Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[1PokeMastr]

But... Marth has nair that has like 9000 hits :o Gets me every single time.

Then.. try to shield grab the final hit of Nair ?
If they aren't spacing it properly/ retreating on the final hit ( Tipper gets grabbed too ) even Ganondorf ( Worst Standing Grab range in the game ) Can grab Marth.

And for a wall of Fairs, yeah, if they miss space it, grab the second one, or if they try to do a cross up and Fair so they land behind you. Turn around and grab them.
It really works wonders.

Sorry if what I have here is wrong.
I don't exactly have the best Marth.

 

[Kuro~]

Lol no. You CAN'T grab tipper nair. That's like...one of the most famous marth gimmicks ever. Bait the grab with tipper nair and tipper fsmash them for being ignorant.

 

[ScareMl]

that's only if marth does retreating nair. they can grab us if we nair into their shield

 

[Pierce7d]

naturally that means you should not nair into a shield.

You are now a better player.

 

[Kuro~]

that's only if marth does retreating nair. they can grab us if we nair into their shield

That's not tipper nair then....=.= he specifically said TIPPER lol

 

[Shaya]

But pierce, what about the ol aerial into their shield into a dolphin slash?

 

[Lord Chair]

I pity the fool who manages not to space a nair on a shield.

How do such jests even come about.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Lol no. You CAN'T grab tipper nair. That's like...one of the most famous marth gimmicks ever. Bait the grab with tipper nair and tipper fsmash them for being ignorant.

I think you missed the part where I mentioned the inability to properly space it or retreat it.

Also, What uses does F-Tilt have for us ?
I think it's under used to be honest, it almost auto tippers people above us on Platforms.

How good is it for a punishing ?

 

[C.J.]

It's for platform pressure and use as an anti-air tool.

 

[Kuro~]

No you don't understand that it literally can't be a TIPPER nair if their grabbing it which is what i'm saying...

I haven't found too much use for ftilt tbh. I use jab in it's place often.

 

[PEACE7]

Ftilt can cover options that we can normally cover with other moves as well like its good against Diddy's sideb, snake's nair it ***** in the marth ditto it has a fair amount of distance and it kills. Also great tool to use when someone is on a platform.

 

[1PokeMastr]

No you don't understand that it literally can't be a TIPPER nair if their grabbing it which is what i'm saying...

I haven't found too much use for ftilt tbh. I use jab in it's place often.

Actually, you can grab a tipper Nair if they don't retreat it.
I know what the Shield Hit lag on a Tipper Nair is.

You can grab a TIPPER Nair.

 

[Shaya]

did someone say wario bull **** power shield grab?

 

[1PokeMastr]

did someone say wario bull **** power shield grab?

No, just a Normal Grab, from anyone.


And wouldn't D3 be worse than Wario PSing and Grabbing ?

 

[Kuro~]

Actually, you can grab a tipper Nair if they don't retreat it.
I know what the Shield Hit lag on a Tipper Nair is.

You can grab a TIPPER Nair.

JAL;KSDJF;ALSKJF;LIASJF;LSKJFOAWIJFOIA;JSDFLKASJFAF

The LOCATION OF THE HITBOX OF THE TIPPER MEANS YOU LITERALLY CAN'T GRAB A TIPPER NAIR. lol.

 

[C.J.]

Oh my gosh. Shut up about this, seriously. This is the Marth boards- not Metagame discussion.

inb4DocKingandJebusandDrkPeachcomesinheretoprovemewrong

 

[Kuro~]

Lol i just get frustrated at small stuff like that

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

It would perhaps be clearer if specified which hitboxes in which scenarios this discussion refers to, i.e. the second hit of a ff nair as Marth lands, or something more specific.

 

[Pierce7d]

It seems I have not missed anything while I was ill. Carry on with the pointless discussion. I am amused.

 

[1PokeMastr]

As long as it's not retreated, and the second or forth hit Tippers a shield.
You can grab it, slow fallen or fast fallen.

 

[Jeos]

if you're a olimar main, probably (if you're slow enough to don't run/jump/dodge)

 

[Reizilla]

If I manage to get a jab lock, does Marth have enough time to short hop fast fall an uair that can connect into upsmash or nair or something, assuming they're at low enough percent.

 

[Kuro~]

If I manage to get a jab lock, does Marth have enough time to short hop fast fall an uair that can connect into upsmash or nair or something, assuming they're at low enough percent.

I'd imagine so. That's a bunch of frame data to look up to find out for sure but i'd imagine you'd have to time the upair the latest possible moment so you can hit them.

 

[Shaya]

You can start to ff 25 frames after you're in the air.
I don't know the data on how long you have on jab locks and stuff.

 

[Reizilla]

Smaaaaaaash laaaaaab.

 

[1PokeMastr]

You have approximately 30 frames of bounce animation + Characters get up animation.

 

[Reizilla]

So then 6 (jump) + 25 (rise) + 5(? up air) + however much ending lag jab has = doesn't work?

 

[Shaya]

Uair is 5 frames.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Or, we could just continue to jab lock them.
Then follow with a Tipper Fsmash.

 

[Reizilla]

Yeah, but I'm looking at damage racking here. And being flashy.

Just to clarify, it would be jump 6 and rise 25 frames, or just 25 frames? If not then it could potentially be frame perfect? xD

 

[Shaya]

Maximum hitstun you're looking at is 30 frames.
I forget how long it takes you to get back to the ground after you ff.

 

[Reizilla]

True. I'll go for it anyway and pull it off on some choke artist, one day.

 

[C.J.]

I believe NEO said that, from start to finish, SHFFuair is 55 frames.

Which seems weird.

 

[LooftWaffles]

Doesnt seem like it would work, only because they arent in a standing position. Youll have to jump, ff frame perfectly and then have uair hit someone whos grounded?

 

[Jeos]

he has to catch him bouncing or time it right when the get up invincibility ends

 

[Sylarius]

There's probably a section of the smashboards that details this, but whenever I go on the smashboards I link myself here and the IC thread <.<
Is there any way of decently recording Brawl replays that's convenient? I don't really know what to look for in stores or online for capture cards. I've heard about Dolphin but I'm not sure how to use it, I searched for a guide on it and it was way too complicated for me.

Personally right now I use my laptop camera which is crap, and the sound is desynched and low which is also crap. I can't stand loud music. Don't have a camera either, long story... So, any advice?

Uploading three replays soon in the critique thread once I have a method of recording other than using my laptop camera. Quality is horrible. :/

 

[ScareMl]

oh syl, i forgot to mention, there's a link here in swf where you can just give yoshq or somebody the replay files, and they'll upload it for you, free of charge. It's awesome, i can't believe i forgot to tell you that. I'm pretty sure they still do it.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=233863

 

[Kel]

What do you guys do against D3? It seems like my only safeish option is to slow-fall nair. Other than that it seems like a 50/50 mix up where D3 wins if he guesses correctly once.

I'm trying to full hop rising fair D3 like he's snake, but it seems to get me into trouble.

What do you guys recommend?

 

[Kuro~]

What do you guys do against D3? It seems like my only safeish option is to slow-fall nair. Other than that it seems like a 50/50 mix up where D3 wins if he guesses correctly once.

I'm trying to full hop rising fair D3 like he's snake, but it seems to get me into trouble.

What do you guys recommend?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=311118

 

[C.J.]

What do you guys do against D3? It seems like my only safeish option is to slow-fall nair. Other than that it seems like a 50/50 mix up where D3 wins if he guesses correctly once.

I'm trying to full hop rising fair D3 like he's snake, but it seems to get me into trouble.

What do you guys recommend?

FH fair is really good vs DDD, you just have to make sure you land safely. DDD isn't mobile enough to chase you so you just have to keep moving. Footstooling him to land is really helpful as well. Slowfall retreating nair is pretty much completely safe on shield so falling with that after FH fair should net you decent shield damage or shield poking if you're lucky to set something up.

Cross-ups work really well vs DDD, just for the love of Marth's unfortunately short life don't do it at kill %s. If you get utilted at 50% yeah, it hurts a bit; but now it's stale and you can adapt from there. Dying at 95% sucks though.

Walk away dtilt is really good vs DDD, just make sure you're not doing that into ftilt spam.

Walking in general is unbelievably important vs DDD.

I really hate using myself as an example, but I played the MU somewhat well in my MM vs 4GOD a couple months ago:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jn5b-fI1AW0

Some things I did very wrong, I was way more scared of ftilt than I should have been. My Dolphin Slashes were obviously stupid. Ignore the majority of the Shieldbreakers- I'm terrible and don't know how to input attacks apparently. Probably the biggest one is I didn't take full advantage of situations and apply all the pressure I could have.


Oh, and when he's offstage, after his second jump in the air, his jumps don't take him anywhere anymore. Just grab the ledge and force the upB and keep knocking him back out again.