Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
LOL @ the Pokémon tier reference...If ALL randomness is taken out, then what will we do with moves that are basically relied on for trip set-ups (Zelda's dtilt, TL's dash attack, etc.), and what will we do with something as variable as Peach's turnip game? If we're gonna blanket remove randomness, we also need a way to compensate such moves without making them OP or UP (is that even a term? Let's go with NU, Smogon-style).
Quick change the subject!uh oh, this discussion again.
Last time, it was very not pretty.
+1Maybe its just me.... But shields regenerate too fast in my opinion.
I don't see any problems with chaingrabs as long as they're DIable/ only work at really specific percents.I can still chaingrab...
I mean it's 10x harder but I can still do it ...
Anyone want me to send a replay?
I can still 0-Death =PI don't see any problems with chaingrabs as long as they're DIable/ only work at really specific percents.
Im doing bthrow to fthrow =It's known that you can still do alt infinites with dash grabs and pivot grabs.
Sure.I can still chaingrab...
I mean it's 10x harder but I can still do it ...
Anyone want me to send a replay?
Have AIM or MSN?Sure.
10char
All interesting, except for the second Peach example, which seems like you'd get way too many stitch faces.Tripping moves: always trip till ~n% and only a certain hitbox trips
After that never trips
Olimar's Pikmin Pluck:
Color changes every n frames.
13 frames Red
13 frames Yellow
13 frames Blue
11 frames Purple
10 frames White
Repeat from red
So the pattern repeats every second.
Peach:
Everything is n% turnip
or
First turnip: weakest
....
last: stitch face
repeat from weakest
Fsmash: First time tennis, second time golf, third time pan. Repeat from tennis
You get what I mean. Randomness can be completely removed without taking away the character's options. And it adds strategy. I'm not saying this will be done soon, or they are the best solutions, the examples are just to prove my statement.
Or you can post the link here?Have AIM or MSN?
how am i supposed to post a replay here...?Or you can post the link here?
upload it to mediafire, megaupload, rapidshare, etc and post the link herehow am i supposed to post a replay here...?
I can't record. Isn't it possible to send replays through the wii?upload it to mediafire, megaupload, rapidshare, etc and post the link here
You don't need to record it, just send the replay file to your SD while in brawl, then put the file on your PC, then upload it, like I did.I can't record. Isn't it possible to send replays through the wii?
They're just examples, you can always change how it works, like 3 cycles for a stitch. Or just nerf stitch face to do 15% dmgAll interesting, except for the second Peach example, which seems like you'd get way too many stitch faces.
And in the Olimar example, I suppose with insane timing and luck (to get the right frame initially) you could get all of one color? lol that'd be cool to mess with.
Sorry if I insulted your intelligence. Can't be too careful.OOO i got it genius
Nah it ment to be that I got it. And that your a genius. I forgot my punctuationSorry if I insulted your intelligence. Can't be too careful.
in your replay, thats just the blizzard cg. i think you can SDI blizzard now so against humans thats not as effective, though i like how it worked. i'll try it out the next time i have friends over.Sorry if I insulted your intelligence. Can't be too careful.
Randomness is not the root of the problem, it's the move's intended use. When D3 presses Side B, the player intends to use a light projectile attack. Waddle Dees and Waddle Doos serve the same function, have the same physics, and only do 2% difference in damage. It is an expected part of using D3's Side B.Since it's pretty much impossible to take out every single form of randomness, taking only some out would definitely cause a lot of complaints. And where would one draw the line on what is "too random"? It's just risky business tampering with that...
Randomness is not the root of the problem, it's the move's intended use. When D3 presses Side B, the player intends to use a light projectile attack. Waddle Dees and Waddle Doos serve the same function, have the same physics, and only do 2% difference in damage. It is an expected part of using D3's Side B.
Gordo's, however, are entirely different. They are significantly larger, travel farther, do more damage (23%) and KO well. You didn't intend on throwing out projectile equivalent of a smash attack, nor were you counting on it. You just wanted to stop your opponent's approach and you killed them by mistake.
So, if the randomized effect changes the player intended purpose of the move, then it's a Sakurai.
Because in a competitive game no player should be awarded for being lucky, or punished for being unlucky.Why is randomness such a big deal. It's pure versatility, in the case of Peach. The turnips all do the same thing, but some are stronger than others. Would you rather they all do the same amount of damage? It's not like it would change the game at all, it would just make turnips less interesting.
Gordos? A threat? Only if they hit you while you're in stun. D3's toss is so slow and predictable; it's not like your going to say: "Oh, I wasn't shielding because I didn't think it was a gordo." You're going to have something thrown at you when you see that animation, so it really doesn't make much of a difference what it is. My only recomendation would be to decrease the size of gordos, because that can mess with your timing.
All in all, I don't care too much about randomness, but taking it out just makes the game blander.
I believe Hitbox shift mod still isn't working yet so, the Dtilt actually hasn't been changed YET.Erm, where exactly is the spike on Pit's dtilt now? I'm having trouble finding it. Tip doesn't seem to work, thanks.
0_o why list it then? Ah well, thanks for clearing that up.I believe Hitbox shift mod still isn't working yet so, the Dtilt actually hasn't been changed YET.
I hate to break it to you, but there are games just as competitive, if not more competitive that have luck intertwined throughout the game.Because in a competitive game no player should be awarded for being lucky, or punished for being unlucky.
You can still keep their options even if you remove the randomness part. D3 can throw Dees and Doos in order, and when you hold B you throw a Gordo, with more endlag.
Peach's turnips can also appear in a set order. Then both players can easily know which turnip is coming, it keeps the variety but removes randomness.
There are always solutions to things you know.
****it JCZ... You're in my head this time. I was going to use that exact comparison. :[Play poker much? Poker is 100% luck and the mindgames that result from that luck, with a smattering of math knowledge which you can use to take advantage of that luck. And I don't think anyone would argue that Poker isn't competitive.
Here is a list of moves they have added special effects on...I think they won't edit the effect of unedited moves in order to save line space.
Also Ness' bat already pings at the tip.
I know why it is good...in fact I love the move...that is why I was thinking of how it could be better in some way...Nair has insane priority. Not only that, it has multiple forms of utility. The strong hit largely serves as a gtfo, and the weak hit can link into uair, utilt, fair and in some cases, a grab. It also lasts forever.
My point was the speed up while nice screwed up the timing on certain things like hitting people below platforms on BF...so I feel it sort of screwed somethings away...Dair lasts for god knows how long, comes out significantly faster, and a has a ******** *nipple spike* trajectory on the very delayed sourspot. The speed up on the move I believe doesn't happen till the hitbox, so it shouldn't be effecting any durations that I know of, unless someone messed up.
I know what all of those are...however still the only one that truly works is Dair...but with PKT the way it was before this nightly it added a new one that helped out by a bit...in fact it just made it someone risky to try and run from Ness to a degree as well...just like in vBrawl (the slower speed really was nice for making it add pressure)Also, multiple true combos exist into kills, dair to uair (has ******** quantities of hitstun, even with the best DI its trivial to pursue this), fair to uair if the opponent fails to SDI out, dthrow uair or nair (depending on DI, the lower BKB on dthrow makes this possible), FF fair (non last hit) to grab bthrow, etc.