Brawl+ Stage Legality Discussion: Brawl+ 7.0 Gold Discussion (Go Discuss Everything!)

[FrozenHobo]

i guess i can look at it, but i don' think theres much wrong with it. its a CP in singles and a neutral in doubles., which seems to work fine. if more people feel its too long it shouldn't be too hard to shrink it.

 

[Alphatron]

These two stages are SSE stages I'd personally recommend.

 

[FrozenHobo]

the first one the right ledge can't be grabbed. if that was fixed it would be perfect.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Now going over some of the SSE stages, I think that a bunch of these can be made into some great stages, especially compared to some of the crappier, non special stages, Big Blue+ cough.

Now I'm going to start by linking to the thread(s) with the stages/ DLs/pics and possibly some suggestions.


Factory Hall (2nd pic from EY's Thread) :
Looks like it could be a great team stage. Shrink the boundaries a little bit, and add a ledge to the right side of the stage. It's almost like a Dreamland 64 coming back to us.

Forest Moss Platforms (4th pic from EY's Thread):
Looks like it's be a great stage. Simple, but unique platform layout. Add ledges, though not to the upper platforms, and it'd probably be great!

Inner Factory (By Rudementry):
I think the stage an look a little something like this:

Change the boundaries, add ledges, do whatever you need to do, but I think the stage, in a similar fashion to how I made my picture, could be a good team stage.

Ideas on other stages? I'm not suggesting too many platform heavy stages because I want as little camping as possible.

*EDIT*
And I agree with the two ledges Alphatron suggested. Read my post for more details on the first stage he mentioned. The second one if good too.

Opinions?

Eternal Yoshi's Post
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9040797&postcount=91

Rudementry's Post
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8753698&postcount=505

 

[MK26]

the first one the right ledge can't be grabbed. if that was fixed it would be perfect.

the correct statement is 'maestro can change that'

or better yet, 'if mediafire wasnt down, maestro would have already had a fix up, but he's too lazy to upload it to any other site'

 

[FrozenHobo]

i don't like that inner factory stage. the others are fine, but that one is just too large.

and maestro, i'm still waiting to get that PS1 pac. good work, though. are we still doing the other PS1?

 

[GHNeko]

GRASSLAND PLATFORMS.

omggggg gogogog that stage has the same design as a custom stage i made a long time ago and it is made of win.

This is also really really good.



EDIT: Has anyone though about replacing a stage with Wifi Room and then replacing Wifi room with something else?

 

[MK26]

of course

i want ps1 saved, i know how it is to be saved, i just need it to be done via code

 

[RPGsFTW]

This one with grab-able ledges! It looks great!

Fix/save some stages and use them instead of already banned stages that have no hope!

 

[Deleted member]

Except that Dreamland 64 is a neutral... ...making that statement a little of an oxymoron.
WWR is in the process of being shrunk, I believe; but is there anyone attempting to shrink SSE: Jungle by a bit? It doesn't have to be shrunk by too much, but something should be done.

Neutrals can be amazing counterpicks. *Cough* Marth's Story =p

And SSE:Jungle shrunk doesnt seem like a bad idea. Err compressed is a better term I suppose. Iits properties of high ceiling, large stage, and medium distance from edge to blast zones make it a good CP on heavy hitters while gimping or confining them to the edge at low percentages. Then camping in the middle at higher percentages to rack damage on them seems to be good for the cp. Although it can be turned into a huge campfest >.>

 

[RPGsFTW]

Where's all the stage legality discussion, seriously?

My TO wants to know why PictoChat has been banned, in B+ at least, for some time now. It's his CP of choice. >_>

 

[GHNeko]

Then unban it lol.

 

[Alphatron]

Pretty sure it was banned due to campy drawings.

 

[MK26]

banned due to a conservative stage list...

 

[Alphatron]

I still thinking Halberd>>>>Delfino Plaza.

 

[JCaesar]

^ I agree. I don't see why either one should be banned though.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Umm, I kinda expected to here more about PictoChat, but if campy drawing is the main problem, then ok.

And I think that Halberd and Delfino both have their own camping issues. More so at Halberd to me. I hate the layout of the long main platform. It gives the stage a very campy feel to it. Delfino has water stalling, walk-off camping, etc. BUT, like JCaesar said, I don't think that they should be banned.

And about Castle Siege. Will the first part staying frozen become the Castle Siege we all use or what? I agree with The Cape, when he said something like: the second part is all about camping, and the third is like another Lylat/FD. The first part is all we need.

 

[Plum]

The third part is also fine gameplay wise, but it offers nothing new to the stage list. The first transformation however is totally unique in its layout, and is definitely a legit CP as far as I'm concerned.

The platform layout is unique, the sloped main platform is unique, and it offers some wall jump/cling options for recovery. Nothing else offers that. The third stage however is like Cape said, a combination of FD and Lylat.

 

[Deleted member]

Umm, I kinda expected to here more about PictoChat, but if campy drawing is the main problem, then ok.

And I think that Halberd and Delfino both have their own camping issues. More so at Halberd to me. I hate the layout of the long main platform. It gives the stage a very campy feel to it. Delfino has water stalling, walk-off camping, etc. BUT, like JCaesar said, I don't think that they should be banned.

And about Castle Siege. Will the first part staying frozen become the Castle Siege we all use or what? I agree with The Cape, when he said something like: the second part is all about camping, and the third is like another Lylat/FD. The first part is all we need.

Picto. Yep. =/

Halberd vs Delfino... I'd disagree. Delfino is much more campy regarding walk off blastzones, corners, and water. Halberd just encourages chars to use the jump thru base as an advantage in counterpicking.

And Siege frozen in first section would be pretty awesome. Similar to Brinstar in CP due to small size, and even better to reduce projectile camping with the small hill/slant on the base. Just the stage ledges/corners suck for some recoveries.

 

[AMKalmar]

... it offers some wall jump/cling options for recovery. Nothing else offers that.

NPC+ offers that. Just sayin'.

 

[Veril]

Siege frozen in the third transformation would be the only platformless stage that could be legal along with FD.

CS contains 2 stages (1st and 3rd transformations) that could each be CP stages if there was no transformation (ie, they each existed independently).

 

[GHNeko]

I still don't think CS 2 is really that bad. It's but a bunch of aspects that are simply being pushed to the side because the stage has a temporary walk-off?

Blaaah.

 

[FrozenHobo]

i honestly don't have a problem with CS and unless some game breaking aspect of the stage makes it impossible to function in its current form, i say leave it as is. if only for now.

 

[Veril]

How about, its not gonna be legal with the:

1. massively campy second transformation that includes a walkoff.
2. random and disrupting influence of the transformation sequence... especially when it saves players from spikes and gimps.


The third transformation is better than Lylat by a large margin due to the tilting being non-random. In fact, the tilting is dependent on character position onstage, and thus adds a strategic element unique to that stage. It also limits the projectile spam you'd see on FD.

The logic behind character balance and stage balance is completely different for everyone's information. We don't need or even want 100% of the stages into neutrals or CP.

 

[FrozenHobo]

ok, so would you prefer the first and third forms to be separate stages?

 

[Veril]

ok, so would you prefer the first and third forms to be separate stages?

Yeah, they both have unique traits without any major flaws.

 

[FrozenHobo]

kk, well getting the first form alone is the easy part... its that third form that will need a code from dant.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

The tilting on Lylat Cruise isn't actually random. It matches up to the background. It's just that it will take way too long to memorize everything regarding tilting on that stage, so it's not worth it.

 

[Veril]

The tilting with the third transformation is controllable by the players. How amazing is that? Come on... F*** Lylat! I want strategic bad***ery! Being able to make the stage till based on character positioning is something no other stage offeres.

 

[GHNeko]

Is it weight dependant as well?

 

[Veril]

Is it weight dependant as well?

Spoiler

I actually don't know

... :embarrass

How sick would that be though?! I'm so psyched for this to potentially be its own stage, you don't even know. Its so legit as a CP.

 

[GHNeko]

If you make it weight dependant, then its a CP for heavies.

 

[AMKalmar]

Alternate stage loader to select it or will it have its own tab? I think hold L with ASL is a good way to do it.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Castle Siege's 2nd and 3rd forms are stupid, imo. What heavy character would honestly pick there instead of the other stages? Heavys don't like an easy opening in which they can be approached. The stages tilting is barely a difference to this. From what I've always witnessed, heavies can abuse platforms pretty well, but it all really depends on the person.

That grass SSE stage looks like a really nice CP/Neutral. That needs to be used. The ledges were already fixed to be grab-able.

And Smashville > Ps2 Frozen, I'd say. Vegas people LOVE Smashville.

 

[Veril]

I never said CSIII was a CP for heavies. Saying the third form is stupid with nothing to support that statement at all is pretty pathetic considering I gave a reason it was amazing.

PSII vs. Smashville is ultimately unimportant. They are both in a class all their own in terms of fairness. If I see any stage that would be an acceptable trade a frozen PSII for, ever, I'll let you all know. I highly doubt this will ever happen.

 

[MK26]

derp

1) modify a regular ps2 file whatever way we like
2) modify ps2 rel file to load custom stages
3) insert custom SSS+stage expansion code into B+ gct
4) rename ps2 file stgcustom#.pac and rel file st_custom#.pac, and put them in the correct folders
5) ???
6) Profit

 

[Veril]

Yo, if that works... well, that would be awesome. Go for it. You're saying we'd have a frozen and unfrozen variant of PSII?

 

[RPGsFTW]

The third transformation is better than Lylat by a large margin due to the tilting being non-random. In fact, the tilting is dependent on character position onstage, and thus adds a strategic element unique to that stage. It also limits the projectile spam you'd see on FD.

I don't think anyone cares enough, honestly now, to use the stage for its tilting to their advantage. I also don't think that makes a valid support reason to make it kept alone.

Me not liking Castle Siege 2/3 doesn't have to effect the decision of the stage being made into separate parts, but you liking it doesn't either. It almost sounds like you'd want it separate just because it may be possible. I wouldn't call that the fairest of reasons, IF it becomes its ow stage.

And the "is better than" part is an opinion as well. And, apparently, Lylat's tilting isn't random s what you said doesn't counter it. Your reason is not amazing as a supporting statement. Though what you say, and what I say, is an opinion anyway.


Good ****, Maestro! =]

 

[FrozenHobo]

@ veril: yeah. we can that for any stage, really... well, most.

 

[MK26]

@ veril: yeah. we can that for any stage, really

q4t

the custom variants are independent of any level freezes applied to the originals, but all customs are affected by the same line of that code

thats why we should figure out the mechanism the stages use,, so we can turn it off in specific cases