Gr. | Mc | Hld | Trg | De. | ad. | Ala | Rni

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 8 | Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred, Adumbrodeus, Alakaslam, Ronike
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
Adumbrodeus | 1 | batsnacks
Alakaslam | 1 | Ranmaru

[/collapse]

Red Ryu (Aoi Inu) | 8 | Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred, Adumbrodeus, Alakaslam, Ronike
Damdred | 2 | DJCrinklecut, Red Ryu (Aoi Inu)
Adumbrodeus | 1 | batsnacks
Alakaslam | 1 | Ranmaru

Not Voting [3]: Fireemblemnier, th3kuzinator, Orboknown


Designated Lynch:

Red Ryu [8] - Gargaglione, Macman, Holder of the Heel, The Real Gamer, Damdred, Adumbrodeus, Alakaslam, Ronike


Deadline is tonight.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

This is all that needs to be said.

Ryu is a threat and needs to go, scum or not.

I thought we established this already. Where is the doubt coming from? Slam?

Eww at the middle, that is transparent.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Guess I die.

Oh well go scum!

 

[Holder of the Heel]

Guess I die.

Oh well go scum!

Confirmed scum!!!!!