Countering (Projectile) Spam - Ultimate

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Jun 22, 2018
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Little Mac. He's not hard to beat, just not fun to play against because he's so tough to fight head-on. Just gotta avoid him and camp, which no one likes.
 
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Kokiden

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
69
No, absolutely not. You rarely see any Bayos or Shieks. The dislike for Shiek comes from Sm4sh time. It's much better now.

Also my opinion on Joker has changed a bit now that I know the MU better. He isn't nearly as annoying as Bayo. That was a bit of a premature placement here..

E: Interesting that you play Zelda but also the characters I dislike fighting. Nice coincidence :p.

If it were the character I encounter online most often, then I guess I'd be Link, though. But Link's really ok to fight for me.
Bayo and Sheik fell off the map in Ultimate unfortunately.

Interesting that you see Link a lot. I thought Joker would’ve been one of the most popular characters to use online.
 

Kokiden

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
69
I just started playing online today.

I’ve definitely encountered quite a few Ness/Lucas and Ganondorf mains. These guys sure do spam PK Fire and PK Freeze a lot...

Fortunately most of the players I’ve come across play seriously and are good practice.

I’ve encountered 2 Jokers and it’s a shame they just spam down B. Good thing I also main Joker so I was patient and pummeled them whenever they abused it too much. It’s not going to look good on the Nintendo online database though...

Minimal trolling and teabagging, which is good at least.

The lag and input delay is godawful.
 
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:ultisabelle: I haven’t hated a character this bad in a while.

Fighting this character is the exact opposite of fun.

Just standing there on the edge waiting the hell out of me to approach and then stage spike me with the fishing rod.

“Then use X character”
This is quick play. I can’t foresee who I fight against.

“Just dodge / shield it”
I do, but since it’s online, it can lag and screw my timing. Also the threat level is high in contrast to the reward of landing a few hits at best, which should also be done off-stage, where characters like :ultisabelle::ultvillager: thrive.
Her risk/reward ratio is very low/very high as she can take a stock of me at 0%, and if I manage to say... spike her, this character can float back up from hell.


And say I’m on a :ultisabelle: killing mood. And I specifically go for another character... then what?

Close range? 0-deaths me with Fishing Rod.

Mid range? She dominates with fairs / bairs.

Long range? How? She pockets everything.
 

The Rhythm Theif

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Honestly, the most annoying fighter for me to face is Ness. All they do is spam PK Fire, throw me around, use PK Thunder to recover and nothing else. My strategy for beating PK Fire is just to jump over it and hit Ness with any of your aerials. Also...

:ultisabelle: I haven’t hated a character this bad in a while.

Fighting this character is the exact opposite of fun.

Just standing there on the edge waiting the hell out of me to approach and then stage spike me with the fishing rod.

“Then use X character”
This is quick play. I can’t foresee who I fight against.

“Just dodge / shield it”
I do, but since it’s online, it can lag and screw my timing. Also the threat level is high in contrast to the reward of landing a few hits at best, which should also be done off-stage, where characters like :ultisabelle::ultvillager: thrive.
Her risk/reward ratio is very low/very high as she can take a stock of me at 0%, and if I manage to say... spike her, this character can float back up from hell.


And say I’m on a :ultisabelle: killing mood. And I specifically go for another character... then what?

Close range? 0-deaths me with Fishing Rod.

Mid range? She dominates with fairs / bairs.

Long range? How? She pockets everything.
Vegeta! More power! Right now!
 
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The Rhythm Theif

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:ultisabelle: I haven’t hated a character this bad in a while.

Fighting this character is the exact opposite of fun.

Just standing there on the edge waiting the hell out of me to approach and then stage spike me with the fishing rod.

“Then use X character”
This is quick play. I can’t foresee who I fight against.

“Just dodge / shield it”
I do, but since it’s online, it can lag and screw my timing. Also the threat level is high in contrast to the reward of landing a few hits at best, which should also be done off-stage, where characters like :ultisabelle::ultvillager: thrive.
Her risk/reward ratio is very low/very high as she can take a stock of me at 0%, and if I manage to say... spike her, this character can float back up from hell.


And say I’m on a :ultisabelle: killing mood. And I specifically go for another character... then what?

Close range? 0-deaths me with Fishing Rod.

Mid range? She dominates with fairs / bairs.

Long range? How? She pockets everything.
Vegeta! More power! Right now!
 

G3_Tavo

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 8, 2019
Messages
7
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Costa Rica
As a :ultgnw: main, I'll be the first to admit a decent GW is annoying af.

UpB beats everything, the unpredictable air mobility makes him difficult to punish on landing and the dsmash to fsmash killing at stupidly low percentages is infuriating for whoever is in the wrong end of those hammers. Plus, of course, there's always the chance for a 9 to appear.


As for me, I have a really hard time against :ultike:s with good spacing. Really difficult to contest that range. Getting below them to parry their nair is effective, but risky, and they kill me at nothing% with a Nair to Uair.

Also having trouble with :ultjoker:. Not sure how to fight a good one yet.
 
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Coolboy

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Netherlands
when i play as Zelda i HATE Sonic, ZSS & Captain Falcon >:l
they are always faster then me and the well known hated move neutral B doesn't work that great against them because of their speed..they know i will use it eventually so they punish me afterwards because they can with their speed..gah!

i struggle alot against Captain Falcon in general...unless i play as Toon Link then we are either even or i am performing great!

i also discovered Jigglypuff can be a pain in the *** when played by a 4 mil player >.> i don't find her impossible to beat just this character can be so annoying!

also when fighting Link as Young Link/Toon Link is also veeery annoying
 

J.I.L

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 30, 2019
Messages
325
when i play as Zelda i HATE Sonic, ZSS & Captain Falcon >:l
they are always faster then me and the well known hated move neutral B doesn't work that great against them because of their speed..they know i will use it eventually so they punish me afterwards because they can with their speed..gah!

i struggle alot against Captain Falcon in general...unless i play as Toon Link then we are either even or i am performing great!

i also discovered Jigglypuff can be a pain in the *** when played by a 4 mil player >.> i don't find her impossible to beat just this character can be so annoying!

also when fighting Link as Young Link/Toon Link is also veeery annoying
Do you have a golden sonic profile pic?
 

DeDeDIke

Smash Apprentice
Joined
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Messages
81
Location
Vancouver
Here are mine (as an Ike main and D3 main):

1. :ultsamus: and :ultdarksamus: - ALL THEY EVER DO IS IMMEDIATELY MAKE A B-LINE TOWARDS THE EDGE OF THE STAGE AND SPAM THEIR F***** CHARGE SHOT!!! UGH!!! SO ANNOYING!!! LIKE, COME FIGHT ME HEAD ON!!!

2. :ultness: - If PK Fire wasn't apart of his moveset, maybe he'd be less annoying. Trying to DI out of it when playing a superheavyweight is impossible sometimes.

3. :ultzelda: - Especially the ones that just mindlessly spam Phantom, Teleport, and Nayru's love all day.

4. :ultlucas: - If PK Fire wasn't enough, they also spam PK Freeze and Thunder. At least he's not a one-trick pony like Ness is.

5. :ultlink: :ulttoonlink: :ultyounglink: - I can deal with the projectile spam while playing Ike, but is a bit harder when I play D3. Still manageable though. I just wish yall Link mains would stop spamming your B moves.

6. :ultrichter: :ultsimon: - I don't see many of them online nowadays, but the ones I meet only know how to use their B button. (Quite ironic, since one of my pockets just so happen to be one of them.)

Edit: There's a few more I forgot to include:

7. :ultisabelle: :ultvillager: - very campy characters that love to spam their Lloyd rocket, and in Isabelle's case, the fishing rod, especially those who wait at the edge of the stage with it to get a cheap kill. AND WHY ARE THERE SO MANY ISABELLE'S ONLINE NOWADAYS???

8. :ultzss: - FLIPPIN' QUICK and that up B in the air is sometimes hard to dodge. Sometimes I feel it's impossible to land a hit sometimes due to how quick she is.
 
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Love Tap

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 5, 2019
Messages
51
Here are mine (as an Ike main and D3 main):

1. :ultsamus: and :ultdarksamus: - ALL THEY EVER DO IS IMMEDIATELY MAKE A B-LINE TOWARDS THE EDGE OF THE STAGE AND SPAM THEIR F***** CHARGE SHOT!!! UGH!!! SO ANNOYING!!! LIKE, COME FIGHT ME HEAD ON!!!

2. :ultness: - If PK Fire wasn't apart of his moveset, maybe he'd be less annoying. Trying to DI out of it when playing a superheavyweight is impossible sometimes.

3. :ultzelda: - Especially the ones that just mindlessly spam Phantom, Teleport, and Nayru's love all day.

4. :ultlucas: - If PK Fire wasn't enough, they also spam PK Freeze and Thunder. At least he's not a one-trick pony like Ness is.

5. :ultlink: :ulttoonlink: :ultyounglink: - I can deal with the projectile spam while playing Ike, but is a bit harder when I play D3. Still manageable though. I just wish yall Link mains would stop spamming your B moves.

6. :ultrichter: :ultsimon: - I don't see many of them online nowadays, but the ones I meet only know how to use their B button.
99% of them, yeah. :/
 

Love Tap

Smash Cadet
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Feb 5, 2019
Messages
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I need to be patient and bait out air dodges more when I'm in a ledge guarding position. I also need practice parrying. I don't even try to because I'm too afraid of throwing the match by a failed party, but I need to remind myself that a few lost matches is no big thing compared to what mastery of parrying would bring to my gameplay. *deep breath*

This one usually only happens with lag but sometimes I roll when I'm trying to back air out of shield. :(
 
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boysilver400

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 7, 2018
Messages
109
:ultfalcon: And :ultinkling: players constantly ****ing dash grab me like it’s smash 4(granted nearly everyone online that I run into does this but these 2 do it the most from what I’ve seen. It’s even worse when they do it right when the match starts and I can’t do anything about it :/

Anyone who has a tether grab also annoys the hell out of me. As you can see, I have an issue with constantly getting grabbed. I’m trying to work on spot dodging tho.

:ultkrool: Is also really annoying because he can get away with damn near everything on lag.
 
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TheDuke54

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 19, 2016
Messages
377
Lucas and Ness got to be the most annoying fighters I come across on random. Mainly because all they know is pk freeze and fire. You can definitely play a good Ness/Lucas. Most on quickplay just resort to the easiest and spammiest move that gives the best reward.
 

BuffKirby

Smash Journeyman
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Feb 18, 2019
Messages
282
:ultyounglink::ultmegaman:
Worst nightmares: YL x Arrows, bombs destroy me (I don’t have a GOOD projectile) as they stand back and fire.

Also Mega Man: Lemon Lemon Lemon Lemon U air U air Gear Gear Gear Lemon Lemon Lemon. Not as horrifying as YL but I really hate this so much.
 

Chadmander

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Apr 3, 2015
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Dallas, Texas
:ultkrool: Immediately rolls to the side of the stage toss crown > shoot cannonball > suck cannonball >shoot in the air and repeat.
Oh and the randy down smash that kills at like 40% because we're on the edge of the stage.

:ultness::ultlucas: I don't care about being bombarded with projectiles its their voices that give me a headache

:ultjoker: :GCD::GCB: til Arsene shows then its spin :GCCN: to win.
 

Rran

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 3, 2014
Messages
117
I don't necessarily mind when a character chooses a very specific, uniform pattern of attack. In cases where I see what they're doing, I take each loss as a moment to collect myself and attempt an alternative approach (which, nevertheless, doesn't always end in my favor sadly... sometimes I just can't adapt lol).

Team Battle is a bit of a different beast. Like, even if I totally understand what the competition is doing, the additional fighters can sometimes completely decimate any attempt to forge a different attack pattern. Characters like Zelda, Samus, K. Rool, the heavenly Goddess of Light, Palutena, etc., really throw a wrench in how I'm able to approach due to having to focus not simply on their projectiles, but their teammates as well. Pretty much the main reason why--if I am engaging in online team battles--i stick to Arena Battles due to being able to swap characters.

Man I really want to be able to switch characters in Quick Play...
 
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Silask20

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jul 2, 2019
Messages
53
Ill give u a solid list. Mind you not every coward character is necessarily played in a cowardly fashion. They were just made for bad players so they can feel good by soamming easy mode things.

Tier 1 cowards- cheap characters that are often played in a cowardly fashion. Spamming, running and spamming some more. Barely see an honorable player use these.

:ultsimon::ultkrool::ultness::ultlucas::ultsonic::ultsamus::ultdarksamus::ultyounglink::ulttoonlink::ultlink:
_________________________________________

Tier 2 cowards- have some cheap moves. Some of them have projectiles and dont revolve around spamming them but behold, some players still will try to find way.

:ultkingdedede::ultmewtwo::ultbowserjr::ultridley::ultrob::ultpalutena::ultzelda::ultvillagerf::ultcharizard:

_____________________________________

Tier 3 cowards-usually not super spammer and not necessarily the easiest to play either but once you get a hang on them you can turn into a real wuss if you want to.

:ultyoshi::ultwolf::ultpacman: :ultmario:
______________________________

Honorable fighters- Of course they can still in some way be played cowardly but are not given the easiest time doing so and dont revolve around cheap cowardice play.

:ultincineroar::ultdk::ultivysaur::ultpokemontrainer::ultpit::ultdarkpit::ultrobin::ultsheik::ultwiifittrainer::ultinkling::ultbowser::ultbayonetta1::ultbayonetta::ultryu::ultken::ultrichter::ultlucario::ultkirby::ultivysaur::ultsquirtle::ultganondorf::ultpiranha::ultken::ultpikachu::ultincineroar::ultgreninja::ultcorrinf::ultcorrin::ultmarth::ultluigi:

And everything inbetween
 
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TheDuke54

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 19, 2016
Messages
377
Villager is tier 2 coward and also honorable? And lol Bayonetta Smash4 is honorable? Bro come on.
 
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Silask20

Smash Cadet
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Messages
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Villager is tier 2 coward and also honorable? And lol Bayonetta Smash4 is honorable? Bro come on.
Oops villager was an accident but yes i dont see bayonetta as dishonorable. I dont play her never have but she spends most of the roubd up close and personal in my experiences.
 

DeDeDIke

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Location
Vancouver
Tier 2 cowards- have some cheap moves. Some of them have projectiles and dont revolve around spamming them but behold, some players still will try to find way.

:ultkingdedede::ultmewtwo::ultbowserjr::ultridley::ultrob::ultpalutena::ultzelda::ultvillagerf::ultcharizard:


And everything inbetween
So is a D3 just spamming Gordos a Tier 2 coward to you? Just curious, why do you put Palu in the same tier? Is it because of her Nair? Ike's Nair is no different from hers, and he's in between?
 

Coolboy

Smash Journeyman
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Aug 27, 2018
Messages
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Netherlands
Ill give u a solid list. Mind you not every coward character is necessarily played in a cowardly fashion. They were just made for bad players so they can feel good by soamming easy mode things.

Tier 1 cowards- cheap characters that are often played in a cowardly fashion. Spamming, running and spamming some more. Barely see an honorable player use these.

:ultsimon::ultkrool::ultness::ultlucas::ultsonic::ultsamus::ultdarksamus::ultyounglink::ulttoonlink::ultlink:
_________________________________________

Tier 2 cowards- have some cheap moves. Some of them have projectiles and dont revolve around spamming them but behold, some players still will try to find way.

:ultkingdedede::ultmewtwo::ultbowserjr::ultridley::ultrob::ultpalutena::ultzelda::ultvillagerf::ultcharizard:

_____________________________________

Tier 3 cowards-usually not super spammer and not necessarily the easiest to play either but once you get a hang on them you can turn into a real wuss if you want to.

:ultyoshi::ultwolf::ultpacman: :ultmario:
______________________________

Honorable fighters- Of course they can still in some way be played cowardly but are not given the easiest time doing so and dont revolve around cheap cowardice play.

:ultincineroar::ultdk::ultivysaur::ultpokemontrainer::ultpit::ultdarkpit::ultrobin::ultsheik::ultwiifittrainer::ultinkling::ultbowser::ultbayonetta1::ultbayonetta::ultryu::ultken::ultrichter::ultlucario::ultkirby::ultivysaur::ultsquirtle::ultganondorf::ultpiranha::ultken::ultpikachu::ultincineroar::ultgreninja::ultcorrinf::ultcorrin::ultmarth::ultluigi:

And everything inbetween
Ganondorf a honorable fighter? LOOOOOOOL have you never been hit by his moves?! :o
hes a cheap character, i am a noob with Ganondorf but i still manage to get him into 4 mil GSP cause his moves are cheap af

and you also realize that mindless spam and spam is a different thing right? someone can still use spam in a way that makes it difficult for the opponent(s) instead of mindlessly spam it,
projectiles are just something you need to learn how to deal with, but it's easier to blame the character, i used to be like that to Spamus but i realized shes not unbeatable and can handle her way better now! :D
and my boi Toon Link is not unbeatable either

but how the hell is K Rool & Sonic cheap?! xD
Sonic sucks on Battlefield stages, not alot he can do there, only if you fight him on a non platform stage he can be annoying but meh that's it
and K Rool is 1 of the worst characters of the game..hes not cheap hes a punching bag :p

sorry when i saw your list i just had to say something..i just can't believe some characters that you placed as honorable and cheap...
 

Silask20

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jul 2, 2019
Messages
53
So is a D3 just spamming Gordos a Tier 2 coward to you? Just curious, why do you put Palu in the same tier? Is it because of her Nair? Ike's Nair is no different from hers, and he's in between?
Her nuetral B spam. And yes some D3 just wait at the ledge and spam gordos

Ganondorf a honorable fighter? LOOOOOOOL have you never been hit by his moves?! :o
hes a cheap character, i am a noob with Ganondorf but i still manage to get him into 4 mil GSP cause his moves are cheap af

and you also realize that mindless spam and spam is a different thing right? someone can still use spam in a way that makes it difficult for the opponent(s) instead of mindlessly spam it,
projectiles are just something you need to learn how to deal with, but it's easier to blame the character, i used to be like that to Spamus but i realized shes not unbeatable and can handle her way better now! :D
and my boi Toon Link is not unbeatable either

but how the hell is K Rool & Sonic cheap?! xD
Sonic sucks on Battlefield stages, not alot he can do there, only if you fight him on a non platform stage he can be annoying but meh that's it
and K Rool is 1 of the worst characters of the game..hes not cheap hes a punching bag :p

sorry when i saw your list i just had to say something..i just can't believe some characters that you placed as honorable and cheap...
Youre welcome to your opinion but the tier 1 cowards are basically written in stone. The kost complained about characters on these forums from what Ive seen because they revolve around cheap play.
 

1FC0

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
1,514
Ill give u a solid list. Mind you not every coward character is necessarily played in a cowardly fashion. They were just made for bad players so they can feel good by soamming easy mode things.

Tier 1 cowards- cheap characters that are often played in a cowardly fashion. Spamming, running and spamming some more. Barely see an honorable player use these.

:ultsimon::ultkrool::ultness::ultlucas::ultsonic::ultsamus::ultdarksamus::ultyounglink::ulttoonlink::ultlink:
_________________________________________

Tier 2 cowards- have some cheap moves. Some of them have projectiles and dont revolve around spamming them but behold, some players still will try to find way.

:ultkingdedede::ultmewtwo::ultbowserjr::ultridley::ultrob::ultpalutena::ultzelda::ultvillagerf::ultcharizard:

_____________________________________
R.O.B. should be a tier 1 coward at least. Playing R.O.B. against most characters mostly consists of running away all the time while covering oneself with lasers and Gyro's until there is a safe opening in which case R.O.B. may start a combo.
 

Silask20

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jul 2, 2019
Messages
53
R.O.B. should be a tier 1 coward at least. Playing R.O.B. against most characters mostly consists of running away all the time while covering oneself with lasers and Gyro's until there is a safe opening in which case R.O.B. may start a combo.
After further studying of ROB i agree. He is a tier one in the right hands
 
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