Character Discussion Thread

[StormC]

Yeah, Heihachi being considered is just something I have no idea what to make of. Even if Sakurai wanted to add a Tekken character, why Heihachi? It'd be like adding Bowser before Mario.

I hadn't considered Ryu vs. Heihachi though. I definitely think someone would say "if we're gonna add a fighting character, why not Ryu?"

 

[Deleted member]

Heihachi is pretty much the go-to guy for crossovers.

 

[Kenith]

Actually, Yoshimitsu as a Namco "fighter rep" would be pretty cool because he could use moves from Tekken and Soulcalibur.
He isn't particularly iconic unlike Nightmare, though.

Heihachi is pretty much the go-to guy for crossovers.

Yeah pretty much. Soulcalibur 2, PlayStation All-Stars...

 

[N3ON]

I partially agree, but with Miyamoto suggesting it, it may have been on Sakurai's mind.

I think Namco being involved sealed the deal though for sure. At least for a Namco character...especially after that stuff about Heihachi.

I doubt Sakurai would've been prompted to return to the idea without Namco though.

Especially since Sakurai only shared that story because Pac-Man did eventually end up included, I'm sure other third-parties we don't even know about were floated at one point or another by someone behind the scenes.

I also am really surprised Heihachi was considered. He doesn't seem to be nearly on the same level as the third-parties we have, nor is he outstandingly unique, or requested...

I'm sure the fanbase would've found an adequate excuse for it should he have wound up included.

And hopefully one that's better than because they were going to add Ryu as well. They did add Ryu, no point to exclude Heihachi now.

It's because Namco was involved and they probably view Heihachi as their representative for fighting games. Or to return the favour to the Tekken team by adding him. I doubt it had anything to do with Ryu.

 

[StormC]

Speaking of third party fighting game franchises being represented by villains... apparently Ono wanted M. Bison?

Now that would have been something else. Bowser, Ganondorf, Dedede, and M. Bison all in the same game.

 

[BKupa666]

For all we know, a ton of characters were "considered," what with the term being so open-ended and all. It takes mere minutes, seconds in some cases, to sort through the pros and cons of any given character, so I have no doubt the team did exactly that during early development.

 

[Bowserlick]

If you are going to speculate and try to throw out what-you-think-is-logic to shoot people down, then commit now to a list of all possible DLC. Otherwise, your aggressive speculation accusations against people are useless and cowardly.

Now we will separate the brave vs the cowardly pig-lickers.

 

[StormC]

If you are going to speculate and try to throw out what-you-think-is-logic to shoot people down, then commit now to a list of all possible DLC. Otherwise, your aggressive speculation accusations against people are useless and cowardly.

Now we will separate the brave vs the cowardly pig-lickers.

Go outside.

 

[Kenith]

If you are going to speculate and try to throw out what-you-think-is-logic to shoot people down, then commit now to a list of all possible DLC. Otherwise, your aggressive speculation accusations against people are useless and cowardly.
Now we will separate the brave vs the cowardly pig-lickers.

I will willingly lick a pig if it's this one.

 

[False Sense]

If you are going to speculate and try to throw out what-you-think-is-logic to shoot people down, then commit now to a list of all possible DLC. Otherwise, your aggressive speculation accusations against people are useless and cowardly.

Now we will separate the brave vs the cowardly pig-lickers.

There's really no point to this. Nobody knows what exactly will happen with DLC. That goes for you as well. People shouldn't "commit" to any characters; dealing in such absolutes only brings about unnecessary conflict.

 

[TallT]

One thing that I haven't really thought about with Metal Gear Solid, is that the series is well known for it's storytelling.

Reading an article on the Top 10 most well known video gaming characters reminded me of that. Granted I disagreed with the list. Mega Man wasn't on it, yet Gordon Freeman was. Mario, Link, Pac-Man, Snake and Pikachu were on there, as were Lara Croft, Master Chief, Gordon Freeman. I forget who else.

I partially agree, but with Miyamoto suggesting it, it may have been on Sakurai's mind.

I think Namco being involved sealed the deal though for sure. At least for a Namco character...especially after that stuff about Heihachi.

Who is Gordon Freeman?

 

[DustyPumpkin]

Who is Gordon Freeman?

A giant nerd who is also the Half-Life protagonist

 

[Fatmanonice]

As long as there is still content being added to the game, it's not "done". DLC brings new stage to Smash speculation because it's a new element in the Smash series.

The rules around support threads are up to you mods, but it's not like we're done with SSB4. There is still additional content to speculate on, unlike with previous games, and the game as it is now is not "complete" as far as total content is concerned. We're in Stage 4.

I still consider this post-SSB4 because, even with DLC, a vast majority of the game has been released, we have a playable copy in hand, most of the original team that worked on the game has been dissolved, and the rate of development has been significantly slowed down so we're getting new content like every three months or so. In my opinion, it's like dessert after dinner and I don't think DLC with this game will have too much of an impact on when the next game comes out.

 

[TallT]

Half-Life protagonist

Oh, I have heard of the game, but never knew the main characters name.

 

[Deleted member]

I will willingly lick a pig if it's this one.

Two things:

1. Holy crap, does Ganon have some melons there....

2. You have very sick fantasies.....

 

[Fatmanonice]

Heihachi is pretty much the go-to guy for crossovers.

Kind of like how Morrigan is the go-to character for Darkstalkers despite the fact she's technically not the main character, she's just approximately 50 billion times more popular.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

Oh, I have heard of the game, but never knew the main characters name.

The gamme itself is pretty neat, bu Gordon as a character, I don't really think he makes much of an impact, you could swap him with Chell from Portal and the games would be exactly the same

 

[Deleted member]

Im pretty sure that's the reasoning people use for a ton of 3rd parties. However, they don't compare to what we've gotten.

Something I thought about earlier...but think about the Top 5 Multi-platform 3rd party characters with a definitive legacy in gaming that are left aside from who we have.

Snake- iconic character from series that revolutionized the stealth genre. Elements of Metal Gear gameplay have left a footprint on other games of the genre, and the series is referenced throughout other games (actually, there's a reference to it in the new Batman game!) Has plenty of popularity in the Smash Ballot.

Rayman- another platforming icon. May not be up there like the ones we currently have, but he's a fairly well known character to gamers and non-gamers alike. Seems like a fairly popular choice in the ballot

Uh...

Simon Belmont- Castlevania is a staple of retro gaming, and is a series that has lasting gameplay impressions on other games in the industry. I don't know much else about Castlevania (never played it), but i'm sure somebody else could go more in depth.

I don't know guys. 3rd parties aren't just like any old 1st party character, and I don't know why someone would think they would be. Every 3rd party we've gotten has been a pretty substantial inclusion. Plenty of 3rd parties simply do not stack up with who we have.

To be fair, Snake wouldn't have been in in the first place if he wasn't a gaming icon. Sakurai has said his piece on adding 3rd parties, and if Snake was say for example, Super Meat Boy, I would have to think things would be different.

Interesting note on 3rd parties: Each of them premiered during earlier gaming years...Also I just realized I didn't list 5. I couldn't even come up with anybody else! (Disclaimer: There are plenty I like, but not many that I feel have the starpower of the featured 3rd parties we've already gotten)

I'd say Bomberman is up there. He was the definitive mascot of Hudson Soft and he is one of the earliest multi-player gaming legends in video game history. Bomberman is someone I think would fit Super Smash Bros. like a glove; the issue he has is that he needs overwhelming fan demand to ever get in and right now he doesn't have that.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Something interesting to note. If anybody cares.

I remember awhile back that there was an issue with Snake's Smash page leading to a title on other consoles. BUT HEY, CHECK THIS OUT: http://www.smashbros.com/us/characters/ryu.html

Now, go to the bottom of this page and click on the link to the website for Street Fighter V. Not on Wii U. On PS4.

Just interesting, I thought.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Speaking of third party fighting game franchises being represented by villains... apparently Ono wanted M. Bison?

Now that would have been something else. Bowser, Ganondorf, Dedede, and M. Bison all in the same game.

Article isnt loading so im taking it at gace value.

Now THAT would have been strange. Ryu by himself is super iconic and ryu honestly bison would have just been . . .weird. good thing they didn't pich hom becauss i actually understand how ryu's inputs work. Stupid hold moves. Crouching all the time is weird.

One guy has been extremely aggressive all day and calls someone a piglicker but the guy being insulted gets a warning. Ooookay then.

The gamme itself is pretty neat, bu Gordon as a character, I don't really think he makes much of an impact, you could swap him with Chell from Portal and the games would be exactly the same

thats probably because chell is just as unexpressive

The only good thing about gordon is that he is a physicist. Everything else is a blank slate. A very boring slate t that especially compared with the TF2 crew and glados.

I'd say Bomberman is up there. He was the definitive mascot of Hudson Soft and he is one of the earliest multi-player gaming legends in video game history. Bomberman is someone I think would fit Super Smash Bros. like a glove; the issue he has is that he needs overwhelming fan demand to ever get in and right now he doesn't have that.

was bomberman really that big? Did i moss an entire crazy time or something? Bomberman never felt legendary to me but am i missing a much bigger leegacy and public appreciation than i thought?

 

[Deleted member]

Something interesting to note. If anybody cares.

I remember awhile back that there was an issue with Snake's Smash page leading to a title on other consoles. BUT HEY, CHECK THIS OUT: http://www.smashbros.com/us/characters/ryu.html

Now, go to the bottom of this page and click on the link to the website for Street Fighter V. Not on Wii U. On PS4.

Just interesting, I thought.

It links to the main Street Fighter website.

 

[N3ON]

I still consider this post-SSB4 because, even with DLC, a vast majority of the game has been released, we have a playable copy in hand, most of the original team that worked on the game has been dissolved, and the rate of development has been significantly slowed down so we're getting new content like every three months or so. In my opinion, it's like dessert after dinner and I don't think DLC with this game will have too much of an impact on when the next game comes out.

I just don't think you can say we're done with Smash 4 if we're still getting content and speculation is still happening... I mean the fact that this whole section closed and then re-opened for DLC sort of shows this is the antithesis of being done.

Dessert would just be the last course of the meal, like DLC would (presumably) be the last stage of Smash 4.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I love Bomberman to death, but I never felt that he was...legendary. I feel as if

It links to the main Street Fighter website.

Fair, but that doesn't change the fact that SFV is front and center on the site. Direct mentions of console exclusivity to PS4 and PC is mentioned. If that was truly an issue, the link to the 3DS game could have been used.

At least that was the main point I was trying to make.

 

[StormC]

Article isnt loading so im taking it at gace value.

Now THAT would have been strange. Ryu by himself is super iconic and ryu honestly bison would have just been . . .weird. good thing they didn't pich hom becauss i actually understand how ryu's inputs work. Stupid hold moves. Crouching all the time is weird.

Here's specifically what he says (note that it's dated 2011):

“Personally speaking, and expanding the roster to all of Capcom, I really wanted Mega Man to be in Smash Bros. because I think he kind of fits in that world. If I had to confine it to Street Fighter then it would definitely be M Bison, because I’d love that sort of mega-villian to fall upon all those pretty Nintendo characters and cause complete chaos.”

It'd be weird, but M. Bison is my favorite Street Fighter character, so I would take him with open arms.

 

[PrettyIvyPearls22]

Comparing Layton to Pacman (the godfather of gaming) is not even fair. Not to mention Sakurai knew who he wanted to get into the roster including third party. Even if you requested them, he knew who he wanted from the get go this time around and more than likely got the rights to those characters years ago before we even knew about Smash 4. So Level 5 or any other company more than likely didn't get contacted at all when the game was in early development.

It seems like we may be at the tunnel of our third party picks. I in all honesty don't think an indie character is going to happen. This is because most of them pays tribute to Nintendo, like seriously what other indie character doesn't do this that makes them so special case to get them in the roster. The western fans thinks we'll get one but I don't see that happening. These companies are just doing this for advertising reasons to get their characters name out there and I don't think this is what Sakurai wants in terms of third party. How I see third parties they more than likely have to match up to Mario's iconic status or is at least close to it, which is probably how we got most of the third parties in.

If we're going to get third party I can see one third party newcomer and Snake coming back as a set. I'm sure there's still some popular choices out there. Also to point out, most of the third parties in Smash now, came in the very early heydays of gaming they have a history and huge legacy that nobody can deny even if you don't like them, the only other character that came from this era that can compare to the others is really Bomberman.

 

[Wintropy]

I'd take Bison on two conditions:

- His "throat cut" pose is a taunt
- "Brave or Grave" appears as a soundtrack

Daaaamn. Bison in Smaaaash.

 

[StormC]

Get either M. Bison or Dracula in Smash so we have a character voiced by Norio Wakamoto.

Metal Face doesn't count.

 

[Deleted member]

Fair, but that doesn't change the fact that SFV is front and center on the site. Direct mentions of console exclusivity to PS4 and PC is mentioned. If that was truly an issue, the link to the 3DS game could have been used.

At least that was the main point I was trying to make.

Why wouldn't SFV be front and center on the main SF website, when SFV is the current hot topic for the franchise?
Just because the Smash Bros. site is linking to the SF website?

Note that unlike any other link (aside from the Pokémon website), the link used was for the main site of the entire series, not just a single game (which Sonic should have done, since now the "link" to Lost World doesn't work right) and the message is different.

 

[N3ON]

The Street Fighter website having SFV front and center is really no different than the Smash Bros. website having SSB4 front and center...

 

[Kenith]

I'd take Bison on two conditions:
- His "throat cut" pose is a taunt
- "Brave or Grave" appears as a soundtrack
Daaaamn. Bison in Smaaaash.

YES. YES.
...
He should be revealed on a Tuesday, like with Street Fighter V.

 

[StormC]

It seems like we may be at the tunnel of our third party picks. I in all honesty don't think an indie character is going to happen. This is because most of them pays tribute to Nintendo, like seriously what other indie character doesn't do this that makes them so special case to get them in the roster. The western fans thinks we'll get one but I don't see that happening.

This is one of my biggest nitpicks with Shovel Knight; his supporters often say "his game is so Nintendo-inspired so he'd fit right in" and such... except that the two biggest influences on the game are Mega Man and Castlevania.

 

[Kenith]

This is one of my biggest nitpick with Shovel Knight; his supporters often say "his game is so Nintendo-inspired so he'd fit right in" and such... except that the two biggest influences on the game are Mega Man and Castlevania.

And Duck Tales...hm...

 

[Fatmanonice]

This is one of my biggest nitpicks with Shovel Knight; his supporters often say "his game is so Nintendo-inspired so he'd fit right in" and such... except that the two biggest influences on the game are Mega Man and Castlevania.

Well, back in those days, people genuinely thought of those as "Nintendo" games because Nintendo pretty much had a monopoly on the market from 1985-1990 so I get the mentality behind those kinds of statements.

 

[N3ON]

To be fair Shovel Knight would fit in pretty well with the cast from simply a character standpoint.

 

[ConDeeCas]

I think Shovel Knight would be a great fit but I don't really think he would have enough moves.

I'd take Bison on two conditions:

- His "throat cut" pose is a taunt
- "Brave or Grave" appears as a soundtrack

Daaaamn. Bison in Smaaaash.

I think you're forgetting some perfectly good taunt material.

 

[Kenith]

Shovel Knight's moveset practically writes itself honestly.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I think Shovel Knight would be a great fit but I don't really think he would have enough moves.
I think you're forgetting some perfectly good taunt material.

Shovel Knight would use Relics as part of his moveset. That's easy enough to make a full moveset out of.

 

[Roaring Salsa]

I'd take Bison on two conditions:

- His "throat cut" pose is a taunt
- "Brave or Grave" appears as a soundtrack

Daaaamn. Bison in Smaaaash.

Don't forget this as a victory celebration:

 

[StormC]

I was rereading Pushdustin's article about cut Smash fighters and came across two interesting snippets:

Wario was planned for Melee. Sakurai has mentioned that he was concerned with overrepresentation of certain series, so some characters that were planned got dropped [...] He also states that if he cut Roy and Marth or Mewtwo, he might have been able to add Wario, but the Mario representation was too much.

At GDC 2008, Sakurai stated that a lot of characters were originally planned, but also many were scrapped so that they could focus on, ‘balancing series representation and making each character unique’.

I guess that went flying out the window in Smash 4, huh?

 

[BKupa666]

I was rereading Pushdustin's article about cut Smash fighters and came across two interesting snippets:




I guess that went flying out the window in Smash 4, huh?

Of note, he labels Wario a Mario character despite Land existing at the time...did he change his mind once Ware started coming out or does he still think Wario (and by extension, Yoshi and DK) count as Mario representation? If it's the latter, we could have a partial explanation for DK getting a big fat goose egg this time around.