DDD Social: we livin' in smash 4

[C.J.]

It's a JC usmash

 

[| Big D |]

I forgot to mention that the analog has to reset to neutral before you press the y button.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I haven't mastered the art of dthrow > usmash yet...

Yo.

Get on that. Makes life so much easier in that MU lmao.

;__; why are you so mean to me

Baby I <3 you D:


Also guys I'm bored so I'm designing a mobile application for Dedede information lmao. I think what I'm going to do is put MU tidbits on it, links to really important threads and links to videos on Youtube. It's easy to do. Just some basic stuff all organized in one spot.

 

[Hoejja]

a JC usmash? sorry i'm nub

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Jump Canceled Up Smash.

The act of Jump Canceling an attack for certain purposes. The benefits vary per character and per move. For example, Toon Link is able to create a pseudo Glide Toss by Jump Canceling his Bombs.


Jump Canceling also enable reverse Hyphen Up Smashes.

Dedede mains would use it to let Hyphen Up Smash come out fast enough to work with the 20 frame advantage window he gains on certain characters so that it's guaranteed from Down Throw. Jump Canceling moves is a universal technique.

 

[bubbaking]

My question is: Why do I have to JC it? Can't DDD just run over and flick the C-stick up for usmash? :/

 

[| Big D |]

It has to be buffered, if you buffer a dash and try to buffer an upsmash a dash attack will come out.

 

[Xubble]

I love being able to guarantee a kill off a grab. It's the feeling of "I got the grab, **** is going up."

 

[Hoejja]

thanks guys for the answers on the MU

btw tech chase i noticed that the video link on the Skid cancelled Shield Grab thread was dead.

 

[Xubble]

http://youtube.com/#/watch?v=pPVB4-NLlsQ&desktop_uri=/watch?v=pPVB4-NLlsQ

 

[Hoejja]

dead link :/

 

[Xubble]

Lies! I'm looking at it right now!

Just go on YouTube and search "skid canceling shield grab." It's the Metagame Minute video.

 

[Hoejja]

Thanks

Also i was reading vayseth's guide on chaingrabs et releases, he wrote that mk, olimar, kirby can be regrabbed after a pummel break, is really 100% assured ? or avoidable by spotdodge?

 

[Xubble]

If you dash grab and force a pummel break, they can be regrabbed if you buffer a grab. But it'll be a standing grab, so you can only do it once I believe.

 

[Hoejja]

ok i see... by buffered grab you mean a skid cancelled shield grab?

 

[Xubble]

No, just a straight up "press Z (or grab button) ten frames before the release animation is over" grab.

 

[Hoejja]

k thanks =)

 

[Kaptain]

There used to be stereotypes going around of people and what characters they use.

Like Falcos are blackk
Peaches are girls, black, or gay
Kirbys are girls

I observed that DDDs are tall as ****.

Commander Beef 6'6"
Exdeath 6'3"
Puma 6'1"
Mampam 6'4"
Fogo is like 6'4" or 5"
Count from Norcal 6'3"
Mr. Bojangles is like 6'3"
Coney 6'1"
Atomsk 6'2"
CO18 LOLOL 6'7"
Tech Chase 6'3"
Zekey 5'10"
Seibrik 5'10"?
Big D 6'9" ????!!!
Pidgezero_one 6'2"
Xubble 6'2"
4GOD 6'0 or 6'1"
Kaptain 5'8" or 5'9"
iLove was like 5'7" - 5'9"

I realize this is kinda late, but i name searched myself and found this. I believe I am the exception to the rule. Im only 5'6". Im short. I ruined it.

 

[pidgezero_one]

We need a dedede boards group shot at apex where we're all standing around someone really short

 

[Kaptain]

We need a dedede boards group shot at apex where we're all standing around someone really short

If you guys wanna sponsor me and my wife to come, we can stand around her. She is 4'10".

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Kaptain, where you been at? Lol

 

[Zekeishere]

F throw is so good in teams man.

 

[Hoejja]

i'll be teamin with a gaw in a few days, any tip for us ? i play the king D

 

[Blubolouis]

If you dash grab and force a pummel break, they can be regrabbed if you buffer a grab. But it'll be a standing grab, so you can only do it once I believe.

Hello, I'd like to know more about this. How is it possible ? DDD's animation is shorter or something ?

Also, I've noticed that sometimes, if you grab DDD and buffer a pummel, he'll instantly break out. Why is that, does it give him frame advantage and does it have anything to do with my question from before^ ?

 

[Kaptain]

Kaptain, where you been at? Lol

To be honest, i thought I was subscribed to this thread, (I wasn't), and I forgot it existed been rather inactive.

But I did attend a tourney 2 weeks ago. Went full penguin.
doubles: 5/12
singles: 9/32

 

[Xubble]

Hello, I'd like to know more about this. How is it possible ? DDD's animation is shorter or something ?

Also, I've noticed that sometimes, if you grab DDD and buffer a pummel, he'll instantly break out. Why is that, does it give him frame advantage and does it have anything to do with my question from before^ ?

Dedede doesn't have a shorter animation, but certain characters when they get released have longer animations. And thanks to Dedede's godlike grab range, he's certain to regrab them on a pummel break.

As for grabbing Dedede, WHEN a character breaks out of a grab is dependent on on the character that is grabbed. Button mashing will break them out much sooner (specifically the Kprime method, look it up). At lower %, characters don't need to hit as many inputs to break out, so pummeling an opponent at lower percents is overall a bad idea since they'll break out before damage (or even the pummel) can happen.

 

[bubbaking]

btw tech chase i noticed that the video link on the Skid cancelled Shield Grab thread was dead.

http://youtube.com/#/watch?v=pPVB4-NLlsQ&desktop_uri=/watch?v=pPVB4-NLlsQ

dead link :/

Lies! I'm looking at it right now!

Lolz! Xubble, I think your link is wrong. Checked myself...

 

[bubbaking]

Also, I've noticed that sometimes, if you grab DDD and buffer a pummel, he'll instantly break out. Why is that, does it give him frame advantage and does it have anything to do with my question from before^ ?

As for grabbing Dedede, WHEN a character breaks out of a grab is dependent on on the character that is grabbed. Button mashing will break them out much sooner (specifically the Kprime method, look it up). At lower %, characters don't need to hit as many inputs to break out, so pummeling an opponent at lower percents is overall a bad idea since they'll break out before damage (or even the pummel) can happen.

I've actually noted some kind of glitch or something that is extremely similar but also very situational during my multiple friendlies with John12346. When DDD is grabbed over a ledge by Lucario (I haven't tested this out in any other MU, but it happens very often during our matches), DDD breaks out immediately, as if I had mashed out with some kind of godly speed. Furthermore, this happens at all %'s, even those well past 100%.

In some ways, this 'glitch' is kinda nifty 'cause its an auto-breakout before Lucario can even pummel us, but at the same time, it can be very, very dangerous because of how fast DDD falls. More than once I've been grabbed out of Super DDD Jump with no jumps left and then instantly broke out before anything could happen, to be easily edgeguarded.

Oh, I should probably point out that this glitch has happened most often for us on Frigate Orpheon. In fact.....I can't really recall this happening on any other stages, but my memory is probably faulty in this regard.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

You don't need a ledge for this.

It also happens when someone dash grabs Dedede as he's landing from the air

 

[C.J.]

I NEED to see some data/testing on this guaranteed pummel out of dash grab break sillyness. I've never heard of this before/seems unlikely and random.

@Bubba, D3 immediately breaks out of grabs, for some stupid reason, if pummels are buffered. Happens onstage and offstage.

This game is stupid.

Tech, I'm fairly sure it's dependent on the pummel being buffered. I'm able to, semi-consistently, control how D3 breaks out when he's out of jumps and I grab his upB over and over again.

 

[Hoejja]

blubo and i are very interested about the pummel break and the possible dash grab after it, he doesn't think it's possible, i hope it is, it needs to be tested out but i can"t =)

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I'll go test this and get answers. C.J. could be right.

 

[bubbaking]

You don't need a ledge for this.

It also happens when someone dash grabs Dedede as he's landing from the air

Ah, ok. That would make sense then. It always baffled us whenever it happened, but we were able to predict when it would happen after a time, so you're probably right.

I NEED to see some data/testing on this guaranteed pummel out of dash grab break sillyness. I've never heard of this before/seems unlikely and random.

@Bubba, D3 immediately breaks out of grabs, for some stupid reason, if pummels are buffered. Happens onstage and offstage.

This game is stupid.

Tech, I'm pretty sure it's dependent on the pummel being buffered. I'm able to, semi-consistently, control how D3 breaks out when he's out of jumps and I grab his upB over and over again.

Ok, that clarifies things even more. Thanks! Btw, what do you think is silly? The pummel break or the regrab?

blubo and i are very interested about the pummel break and the possible dash grab after it, he doesn't think it's possible, i hope it is, it needs to be tested out but i can"t =)

Wait, dash grab? I thought it was just a standing re-grab?

 

[Hoejja]

well idk if it's a dahs grab or a standing grab, but w/e works :d

 

[C.J.]

I think if for some reason a dashgrab break giving the opponent more "dead" frames than a normal grab break allows for a regrab, it would be silly. So, the regrab would be the silly thing. But this game is silly, so it's possible. I'd just need to see the data before I believe it is all.

And yeah, I'm not opposed to being wrong at all, Tech. It's just the ONLY thing that I can think of that could cause the semi-consistency I'm able to get.

 

[bubbaking]

I think if for some reason a dashgrab break giving the opponent more "dead" frames than a normal grab break allows for a regrab, it would be silly. So, the regrab would be the silly thing. But this game is silly, so it's possible. I'd just need to see the data before I believe it is all.

Well, the only time I've ever pulled something like that off was on Ness, and it's obvious why that worked. However, I believe DDD is almost guaranteed a dtilt on certain characters after a pummel break (maybe I'm remembering wrong). If that's the case, then I guess a re-grab isn't so ridiculous, but it's still silly. Ummm, I remember reading on Vayseth's guide somewhere that DDD gets the regrab on Bowser and Zard under certain circumstances because of how they stand or something. I'd have to go and re-read it to be sure, though...

 

[C.J.]

Framewise, there's nothing to suggest it though. The following excludes Bowser, DK, and the PSIboys from it.

Character X grabs character Y.
X pummels Y until Y breaks out.
Character X has 29 "dead" frames while Y has 30.
X gets a guaranteed jab if they have a frame 1 jab (Squirtle, ZSS).
Spotdodge invincibility comes out frame 3 for character Y (since frame 1 Y is still in a dead frame while X can act).
Earliest grab hitbox is on frame 6 which would be after spotdodge invincibility.
Y's shield comes up frame 2 so there's no way dtilt is close to hitting.


The ONLY way anything works is if DDD's dash grab has some special property in regards to grab breaks that I haven't seen written/proven anywhere.

I guess it MIGHT MAYBE POSSIBLY have something to do with a grounded release vs a pummel release? That still doesn't seem likely though.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I think if for some reason a dashgrab break giving the opponent more "dead" frames than a normal grab break allows for a regrab, it would be silly. So, the regrab would be the silly thing. But this game is silly, so it's possible. I'd just need to see the data before I believe it is all.

And yeah, I'm not opposed to being wrong at all, Tech. It's just the ONLY thing that I can think of that could cause the semi-consistency I'm able to get.

I mean none of us have any CONCLUSIVE evidence supporting these claims so I could be wrong. We could both be wrong lmao.

Fortunately, we can find out the answer to this though with some good ol' frame data. Could be useful to know why this happens.

 

[Hoejja]

well vayseth in his guide make the distinction between a pummel break, which is a a release during a pummel on a character that without the pummeling would do a air break : such as wario, and a ground break. the ground break happens on characters that touch the ground during the grab animation, whether or not they are pummeled.
BUT : if you do a standing grab on these short characters mentionned above and that are released in air or pummel break, they will touch the ground ( everyone of them? idk, but some will)

So what vayseth said is that DDD's dash grab seems to have some special property on some characters , since the pummel break is guaranteed after it. ( Mario Luigi Yoshi Wario Ice Climbers (Solo Popo or SoPo) Kirby Metaknight Olimar Pikachu Squirtle Jigglypuff Ness Lucas Mr. Game and Watch )

but he never rly proved this, or guaranteed a regrab after a pummel break. he just wrote that :
"Notice before that I said there were a list of characters who were small enough to trigger the feet dangling animation over the level. Well, of those characters, the following six characters fall right next to King Dedede and are in range of a D Tilt:

Mario, Kirby, Metaknight, Olimar, Ness, Lucas.

I know what you all are hoping for and unfortunately that is not the case. The other four characters have faster Pummel Break recoveries and a D Tilt is not guaranteed. Could it work as a mindgame? OH YEAH. Not guaranteed though. However, people might not be conscious of this information, so you never know who you could get with it. I was, however, able to get a regrab consistently on each character. What does this mean? If you just so happen to dash grab any of those characters (three of which can't be chaingrabbed, so there's no guaranteed set up for it), and just so happen to force a Pummel Break instead of an Air Break, you can regrab them and pummel them some more. So... at most 10% more in damage, if the stars and planets align and your opponent put down his controller. Also, since you had to dash grab them to cause the Pummel Break and there isn't time to dash grab again (only time for a normal, standing grab) you cannot force the animation to happen twice in a row, so all you get is some extra lousy pummel damage but it's interesting to note!"


am i being clear ? maybe i understood it wrong

 

[pidgezero_one]

Well, the only time I've ever pulled something like that off was on Ness, and it's obvious why that worked.

i mad

10mads