Social Banjo-Kazooie Social Thread - Project Dream Come True!

[3BitSaurus]

Yeah, PSASBR really needed to utilize a more diverse cast. It feels less like a celebration of PS4 all stars, but instead it feels like a game to advertise 24 different games at once.

It had some cool ideas, though, like crossover stages and rival battles. It also had some weird ideas, like the "only kill with specials" and some parts of the general gameplay.

Just imagine Crash and Spyro in that game as rivals. That, and regular Dante. The roster already becomes a bit better just from that.

Maybe one day I'll post a for-fun PSASBR2 roster here. But for today, I'll compromise with my Grunty Industries post... coming until tonight.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Yeah, PSASBR really needed to utilize a more diverse cast. It feels less like a celebration of PS4 all stars, but instead it feels like a game to advertise 24 different games at once.

To add insult to injury, some of said characters had their series become dead or put on ice sometime afterwards (Jak & Daxter and Sly both got follow-ups that didn't do so well, and Sony let Insomniac take a presumed break from Ratchet & Clank for lord knows how long after the RC1 remake).

It's like it was unintentionally saying "remember these guys from the good old days of the PS2? Take a good, long look at them, because we're putting them back into the vault forever after this".

But I digress. I'm thankful that there's more attempts at understanding what fans want with this series. You don't build up years of goodwill overnight, after all.

 

[ze9]

Guess it's just a matter of YOUR nostalgia VS MY nostalgia. Different generations have different dream characters. That's fine.
And that's why diversifying the characters is a good thing.

 

[yeet123]

https://twitter.com/OaklandElliff/status/1153742595480326144​

So dope

 

[Evil Trapezium]

https://twitter.com/OaklandElliff/status/1153742595480326144​

So dope

Kind of makes me wonder why Banjo only has four fingers in Japan instead of five.

 

[3BitSaurus]

So, came back from Grunty Industries and... well...

To be honest, it wasn't nearly as bad as I remember. Still the worst level to me, though.

The thing with GI is that the level forces you to do things in a certain way - at least for the first few Jiggies. When you first arrive, the front door is locked, but you can access a switch that opens the train station. Meaning that if you skipped Old King Coal somehow, be ready for some backtracking.

Once you get inside via Chuffy, you can open the doors and proceed to navigating the structure. For the most part, it's the same deal for all five floors: find your way to the next floor via an alternative way (a window, an air vent or whatever), activate the teleporter and unlock the Elevator Shaft exit so you can return easily later.

Most of the level is sectioned and you can only explore the first floor freely at first. To make things a bit more strange, you need to collect batteries, unscrew... well, screws and press switches to open several passageways inside the factory. And to be clear: you need all of these open if you want every Jiggy.

Looking back, I can see not only why this level is hated... but also why DK64 is hated. That entire game felt like Grunty Industries, with everything divided into sections and the game seemingly punishing you for exploring at your own pace. If you don't know what you're doing (and believe me, kid Saurus had no idea what he was doing), you're going to get overwhelmed for sure.

To help me explain why... here are some highlights:

Grunty Industries Highlights

Spoiler: Spy-I-Cams and Tintops

Let me start by saying that these things can go to hell. They're all over the place, are annoying to defeat (especially in Clinker's Cavern) block important passageways, just like the octopi in Atlantis and serve no other purpose than interrupt your progress through the level.

You need to shoot the camera to temporarily disable the Tintops from spawning, but sometimes they are positioned in such an awkward angle that this simply isn't possible. And I don't understand why they made the alarm activate even if you're Washer Banjo, when not only should you not qualify as an intruder (I mean, you're using the Service Elevator after all), but you also have no means of defending yourself from these things.

At least, unlike the octopi, you can simply run away from the Tintops. Doesn't make them less annoying, tough.

Spoiler: Elevator Shaft and Service Elevator

You don't exactly do anything in the Elevator Shaft, but you do a lot with it. Each door aside from the first floor's is closed when you first arrive, so you need to actually explore each floor and find the door leading to the Shaft in order to open it. Usually, getting to the next floor involves a Shock Jump Pad or the Claw Clamber Boots, so look out for those.

The Service Elevator can only be accessed by Washer Banjo, along with a few marked doors. This is important because Washer Banjo, like the Daddy T-Rex, can't use the teleporter pads.

If you want to fully explore this place, you'll need all the possible entryways to every floor unlocked. These are two of the features that I feel contribute a lot to people's general frustration with this level, as it feels like every little room is cordoned off. And when you factor in the batteries, screws and the Emergency Exit... not a good start for most players. Speaking of...

Spoiler: Bazza! Batteries and Screws

There are four doors in Grunty Industries that need batteries to open. Said batteries are... all over the place, really. You need the Taxi pack to get each one, then navigate all the way back to the door and use it. Combined with the things said above, it feels like you're unlocking doors to unlock other doors sometimes.

The Screws are equally important, as you can't use one of Mumbo's pads (which opens the way to the boss), complete the worker rabbit quest and access certain corridors without unscrewing them. The way it works is this: if an object needs unscrewing, the bolts are always on the floor directly above it. This means you need a bit of map awareness in order to find exactly the ones you're looking for. Thankfully, the factory has signs for everything, so remember where the rooms are. Always.

Spoiler: Washer Banjo

An interesting transformation. You can only get into certain doors with Washer Banjo (including one that houses a Jiggy) and it's needed to press a switch that unlocks the way to the boss. But the most important quest here is finding the worker rabbits and washing their clothes, which... was a lot less trouble than I remembered, honestly. Whenever you pass a rabbit, try to memorize where they are. Then, after you open all doors and passages, try doing this quest. It's way easier than I think a lot of people perceive it.

The only thing preventing Washer Banjo in being more instrumental for navigating Grunty Industries is the lack of a good jump. So, once more, it feels like the level is deliberately preventing you from exploring at your own pace.

Spoiler: EMP

Many people find this spell a chore, but I find it interesting. Once you use a Mumbo pad, he disables the machinery in the area for a few seconds. You then need to switch back to the bear and bird, go back to that same area and do what you need to do. This is required to unlock the way to the boss, as well as the 4th Floor elevator door, the Quality Control minigame and Clinker's Cavern.

For once, alternating between the characters repeatedly feels like it has a purpose, while seeming like a natural thing to do. Seems like Rare learned from their mistakes with DK64 a year before, at least when it comes to this.

Spoiler: Weldar

Not going to lie: he gave me hell as a child, especially the part where he electrifies the floor. But now, he seemed a lot easier (though still a bit tougher than the other bosses so far). Weldar also seems to be one of the few bosses with an unlocking requirement (using Mumbo to disable a magnet, then pressing a switch with Washer Banjo). Another unique thing is that you don't get his Jiggy right away after you win, instead opening a pathway to it.

The trick is to distance yourself a bit, but not by much, so that you're just in range when he starts his suction attack. It's really obvious what you need to do in this fight, too. The camera doesn't help one bit, but try to lock the view on Weldar whenever you have the chance.

"How about some nuts and bolts?" hasn't aged well, though.

Spoiler: Packing Room, Quality Control and Clinker's Cavern

The three minigames of this place.

Packing Room needs a battery to be accessed and has you collecting Twinklies again, but this time you have to deliver them to colored doors. It's possible to enter the minigame with only Banjo and leave Kazooie out, but I certainly wouldn't reccommend it, because you lose access to the Running Shoes then. Really easy minigame, just be mindful of how many Twinklies you're carrying because it slows you down.

Quality Control is a sort of shooting gallery where you need to shoot only the blue Rareware barrels with grenade eggs. If you shoot a green one instead, the room is filled with toxic gas, forcing you to go back to Cable Room and clean it by pressing a switch. Just try to predict the movement of the drums, not much to say. I'm far more interested in the Cable Room, actually. It needs a battery to unlock and seems way too elaborate for a room you're just supposed to pass through... hmm, do I smell cut content?

Finally, Clinker's Cavern is basically Ordnance Storage part two. It's harder and has a more strict time limit, but at least you can locate the Clinkers based on the, uh, sounds they make.

All in all, I remembered why this level is so disliked. It basically takes nearly all elements of exploration and world interaction and basically does away with them, opting to cut your path off in different ways. Still, it wasn't as bad as it felt ten years ago. I thought I wouldn't be able to get even half of the collectibles on my first visit, but here we are.

Spoiler: Grunty Industries Totals

Next time... I'll be between a hot and cold place... let's see if that one remains my third favorite world of Tooie.

 

[yeet123]

So, came back from Grunty Industries and... well...

To be honest, it wasn't nearly as bad as I remember. Still the worst level to me, though.

The thing with GI is that the level forces you to do things in a certain way - at least for the first few Jiggies. When you first arrive, the front door is locked, but you can access a switch that opens the train station. Meaning that if you skipped Old King Coal somehow, be ready for some backtracking.

One you get inside via Chuffy, you can open the doors and proceed to navigating the structure. For the most part, it's the same deal for all five floors: find your way to the next floor via an alternative way (a window, an air vent or whatever, activate the teleporter and unlock the Elevator Shaft exit so you can return easily later).

Most of the level is sectioned and you can only explore the first floor freely at first. To make things a bit more strange, you need to collect batteries, unscrew... well, screws and press switches to open several passageways inside the factory. And to be clear: you need all of these open if you want every Jiggy.

Looking back, I can see not only why this level is hated... but also why DK64 is hated. That entire game felt like Grunty Industries, with everything divided into sections and the game seemingly punishing you for exploring at your own pace. If you don't know what you're doing (and believe me, kid Saurus had no idea what he was doing), you're going to get overwhelmed for sure.

To help me explain why... here are some highlights:

Grunty Industries Highlights

Spoiler: Spi-I-Cams and Tintops

Let me start by saying that these things can go to hell. They're all over the place, are annoying to defeat (especially in Clinker's Cavern) block important passageways, just like the octopi in Atlantis and serve no other purpose than interrupt your progress through the level.

You need to shoot the camera to temporarily disable the Tintops from spawning, but sometimes they are positioned in such an awkward angle that this simply isn't possible. And I don't understand why they made the alarm activate even if yo're Washer Banjo, when not only should you not qualify as an intruder (I mean, you're using the Service Elevator after all), but you also have no means of defending yourself from these things.

At least, unlike the octopi, you can simply run away from the Tintops. Doesn't make them less annoying, tough.

Spoiler: Elevator Shaft and Service Elevator

You don't exactly do anything in the Elevator Shaft, but you do a lot with it. Each door aside from the first floor's is closed when you first arrive, so you need to actually explore each floor and find the door leading to the Shaft in order to open it. Usually, getting to the next floor involves a Shock Jump Pad or the Claw Clamber Boots, so look out for those.

The Service Elevator can only be accessed by Washer Banjo, along with a few marked doors. This is important because Washer Banjo, like the Daddy T-Rex, can't use the teleporter pads.

If you want to fully explore this place, you'll need all the possible entryways to every floor unlocked. These are two of the features that I feel contribute a lot to people's general frustration with this level, as it feels like every little room is cordoned off. And when you factor in the batteries, screws and the Emergency Exit... not a good start for most players. Speaking of...

Spoiler: Bazza! Batteries and Screws

There are four doors in Grunty Industries that need batteries to open. Said batteries are... all over the place, really. You need the Taxi pack to get each one, then navigate all the way back to the door and use it. Combined with the things said above, it feels like you're unlocking doors to unlock other doors sometimes.

The Screws are equally important, as you can't use one of Mumbo's pads, complete the worker rabbit quest and access certain corridors without unscrewing them. The way it works is this: if an object needs unscrewing, the bolts are always on the floor directly above it. This means you need a bit of map awareness in order to find exactly the ones you're looking for. Thankfully, the factory has signs for everything, so remember where the rooms are. Always.

Spoiler: Washer Banjo

An intersting transformation. You can only get into certain doors with Washer Banjo (including one that houses a Jiggy) and it's needed to press a switch that unlocks the way to the boss. But the most important quest here is finding the worker rabbits and washing their clothes, which... was a lot less trouble than I remembered, honestly. Whenever you pass a rabbit, try to memorize where they are. Then, after you open all doors and passages, try doing this quest. It's way easier than I think a lot of people perceive it.

The only thing preventing Washer Banjo in being more instrumental for navigating Grunty Industries is the lack of a good jump. So, once more, it feels like the level is deliberately preventing you from exploring at your own pace.

Spoiler: EMP

Many people find this spell a chore, but I find it interesting. Once you use a Mumbo pad, he disables the machinery in the area for a few seconds. You then need to switch back to the bear and bird, go back to that same area and do what you need to do. This is required to unlock the way to the boss, as well as the 4th Floor elevator door, the Quality Control minigame and Clinker's Cavern.

For once, alternating between the characters repeatedly feels like it has a purpose, while seeming like a natural thing to do. Seems like Rare learned from their mistakes with DK64 a year before, at least when it comes to this.

Spoiler: Weldar

Not going to lie: he gave me hell as a child, especially the part where he electrifies the floor. But now, he seemed a lot easier (though still a bit tougher than the other bosses so far). Weldar also seems to be one of the few bosses with an unlocking requirement (using Mumbo to disable a magnet, then pressing a switch with Washer Banjo). Another unique thing is that you don't get his Jiggy right away after you win, instead opening a pathway to it.

The trick is to distance yourself a bit, but not by much, so that you're just in range when he starts his suction attack. It's really obvious what you need to do in this fight, too. The camera doesn't help one bit, but try to lock the view on Weldar whenever you have the chance.

"How about some nuts and bolts?" hasn't aged well, though.

Spoiler: Packing Room, Quality Control and Clinker's Cavern

The three minigames of this place.

Packing Room needs a battery to be accessed and has you collecting Twinklies again, but this time you have to deliver them to colored doors. It's possible to enter the minigame with only Banjo and leave Kazooie out, but I certainly wouldn't reccommend it, because you lose access to the Running Shoes then. Really easy minigame, just be mindful of how many Twinklies you're carrying because it slows you down.

Quality Control is a sort of shooting gallery where you need to shoot only the blue Rareware barrels with grenade eggs. If you shoot a green one instead, the room is filled with toxic gas, forcing you to go back to Cable Room and clean it by pressing a switch. Just try to predict the movement of the drums, not much to say. I'm far more interested in the Cable Room, actually. It needs a battery to unlock and seems way too elaborate for a room you're just supposed to pass through... hmm, do I smell cut content?

Finally, Clinker's Cavern is basically Ordnance Storage part two. It's harder and has a more strict time limit, but at least you can locate the Clinkers based on the, uh, sounds they make.

All in all, I can see why this level is so disliked. It basically takes nearly all elements of exploration and world interaction and basically does away with them, opting to cut your path off in different ways. Still, it wasn't as bad as it felt ten years ago. I thought I wouldn't be able to get even half of the collectibles on my first visit, but here we are.

Spoiler: Grunty Industries Totals

View attachment 232319

Next time... I'll be between a hot and cold place... let's see if that one remains my third favorite world of Tooie.

Im playing through Tooie rn and just beat Industries... its such a slog. Worst world in the series easily. Labyrinthian level layout, too much transformation/wumba stuff, too many banjo taxi pack objectives, too many minigames, too many panels to unscrew...

 

[StormC]

Kind of makes me wonder why Banjo only has four fingers in Japan instead of five.

Probably because Japanese developers have never handled him before (unlike the Kongs, who got five fingers when they were put in Mario spin-offs). Then again K. Rool got to keep his four fingers... probably less important for him since he's not a playable character usually.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

You guys want to know what gets me so steamed in Smash Ultimate? When I start a battle arena with Spirits on, and other players use Super Armor to try to get easy wins. Luckily, I know that grabs and Final Smashes break through super armor. And also, when I try to set it to let 4 players in, taunt partiers show up! I hate taunt parties! *Panting* Whew, vented that out.

 

[Megadoomer]

So, came back from Grunty Industries and... well...

To be honest, it wasn't nearly as bad as I remember. Still the worst level to me, though.

The thing with GI is that the level forces you to do things in a certain way - at least for the first few Jiggies. When you first arrive, the front door is locked, but you can access a switch that opens the train station. Meaning that if you skipped Old King Coal somehow, be ready for some backtracking.

Once you get inside via Chuffy, you can open the doors and proceed to navigating the structure. For the most part, it's the same deal for all five floors: find your way to the next floor via an alternative way (a window, an air vent or whatever), activate the teleporter and unlock the Elevator Shaft exit so you can return easily later.

Most of the level is sectioned and you can only explore the first floor freely at first. To make things a bit more strange, you need to collect batteries, unscrew... well, screws and press switches to open several passageways inside the factory. And to be clear: you need all of these open if you want every Jiggy.

Looking back, I can see not only why this level is hated... but also why DK64 is hated. That entire game felt like Grunty Industries, with everything divided into sections and the game seemingly punishing you for exploring at your own pace. If you don't know what you're doing (and believe me, kid Saurus had no idea what he was doing), you're going to get overwhelmed for sure.

To help me explain why... here are some highlights:

Grunty Industries Highlights

Spoiler: Spy-I-Cams and Tintops

Let me start by saying that these things can go to hell. They're all over the place, are annoying to defeat (especially in Clinker's Cavern) block important passageways, just like the octopi in Atlantis and serve no other purpose than interrupt your progress through the level.

You need to shoot the camera to temporarily disable the Tintops from spawning, but sometimes they are positioned in such an awkward angle that this simply isn't possible. And I don't understand why they made the alarm activate even if you're Washer Banjo, when not only should you not qualify as an intruder (I mean, you're using the Service Elevator after all), but you also have no means of defending yourself from these things.

At least, unlike the octopi, you can simply run away from the Tintops. Doesn't make them less annoying, tough.

Spoiler: Elevator Shaft and Service Elevator

You don't exactly do anything in the Elevator Shaft, but you do a lot with it. Each door aside from the first floor's is closed when you first arrive, so you need to actually explore each floor and find the door leading to the Shaft in order to open it. Usually, getting to the next floor involves a Shock Jump Pad or the Claw Clamber Boots, so look out for those.

The Service Elevator can only be accessed by Washer Banjo, along with a few marked doors. This is important because Washer Banjo, like the Daddy T-Rex, can't use the teleporter pads.

If you want to fully explore this place, you'll need all the possible entryways to every floor unlocked. These are two of the features that I feel contribute a lot to people's general frustration with this level, as it feels like every little room is cordoned off. And when you factor in the batteries, screws and the Emergency Exit... not a good start for most players. Speaking of...

Spoiler: Bazza! Batteries and Screws

There are four doors in Grunty Industries that need batteries to open. Said batteries are... all over the place, really. You need the Taxi pack to get each one, then navigate all the way back to the door and use it. Combined with the things said above, it feels like you're unlocking doors to unlock other doors sometimes.

The Screws are equally important, as you can't use one of Mumbo's pads (which opens the way to the boss), complete the worker rabbit quest and access certain corridors without unscrewing them. The way it works is this: if an object needs unscrewing, the bolts are always on the floor directly above it. This means you need a bit of map awareness in order to find exactly the ones you're looking for. Thankfully, the factory has signs for everything, so remember where the rooms are. Always.

Spoiler: Washer Banjo

An interesting transformation. You can only get into certain doors with Washer Banjo (including one that houses a Jiggy) and it's needed to press a switch that unlocks the way to the boss. But the most important quest here is finding the worker rabbits and washing their clothes, which... was a lot less trouble than I remembered, honestly. Whenever you pass a rabbit, try to memorize where they are. Then, after you open all doors and passages, try doing this quest. It's way easier than I think a lot of people perceive it.

The only thing preventing Washer Banjo in being more instrumental for navigating Grunty Industries is the lack of a good jump. So, once more, it feels like the level is deliberately preventing you from exploring at your own pace.

Spoiler: EMP

Many people find this spell a chore, but I find it interesting. Once you use a Mumbo pad, he disables the machinery in the area for a few seconds. You then need to switch back to the bear and bird, go back to that same area and do what you need to do. This is required to unlock the way to the boss, as well as the 4th Floor elevator door, the Quality Control minigame and Clinker's Cavern.

For once, alternating between the characters repeatedly feels like it has a purpose, while seeming like a natural thing to do. Seems like Rare learned from their mistakes with DK64 a year before, at least when it comes to this.

Spoiler: Weldar

Not going to lie: he gave me hell as a child, especially the part where he electrifies the floor. But now, he seemed a lot easier (though still a bit tougher than the other bosses so far). Weldar also seems to be one of the few bosses with an unlocking requirement (using Mumbo to disable a magnet, then pressing a switch with Washer Banjo). Another unique thing is that you don't get his Jiggy right away after you win, instead opening a pathway to it.

The trick is to distance yourself a bit, but not by much, so that you're just in range when he starts his suction attack. It's really obvious what you need to do in this fight, too. The camera doesn't help one bit, but try to lock the view on Weldar whenever you have the chance.

"How about some nuts and bolts?" hasn't aged well, though.

Spoiler: Packing Room, Quality Control and Clinker's Cavern

The three minigames of this place.

Packing Room needs a battery to be accessed and has you collecting Twinklies again, but this time you have to deliver them to colored doors. It's possible to enter the minigame with only Banjo and leave Kazooie out, but I certainly wouldn't reccommend it, because you lose access to the Running Shoes then. Really easy minigame, just be mindful of how many Twinklies you're carrying because it slows you down.

Quality Control is a sort of shooting gallery where you need to shoot only the blue Rareware barrels with grenade eggs. If you shoot a green one instead, the room is filled with toxic gas, forcing you to go back to Cable Room and clean it by pressing a switch. Just try to predict the movement of the drums, not much to say. I'm far more interested in the Cable Room, actually. It needs a battery to unlock and seems way too elaborate for a room you're just supposed to pass through... hmm, do I smell cut content?

Finally, Clinker's Cavern is basically Ordnance Storage part two. It's harder and has a more strict time limit, but at least you can locate the Clinkers based on the, uh, sounds they make.

All in all, I remembered why this level is so disliked. It basically takes nearly all elements of exploration and world interaction and basically does away with them, opting to cut your path off in different ways. Still, it wasn't as bad as it felt ten years ago. I thought I wouldn't be able to get even half of the collectibles on my first visit, but here we are.

Spoiler: Grunty Industries Totals

View attachment 232319

Next time... I'll be between a hot and cold place... let's see if that one remains my third favorite world of Tooie.

I'm replaying Tooie on the Xbox 360, and I'm not looking forward to going through Grunty Industries. Maybe I'm building it up in my mind to be worse than it actually is, but I remember that place being a pain just to open the front gate, let alone navigate it. Plus, I'm pretty sure I was missing five notes in that level during my original playthrough, and I have no idea how to figure out where they'd be.

I still need to finish Witchyworld and play through Jolly Roger's Lagoon and Terrydactyland, at the very least, so I probably won't get there for a while. My main concern is that I used to have a Banjo-Tooie guide, but I sold it, so while older issues of Nintendo Power will help for the first four levels, finding the collectibles in the remaining worlds seems like it will be annoying.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I'm replaying Tooie on the Xbox 360, and I'm not looking forward to going through Grunty Industries. Maybe I'm building it up in my mind to be worse than it actually is, but I remember that place being a pain just to open the front gate, let alone navigate it. Plus, I'm pretty sure I was missing five notes in that level during my original playthrough, and I have no idea how to figure out where they'd be.

I still need to finish Witchyworld and play through Jolly Roger's Lagoon and Terrydactyland, at the very least, so I probably won't get there for a while. My main concern is that I used to have a Banjo-Tooie guide, but I sold it, so while older issues of Nintendo Power will help for the first four levels, finding the collectibles in the remaining worlds seems like it will be annoying.

Well, I still remembered a few things even though this was my first playthrough in 10 years. So I think that helped. But I remember a lot of suffering from my time here as a kid. The stuff with Mumbo and Washer Banjo in particular was awful. Now, though... it wasn't nearly as bad. It's still the worst level for me, mind you, but I found it a bit more tolerable this time around. Even the layout becomes easier after you memorize it... though how much time that can take seems to differ between players. The Tintops were still a pain, though.

The thing I dislike about the Grunty Industries experience is that the level design seems to go in the opposite direction of what it is up until that point... even in Atlantis, which I disliked at times because of this, there was some leeway to explore. In Grunty Industries, there's none. Either find a way to unlock every passage, elevator and entryway before you do anything or have fun doing laps around it for hours. I mean, look at all my previous Totals screenshots. Most levels so far took me about an hour... Grunty Industries took almost three.

I confess I had to look up online to find the last of the four batteries, though... the ones for the first and second floors are okay, but the one for the last floor seems to have been dropped in a completely unrelated location. Really counter-intuitive, that one.

I'm trying to find as many collectibles as I can on the first run of each level, then I'll get the Stop'n Swop eggs and Dragon Kazooie and do one final backtracking roundup before going for Cauldron Keep.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

So, came back from Grunty Industries and... well...

To be honest, it wasn't nearly as bad as I remember. Still the worst level to me, though.

The thing with GI is that the level forces you to do things in a certain way - at least for the first few Jiggies. When you first arrive, the front door is locked, but you can access a switch that opens the train station. Meaning that if you skipped Old King Coal somehow, be ready for some backtracking.

Once you get inside via Chuffy, you can open the doors and proceed to navigating the structure. For the most part, it's the same deal for all five floors: find your way to the next floor via an alternative way (a window, an air vent or whatever), activate the teleporter and unlock the Elevator Shaft exit so you can return easily later.

Most of the level is sectioned and you can only explore the first floor freely at first. To make things a bit more strange, you need to collect batteries, unscrew... well, screws and press switches to open several passageways inside the factory. And to be clear: you need all of these open if you want every Jiggy.

Looking back, I can see not only why this level is hated... but also why DK64 is hated. That entire game felt like Grunty Industries, with everything divided into sections and the game seemingly punishing you for exploring at your own pace. If you don't know what you're doing (and believe me, kid Saurus had no idea what he was doing), you're going to get overwhelmed for sure.

To help me explain why... here are some highlights:

Grunty Industries Highlights

Spoiler: Spy-I-Cams and Tintops

Let me start by saying that these things can go to hell. They're all over the place, are annoying to defeat (especially in Clinker's Cavern) block important passageways, just like the octopi in Atlantis and serve no other purpose than interrupt your progress through the level.

You need to shoot the camera to temporarily disable the Tintops from spawning, but sometimes they are positioned in such an awkward angle that this simply isn't possible. And I don't understand why they made the alarm activate even if you're Washer Banjo, when not only should you not qualify as an intruder (I mean, you're using the Service Elevator after all), but you also have no means of defending yourself from these things.

At least, unlike the octopi, you can simply run away from the Tintops. Doesn't make them less annoying, tough.

Spoiler: Elevator Shaft and Service Elevator

You don't exactly do anything in the Elevator Shaft, but you do a lot with it. Each door aside from the first floor's is closed when you first arrive, so you need to actually explore each floor and find the door leading to the Shaft in order to open it. Usually, getting to the next floor involves a Shock Jump Pad or the Claw Clamber Boots, so look out for those.

The Service Elevator can only be accessed by Washer Banjo, along with a few marked doors. This is important because Washer Banjo, like the Daddy T-Rex, can't use the teleporter pads.

If you want to fully explore this place, you'll need all the possible entryways to every floor unlocked. These are two of the features that I feel contribute a lot to people's general frustration with this level, as it feels like every little room is cordoned off. And when you factor in the batteries, screws and the Emergency Exit... not a good start for most players. Speaking of...

Spoiler: Bazza! Batteries and Screws

There are four doors in Grunty Industries that need batteries to open. Said batteries are... all over the place, really. You need the Taxi pack to get each one, then navigate all the way back to the door and use it. Combined with the things said above, it feels like you're unlocking doors to unlock other doors sometimes.

The Screws are equally important, as you can't use one of Mumbo's pads (which opens the way to the boss), complete the worker rabbit quest and access certain corridors without unscrewing them. The way it works is this: if an object needs unscrewing, the bolts are always on the floor directly above it. This means you need a bit of map awareness in order to find exactly the ones you're looking for. Thankfully, the factory has signs for everything, so remember where the rooms are. Always.

Spoiler: Washer Banjo

An interesting transformation. You can only get into certain doors with Washer Banjo (including one that houses a Jiggy) and it's needed to press a switch that unlocks the way to the boss. But the most important quest here is finding the worker rabbits and washing their clothes, which... was a lot less trouble than I remembered, honestly. Whenever you pass a rabbit, try to memorize where they are. Then, after you open all doors and passages, try doing this quest. It's way easier than I think a lot of people perceive it.

The only thing preventing Washer Banjo in being more instrumental for navigating Grunty Industries is the lack of a good jump. So, once more, it feels like the level is deliberately preventing you from exploring at your own pace.

Spoiler: EMP

Many people find this spell a chore, but I find it interesting. Once you use a Mumbo pad, he disables the machinery in the area for a few seconds. You then need to switch back to the bear and bird, go back to that same area and do what you need to do. This is required to unlock the way to the boss, as well as the 4th Floor elevator door, the Quality Control minigame and Clinker's Cavern.

For once, alternating between the characters repeatedly feels like it has a purpose, while seeming like a natural thing to do. Seems like Rare learned from their mistakes with DK64 a year before, at least when it comes to this.

Spoiler: Weldar

Not going to lie: he gave me hell as a child, especially the part where he electrifies the floor. But now, he seemed a lot easier (though still a bit tougher than the other bosses so far). Weldar also seems to be one of the few bosses with an unlocking requirement (using Mumbo to disable a magnet, then pressing a switch with Washer Banjo). Another unique thing is that you don't get his Jiggy right away after you win, instead opening a pathway to it.

The trick is to distance yourself a bit, but not by much, so that you're just in range when he starts his suction attack. It's really obvious what you need to do in this fight, too. The camera doesn't help one bit, but try to lock the view on Weldar whenever you have the chance.

"How about some nuts and bolts?" hasn't aged well, though.

Spoiler: Packing Room, Quality Control and Clinker's Cavern

The three minigames of this place.

Packing Room needs a battery to be accessed and has you collecting Twinklies again, but this time you have to deliver them to colored doors. It's possible to enter the minigame with only Banjo and leave Kazooie out, but I certainly wouldn't reccommend it, because you lose access to the Running Shoes then. Really easy minigame, just be mindful of how many Twinklies you're carrying because it slows you down.

Quality Control is a sort of shooting gallery where you need to shoot only the blue Rareware barrels with grenade eggs. If you shoot a green one instead, the room is filled with toxic gas, forcing you to go back to Cable Room and clean it by pressing a switch. Just try to predict the movement of the drums, not much to say. I'm far more interested in the Cable Room, actually. It needs a battery to unlock and seems way too elaborate for a room you're just supposed to pass through... hmm, do I smell cut content?

Finally, Clinker's Cavern is basically Ordnance Storage part two. It's harder and has a more strict time limit, but at least you can locate the Clinkers based on the, uh, sounds they make.

All in all, I remembered why this level is so disliked. It basically takes nearly all elements of exploration and world interaction and basically does away with them, opting to cut your path off in different ways. Still, it wasn't as bad as it felt ten years ago. I thought I wouldn't be able to get even half of the collectibles on my first visit, but here we are.

Spoiler: Grunty Industries Totals

View attachment 232319

Next time... I'll be between a hot and cold place... let's see if that one remains my third favorite world of Tooie.

The Tintops are annoying, but can be easily dispatched with the Wonderwing or Grenade Eggs.

 

[3BitSaurus]

The Tintops are annoying, but can be easily dispatched with the Wonderwing or Grenade Eggs.

Not on Clinker's Cavern, though. Ammo is too limited and the space is narrow, so it's easy to blow yourself up.

Plus, there's the issue of the cameras you need to destroy being in awkward positions and the Tintops appearing even as Washer Banjo (you can't kill them with the underwear. I tried.)

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Not on Clinker's Csvern, though. Ammo is too limited and the space is narrow, so it's easy to blow yourself up.

Plus, there's the issue of the cameras you need to destroy being in awkward positions and the Tintops appearing even as Washer Banjo (you can't kill them with the underwear. I tried.)

Unless you have the Nestking cheat code on. It gives you infinite eggs and feathers. Plus, try the Super Banjo cheat, it doubles Banjo & Kazooie's running speed (and works on Mumbo too.)

 

[3BitSaurus]

Unless you have the Nestking cheat code on. It gives you infinite eggs and feathers. Plus, try the Super Banjo cheat, it doubles Banjo & Kazooie's running speed (and works on Mumbo too.)

Yeah, that's the thing, I'm trying to do a cheatless run to gauge stuff more accurately. It's my first run in 10 years after all, so I want to fully experience the normal game before having fun with cheats.

The closest I'll get to that is Dragon Kazooie.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Yeah, that's the thing, I'm trying to do a cheatless run to gauge stuff more accurately. It's my first run in 10 years after all, so I want to fully experience the normal game before having fun with cheats.

The closest I'll get to that is Dragon Kazooie.

Ah. OK. Then for an extra challenge, try Super Baddy. This cheat doubles the speed of enemies and bosses.

 

[TheZoologist]

Yeah, that's the thing, I'm trying to do a cheatless run to gauge stuff more accurately. It's my first run in 10 years after all, so I want to fully experience the normal game before having fun with cheats.

The closest I'll get to that is Dragon Kazooie.

Good on you! I prefer playing with cheats on Banjo-Tooie for a more fun and leisurely stroll through the Isle of Hags but I admire anyone who plays the game cheat-less. Part of the reason why I got ****ed off at the XBLA versions of Banjo-Kazooie and Banjo-Tooie was them gatekeeping using cheats because of 'achievements' and such which I could care less about. I just wanna play the games the way I want, and since the cheats were literally programmed in the game by the developers themselves, I don't people should be faulted for wanting to use them. As long as its a single-player experience, play the game the way you want.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Good on you! I prefer playing with cheats on Banjo-Tooie for a more fun and leisurely stroll through the Isle of Hags but I admire anyone who plays the game cheat-less. Part of the reason why I got ****ed off at the XBLA versions of Banjo-Kazooie and Banjo-Tooie was them gatekeeping using cheats because of 'achievements' and such which I could care less about. I just wanna play the games the way I want, and since the cheats were literally programmed in the game by the developers themselves, I don't people should be faulted for wanting to use them. As long as its a single-player experience, play the game the way you want.

Yeah, I always used Super Banjo and Fallproof. I also sometimes switched Nestking on and off, but kept the Eggs and Feathers cheats on to double my supply. Super Banjo is great, especially with Kazooie, as she moves almost as fast as the Roadrunner.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Good on you! I prefer playing with cheats on Banjo-Tooie for a more fun and leisurely stroll through the Isle of Hags but I admire anyone who plays the game cheat-less. Part of the reason why I got ****ed off at the XBLA versions of Banjo-Kazooie and Banjo-Tooie was them gatekeeping using cheats because of 'achievements' and such which I could care less about. I just wanna play the games the way I want, and since the cheats were literally programmed in the game by the developers themselves, I don't people should be faulted for wanting to use them. As long as its a single-player experience, play the game the way you want.

Eh, I hardly see Banjo-Kazooie games as a "challenge run" or anything like that. It's more so that I can be more accurate in my judgment, especially game-design-wise when I make my posts. Can't exactly do that if I have infinite ammo or can't die, right?

I will admit to being a bit of a tryhard when it comes to difficulty, though. I'm one of those people who likes playing hard games when they're stressed. For some reason.

Cheats and such are great for having fun post game (especially the "Big head/Small head" type) and Tooie should be an accessible game, but for other games, having them readily available kinda ruins my experience. I remember how frustrated I was when I cleared Celeste and found out about the Assist Mode and the fact that some special collectibles can only be reached when you use it.

Like... what was the point then? Why did I spend hours playing a game about getting over barriers, especially the ones you impose on yourself, if I could have just cheated my way through?

In Banjo games, at least you have to put in some work to get the cheats in the first place... which I feel is a great solution. It's not like Cheat Pages are too hard to get, and you can always find the code online, but still need to unlock the Code Chamber and input it manually.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

I just checked the eShop. It still doesn't have the Hero listed! Still says: Fighter Pack 2 and release date is still 2/29/20!

What's taking so stupid long?!?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I just checked the eShop. It still doesn't have the Hero listed! Still says: Fighter Pack 2 and release date is still 2/29/20!

What's taking so stupid long?!?

He'll be done when he's done, and properly.

Spoiler

No offense, but the expectation of instant gratification is starting to get annoying.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

He'll be done when he's done, and properly.

Spoiler

View attachment 232370

No offense, but the expectation of instant gratification is starting to get annoying.

But he should have been out already! Did Nintendo forget or something?! I am getting tired of waiting!

And they better not take this long with Banjo & Kazooie! Would be rude!

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

But he should have been out already! Did Nintendo forget or something?! I am getting tired of waiting!

It's just a placeholder date, no big deal. I'm patiently waiting in the meantime.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

It's just a placeholder date, no big deal. I'm patiently waiting in the meantime.

Not the date! They said Summer 2019! And Summer is over in one month! They better not delay Banjo. It would make me so mad!

 

[Strong Badam]

Yeah, that's the thing, I'm trying to do a cheatless run to gauge stuff more accurately. It's my first run in 10 years after all, so I want to fully experience the normal game before having fun with cheats.

The closest I'll get to that is Dragon Kazooie.

I always get Dragon Kazooie on my runs. Never really cared much for the cheato page cheats, but I always get all of the cheato pages regardless. I'm a 100%er when it comes to Banjo games.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Not the date! They said Summer 2019! And Summer is over in one month! They better not delay Banjo. It would make me so mad!

I'm pretty sure Summer only lasts until late September, but okay.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

I'm pretty sure Summer only lasts until late September, but okay.

Thought September was the fall?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Thought September was the fall?

It officially starts on the 23rd of the month, at least depending on the region that one lives in.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

It officially starts on the 23rd of the month, at least depending on the region that one lives in.

-_- So you mean to say, that they could wait till September to release the Hero, and actually delay Banjo's return to Winter?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

-_- So you mean to say, that they could wait till September to release the Hero, and actually delay Banjo's return to Winter?

...No. Let's not exaggerate things like that.

Let's just wait for EVO to blow over before assuming the worst.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

...No. Let's not exaggerate things like that.

Let's just wait for EVO to blow over before assuming the worst.

That isn't helping!

 

[Daniel2210]

I don't mind the long development times. It just means they're putting more work into the characters and they'll look even better than they did in their trailers. I thought Banjo looked great, and I'm happy they will have spent at least another 3 months after his reveal trailer working on him and making him even better.

 

[TheZoologist]

...No. Let's not exaggerate things like that.

Let's just wait for EVO to blow over before assuming the worst.

Don't mind him, he's on the spectrum and probably just anxious. I'm with you though, I'm just patiently waiting out for the Hero to show up. I'm personally excited to see what they bring to the table gameplay-wise. And don't be so anxious, friend-o! Banjo & Kazooie are confirmed! After years of anxiously waiting for nothing, we finally have confirmation! I can wait a little longer. The fall isn't more than a few months away and I've got plenty to be excited about before even Banjo & Kazooie show up for Smash! New episodes of It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, DuckTales, and My Hero Academia, the Steven Universe Movie, and Halloween, of course! This might be my favorite season of Autumn this upcoming year <3

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Don't mind him, he's on the spectrum and probably just anxious. I'm with you though, I'm just patiently waiting out for the Hero to show up. I'm personally excited to see what they bring to the table gameplay-wise. And don't be so anxious, friend-o! Banjo & Kazooie are confirmed! After years of anxiously waiting for nothing, we finally have confirmation! I can wait a little longer. The fall isn't more than a few months away and I've got plenty to be excited about before even Banjo & Kazooie show up for Smash! New episodes of It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, DuckTales, and My Hero Academia, the Steven Universe Movie, and Halloween, of course! This might be my favorite season of Autumn this upcoming year <3

Well, they took till April to drop Joker. Who is to say they aren't going to wait till November to drop Banjo?! If they're taking this stupid long!

Sorry. Just worried they'll delay Banjo to Winter.

 

[3BitSaurus]

...No. Let's not exaggerate things like that.

Let's just wait for EVO to blow over before assuming the worst.

I don't think anything will happen at EVO. But if it does, I'll be happy too.

I don't mind the long development times. It just means they're putting more work into the characters and they'll look even better than they did in their trailers. I thought Banjo looked great, and I'm happy they will have spent at least another 3 months after his reveal trailer working on him and making him even better.

I don't think there's that much work left for Hero, based on the E3 trailer... if not this week, he might release the next.

We always knew Banjo and Kazooie would come in fall, so that means at least late September. Let's hope they come with a lot of stuff in the meantime.

What I am curious about, though, is if fighter number 4 is already being worked on. Probably, since Joker, Hero and Banjo were all being done at the same time, according to a tweet from Sakurai.

Don't mind him, he's on the spectrum and probably just anxious. I'm with you though, I'm just patiently waiting out for the Hero to show up. I'm personally excited to see what they bring to the table gameplay-wise. And don't be so anxious, friend-o! Banjo & Kazooie are confirmed! After years of anxiously waiting for nothing, we finally have confirmation! I can wait a little longer. The fall isn't more than a few months away and I've got plenty to be excited about before even Banjo & Kazooie show up for Smash! New episodes of It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, DuckTales, and My Hero Academia, the Steven Universe Movie, and Halloween, of course! This might be my favorite season of Autumn this upcoming year <3

Between Banjo reuniting with Donkey and Diddy and Donald reuniting with Panchito and José, the nostalgia has been running high for me these past few months.

 

[UnknownJ25]

I don't know who's worse at announcing fighter dates. Nintendo with Smash or Netherrealm with MK11.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I don't know who's worse at announcing fighter dates. Nintendo with Smash or Netherrealm with MK11.

Had you not included "fighter" in your sentence, I would have said Atlus.

I mean, Square can hold information for years on end too, but... at least they don't make announcements of an announcement.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

I don't know who's worse at announcing fighter dates. Nintendo with Smash or Netherrealm with MK11.

Nintendo.

 

[ze9]

I'm all for being patient, but the fighter pass is really starting to drag.
They announced it back on november 1st, and now, 9 months later, we still only have and. 2/6 characters. I guess the Hero will come around EVO, so in the next 14 days, but still, that's some weird pacing. The last 3 character will have to come out in pretty quick succession, if they want to finish it before next march.
I can only imagine how slow september and october will feel, since we will be waiting directly for Banjo then...

 

[Llort A. Ton]

I'm fine with waiting for Banjo as of now. Now that I know that he's in, I'm resting easy knowing that by the end of the year I will be maining him and Kazooie. No more what ifs and no more Steve VS Banjo ****posting makes everything a lot calmer.