Bad Idea Mafia 4! Game Over, Scum Wins!

[BSL]

the way you describe your "gunning for Sworddancer" sounds like OMGUS.

 

[Xivii]

@Gova: Same difference...

Anyways 1 scum godfather down. Moving on.

Gova, stances on Kuz, Ryker, and someone you haven't given a stance on of your choice that's not me or you?

Clown: I can hardly remember any of your stances other than bsl. Can you reiterate [sp]?

July: You said Vocal had an accurate analysis on Kuz' play. Were you thinking this before? Or did Vocal bring it to your attention?

Luxor: Stop being lazy. Play like you did d1 of FE. That's when you were actually playing the game. I love your ISOs. You should do some on people you feel need looking into.

@mod: Can we request replacements & prods

Request status or something on Kirbyoshi

 

[th3kuzinator]

Gova is so anti-town right now I'd love to shoot him dead By continuing to rebel against a plan that the rest of us agree will bring at least marginally more stability to an unstable game, he divides opinions and hampers actual scum hunting because people keep focusing on arguing against him. Ignoring him will still leave him as anti-town because he doesn't seem to like co-operating with us, which is extremely frustrating as he could be town (not sure, he's pretty null to me right now). Wish I could slap him silly ir

*sigh*

At any rate, unless you are pursuing Gova as a scum read, I would please ask you all to direct your attention towards other matters. After reading this whole game it's pretty obvious that he won't be changing his stance because someone magically convinces him he is wrong; it's better to move on as best we can and try to focus on finding scum.l

First, what hes doing is not anti-town. Its the popular option and you perceive it as anti-town because you will receive less flak and more town points by agreeing with the option that a majority support.

Second, anti-town =/= scummy. Frankly, the ground which you state you want to shoot Gova with are bull**** and, if you think he is scummy enough to be shot, why are you dissuading others from focusing on him? Furthermore, why do you want to shoot him despite having a town read on him?

Sworddancer/Luxor/Vocal.

 

[th3kuzinator]

the way you describe your "gunning for Sworddancer" sounds like OMGUS.

Orly? I think the word you are looking for is tunneling.

Was his 298 a giant OMGUS post?

 

[th3kuzinator]

EBWOPS

Its the popular option

It goes against the popular option

why do you want to shoot him despite having a town read on him?

why do you want to shoot him despite having a null read on him?

 

[BSL]

Okay, I'm going to go on and shoot my **** and tell that my number 1 scum pick is Kuz.



Here, Kuz takes an unneccessarily rough position against me. All I did my previous post was call him out for two lines in his post that bugged me. Instead of asking for clarification as to why I called him out, he immediatly jumped to the other side of the fence, accusing me of being scum. Note how he leaves no room for me to be protrayed positively. He accuses me of focusing on fluff, but even if I did respond to every single part of his post, I would still be classified as "stubborn."

In short, my post did not call for such a response.



A bit more of the same from above.



Kuz seems to be trying to garner support here, but in the wrong way. It's kinda hard to explain, but something feels scummy about the whole "oh, well, we might disagree, but at least you're doing it better than scummy player x over there!" thing that Kuz pulls here. It's like he's trying to make me a common enemy between him and Luxor.



Most of this post is just an analysis. However, what bugs me about is how Kuz asks others if they noticed me doing a fake anaylsis. If he thinks I've been doing a fake anaylsis, then he should point it out himself. He shouldn't just subtly poke at this subject to see if it's okay to go after (which I kind of see him doing here).

So yeah, in summary, I feel Kuz is the scummiest person right now because he has came into this game being unnecessarily antagonistic. His play also feels off in the sense that he's trying to garner support but in the wrong ways ("you're play is better than his play," and "has anyone else noticed him doing this?").

---

Zen, forgive me if I missed it but what leads you to the conclusion that Gova is scummy? How have you've differentiated that this is scum Gova and not just stubborn town Gova? Summoner already asked Seph this question, but I want your response to it.

July, some have said to you this game that you're obv. town, but if you ask me you're playing a pretty "backseat" game so far. Tell me, what are you're thoughts on (and this is a semi-random pick) Ryker?

Off to my tourny now.

Orly? I think the word you are looking for is tunneling.

Was his 298 a giant OMGUS post?

i just made a quick comment before i went back to reread. thar ya go.

 

[BSL]

afa;ishg;oas what the heck, my post got ruined

 

[th3kuzinator]

So...you quoted it for me.

I am perfectly capable of finding it myself, I want to know your thoughs on it, hence me asking you.

 

[BSL]

All I did my previous post was call him out for two lines in his post that bugged me.

not true. you actually voted him.

Instead of asking for clarification as to why I called him out, he immediatly jumped to the other side of the fence, accusing me of being scum.

you mean clarification as to why you voted him? dont you think it needs a clarification?

we've discussed this. voting without clarification is bad.

 

[BSL]

sworddancer is scummier than kuz, imo.

 

[Xivii]

Kuz: Gova is scum because he is taking a stance without reasoning. He was trying to be cool and stuff with his "vote counts are dumb" but ****ed up. I imagine he had it in his mind that disagreeing with the common opinion would make him look town who isn't afraid of anything when he made that post. But then he actually had to explain why. The thing is though, his reasons are bs. It's not a matter of different views in mechanics, it's a matter of logical reasoning. After making such a screw up, Gova had no choice but tobhold strong to his position. Scum often make the mistake that intransigency is a way to be town, when really it's a scumtell. Gova is arguing his position and against the points I have made against his irrational reasoning without any will to fold over and admit to being wrong. Not one thing. Even though I've shown that his points are invalid.

This, vocal and Kuz, is what makes Gova scum. Not the fact that his argument is the anti-town position, but for his refusal to see admit to fallicy when it is so clearly there.

 

[Xivii]

to hold*

 

[Gova]

Really Zen? In a currently ongoing game you said that you beleive it is better for PR's to claim straight away instead of wasting time to get them to L-1. That's kinda the same thing I'm doing here, I don't think vote counts are necessary and I said why. Speaking of claiming, with regards to your interaction Summoner, do you beleive bombs should claim now, or when they're about to be shot? I don't remember what you said about that.

As for your reads, Kuz and Ryker are most likely town imo. As for the third, uh, I guess July can be town too.

 

[Xivii]

Inactive: Kirbyoshi
Scummiest: Gova, bsl, Kuz,
Scummy: July, Luxor
Need more: Summoner, Clown, Sword, Vocal
Town read: Delvro (Want more though).
Town: Seph, Ryker

 

[Xivii]

Really Zen? In a currently ongoing game you said that you beleive it is better for PR's to claim straight away instead of wasting time to get them to L-1. That's kinda the same thing I'm doing here, I don't think vote counts are necessary and I said why. Speaking of claiming, with regards to your interaction Summoner, do you beleive bombs should claim now, or when they're about to be shot? I don't remember what you said about that.

As for your reads, Kuz and Ryker are most likely town imo. As for the third, uh, I guess July can be town too.

That's not the same thing at all o_O........

And now that you bring it up, yes I do the the one and only bomb should claim. I haven't brought it up because I haven't felt like arguing for it.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Zen, why can I be wrong and be egocentric (one word) and Gova can be wrong and be scum?

Kirbyo is inactive everywhere. Request Prod/Replace

 

[BSL]

can you rewrite that second to last sentence?

 

[BSL]

@zen, not ryker

 

[Luxor]

Luxor: Stop being lazy. Play like you did d1 of FE. That's when you were actually playing the game. I love your ISOs. You should do some on people you feel need looking into.

To be fair I was equally lazy and equally scummy at the start of Day 1 in FE, lol. I'll have more time after I take my big chemistry test today, though.

And now that you bring it up, yes I do the the one and only bomb should claim. I haven't brought it up because I haven't felt like arguing for it.

Are you saying bombs should claim? Because they shouldn't- it's easy for scum to fakeclaim and then it gets messy. Maybe if we got every "bomb" to claim and had cops check them, but in any case bombs should never claim one at a time.

 

[Xivii]

Zen, why can I be wrong and be egocentric (one word) and Gova can be wrong and be scum?

Kirbyo is inactive everywhere. Request Prod/Replace

You two aren't arguing the same thing. Your argument is that you think you have superior judgement and thus refuse to listen to others reads and go off your own. While this is an anti-town position, it is totally logical.

Gova reasoning is that the vote count brings factors into the game so he wont use it. However such factors exist WITHOUT the vote count (which he agrees to). So his reasons for not using the count are invalid. It's not that hus view is anti-town (which it is), it's that his reasoning is illogical.

Thus fake. He is now making up newer reasons that he did not have before that still don't make sense: "not having vote counts means people don't have to be at L-1 to claim"

like seriously lolwut

 

[th3kuzinator]

@Luxor, What, you're not going to respond to me calling you scum?

That hurts

 

[Luxor]

You called me scum?

 

[Xivii]

Am I mistaken that there is only one bomb or am I the only one that read the OP?

 

[Luxor]

Sworddancer/Luxor/Vocal.

If you're talking about this, I'm not sure how to respond to it except by saying "I'm not scum."

 

[th3kuzinator]

There is one bomb and there is one cop, yes. Why does that warrant a bomb claim?

 

[Xivii]

can you rewrite that second to last sentence?

That's not the same thing at all o_O........

And now that you bring it up, yes I do think the one and only bomb should claim. I haven't brought it up because I haven't felt like arguing for it.

Bettah ?

 

[th3kuzinator]

If you're talking about this, I'm not sure how to respond to it except by saying "I'm not scum."

Luxor is also scum because he has been playing a middle of the road type game that tries to make it seem as if he is actively contributing while not getting his hands dirty.

Was that so hard to find? Nah.

 

[Gova]

You two aren't arguing the same thing. Your argument is that you think you have superior judgement and thus refuse to listen to others reads and go off your own. While this is an anti-town position, it is totally logical.

Gova reasoning is that the vote count brings factors into the game so he wont use it. However such factors exist WITHOUT the vote count (which he agrees to). So his reasons for not using the count are invalid. It's not that hus view is anti-town (which it is), it's that his reasoning is illogical.

Thus fake. He is now making up newer reasons that he did not have before that still don't make sense: "not having vote counts means people don't have to be at L-1 to claim"

like seriously lolwut

You do realise things can have multiple factors right? There are certain aspects that I think we could do without and I've explained that.

Show the bolded.

I also, disagree with you about the bomb claiming. While it does give us a clear, it allows scum to end the game a day early I think. I haven't checked the math. I'd rather have the bomb be NK'ed.

 

[BSL]

Bettah ?

yeah. i wasnt able to tell if you were for or against the bomb claim. i thought you were for it, but it was a tad bit unclear.


not to address it.

i dont think bombs should claim. in fact, bomb claiming is something that should wait until "L-1" like anything else. if bomb doesnt claim, there's a chance that bomb gets NK'd, which would benefit town a lot.

if we have bomb claim now, then multiple people could claim bomb, and then how do we figure out who is telling the truth? investigate them one by one? it sets up for more chaos and confusion.

and of course, if bomb claims, then mafia will know who the bomb is and simply save them for the LYLO/MYLO or whatever it would be.

 

[BSL]

ebwop: now** to address it.

 

[Luxor]

Was that so hard to find? Nah.

Forgot about that part, I read it on the bus to school haha.
I'm playing fairly middle-of-the-road because I feel there's insufficient data to compute who's scummy. Summoner/Delvro/Vocal (with excuse, of course)/Kirbyoshi/etc. all haven't really said much meaningful stuff at all- in Kirbyoshi's case, literally nothing of importance at ALL. For now I'm trying to poke around and find little things. When I have a little more time I can take some meaningful actions.

I also, disagree with you about the bomb claiming. While it does give us a clear, it allows scum to end the game a day early I think. I haven't checked the math. I'd rather have the bomb be NK'ed.

Bombs don't claim because:
1. Scum claims bomb. No one shoots the "bomb." Scum lives. Bad.
2. Bomb claims bomb. Godfather daykills bomb. Two townies die. Bad.
3. If bomb doesn't claim bomb, bomb can get himself NK'ed and save a life. Good. This is a bomb's main goal (besides catching scum).

Kuz, back me up on bombs not claiming. You're against it, right?

 

[Gova]

Luxor, I just said I don't want bombs to claim. Why are you explaining my stance to me?

 

[BSL]

zen, why am i scummiest?

 

[Luxor]

Luxor, I just said I don't want bombs to claim. Why are you explaining my stance to me?

Meant that part @Zen, sorry.

 

[th3kuzinator]

1. Scum claims bomb. No one shoots the "bomb." Scum lives. Bad.
2. Bomb claims bomb. Godfather daykills bomb. Two townies die. Bad.
3. If bomb doesn't claim bomb, bomb can get himself NK'ed and save a life. Good. This is a bomb's main goal (besides catching scum).

1. Completely right assessment. I can't find any flaw with this at all. Scum, claim bomb for us and we won't CC you. Honest.
2. Only a problem at endgame, but yes.
3. Yes.

4. Scum will know NOT to nk the bomb and then have a higher chance of hitting cop and a 0% chance of NKing bomb.

Why do you need me to back you up on this again?

 

[Luxor]

Because Zen/Summoner think bombs should claim or something.

 

[-Vocal-]

<_<

If you truly re-read my posts you would see I have been gunning for Sworddancer. almost every post after he bothered opening his mouth to spout nonsense at me.

Luxor is also scum because he has been playing a middle of the road type game that tries to make it seem as if he is actively contributing while not getting his hands dirty.

I don't think what Swords did warrants as strong a reaction as you have given in response. It really just seems like OMGUS, as someone else said a few posts before this, and as soon as I started reading I called that out as seeming just as a farce to draw attention. It's flimsy reasoning, and the fact that you're sticking to it and trying to justify it instead of reconsidering your focus makes me even more suspicious of you.

First, what hes doing is not anti-town. Its the popular option and you perceive it as anti-town because you will receive less flak and more town points by agreeing with the option that a majority support.

Second, anti-town =/= scummy. Frankly, the ground which you state you want to shoot Gova with are bull**** and, if you think he is scummy enough to be shot, why are you dissuading others from focusing on him? Furthermore, why do you want to shoot him despite having a town read on him?

Sworddancer/Luxor/Vocal.

1) Distracting the town away from meaningful conversation is anti-town. Gova's play all day has been arguing about the voting mechanism, which has distracted town away from meaningful scum discussion (aside from those who believe his stance makes him scum/is scummy).

2) The reason I said I wanted to shoot him is because then I wouldn't have to play with him It was not declaring him to be scum, only stating a distaste for his playstyle.

Kuz remains my vote for shootee. BSL is a possible vote for shooter, but we'll see where the day goes from here.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Yeah and you needed my help why?

I still responded because I felt like being sarcastic with point 1.

 

[-Vocal-]

Also, I never said I have a town read on Gova - I said I have a nulltell.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Hmmmmmm

Zen, I don't think you're crazy about bomb claiming anymore. I'm beginning to see the advantages of it.