Bad Idea Mafia 4! Game Over, Scum Wins!

[Clownbot]

Gheb, you're acting as if there hasn't been reasoning for people finding Lux suspicious. Do you just think the reasoning that's been provided isn't sufficient?

 

[Clownbot]

Red Ryu isn't helping my town read on Seph, but for the time being my stance remains. I'm a bit mystified by people finding the suspicion on him legitimate (and until Kuz said otherwise, I thought the people pushing for him were doing so because of inactivity). I can't really articulate it well, but it's akin to the reason I had a town read on Gova.

Ryker, I imagine you're not in the mood to negotiate, but since you think Vocal is the Godfather would you settle for having Red Ryu shoot toDay?

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

No. I'd rather have a psuedo cleared Summoner.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

That post on Luxor doesn't clear him for me. And I haven't seem scum Luxor, that is meta I don't know but read wise I find that kind of defense to be lacking.

In a nutshell he pointed out inactives of fluffy town.

~

And I'm fine with Summoner shooting if he posts, I still want Clownbot or Luxor to do it more than him.

 

[SummonerAU]

I'll be making a post for sure when I get home from uni(8 hours or so) and if people want me to shoot at that time, I'll do it. I want to see if people have any questions of me. Right now though, I'm not focused enough on this to post anything about anyone. Had a quick skim of the last few pages though. First things that popped into my head from it.

Red Ryu, you mentioned you don't put all your cards on the table for scum to read, are you going to after what people have said about the matter?

Ranmaru is town? ****that****.png

 

[BSL]

why'd you think ranmaru was scum? just his read on Delv and subsequent ignoring of your questions?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Gheb, you're acting as if there hasn't been reasoning for people finding Lux suspicious. Do you just think the reasoning that's been provided isn't sufficient?

I'd say it's unremarkable enough for lots of people to not see any issues with it. If there actually *is* any reasoning behind it I seriously doubt it's actually sufficient though.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I may want to reconsider not laying my cards on the table. I didn't consider this day before lylo or equivalent to it in a sense. Let me think about this.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

While we're waiting for summoner ... somebody explain to me where suspicions against Luxor are coming from.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

Clown, be honest though, when has scum ever been so quick to dismiss themselves?

If you can provide a satisfying answer to that, then I'll be more likely to acceapt Lux being shot like you want.

 

[Clownbot]

Luxor is also scum because he has been playing a middle of the road type game that tries to make it seem as if he is actively contributing while not getting his hands dirty.

My reasoning is that he took an easy stance in saying that Gova was scummy, and then when I called Gova town and called out one of more of the people on his wagon as likely scum, he invited my post and said he "liked" it, almost as if trying subtly to convince us he wasn't afraid of the suspicion.

Luxor is also scummy as ****. I have him down for coasting and seeming like Ranmaru Jr

Might be more, this is what I could find from memory.

Clown, be honest though, when has scum ever been so quick to dismiss themselves?

If you can provide a satisfying answer to that, then I'll be more likely to acceapt Lux being shot like you want.

I don't know what you're asking but I suspect it's in the same vein as your previous post directed at the Lux suspicion, which to put it bluntly is bull****.

 

[SummonerAU]

I ended up missing my bus and spending another 2 hours getting home ans sleeping when I got back, sorry about that. Moving on...

@BSL: Pretty much BSL, he did not explain why he thought Delvro was scum at the time, instead just saying he was scum and moving on.

My top 2 picks would have to be Luxor and Sworddancer. I don't believe Red Ryu is scum and I would much rather shoot Luxor. I'll be doing the shooting sometime in the next 6 hours. Red Ryu, you should post your thoughts.

bah, I feel like I need to talk about a lot more. Shoot me some questions please.

 

[Luxor]

Shooting Luxor without discussion is bad, FYI.

 

[Luxor]

Or at least alert me before you positively definitely will shoot.

 

[SummonerAU]

nah, I wasn't serious about the 6 hour thing, I just wanted to make you post since I checked your psot history and you'd made some posts elsewhere recently

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Elaborate on not scum read for RR.

 

[SummonerAU]

I don't see Red Ryu's posts today as scummy and I didn't see Seph's posts (from memory) as particularly scummy either. Seph's posts in particular I just saw as someone who strongly thought voting was the way to go.

 

[BSL]

i thought seph was only viewed as scummy because he stuck around only for the beginning where mechanics were discussed.

iirc, nothing he said was scummy, it was just the fact that he left after mechanics were done.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Why is Luxor more scummy than Red Ruy/Seph who hasn't really put himself out to damn himself?

 

[Luxor]

nah, I wasn't serious about the 6 hour thing, I just wanted to make you post since I checked your psot history and you'd made some posts elsewhere recently

I believe I was just outplayed.

 

[SummonerAU]

Is that a trick question Ryker? I mean, if Red Ryu hasn't really "put himself out to damn himself" then he isn't going to be anything worse than null.

Luxor, do you have anything to say to the people who want you shot? Also, you said shooting you without discussion is bad, what do you want to discuss then? Another thing, if I only have two choices to shoot, you and Red Ryu, why should I shoot Red Ryu over you? (I don't want to see "because I'm town")

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Is that a trick question Ryker? I mean, if Red Ryu hasn't really "put himself out to damn himself" then he isn't going to be anything worse than null.

Luxor, do you have anything to say to the people who want you shot? Also, you said shooting you without discussion is bad, what do you want to discuss then? Another thing, if I only have two choices to shoot, you and Red Ryu, why should I shoot Red Ryu over you? (I don't want to see "because I'm town")

No it's not. You didn't find Seph's posts scummy, then he would be a null tell. Therefore there is something you have in Luxor's play that makes him worse than a null tell. What is it, specifically? It's the same thing you're asking Luxor about RR in your post.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

While we're waiting for summoner ... somebody explain to me where suspicions against Luxor are coming from.

Still want an answer to this even though we're not waiting for summoner anymore.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'd like to see Summoner answer my question before anyone answers your's, Gheb.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Kay

 

[SummonerAU]

Luxor was just weird around Ranmaru. While Ranmaru was alive, I don't recall Luxor commenting on why he was scummy. I realised I was a little sketchy over the details during that time peroid (since I only quickly read it when I got the time to) so I reread. Luxor ended up switching his views of Ranmaru from not shooting scum to godfather. Ran ended up asking about this and he didn't reply to it. Luxor also talked about shooting Ranmaru today because he was godfather. I get the feeling that Luxor knew how important today would be for town(just a feeling so YMMV) and this makes me think he's scum. Before this reread I only thought he was scummy because I thought he was weird during that peroid and didn't remember why I thought that. Luxor mentioned something about posting his reasons for thinking Ran is scum but I don't believe he ever did.

I also don't recall Luxor making a scum stance on someone who hasn't already been 'cleared' or flipped town, but this could just be a coincidence. I think he's been after July, Ran, Ryker and maybe Delvro.

Some kinda related thoughts:
I was thinking about what possible reason scum would prefer killing Ranmaru over BSL. I was thinking N1 that scum might think he's targetting Ryker or some dumb target and would prefer to kill someone else, but N2 they knew he was going to target Gheb. If I had to make a call on a GF right now, I would consider Gheb to say the least. I was thinking about why Luxor(assuming scum for this) would allow Ran to get shot if he was setting up a Ran shot for today, and I can only think of this scenario: Scum want the GF to get investigated by Cop to give them some town cred, Luxor got overruled by his team and they shot Ran instead (because giving us an extra 'clear' today is bad) and hoped to end the game tomorrow because it would be a lot harder for them after one of them got shot. Anyway, this is PURE SPECULATION that I wanted to get out if we make it to tomorrow and I end up being killed in the night (which could happen if I shoot the right person).

 

[Clownbot]

Elaborate on not scum read for RR.

Gheb, didn't you say earlier that you can't elaborate on not having a scum read on a certain person?

Still want an answer to this even though we're not waiting for summoner anymore.

You're either skimming or refusing to acknowledge my post, neither of which are good.

I'd like to see Summoner answer my question before anyone answers your's, Gheb.

-_____-

 

[July]

Luxor was just weird around Ranmaru. While Ranmaru was alive, I don't recall Luxor commenting on why he was scummy. I realised I was a little sketchy over the details during that time peroid (since I only quickly read it when I got the time to) so I reread. Luxor ended up switching his views of Ranmaru from not shooting scum to godfather. Ran ended up asking about this and he didn't reply to it. Luxor also talked about shooting Ranmaru today because he was godfather. I get the feeling that Luxor knew how important today would be for town(just a feeling so YMMV) and this makes me think he's scum. Before this reread I only thought he was scummy because I thought he was weird during that peroid and didn't remember why I thought that. Luxor mentioned something about posting his reasons for thinking Ran is scum but I don't believe he ever did.

I also don't recall Luxor making a scum stance on someone who hasn't already been 'cleared' or flipped town, but this could just be a coincidence. I think he's been after July, Ran, Ryker and maybe Delvro.

Some kinda related thoughts:
I was thinking about what possible reason scum would prefer killing Ranmaru over BSL. I was thinking N1 that scum might think he's targetting Ryker or some dumb target and would prefer to kill someone else, but N2 they knew he was going to target Gheb. If I had to make a call on a GF right now, I would consider Gheb to say the least. I was thinking about why Luxor(assuming scum for this) would allow Ran to get shot if he was setting up a Ran shot for today, and I can only think of this scenario: Scum want the GF to get investigated by Cop to give them some town cred, Luxor got overruled by his team and they shot Ran instead (because giving us an extra 'clear' today is bad) and hoped to end the game tomorrow because it would be a lot harder for them after one of them got shot. Anyway, this is PURE SPECULATION that I wanted to get out if we make it to tomorrow and I end up being killed in the night (which could happen if I shoot the right person).

I don't believe Luxor posted his Ran godfather idea partly because he took some heat yesterDay for godfather speculating and wanting to make a case against and shoot a semi-cleared instead of looking for nonshooters. You do have reasons against Luxor though, I do like that.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the second part about night actions wifom?

Also, Summoner, can you elaborate on your read on Swords as well? He is your #2 scumpick right?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Gheb, didn't you say earlier that you can't elaborate on not having a scum read on a certain person?

No, I definitely didn't use such absolute wording because I avoid doing so.

What I said was that you shouldn't elaborate on or point out town reads, if it isn't necessary. RR being one of the main suspects however is good enough reasoning for somebody to elaborate on why he thinks he is town.

You're either skimming or refusing to acknowledge my post, neither of which are good.

What do you mean by "good"? No, I didn't acknowledge your post and that's not a bad thing just because you yourself don't like it.

 

[Clownbot]

What do you mean by "good"?

I don't know what kind of answer you're expecting for this? It's not really something that can or needs to be elaborated.

No, I didn't acknowledge your post and that's not a bad thing just because you yourself don't like it.

Load of crock.

And you call people out on baseless statements.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

So somebody explain to me how Luxor is supposed to be scum?

 

[Clownbot]

Gheb, elaborate on the latter part of your #1549 to me. I'm really interested in what possessed you to say it.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

For me it's because Luxor hasn't committed much to town in terms bulk content.

I'm fine with people being brief or short like Gheb, I'm not when I don't feel like the content is good for helping town and feels like fluff.

He has brought forth some ideas, but he doesn't outright go to people unless they aren't cleared and doesn't pursue it much.

Based on Summoner's post I and the reasons he out worth, I view him as town, that being said I would like to test other people to shoot before him if this is the case. If town feels like he need sot be cleared then he can shoot.

I would like Clownbot to shoot today based on the recent posts and activity.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

Okay Summoner, I have two questions for you.

Summoner I want to know why you think I'm scummy?

What do you make of Vocal's/RR tunneling of Clown?

Going to drop my question to Clown since tbh I think him saying "it's bull****" is actually a good answer on reflection.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Gheb, elaborate on the latter part of your #1549 to me. I'm really interested in what possessed you to say it.

I don't trust you in the slightest. Other people should remind me how Luxor's scummy in their own words.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

@Gheb - He's not DOING anything. Everything he's been onto has been wrong and from my experience, that's a bad thing. I dunno, could be scum, but definitely not as bad as RR/Summoner or even Clownbot.

@Summoner - I don't give a rat's *** who the godfather is. I want to go the route that has the best chance of giving us a scum hit and that's to go after those who are cleared as not Godfather. Once those two are dead, there's absolutely no way to find the last scum outside of just plain scum hunting.

 

[Clownbot]

Gheb, I believe I misunderstood your 1549.

I don't trust you in the slightest. Other people should remind me how Luxor's scummy in their own words.

And they're doing just that. I also quoted people other than myself in my post with reasoning against Luxor. Is that invalid because I quoted it? Is any reasoning against Luxor going to be acceptable to you when you think I'm scum and he's a suspect of mine?

 

[Clownbot]

Ryu, specifically what recent activity has led you to the conclusion that I should shoot?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Summoner and Luxor...not sure if I want them to shoot as much as you. Summoner more so when I feel like he is town so I don't feel like I want to test him as much as your or Luxor, Luxor got a stronger scum read for me, I'd rather he not be holding the gun that shoot today.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

This game is slowing down and while I can't really introduce any new avenues of discussion I'd like to help it picking up speed again.

These are the remaining players:

BSL
Luxor
RedRuy
SummonerAU
Gheb
-Vocal-
Sworddancer.
July
Clownbot
Ryker

Ryker is unCC'd bomb, BSL is unCC'd cop so they are clear. BSL has an inno on July and myself so there's only a 1/10th chance for each of us to be scum so we are semi-clear...that leaves:

Luxor
RedRuy
SummonerAU
-Vocal-
Sworddancer.
Clownbot

For now I'm inclined to give +townie points to Sword and Clown for not letting the cleared players dominate discussion. That's something I could see mafia do in such a situation where we have a number of cleared / semi-cleared players.
While I don't agree that Luxor is scummy, I agree that he's been passive enough to make a reasonable shooter toDay. Him shooting one of Vocal, Summoner or RR is the ideal course of action in my eyes.

Ryu just strikes me as scummy. Seph has been allowed to live under the pretext that he's not been scummy [which I disagree with anyway] but "only inactive". Now that he's been replaced I don't see the input from Ryu either other than shallow and brief points on whom he thinks should be shot.
Similar things apply to Summoner as well, except that he managed to pseudo-prod dodge his way out of being replaced. How long are we supposed to tolerate this? His recent posts mainly justify his stances on Luxor [which is fine] and Seph / Ryu being alive. Even if you post more now I'm not fine with the input atm.

As for Vocal, I don't like how he got quiet recently, right when Summoner shows up somebody else "disappears". Contribute something substantial or else I can't get rid of the feeling that you are soft-coasting.