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Cold Shoulders: Ice Climbers Social Thread
- Thread starter Nguz95
- Start date
RideTheLine
Smash Cadet
Iceman
Smash Apprentice
Hey guys! I just wanted to get some feedback from the community. What would you write if I asked you to describe the Ice Climber's strengths and weakness? What are they looking to to exploit and what are they hoping to avoid? I'm interested to see how different individuals describe the character.
I found this hilarious.
RideTheLine
Smash Cadet
Strengths: High damage output from the barrage of moves they can emit. High kill power, even when just Sopo, due to powerful smashes, an easy bair, and reliable kills off of grabs. They have the best follow-ups from grabs om the game, leading to regrabs, good combos, high pummel damage, or sometimes maybe an infinite. Amazing ground movement. An unusual but, in my opinion, extremely useful projectile that opens approaches, forces ground-based opponents to approach, and can even score gimps. An unusual but, when used properly, highly powerful combo game. Solid n00b-crushing edgeguards (spam Blizzard on the ledge, if the opponent can't sweetspot, it's already over). Very good stage presence, as their grab game forces the opponent to switch their game up. As the Ice Climbers, your opponent will have to pick his options carefully or face your amazing punish game. Your movement, projectile, and threat will give you control over the match.
Weaknesses: Light. Bad air movement. A separated pair of climbers is a terrified one. Nana is a valuable commodity, her death will set you back hard. Should an opponent get a solid kill on Nana early on, you lose a large part of your options. Your punish game goes flat, and the opponent becomes extremely able to go berserk on you. All that stage presence is gone. When Belay isn't an option, your recovery is easy to edgeguard. A large technical barrier exists, with weird tech that no other character will prepare you for. A flubbed or poorly timed desynch can lead to a dead Nana, or worse, a dead Popo. A lack of meta from the very few players, and many of those who are interested in them are dissuaded from their "low tier" status. Most players just want to play the Melee Ice Climbers, but this is a new meta that has not fully been adapted to yet.
Overall, they are a curious case of a glass cannon who doesn't typically go balls to the wall.
Hinichii.ez.™
insincere personality
- Joined
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- hinichii
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It's bout to change, come 3.5
People might actually play them
People might actually play them
Player -0
Smash Hero
In 3.5 will Sopo's Up B be quicker like Melee? I feel it was more convenient then.
Player -0
Smash Hero
I'm also pretty sure they're attempting to remove "all" infinites. Besides in Melee wobbles is banned at some tournaments, notably Big House. Removal of an infinite would prevent this rift.
Kef
Smash Apprentice
I wanna know if the glitch that allows Nana to hold the opponent is gonna get removed or not. I felt this was a great part of their game in this game, even if it was somewhat unreliable.
The Eddie/Relius fanboy in me would love for them to make something like Side-B have more hitstun/blockstun, so you could throw Nana out there to lockdown the opponent or extend combos.
The Eddie/Relius fanboy in me would love for them to make something like Side-B have more hitstun/blockstun, so you could throw Nana out there to lockdown the opponent or extend combos.
The reason it was banned at Big House is cus of Tafokints' weird ass tourney ruleset. And my argument for them having Wobbling and the Brawl CG is because without that, there's not much notably they can do, therefore the entire Icies meta is eliminated.
Player -0
Smash Hero
Do you mean the 1 frame where you can choose where Nana will throw the opponent? Also what's that first gif in your sig?
Juggleguy's decision I'm pretty sure. Also the PMDT is trying to make it so IC's have things that aren't wobbling. Also IC's entire meta isn't wobbles and the CG, if you think that then you're saying Fox's entire metagame is Up-Smash and shine.
You can do awesome stuff and do a ton of epic grab combos without infinites; see (I think) Fly's epic grab combo vs. M2K. I don't have the gyfy. @
Hylian
do you know where it is?
Player -0
Smash Hero
I was pretty sure it was Wobbles or fly and took a guess. Hence the "I think."
But yeah.
But yeah.
Not my point. I know they have sick handoffs they can do, it's just the problem that in Melee and Brawl, you didn't necessarily have to use them to win, but they were still there, and it was the FEAR of getting wobbled or chaingrabbed that affected the meta. It's all a psychological thing. My reference for that is Tomber's thread on it, which goes into the psychology of wobbling in detail. But that part of the meta has been eliminated by the BR, effectively making Icies one of the hardest characters to use in PM.
Oh wow, look, the last PM tourney I entered. Decided I would enter under the pseudonym of 'imisswobbling' for a laugh, and game 1 didn't go horribly. Then my thought process was; "If I take him to a smaller stage, it'll be easier for me to kill him!" I clearly didn't take into account how it would also be easier for him to kill me, also. Anyways, enjoy I guess.
nimigoha
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2014
- Messages
- 877
Haven't ever seen this.
Also I think he means when Nana grabs and doesn't throw, then the opponent just mashes out. It happens to me more often than I'd like. It seems to be some sort of desync where you get control of Nana because *sometimes* I'm able to control her throw but usually I've already expected her to Uthrow and I'm jumping up to follow up on nothing.
I'm not consistent enough with handing off to Nana yet so I haven't really tested how to force Nana to hold.
Iceman
Smash Apprentice
You can actually choose which throw Nana uses
nimigoha
Smash Ace
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You mean when she's just standing there holding them? I think I always just get too flustered and they mash out, because I don't expect it.
Kef
Smash Apprentice
Near the ledge you can, but if you use the glitch midscreen you can not do a D-Throw as far as I know.
Cha0tic313
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Oct 4, 2014
- Messages
- 17
I wished they played the same way they did in melee, personally
Iceman
Smash Apprentice
Not exactly. It is literally a handoff in the middle of the stage. If you press a direction on the cstick the second Nana grabs someone then she will throw in that direction. Essentially you can downthrow with Popo, then downthrow with Nana at any position on the stage. We talked about this alot in the grabs and desyncs forum. You should be able to read all the posts. It's possible to do only downthrow handoffs anywhere on the stage, but it is very difficult.
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Iceman
Smash Apprentice
double post sorry
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Iceman
Smash Apprentice
You might want to wait to practice it since the grab release points are going to be different next update. It might be a different timing
nimigoha
Smash Ace
- Joined
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- 877
Okay so I just figured some stuff out but the timing is so difficult I can't do it consistently.
I'm getting the Nana Dthrows more frequently but I accidentally keep holding down and when I try to regard with Popo I do a Dtilt. Will practice.
Figured out how to 'freeze' Nana in the hold. As Nana is regrabbing, hold down. Popo will crouch and Nana will grab and hold the opponent. As soon as Popo un-crouches, she'll do her normal stage position determined throw.
Not sure how to proceed, or if it's worth doing all this work when 3.5 will be different.
@
Hylian
I'd love to hear what you have to say.
I'm getting the Nana Dthrows more frequently but I accidentally keep holding down and when I try to regard with Popo I do a Dtilt. Will practice.
Figured out how to 'freeze' Nana in the hold. As Nana is regrabbing, hold down. Popo will crouch and Nana will grab and hold the opponent. As soon as Popo un-crouches, she'll do her normal stage position determined throw.
Not sure how to proceed, or if it's worth doing all this work when 3.5 will be different.
@
Hylian
I'd love to hear what you have to say.
Player -0
Smash Hero
If you hold down, can you choose the direction of Nana throwing with the C-Stick?
I think it's too gimmicky to learn and not consistent enough. I would rather just get my normal grab punishes.Okay so I just figured some stuff out but the timing is so difficult I can't do it consistently.
I'm getting the Nana Dthrows more frequently but I accidentally keep holding down and when I try to regard with Popo I do a Dtilt. Will practice.
Figured out how to 'freeze' Nana in the hold. As Nana is regrabbing, hold down. Popo will crouch and Nana will grab and hold the opponent. As soon as Popo un-crouches, she'll do her normal stage position determined throw.
Not sure how to proceed, or if it's worth doing all this work when 3.5 will be different.
@
nimigoha
Smash Ace
- Joined
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It's definitely inconsistent but if you mess up then she does a normal Uthrow which you can react to anyway.
I learned some basic soft combo regrabs and setups with ICs and have done movement work on them but I'm throwing them on the back burner until 3.5, can't wait for the grab release fix. Then I'll see if anything changes with this.
Iceman
Smash Apprentice
Yes
Kef
Smash Apprentice
Oh ok, I see what you mean. I think we were talking about two different things.
What I meant was the Nana hold glitch that when done midscreen, you can't seem to DThrow from it (only UThrow, FThrow, BThrow). I am guessing we are talking about two different things, cause this glitch is relatively easy to perform.
Also, I am liking that someone already took the initiative in posting a video of their PM play. Hopefully I keep it going this weekend when I play with friends, after not delivering with the midscreen infinite video.
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Sharkz
Smash Ace
As someone who mains IC's in Melee, but doesn't mess with them too much in PM, should I be excited?
MudkipUniverse
Smash Ace
Wonder what 3.5 will bring to the table, I have been practicing campy turnaround desynchs. lel
Decided I can't hack Icies in PM. They just feel nothing like their Melee or Brawl counterparts. Gonna have to find a new main if 3.5 even interests me enough to hold my attention as a competitor. Gonna have to watch it anyway considering I'm the region's commentator and PM being the most popular game... But Icies man, I just wish they had SOMETHING.
so I'm planning on maining IC's after they "fix" Mewtwo in 3.5, and I wanna start incorporating some desync shenanigans so I can be a stupidly flashy player.
in Brawl, IC's uptilt clanks with fox and falco's side b's, is it the same in PM?
I was wondering if, expecting the side b onto the stage as recovery, you could spotdodge desync > nana uptilt > popo charge fsmash, to stop them with the clank, to kill em.
obviously not the best option, or even close to optimal. just wondering 'cause it's a funny idea I had
would that work?
in Brawl, IC's uptilt clanks with fox and falco's side b's, is it the same in PM?
I was wondering if, expecting the side b onto the stage as recovery, you could spotdodge desync > nana uptilt > popo charge fsmash, to stop them with the clank, to kill em.
obviously not the best option, or even close to optimal. just wondering 'cause it's a funny idea I had
would that work?