Darky-Sama
Smash Lord
The Captain's Match-Ups!
(Falcon Match-Up General Discussion)
OH NO! OUR MAIN SUCKS!
Well, not anymore.
Keep in mind.
All match-up discussions noted are subjectable to change.
______________________________________________
(Falcon Match-Up General Discussion)
OH NO! OUR MAIN SUCKS!
Well, not anymore.
Keep in mind.
All match-up discussions noted are subjectable to change.
______________________________________________
Okay, lets try this again. Hopefully our FINAL General Discussion Thread.
Lets keep this one alive and updated on the regular.
Rules and Guidelines:
Code:
1.) Flaming [COLOR="Red"]will not[/COLOR] be tolerated.
2.) If you're visiting our General Discussion from another
character board to assist with our Match-Up Evaluations,
we ask that you [COLOR="Red"]actually[/COLOR] use logic and reasoning,
rather than simply quoting "0:100. End Discussion".
[COLOR="Red"]That does not benefit our boards.[/COLOR]
3.) Use decent grammar and punctuation
if you want your posts to be acknowledged.
It makes things much easier for others to
understand and to come to a valid conclusion.
4.) Keep the arguments and debates professional.
Take personal discussions and disputes elsewhere.
5.) Feel free to use moderate humor,
but do not spam the General Discussion Thread.
6.) Match-Ups will generally be discussed for [COLOR="Red"]up to two weeks[/COLOR].
More information can be added in the future,
but we have a lot of ground to cover for our match-ups.Special thanks to Lord Helmet, Slader7 and Teluoborg for assisting with this guide; as well as the other Falcons who assisted with the match-up discussions.
S Tier:
Meta Knight
"CUHM!"
Ratio: 20:80
What to watch out for:
- Meta Knight's lagless aerials.
- Meta Knight's lagless grounded moves.
- Tornado of priority.
- 1-2 frame Downsmash.
- Shuttle Loop.
Things to keep in mind:
- Recover around Meta when offstage to avoid getting gimped.
- Aerial Grab Release on Meta Knight can promote follow-ups.
- Don't stale your up smash, save it for a back-up kill move.
- Meta Knight has no nipples.
- Meta Knight has no knees.
Falcon's hardest match-up, no questions asked. You're going to have to know this match-up inside and out to even stand a chance against a good MK, even then, you've got your work cut out for you. MK has the clear advantage. Lagless, extremely quick attacks, ridiculous priority and disjointed hitboxes. Now, MK isn't an impossible match-up for Falcon to win, but your chances at doing well against one {professional or scrub} are extremely low, considering Meta Knight's physics are generally better. This match-up requires patience and a good knowledge of the match-up to do even considerably well.
When playing Meta Knight, you really have to watch out for his entire move set. Dtilt and ftilt **** our ground game, but are both beatable with utilt. MK's whorenado is a huge brick in our colon. We can, however, easily beat a grounded nado with Falcon Kick, spaced down smashes and utilts. If he goes airborne, utilt him, run away, or shield and punish his freefall. In the air we can hold our ground. Use uair when under MK and properly spaced bairs a lot. Remember, staying below Meta Knight at an angle is the best option if you plan on harming him in the air. Don't try to go for follow-ups or epic combos when playing against a Meta Knight because he is NOT a character that you can play flashy against and get away with it. Regardless of your skill level, just about any Meta Knight can stop your follow-ups with the push of a few buttons. You absolutely must play defensive and really read your opponent at all times.
Punish MK with jabs and (shield) grabs, those are your only truly safe options against MK. If you can perfect shield his up-B, you can punish with a Falcon Dive or uair. Keep in mind:
Grab release -> regrab.
Grab release -> uair.
Grab release- > hyphen smash.
Those might not all be legit, but they're a good way to catch an MK off guard, plus a fresh upsmash can kill MK around 120%.
Snake
"Kept you waiting, huh?"
Ratio: 35:65
What to watch out for:
- Up Tilt extends up to three character spaces away from Snake.
- Forward Tilt is fast, has a decent range, and can be used to 'tilt walk'.
- Mortar Sliding can move Snake from one side of the stage to another with ease.
- Grenade stripping can cause grenades to drop, even if YOU'RE the one holding it.
- Down Throw can be tech-chased.
Things to keep in mind:
- Snake's recovery can be easily punished.
- Snake's grab range is extremely large.
- All of Snake's aerials have extreme landing lag if not timed properly.
- Obviously; keep track of where he places his C4 and Claymores.
- Snake's jab comes out on the third frame.
Perhaps one of the most feared characters on the tier list. Snake is often played to an extremely high defensive level. Spamming grenades and placing explosives around the stage to place opponents on lockdown, forcing them avoid the explosives and fall right into a position to be punished. Certainly not a character to underestimate, regardless of the skill level of any player. Though he's difficult, Snake isn't as much of a problem for Captian Falcon as one would think. Nowhere near in the Captain's favor, but certainly not a 'no contest' match-up.
As soon as a match begins, you should be prepared for Snake to start off with his grenade game. Approaching from the air would be your best bet to avoid them, though any smart Snake player will know exactly how to punish Falcon for an aerial approach. If you consistantly approach from the air, your chances of being predicted and punished will raise dramaticly. If you do need to avoid grenades, I recommend running toward Snake and pulling up a shield out of your dash before his grenade can hit you, or fastfall from the air before reaching a distance where Snake can punish you, then attack with a grounded move immediately after.
Keep in mind, if you pick up a grenade that Snake throws at you-- and he takes out another grenade and drops it with his shield; YOU WILL DROP THE GRENADE YOU ARE HOLDING AS WELL. This is called 'Grenade Stripping'. Don't let yourself get mindgamed by it. If you pick up a grenade, run toward Snake immediately after, then pull up a shield. If he happens to grenade strip you; at least you won't be in the grenades range. If he doesn't, then you'll be holding the grenade with a shield up, which will cause him to get hit and not you. If you choose not to do this, then be careful when picking up grenades or you'll end up taking a lot of damage.
Both Falcon and Snake have jabs that offer priority and protection against each other's attacks. Where our jab can rack up a lot of damage in place, Snake's deals a solid amount of damage with decent knockback. Though his forward tilt is much more reliable and abused in situations, it's always a good idea to watch out for the jab. As for our own, we can cancel it into a grab; which is highly recommended, considering Snake can pull out a grenade during our fourth jab (AKA; The Jab Barriage). However, if you're willing to take a bit of damage, go ahead and use the fourth jab; since Snake will be taking the same amount of damage, plus the additional percent from the jab. This may also promote a chance to get Snake above you in the air depending on his percentage compared to your own.
While in the air, Falcon holds a bit of an advantage. Even though Snake has aerials with amazing knockback capabilities, his ability to follow up afterwards is close to impossible -- considering nine times out of ten, when he does get you caught with an aerial (or if he misses, even), he'll have a long period of landing lag. Abuse your up air against Snake when you're on the stage, and while offstage, don't hesitate to attempt a Knee of Justice. If Snake air dodges, he'll most likely be put in a position where he'll have difficulty making it back to the stage; if he decides to stay on his cypher, the Knee of Justice will cancel out his super armor and usually guarantee you a KO.
Last but not least, be on guard at all times. Even if it seems like the Snake is playing defensively, he can easily change to an offensive disposition that will demolish your approach. Avoid using any attacks that offer large amounts of start-up or cooldown time because Snake CAN punish you just as easily as you can punish him. Don't lose your sense of patience and end up doing something stupid to try and obtain a quick kill. It doesn't take much effort for Snake to change the tides of a game in his favor, and if you gain any lead whatsoever, they usually won't hesitate to abuse whatever moves necessary to regain the advantage.
Wario
"Wah, wah, WAH!"
Ratio: 40:60
What to watch out for:
- Unique aerial mobility and control.
- Wario's Bite.
- Super Armor on Forward Smash.
- High kill potential.
- Wario's Waft: both fully and half charged.
Things to keep in mind:
- Wario can be grab released into multiple, unescapable attacks. [EX. Knee / Falcon Dive]
- Wario's Waft is actually at it's maximum potential a few seconds before Wario begins blinking.
- (Pummel) -> Grab Release -> Falcon Dive is an easy way to build damage on Wario without staling your kill moves.
- Up air is a good way of safely pressuring Wario in the air.
- Don't be afraid to grab release Wario to play 'fair'. We're Falcons, Grab Release -> Knee is as fair as we get.
*Important AT/Gimmicks*
Wario Slayer {discovered by 2Knee}
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7L1Dr3DHqB0&fmt=18
An extremely awkward match-up for Captain Falcon. Though we had a highly debated discussion on what the ratio should truly be, we're going to consider it 40:60 unless proven otherwise. Many people believed the match-up was in Falcon's favor, some claimed it was in Wario's favor, and most people considered it to be about even. In all honesty, Captain Falcon has far too many options in the match-up against Wario to place it any lower than that. Another thing to keep in mind about this match-up is that grab releasing Wario isn't playing dirty. We're bottom tier, Wario's top tier. Pikachus won't hesitate to cut us down, so we shouldn't hesitate to grab release Wario -> Manliness. If you decide not to, you're most likely going to get wrecked, in all honesty.
Even though grab releasing -> Knee of Justice is manly as hell, you should save that for your kill move. Grab release -> Up+B is much better for racking up damage, as well as grab release -> Utilt. Grab release -> Nair is also good if you know how to Nair tech chase, but alternating between the Utilt and Up+B is much better for getting damage in. Up+B guarantees 17%+ if you include pummels and Utilt guarantees 13%+ if you include pummels. Your Knee of Justice should be able to KO around 90% if you don't stale it throughout the match.
Wario has an amazing air game, much better than our own. He can easily pressure us with his short hop aerial approaches and make it difficult for us to get a clean edge on him. He can space his forward airs to smack us away from him every time we go in for a grab, so DON'T try to approach with grabs constantly. RAR some Bairs and fast fall with properly spaced Uairs to get more damage in and punish Wario with a grab whenever you get the chance. Keyword here is PUNISH, not offensively spam your grab game.
If Wario is above you in the air, you can safely space your Uairs to knock him around without much fear of being punished for it. Dair and chomp are two of the biggest problems when it comes down to the aerial battles. Both can be used to stop our approaches if we don't space properly, and offstage, both can be deadly if used against us. Wario can use his Dair directly through us and if you don't DI correctly, it can throw you off for a kill. Chomp basically speaks for itself, offstage it can be used as a suicide attempt and if Wario manages to end it midway, he can recover via bike&up+B // bike&waft.
Regardless of those facts, Wario shouldn't be underestimated, obviously. He has kill potential, amazing control and mobility in the air, good camping abilities, priority, a good recovery and ways to rack damage up rather quickly compared to most of the roster. Things that we, the Falcon mains, can only do moderately well. The main thing tipping this match-up even close to our favor is the grab release combos, so again, don't think that grab releasing is playing too dirty if you really want to win. Either that, or know it's dirty and convince yourself that you love it.
Falco
Not avaliable.
Diddy Kong
Not avaliable.
King Dedede
Not avaliable.
A Tier:
Marth
Not avaliable.
Mr. Game & Watch
Not avaliable.
Pikachu
Not avaliable.
Olimar
Not avaliable.
Ice Climbers
Not avaliable.
R.O.B.
Not avaliable.
Kirby
Not avaliable.
B Tier:
Lucario
Not avaliable.
Zero Suit Samus
-Tips for Sweet Victory;Ratio: 40:60
What to watch out for:
- Armor Pieces can easily promote her stage control.
- Her up air can be used to juggle, as well as outmatch Falcon's air game.
- Her dash attack can be linked to other attacks; including another dash attack.
- Her down smash can be used to setup KOs and follow-ups.
- She has a buffered chaingrab on Falcon that lasts up to 60%.
Things to keep in mind:
- Zero Suit Samus's main form of recovery is a tether.
- Though her air game is generally better, her options are limited if you're below her in the air.
- Since she's a lightweight, Falcon has a much easier time KOing ZSS than she does at KOing him.
- Her down smash, side+b and grab can be easily punished with a short hop knee if she misses.
- Her jab comes out in one frame and has decent priority.
This match-up is a very awkward one for Captain Falcon. Unlike most other characters, Zero Suit Samus can demolish Falcon's aerial approaches with her up air alone, which does extreme harm to our overall metagame for this match-up. However, being strict on timing, this places us at a risk while approaching with our aerials. Being hit with one up air can often result in her attempting to juggle you in the air, or following up with another aerial (usually a Bair or Uair) or a special (most likely an Up+B). This limits us to focusing more on our ground game than the usual aerial approaches. Of course, we're going to be forced into the air one way or another, be it during our recovery or a tendency to punish a Zero Suit's mistakes.
The only recommended time to willingly go into the air is once you've forced Zero Suit Samus above you, because her options to evade are limited to her down air (which is a stall-and-fall) or a fastfall aerial in another direction. Both of which are risky and difficult to pull off. Due to this, Falcon can gain a large edge over Zero Suit if he can stay on her while she's in the airspace above him. Other than that, she'll have to try and air dodge skillfully enough to avoid Falcon's aerials while trying to get back on the ground or below him again.
Recommended Aerials: Spaced Neutral Airs and Up Airs.
As soon as the match begins, you have to be ready to shield, jump or dodge. A good Zero Suit Samus won't hesitate to put those armor pieces of hers to good use, and that can usually mean bad news for her opponents. Though Falcon lacks a projectile game, his ability to control items is perhaps one of the most impressive in the game. Where he does lack a long ranged glidetoss; there are still multiple ways for him to take advantage of the armor pieces:
[+] Captain Falcon has a JCGT {Jump Canceled Glide Toss}. Though it doesn't give him nearly as much of a momentum boost, it still causes him to slide about the same distance of Diddy's normal glide toss (or possibly a bit further). A retreating, reverse JCGL would be your best option for staying away from Zero Suit Samus, since Falcon's grounded throws are rather laggy due to his overly dramatical tosses.
[+] Thanks to Captain Falcon's lagless aerials, he can easily Z-Drop an armor piece while in midair and follow up with an aerial when ZSS is below him. Keep in mind, dropping the armor piece still provides considerable knock back, unlike most other items that can be used to combo after an Z-Drop (Ex. Turnips and Bananas). That makes your timing very strict, depending on what aerial you wish to follow up with.
On the ground, Zero Suit Samus has both speed and range, but many of her attacks have a large amount cool down time. This limits her abilities to out maneuver Falcon's ground game by a good quarter. Another large factor for the difference in their ground game is that Falcon is one of the few characters that can outmatch ZSS in speed. You would be surprised at how easy it is to simply run away from her attacks, then going back in to punish with a reverse Raptor Boost or another attack.
Approaching Zero Suit Samus is the difficult part of the match-up. She controls the air, and can offer somewhat of a "bait and punish" strategy against Falcon when he attempts to approach her on the ground. The bad thing about this is, she has range and projectiles, where Falcon does not. This forces Falcon to approach her if she doesn't want to get too close herself. Her down smash is the biggest the to look out for while on the ground. It's range stretches out a good two character spaces infront of her and has a hitbox that extends up to the height of her head. Though it has extremely slow start-up and cool down time, if she uses it while you're attacking from a distance or running towards her, you'll most likely get hit. Approach with caution and be prepared to pull up a shield at any time, even while dashing towards her. Once her attacks miss (or have been shielded), then you can attempt to punish her with a grab or an attack in return.
slader7 said:Stages to Avoid:
Final Destination: 70-30 ZSS (Falcon's most terrible stage)
Brinstar: 70-30 ZSS (The terrain's unevenness hinders Falcon's AC abilities)
Norfair: 70-30 ZSS (Falcon has options in platforms, but ZSS has better options)
Rainbow Cruise: 75-25 ZSS (Can you spell R-A-P-E?)
Jungle Japes: 70-30 (ehh)
Neutral:
BattleField: 65-35 ZSS
SmashVille: 65-35 ZSS
Halberd: 65-35 ZSS
Yoshi's Island: 65-35 ZSS
Frigate Orpheon: 65-35 ZSS
PictoChat: 65-35 ZSS
Good:
Pokemon Stadium: 60-40 ZSS
Delfino Plaza: 60-40 ZSS
Castle Siege: 55-45 ZSS
Port Town Aero Dive: 45-55 Falcon (it has no ledges)
Toon Link
Not avaliable.
Pit
Not avaliable.
Donkey Kong
Not avaliable.
C Tier:
Peach
Not avaliable.
Luigi
Not avaliable.
Fox
Not avaliable.
Wolf
Not avaliable.
Sonic
Not avaliable.
Sheik
Not avaliable.
D Tier:
Bowser
"We prefer to be called 'Festively Plump'."
Ratio: 45:55
What to watch out for:
- Large grounded range.
- Large aerial range.
- High kill potential.
- Large shield.
- Lots of {OOS} Out of Shield options.
Things to keep in mind:
- Bowser is a large target; {Combo Bait}.
- Bowser has amazing range to punish approaches.
- Bowser's shield is large, making him difficult to pressure.
- Bowser is most vulnerable while in the air.
- Attempt to bait as much as possible.
Bowser is one of Falcon's more favorable match-ups. A large, bulky character that proves as good combo bait, right? Wrong. Bowser might infact be easy to combo, but getting the combo started can be more difficult than going to college. Bowser might be slow and large, but he's an absolute tank against characters who lack projectiles, especially Falcon.
To start off this discussion, we'll go ahead and talk about Bowser's amazing shield. Perhaps one of the most durable in the game. Most of our approaches can be demolished because of Bowser's large shield and his amazing {OOS} options. Keep in mind that Bowser has amazing grab range as well, so hitting him while he's in his shield can result in being shield grabbed. That makes our aerial approaches predictable and close to useless to say the least. Not only does Bowser have his amazing shield to limit our air game, he also has amazing grounded range to repel most of our grounded approaches. Forward tilts and grabs are especially useful against Falcon because he has to get close to Bowser to be able to hit him. Once of the largest problems about lacking a projectile game. That makes Bowser's defensive game extremely useful against Falcon no matter how you look at it.
Now, how to get around a highly defensive Bowser.
First, you'll want to know how to approach with:
-Shield out of dash -> Grab/Jab {depending on how Bowser reacts}.
-Jump fastfall airdodge {near Bowser} -> Buffered jab -> Jab {or grab}.
Approaching Bowser is rather difficult no matter how you look at it, so the best option at getting close is with airdodges and shields to get as close as you possibly can. Once you're within range, you can use a grab -> throw to force Bowser into the air. One thing that's good about this match-up is Bowser lacks many options to get around Falcon's air game safely, especially when caught above Falcon on {or off} of the stage. If you can get Bowser into the air, you're pretty much in the clear.
Baiting attacks from Bowser is another good way of approaching. Dashing toward Bowser, doing a short hop fastfall backflip away from him or toward him, then punishing depending on his reaction. You can't really go wrong with fake-outs while using Falcon because of his mobility on the ground and in the air.
Zelda45-55
- Utilize:
- JABS, utilt, dtilt, up-angled ftilt, FH nair>jab>>jab>grab
- SD'd aerials, uair, nair, bair
- Raptor Boost
- Dthrow
- Other tips:
- Use a lot of jabs and FF'd uairs or RAR'd uairs
- Be cautious and patient with his Fortress OoS
- When you're hanging on the ledge, roll in so that you do not get Fire Breath *****
- When trapped in Fire Breath, SDI up and away to escape
- Watch out for his quick, powerful tilts
- CP:
- Lylat
- BF
- FD
- SV
- Ban:
- Brinstar
- Norfair
Not avaliable.
Pokémon Trainer
Not avaliable.
Ike
"I **** my friends."
~General ****.
Ratio: 50:50
What to watch out for:
- An agreeably disjointed jab with locking potential.
- Neutral Air and Forward Air pressure game.
- Extremely high kill potential.
- Overall high range on attacks.
- Neutral+B and Up+B have super armor frames.
Things to keep in mind:
- You can DI out of Ike's jab lock.
- Above 40%, play defensively. Ike can KO you around this percent.
- Ike is easy to punish offstage {beware of his up+B, however}.
- Captain Falcon's Up+B demolishes Ike's Up+B.
- Like Falcon, Ike lacks projectiles. Camping and punishing is effective.
Compared to most of the Captain's match-ups, Ike isn't nearly as difficult to manuever around. This match-up focuses generally around how good Ike is at punishing and how skillful the person playing Falcon can mindgame and avoid Ike's attacks. Playing defensive with Falcon is extremely useful here, until you get one opening on Ike. Forcing Ike into the air can leave you multiple options for punishing him while airborne or once he lands, considering majority of his aerial options leave him with a high cool down time // landing lag.
While grounded, it's best to avoid getting caught in Ike's jab. The second and third hit's of Ike's jab have enough range to hit Falcon out of his aerial approaches {and even catch Falcon in a jab lock if the second hit is canceled}. If caught in a jab lock, Falcon can either DI through Ike, or outside of the jab's range by moving backward and pulling up a shield before the jab is able to hit again {recommended}. Overall, this is Ike's largest match-up leveling factor when it comes to a general offense. Play it safe and try to stage out of his jab range or you'll end up eating a good percentage before getting out of it.
[So, how do we get around the jab?] -- The most effective ways of getting through Ike's jab safely would be to dash toward him, pulling up a shield while in the midst of the dash {causing Falcon to slide as far into the jab as possible, while having a shield up}, and attempting to shield grab Ike between his jab hitboxes. Another recommended method is to run toward Ike, short hop and air dodge through him and attempt to punish him with a buffered grab or dash attack. {Dash attack is good for getting past Ike's first jab, which is all he should have time to perform with decent buffering.}
The one thing in this match-up that cannot be overlooked is Ike's ability to KO opponents at percents as low as 50 with a clean forward smash {not staled}. Although Falcon, being a generally heavy character, can probably survive a forward smash around 70-75% with proper DI. It's manditory to keep an eye out for Ike's smash attacks while recovering back onto the stage or when knocked into the air because they can punish you upon landing if you don't dodge properly.
Staying offensive against Ike isn't a bad idea, considering he lacks speed and a projectile game, but he's not a character you'd want to get greedy and test your luck against at higher percents. If you want to play offensively, attempt to pressure Ike with grabs and aerials as much as possible to keep him on the defensive; keeping him in the air is usually the best option since it limits Ike's options of retaliation. So he's left with being hit, or being punished upon landing.
E Tier:
Lucas
Not avaliable.
Mario
Not avaliable.
Ness
Not avaliable.
Yoshi
Not avaliable.
Samus
Not avaliable.
F Tier:
Jigglypuff
Not avaliable.
Captain Falcon
Ratio: 50:50
Captain Falcon Dittos. Possibly the most manly match-up in the game.
Knee vs Knee. Punch vs Punch. Nipples vs Nipples. Testosterone vs Testosterone.
Show them your moves and may the better Captain win! Hyesz.
(Note: Real Match-Up Data will be added later.)
Link
Not avaliable.
Ganondorf
Not avaliable.
