Character Idea Submission Thread

[| Kailex |]

Copying more than one move sounds nice. I.E (fox/falco= laser + shine || wolf= laser + side-b || luigi= fireball + missfire || mario= fireball + down b || snake= grenade + c4) I think Ive said more than enough, not sure if its even possible to do

 

[Rizner]

Copying more than one move sounds nice. I.E (fox/falco= laser + shine || wolf= laser + side-b || luigi= fireball + missfire || mario= fireball + down b || snake= grenade + c4) I think Ive said more than enough, not sure if its even possible to do

But then you lose Kirby's other moves. I'd take a grenade from snake, but wouldn't lose my hammer or brick for the c4. shine would take too long because you don't have the air mobility, he doesn't need the recovery options of the other two and realistically his hammer is a solid counter to their side b moves, and Kirby with a cape would take way too much, plus I don't think it would be a necessary thing against a Mario

 

[Phan7om]

Heres My Two Cents

Yoshi

• Give him the ability to attack/jump/wavedash Oos.
• Keep Yoshi's ability to get that extra hop when he Up-Bs from Brawl, but keep the ability to throw eggs backward from Melee
• Keep his Brawl Weight
• Make Side-B shoot forward while in the air, take away the helpless state when he finishes using it, takes away his jumps, but can still Up-B. Give it light armor.

Kirby

• Make grounded Final Cutter, a tad shorter/quicker (about 60% of full height), and make the projectile slower (Wolf's laser speed)
• Change aerial hammer to his Melee hammer, but make it strong like his Brawl aerial hammer. Make it similar to R.O.B's N-air
• Make grounded stone's startup quicker, (hit about frame 3) and cancel earler (can cancel 6 frames after hitbox comes out) give the ability to air-dodge, jump, or attack right out of the cancel.
• I dont think Inhale should be changed much, but I think that there should be a combo where it is a guaranteed inhale on all of the characters.

Olimar

• I feel the white pikmin should do about 12% damage per hit when attached due to Side-B.
• Keep his Down-B superarmor, but increase the startup and ending lag times. (Marth/Ike/Roy/Peach's counters/toad)
• Make it easier to choose which pikmin comes out. This will probably take too much programming, but maybe make it so the longer you hold B the pikmin you pull will be different. (Ex. "Let go of B" Frames: Red 1-6, Yellow 7-12, Blue 13-18, White 19-30, Purple 30~)

Ice Climbers

• I think Neutral-B should be faster, and has a greater chance to freeze the opponent for a couple of frames, even at 0%.
• Smarter Nana
• Make Squall Hammer recovery strictly horizontal, similar to DK's up-b but only horizontal
• Nerf the smashes a little. (make them their Brawl strength)
• Nerf the ICs grab range, but keep the ability to chaingrab from Melee (NOT BRAWL!!!)

Samus- I think we can steal a little from Smash 4 on this one.

• Faster & Stronger Charge Shot
• Keep the kill potential of the Missiles from Melee
• Faster Homing Missiles
• Brawl Z-air
• Make F-smash faster and stronger
• Down-B bombs dont explode as quickly. Keep the superwavedash tho.

Tether Edge-Grabs: Since a lot of us feel like its a bit broken. I think a good way to fix it would be to make it where they can only grab the ledge when the edge-grabber isn't invincible. When he/she is invincible, the tether user should miss the edge, but get some kind of momentum shift up/left or up/right (depending on which way they are facing, but only for Up-Bs not Z-airs)

 

[| Kailex |]

I guess that all of my ideas just fit brawl minus and not project m /: oh well

 

[Giygacoal]

Would it be possible to make Lucario's aura charge indicator appear sooner? I just failed a recovery because after forward-airing my opponent off-stage, I didn't know I got a charge (so that I could cancel up-B and cover some of the distance with an air dodge), and while in special fall I saw his hands glow.

 

[DrinkingFood]

For those of you saying Yoshi needs jump OoS... fine, but if that's the case, he needs a regular shield. With the exception of his no jump OoS limitation, his shield is better in every way than everybody else's, so willy-nillily (this is the adverb form) adding jump to that will give him undisputably the best shield in the game by a large margin. Which I mean, it's not a bad thing to have the best of something. I've just been under the impression that PMBR is trying to avoid extremes of design based on the kinds of patching they do.

 

[MonkUnit]

i don't feel one way or the other about yoshi jumping oos, but keep in mind that if he was able to jump oos that at the end of the day, that is still attached to yoshi.

 

[TreK]

So, I feel there is a bit of hatred towards Ivysaur. I'm conflicted about it, being a main of said character. On the one hand, she's in a fine place right now : not winning too many tourneys, not absent either. On the other hand, if people are complaining so much, maybe it is that she's not up there for the right reasons.
So I figured I'd give feedback as to what parts of this character do break a Smash law in my ever so slightly less biased opinion (or rather, biased in another direction), eventually suggest a way to alter it, and let you be kind and compensate somehow for the losses.
1) Her recovery. Tether recoveries as of now in PM do not just look and feel different from normal recoveries : they are simply better. When doing a normal recovery, there are two scenarios, and two outcomes : either the opponent is on the ledge, in which case you land on the stage in a helpless state, with a lot of lag, or your opponent isn't occupying said ledge, and it's up to you to either sweet spot it, or simply grab it with a bit of vulnerability. In either of these scenarios, Ivy's recovery is achieving better than a normal recovery. If there is an opponent on the ledge, she does land on the stage, but she's given the opportunity to stall the opponent's invincibility frames, countering the strategy, and she doesn't land in an helpless state. If there isn't an opponent on the ledge, she doesn't have to aim to sweetspot the ledge. At least one of these advantages has to go, so that at least half of the opponent's edgeguarding gameplan can still apply on Ivy.
2) Her Razor Leaf. It has very little answers, and shielding isn't one of them. There are two immediate solutions for this : either make shield reflecting easier and more reliable (I've had a couple times my Razor Leaf powershielded, but not reflected, and that was very awkward), or make the projectile disappear on shield, like PK Fires did in Brawl. It is important to note that either of those solutions involve a change in the pace of tossing Razor Leaves around, due to the limitation of only one RL on screen at a time. Reflecting a razor leaf doubles the move's cooldown, thus hinders Ivysaur a lot, and deleting it halves it, thus helping Ivysaur in a sense. By doing both, you would really put the emphasis on getting that powershield to approach, and not just shielding it. That sounds like an interesting concept to me.
3) Her bair. It has Marth's fair range, but hits twice. Which is to say, it is VERY good. It instantly negates any form of approach from the air, by outranging basically everything you could possibly throw at me. I know it would break yet another smash law to have an aerial with special priority, but if aerials could actually clash with it like they do with projectiles, I think that would help a lot of characters that currently do not have an answer to this move. The most intuitive thing would have been to give it lazer priority (like MK's moves), but it wouldn't have helped the projectile-less characters like Falcon, which need it the most. So I guess I am actually suggesting the opposite thing.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I'm going to be real frank. Not sure how seriously my feedback will be taken into consideration, but I'll just have a say on several aspects that bug me of certain characters.


Sonic:
I hope this doesn't come off as biased (with good reason), but as a Brawl Sonic main, I found his moveset to be absolutely alien to everything I knew. It feels like I'm playing a Luigified Sonic clone. NONE of the strategies I built as this character work for me. Every aspect I considered fun about him were removed (like Spinshot for example, or the super armor spin moves). His recovery was severely nerfed. And he just feels SLOWER now.
Sonic's dead to me in P:M, and it upsets me a great deal that a lot of charactes retained their moves, and they were respected. But Sonic was completely overhauled to the point he's no longer the same character. All that was needed IMHO, was improve his kill power in some moves, and speed up some of his Tilts and jabs.
If PMBR plans to keep Sonic this way, than I really hope they release one of Sonic's friends with the Brawl moveset through the clone engine. (But we all know how remarkably well they're doing at the polls...)


Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard:
The whole point of these characters being in the game was because they were supposed to come AS A GROUP. Taking out the Trainer and separating them into "Wild" Pokemon was kind of a crap move, IMO.
I know I'm in a non-vocal minority here when I say that what I loved the most about P.T. was the fact that I could switch Pokemon to adapt my strategy. (Or ideally, that would've been the case if only I wasn't FORCED to switch in certain ocassions). However that could have been fixed... Except the way they went around to solve a FORCED gimmick was by FORCING them to separate....
... So why exactly do Zelda and Sheik get away with so freaking much? They get to keep their transformations in PM (because Melee traditions = THE LAW, or because LoZ = GOD), and they are NEVER blamed for Sakurai's apparent struggle with the 3DS.
On the other hand, a character like Pokemon Trainer who was included for the sole reason of switching between characters (and was force-fed TWO gimmicks for this very same reason, the force-switch, and the stamina) gets split.
I really don't care a whole lot for each of the Poke's Down+Bs... But at least, through a Taunt button, it would be nice if I could CHOOSE to switch between them.
(Horizontal Taunt = Ivy, Up Taunt = Squirtle, Down Taunt = Charizard) And no, I don't think that would make them broken. Sheik was a BEAST in Melee despite her lack of Down+B. Heck, she had TWO nearly useless Specials and she was still beastly.


There is absolutely NO respect for Brawl in P:M.
My two mains were butchered and have lost all traces of what I found charming and fun in them.
Don't get me wrong, I know they're trying to make some of these characters more "fun", or more appropiate to the source material (Sonic, Wario, etc). But some things should be respected. And if the Melee cast gets to have their movesets pretty much untouched (except for maybe Zelda) then by all means try to leave Brawl characters as they are with just the appropiate balance.

Otherwise.. might as well stop struggling with Olimar and release him without Pikmin in his moveset for the next update.

I hope I'm not being too harsh on this matter, but the novelty is starting to wear off as I start to miss my mains.
Yeah, I could just stick to Brawl and "quit my whining". But I decided since everyone has a say on these matters... why shouldn't I speak my mind? And besides, this is a GREAT project. What has been achieved could be considered groundbreaking as far as CONSOLE game modding goes.

And Project M itself just FEELS right, it's no wonder why it became my favorite SSB instantly.
Which is why I ask just for a LITTLE bit more respect for certain characters. They are not blank slates you are working on, they are established characters that people took the time and effort to get good with.
For blank slates there are 5-7 Clone-engine spots to work on.

My 3rd main would be Samus, and I'm not sure you all can imagine just how TERRIFIED I am for her to not feel like Samus either. XD

Well... that's that. My 2 cents.

 

[NisforSmash]

I'm going to be real frank. Not sure how seriously my feedback will be taken into consideration, but I'll just have a say on several aspects that bug me of certain characters.


Sonic:
I hope this doesn't come off as biased (with good reason), but as a Brawl Sonic main, I found his moveset to be absolutely alien to everything I knew. It feels like I'm playing a Luigified Sonic clone. NONE of the strategies I built as this character work for me. Every aspect I considered fun about him were removed (like Spinshot for example, or the super armor spin moves). His recovery was severely nerfed. And he just feels SLOWER now.
Sonic's dead to me in P:M, and it upsets me a great deal that a lot of charactes retained their moves, and they were respected. But Sonic was completely overhauled to the point he's no longer the same character. All that was needed IMHO, was improve his kill power in some moves, and speed up some of his Tilts and jabs.
If PMBR plans to keep Sonic this way, than I really hope they release one of Sonic's friends with the Brawl moveset through the clone engine. (But we all know how remarkably well they're doing at the polls...)

I can see you're frustration with sonic but I think what they did with him was for the best. His new spin moves attack is useful and his fsmash and dsmash got buffed a little right? And dat moonwalk is god tier. However I wouldn't mind a light armor on a fully charged spin dash, it's annoying when you charge it and after releasing it just clanks with a projectile. His homing attack is good too but I think their should be slightly less of a startup time on it. I wouldn't expect a change for sonic until the full roster is out or after a bunch of tournaments happen and it's clear that he isn't as good as he should be which I don't expect should happen.

Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard:
The whole point of these characters being in the game was because they were supposed to come AS A GROUP. Taking out the Trainer and separating them into "Wild" Pokemon was kind of a crap move, IMO.
I know I'm in a non-vocal minority here when I say that what I loved the most about P.T. was the fact that I could switch Pokemon to adapt my strategy. (Or ideally, that would've been the case if only I wasn't FORCED to switch in certain ocassions). However that could have been fixed... Except the way they went around to solve a FORCED gimmick was by FORCING them to separate....
... So why exactly do Zelda and Sheik get away with so freaking much? They get to keep their transformations in PM (because Melee traditions = THE LAW, or because LoZ = GOD), and they are NEVER blamed for Sakurai's apparent struggle with the 3DS.
On the other hand, a character like Pokemon Trainer who was included for the sole reason of switching between characters (and was force-fed TWO gimmicks for this very same reason, the force-switch, and the stamina) gets split.
I really don't care a whole lot for each of the Poke's Down+Bs... But at least, through a Taunt button, it would be nice if I could CHOOSE to switch between them.
(Horizontal Taunt = Ivy, Up Taunt = Squirtle, Down Taunt = Charizard) And no, I don't think that would make them broken. Sheik was a BEAST in Melee despite her lack of Down+B. Heck, she had TWO nearly useless Specials and she was still beastly.

They separated them to make 3 unique characters because they each had a different playstyle. I agree that their down+B's are situational at best but for the most part useless but still, they can hold their own against the rest of the cast.

As for Zelda and sheik, IMPO I would either separate them or make their special moves almost identical somehow. I don't like that their are two characters joined by one special move. Yes in LoZ they are the same, but for smash purposes I don't really see that as being fair. If you look at mortal kombat deception, each character has 2 fighting styles and a weapon. in the case of noob-smoke(noob saibot and smoke), they sacrifice both weapons for one fighting style each which works because everyone else has 2 fighting styles anyway. In the case of smash, you only have one moveset and trading a special move for another new moveset doesn't seem balanced, especially when one of the characters can practically win a tournament with 2 specials and a moveset. I would suggest maybe separating them by giving Zelda/sheik something similar to the aura system exept only for the transform move, where you have to build up magic before you're allowed to transform or you have to either take/lose a stock before transforming is available to you. I doubt this will happen and I don't really have problems with the characters matchup wise anyway.

Really I guess the solution to your problems is to just adapt.

Also fear not for samus, she's in good hands.

 

[NisforSmash]

His dash from brawl is imo the best if keeping from any game, as long as it keeps the knocking up aspect with the new gravity.
I assume, as you mentioned melee specifically, you want his melee grabs? Please no, they were so bad. People would get out of throws mid animation, dthrow didn't damage until end,etc. Keep those like brawl.

For copies, you're suggesting that taking away half his moveset and not doing anything drastic to the rest will keep him viable, but that's unrealistic. Keephis specials, because otherwise you lose the character. He shouldn't copy other full movesets - that's not the point of his ability.He only needs that to be able to go in and get a projectile against ranged characters. He doesn't get a great falcon punch? That's fine, because he has the tools against it. But going against a falco or fox, you may need the lasers to deal with their camping. Kirby should have his own style like what has been defined already - brick, hammer, final cutter recovery. If you want angles on neutral b just let it be angled the same way as a ftilt.

I wanted the brawl grabs, but I guess I should have specified.

I'm suggesting rather than take away half his moveset, half his moveset should be based on whoever he's fighting if he gets a copy. he doesn't necessarily need to have every special move but it would be cool if they could do that.

another idea I had was that he would work the way he always did except depending on who he swallowed, he would get some kind of gimmick. I.E swallowing link gives him a stronger final cutter while tlink would change the knockback. swallowing D3 could give him armor on his hammer swing, Mario would give him a fire effect on his fsmash. simple stuff like that. what do you think?

Edit: sorry for dp

 

[GP&B]

My 3rd main would be Samus, and I'm not sure you all can imagine just how TERRIFIED I am for her to not feel like Samus either. XD

Well, she's going to be based heavily off of Melee Samus which is something you can't really be disappointed in (way better projectiles, missile canceling, awesome recovery) plus whatever surprises they have for her that we don't know about. You can definitely expect for Zair to come back at least.

There's been plenty of complaints about 2.6 Sonic though. I feel as though they're going to take a lot of feedback into serious consideration so you are sincerely not in the minority on how Sonic feels right now.

 

[Giygacoal]

Sonic:
I hope this doesn't come off as biased (with good reason), but as a Brawl Sonic main, I found his moveset to be absolutely alien to everything I knew. It feels like I'm playing a Luigified Sonic clone. NONE of the strategies I built as this character work for me. Every aspect I considered fun about him were removed (like Spinshot for example, or the super armor spin moves).

Yeah, this is a different game. Besides, I'm pretty sure his spin moves don't have super armor in Brawl.

His recovery was severely nerfed.

Melee-style mechanics. Good recovery is supposed to be a luxury.

And he just feels SLOWER now.

You're kidding, right? Learn the techniques, Brawl player.

Sonic's dead to me in P:M, and it upsets me a great deal that a lot of charactes retained their moves, and they were respected. But Sonic was completely overhauled to the point he's no longer the same character. All that was needed IMHO, was improve his kill power in some moves, and speed up some of his Tilts and jabs.

You should be grateful. The animators put a lot of work into his moveset so that it looks much less monotonous. You wouldn't be in a minority to complain about 2.6b Sonic, but if you're tlaking about PM Sonic in general... well, I don't see much wrong with the direction the character went. He's bait-and-switch, fast, and smooth.

Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard:
The whole point of these characters being in the game was because they were supposed to come AS A GROUP. Taking out the Trainer and separating them into "Wild" Pokemon was kind of a crap move, IMO.

It was a necessary decision to make more creative movesets.

I really don't care a whole lot for each of the Poke's Down+Bs... But at least, through a Taunt button, it would be nice if I could CHOOSE to switch between them.
(Horizontal Taunt = Ivy, Up Taunt = Squirtle, Down Taunt = Charizard) And no, I don't think that would make them broken.

They thought of that. It's not technically feasible to program.

Sheik was a BEAST in Melee despite her lack of Down+B. Heck, she had TWO nearly useless Specials and she was still beastly.

How well a character is designed overall is more interesting to the PMBR than simply how good a character is. We don't need five characters following the same trend of having underused special moves. I get what you're saying, but no character is entitled to everything similar characters have.

There is absolutely NO respect for Brawl in P:M.

I disagree. Look at Meta Knight. He turned out just fine. Ganondorf has the Flame Choke.

My two mains were butchered and have lost all traces of what I found charming and fun in them.

You can play Sonic the same way you were able to in Brawl. He's just faster and has more interesting moves now.

Don't get me wrong, I know they're trying to make some of these characters more "fun", or more appropiate to the source material (Sonic, Wario, etc). But some things should be respected. And if the Melee cast gets to have their movesets pretty much untouched (except for maybe Zelda) then by all means try to leave Brawl characters as they are with just the appropiate balance.

You clearly don't know the characters well enough. Donkey Kong has a new dash attack, Roy has been significantly de-cloned, Ganondorf has a few different moves, Ness has elements from Smash 64, Mario's moveset is a combination of Melee Mario's and Dr. Mario's, Bowser has armor... and that's not even counting the many finer changes the characters have.

Which is why I ask just for a LITTLE bit more respect for certain characters. They are not blank slates you are working on, they are established characters that people took the time and effort to get good with.

Project M has the utmost respect for every character.

My 3rd main would be Samus, and I'm not sure you all can imagine just how TERRIFIED I am for her to not feel like Samus either. XD

It was confirmed that her design is relatively conservative and true to her Melee playstyle, but you seem impossible to satisfy, so that doesn't mean much to you.

 

[CalvinWars]

How do you feel about Kirby's Kirbycides? Do you think his throws should be able to Kirbycide like Melee or unable to Kirbycide like Brawl? If you support Throw Kirbycides, should his throws still be breakable out of?

I think the throws should be Kirbycidable, but still be able to broken out of, albeit harder than it was in Melee. Back in the Smashmods thread, there was some oppositionagainst Kirbycide throws because they didn't want Suicide to be a viable option because of its apparent "cheapness", but I still think that they should be an option.

 

[Rizner]

I wanted the brawl grabs, but I guess I should have specified.

I'm suggesting rather than take away half his moveset, half his moveset should be based on whoever he's fighting if he gets a copy. he doesn't necessarily need to have every special move but it would be cool if they could do that.

another idea I had was that he would work the way he always did except depending on who he swallowed, he would get some kind of gimmick. I.E swallowing link gives him a stronger final cutter while tlink would change the knockback. swallowing D3 could give him armor on his hammer swing, Mario would give him a fire effect on his fsmash. simple stuff like that. what do you think?

Edit: sorry for dp

Ahh, ok. I think I completely misinterpreted your previous post. Sorry about that. With your current idea, it seems cool and overall very interesting, but I would be worried about balancing him as a character without it and with it. He would need to be competitive without it, or you'll spend a whole match just trying to get it, and not be overpowered with i. While as a concept it's cool,I don't think out would make a good competitive experience. I also feel it shouldn't be a staple to his meta - it's a nice thing to have but a lot of the time of prefer to keep his b instead of others.
But yeah if it were possible and done really well, it would be a cool feature. I just think it would be too hard to balance.

 

[Rizner]

How do you feel about Kirby's Kirbycides? Do you think his throws should be able to Kirbycide like Melee or unable to Kirbycide like Brawl? If you support Throw Kirbycides, should his throws still be breakable out of?

I think the throws should be Kirbycidable, but still be able to broken out of, albeit harder than it was in Melee. Back in the Smashmods thread, there was some oppositionagainst Kirbycide throws because they didn't want Suicide to be a viable option because of its apparent "cheapness", but I still think that they should be an option.

I think his suicide option with neural b is enough, and doesn't need the throw Kirby cide. I really am against breaking out mid animation. It ruins all the plans.

Also sorry for double post.

 

[Mr.Pickle]

For those of you saying Yoshi needs jump OoS... fine, but if that's the case, he needs a regular shield. With the exception of his no jump OoS limitation, his shield is better in every way than everybody else's, so willy-nillily (this is the adverb form) adding jump to that will give him undisputably the best shield in the game by a large margin. Which I mean, it's not a bad thing to have the best of something. I've just been under the impression that PMBR is trying to avoid extremes of design based on the kinds of patching they do.

This a 100 times, his shield is already incredible, and giving him jump Oos would be ridiculous.

 

[JOE!]

Charizard's Aerial Nspec should shoot a slower moving, multi-hitting fireball (fire blast?) at a diagonal angle downward, but still be Flamethrower on the ground.

 

[NisforSmash]

Charizard's Aerial Nspec should shoot a slower moving, multi-hitting fireball (fire blast?) at a diagonal angle downward, but still be Flamethrower on the ground.

this could be interesting. in air he could shoot up to 3 embers the size of a half charged aura sphere. they would go in the direction of sheiks needles and he could angle them slightly upward or downward more if he predicts a jump/roll/wavedash.

 

[JOE!]

No need for angles or up to 3... just 1 fireball diagonally down sort of Like Akuma's I believe?

 

[me9595]

just a general idea, not really character specific, but when entering a name that is already in the list of names, the cursor should move down to where that name is, just to make searching easier. i have no idea how easy or hard that would be though

 

[MonkUnit]

That is already in Project M. If you enter a name that is already on the list, you will automatically select it and use it.

 

[Rizner]

just a general idea, not really character specific, but when entering a name that is already in the list of names, the cursor should move down to where that name is, just to make searching easier. i have no idea how easy or hard that would be though

Iut already selects that name if you enter it

 

[ViewtifulHoe242]

im here talking about lucario. since he's pretty much a street fighter now, i think a wonderful change in his favor(that he maybe needs to get him out of the rut he's in) would be that his aerial auraspheres be shot downwards like akuma's, the character who he's pretty much repping. i guessing that the aerial spirit bombs if shot diagonally down would wreck recovery options for ( pretty much all these guys( ) so im asking that just the nomal aurasphere/hadoken be able to get get thrown at an angle befitting of his street fighter heritage.
Also his aerial game...isn't that great and i understand that its a tradeoff for his solid ohc ground game, but seriously, his f-air is pretty much garbage. its lovely what was done with his n-air and b-air his only decent aerial moves, but would a blatant ripoff of sheiks/mewtwos f-air(short reach, good speed and power) be too much too ask for? if only one of these changes could be implemented im really praying that his fair gets a tune up. thanks for reading all this, best wishes to you all.

 

[Kix]

I'd be much more interested in keeping Yoshi's shield unique. Maybe something like a weak blast radius when he comes out of the egg (or that could be done for Egg Roll) and or jumping in egg (which would shield things in the air) and/or egg roll out of it or something.

 

[NisforSmash]

No need for angles or up to 3... just 1 fireball diagonally down sort of Like Akuma's I believe?

that's true. it would have to have a decent amount of knockback though. could be a good anti recovery tool and will stress the importance of charizard being in the air.

 

[PastLink]

wow, i feel like a tool for not looking around more before making that missing characters discussion thread...

well, i suppose i'll just post some of the ideas i had there to here.

the main change i'm looking at is his copy ability. this being that some of kirby's copy abilities just suck compared to the originals, and this is due to kirby's size. others however become deadly due to his multijump (mario/doc fireballs anyone?)
but what i'm thinking is what if he wasn't restricted to only using only neutral B moves? what if instead of falcon punch upon absorbing the captain he instead gained a kirby version of falcon kick? or if he gained peaches turnips instead of her counter? i think some sick stuff can be done this way. the only problem is it may be a little awkward for some moves to be mapped to neutral B. but i think this would open up alot more for the pink puffball if PMBR picked the moves right.

so i kinda had this idea for samus, not sure how much this would help her. i heard she was good in melee, but still not quite top teir? correct me if i'm wrong. but any ways, i thought of this at work. what if her smashed, missle starts slow at firing, almost staying still, and then rapidly speeds up. i kinda thought of it this way in mind because i wasn't sure if samus could short hop fast fall the missles (i'm only familiar with vBrawl samus and i remember the launching time to be pretty slow...), this way, she can send one up top and one under, both relatively well spaced behind the other. just spitballin here.

 

[NisforSmash]

so i kinda had this idea for samus, not sure how much this would help her. i heard she was good in melee, but still not quite top teir? correct me if i'm wrong. but any ways, i thought of this at work. what if her smashed, missle starts slow at firing, almost staying still, and then rapidly speeds up. i kinda thought of it this way in mind because i wasn't sure if samus could short hop fast fall the missles (i'm only familiar with vBrawl samus and i remember the launching time to be pretty slow...), this way, she can send one up top and one under, both relatively well spaced behind the other. just spitballin here.

I support this idea 100%. Maybe throw in an option to angle it upward on ground and downward while in air.

 

[PastLink]

I support this idea 100%. Maybe throw in an option to angle it upward on ground and downward while in air.

maybe, but you gotta think about how much it may lower the skill level when having to deal with landing from the air or dealing with air to ground pressure respectively. Now i don't play her so i don't know how bad or good her options are for each of those situations, but i just feel that something like that may make her "too easy" not that she needs to be fox/falco technical but if you need to deal with an aerial character or cover your @$$ getting to the ground i sorta see the situation playing out like this. "why use any option other than missles?" which isn't good for a character. ultimately it's just something that'll need playtesting like any of the ideas on this thread. sorry for being wordy, for some reason the idea of angling them made me think "hoo boy that may be a bit TOO good" irregardless of their slow start up i mentioned.

 

[JOE!]

that's true. it would have to have a decent amount of knockback though. could be a good anti recovery tool and will stress the importance of charizard being in the air.

Why would it need KB?

Look, using Flamethrower mid-air already creates a diagonally downward facing stream of fire.

Making him shoot out a (fire blast?) that merely deals rapid hits and passes through folks just like Flamethrower but in a more user-friendly method of "fire and forget" would be a neat asset that follows Charizard's style: making enemies respect your presence.

 

[NisforSmash]

maybe, but you gotta think about how much it may lower the skill level when having to deal with landing from the air or dealing with air to ground pressure respectively. Now i don't play her so i don't know how bad or good her options are for each of those situations, but i just feel that something like that may make her "too easy" not that she needs to be fox/falco technical but if you need to deal with an aerial character or cover your @$$ getting to the ground i sorta see the situation playing out like this. "why use any option other than missles?" which isn't good for a character. ultimately it's just something that'll need playtesting like any of the ideas on this thread. sorry for being wordy, for some reason the idea of angling them made me think "hoo boy that may be a bit TOO good" irregardless of their slow start up i mentioned.

You wouldn't throw out a missile if the other person is right under you because it definitely wouldn't hit. when i say angle, i mean a hard 45 degree angle either upward (ground) or downward (air). I don't think it would be too good because with the slow startup, the opponent would have time to react. sorry i should have specified.

Why would it need KB?

Look, using Flamethrower mid-air already creates a diagonally downward facing stream of fire.

Making him shoot out a (fire blast?) that merely deals rapid hits and passes through folks just like Flamethrower but in a more user-friendly method of "fire and forget" would be a neat asset that follows Charizard's style: making enemies respect your presence.

i'm trying to get a visual image of what your saying so i can understand but heres what i'm interpreting. charizard shoots out a ball the size of a fully charged super scope shot but instead of it hitting like a half charged super scope shot it hits multiple times but goes through them?

 

[BigglesWorth]

Playing Yoshi more. I do agree more with others on how jumping out of shield for you would make him a great deal more competitive without taking away from his uniqueness. The four things that make his playstyle: Parrys & Reactive Counter, Egg Throw Maneuvers for Edge Guarding, zoning, and high air juggling, double jump cancels for gimping in and out by varrying the heights of attacks and attacking around platforms, and unusual djc, waveland, moonwalk mechanics with his down b that allows him to favor platforms. Jumping out of shield would help but it still doesn't quite give yoshi much answer for how easily he is grabbed out of air and so easily gimped at certain spots and his bad grab game. Egg Toss should be just like Melee (it adds to his reactive nature). Out of Shield Jumping gives him options to deal with heavy pressure. Jumping out Egg Roll gives him an effective horizontal recovery a way to chase arial juggles. The last addition I think that should be added solves both Yoshi's almost hit out of the air issue and his lack of grab game: give him an arial grab that functions like his Egg Lay (without the pooping them out part). He can throw up or sideways when he is in the air and throw down if he is on the ground. The air grab gives Yoshi was of interepting arial gimps and gives option to gimp grabs as he fast falls or traverses platforms. In addition by making the grab tiltable it will allow yoshi to grab opponents laying down or just normally out of reach (which blocks a few combo set ups he could have). So I refine my suggestion: Out of Shield Jumping, Arial/Tiltable Grab, Melee Egg Toss and Egg Roll, Instantly jump cancelled egg roll.

 

[Trinsic]

This has nothing to do with gameplay, but I would really appreciate it if the spit that comes flying out of Yoshi's mouth when he uses his neutral B gets removed.

 

[ph00tbag]

There is absolutely NO respect for Brawl in P:M.

 

[shinhed-echi]

That does it.

As of now I'm going report-frenzy on this side of smashboards, so give me a ******* excuse, and I will.
Clearly unsuscribing isn't enough, so I'm going to go for more drastic measures.

 

[Fortress]

Wait, I haven't been in this thread, I'm behind. Why report everybody?

 

[Shadic]

Apparently because he was being disagreed with. I can't find anything immediately offensive in any responses.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Wait, I haven't been in this thread, I'm behind. Why report everybody?

Because this side of the boards is infested with immature people who can't take criticism/feedback well, and have to resort to jabs and insults, just for speaking my mind.
Everytime I get an Alert coming from Project M boards, I get more irritated by whoever is quoting me.
I've unsuscribed, I've said I'm done here, and people KEEP quoting me for more jabs at me.

So I've just HAD IT.
I'm starting to HATE P:M because of the community alone.

 

[Fortress]

My two mains were butchered and have lost all traces of what I found charming and fun in them.

Probably because of the way you're handling it, to be honest. You don't have to reply to the people 'jabbing' at you. You can use the ignore function. Your e-peen isn't at stake here. Might just be the whole 'me, me, me' mentality.

I mean, just reading through this last page, I haven't seen anybody outright bash you. Not sure what the big deal is. The only thing I can find that at all comes close is Flowteau replying to you earlier, giving you a point-by-point rebuttal. But, that's not even slamming you for anything.

 

[red9rd]

...

I'll just leave this here

Spoiler