Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[Thunder Of Zeus]

What are some options on the ledge? I just know ledge jump F-air or ledge jump U-air..... I'm a scrub lol

Here are the things I use:
*Abbreviations will be as follows: FD=Final Destination, BF=Battlefield, SV=Smashville, LD=Ledge Drop, N/U/D/F/Bair=Neutral-Air/Up-Air/Down-Air/Forward-Air/Back-Air, AH=Aerial Hop, SB=Shield Breaker, DS=Dolphin Slash, DB=Dancing Blade (Numbers will indicate the hit in the sequence and arrows will indicate the direction of the hit)
On FD:
LD>AH>Uair
LD>AH>Fair
LD>AH>Nair
LD>AH>DB1(>DS)
LD>DS
LD>AH>SB
LD>AH>DB1(>DB2>DB3>DB4)
LD>AH>Counter
You could also press R/L and roll
You could press toward the stage with your joystick to walk onto it
You should almost NEVER use the standard stage attack by pressing B
There are others but I have other matters to attend to.

Hi Marths. I'm hippie I play Marth in a scrub level, ask PD or Minty I lurk alot here.

I was wondering if any of you guys true pivot or fox trot (I get these terms mixed up heavily alot so excuse my nubiness) like you run pivot and do the fsmash. I read Junk's thread on it but I can't seem to do it mostly cause I end up doing a dash attack >_>. So any inputs Marths?

I Fox Trot Occassionally for a mindgame but I do Stutter Step Fsmash (if that's what you're referring to.)

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

@ hippie

I'm pretty sure I know what you're trying to say.

Whenever you mix up those fox trots with pivoting and stuff to ty to put in a fsmash in there, if you come out with a dash attack instead, it means that you inputted the fsmash too late. You have to do the fsmash ( i use cstick since the control stick is used for the fox trotting and stuff ) RIGHT after you input a dash. If you come out with a dash attack, it means you're doing it too late.


@ ToZ

Yeah I think he means stutter stepping, but he also means dashing randomly and pivoting and stuff... I think...

example:

(facing right)

right > right > left > pivot back to right immediately after turning left > left + fsmash (which is a backwards stutter step fsmash)

stuff like that

 

[Lord Chair]

Marths,

I have problems with my ledge game with me hanging on the edge, especially over 100%

Gaw dtilt clashes with 100%+ getup attack, dtilt beats ledge roll, ledgehops, and getups. Ledge jumps are demolished with his Nair.

Counter can be baited, and I'm not looking for something risky against G&W at 100%+.

 

[Angel.M <3 C:]

Marths,

I have problems with my ledge game with me hanging on the edge, especially over 100%

Gaw dtilt clashes with 100%+ getup attack, dtilt beats ledge roll, ledgehops, and getups. Ledge jumps are demolished with his Nair.

Counter can be baited, and I'm not looking for something risky against G&W at 100%+.

mix things up. I like ledge drop fairing til they get annoyed and move away. lol

 

[Lord Chair]

mix things up. I like ledge drop fairing til they get annoyed and move away. lol

Well spaced dtilt beats it

 

[Angel.M <3 C:]

Well spaced dtilt beats it

i don't mean fairing to the stage. I mean THROUGH the stage then up-bing back up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2RwBDowrY0
like at 0:07

Edit: that's not exactly how it's supposed to be done. but your supposed to fair drop. and it hits the tip of the stage then you up-b recover

 

[Lord Chair]

i don't mean fairing to the stage. I mean THROUGH the stage then up-bing back up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2RwBDowrY0
like at 0:07

Edit: that's not exactly how it's supposed to be done. but your supposed to fair drop. and it hits the tip of the stage then you up-b recover

I know about that and I use it, but it has in no way enough range.

As such, it doesn't really serve a purpose unless G&W is spacing the dtilt very stupidly.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

I know about that and I use it, but it has in no way enough range.

As such, it doesn't really serve a purpose unless G&W is spacing the dtilt very stupidly.

Have you tried ledge drop>air hop>nair? The range on nair is ridiculous. You could also try to hit him with a DS since it has invincibility frames at the beginning.

Plank??

 

[Megavitamins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvgKB4eAQPs

1:48-1:53

It's not what CHaos marth is talking about, but it still looks cool . And I know what you mean about ledge drop fair to stage spike edge guard, I've had some crazy gimps w/ that before lol.

Edit: Read Hippie's post. I use fox trot to dash dance...

Since you can do the dumb brawl dash dance (changing direction while going like half an inch in each direction), I input one dash, input another dash, then quickly change direction for a *dash dance* effect. Only time I really use it tbh. I never use true pivot lol

 

[Lord Chair]

Have you tried ledge drop>air hop>nair? The range on nair is ridiculous. You could also try to hit him with a DS since it has invincibility frames at the beginning.

Plank??

Nair gets through worse than fair, true story. Dolphin Slash is about the riskiest thing I could do, especially at high percentages.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Nair gets through worse than fair, true story. Dolphin Slash is about the riskiest thing I could do, especially at high percentages.

...plank??

 

[YUNq PHR3$H]

K I Don't Main Marth
But This Came To Mind When I Was Thinking
Which Is Better With Marth . .
FoxTrotting Or Pivot Walking And Why

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

K I Don't Main Marth
But This Came To Mind When I Was Thinking
Which Is Better With Marth . .
FoxTrotting Or Pivot Walking And Why

Pivot walking cause Mikehaze uses it.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Depends for what reason...

Fox trotting can be predictable since you move a certain interval each time, but you can pivot out of a fox trot to stutter step a fsmash or something if you want to bait you opponent and then punish with a fsmash or something...

Pivot walking is faster than fox trotting, and is more mobile because unlike fox trot, you can jump any time to perform an aerial or such. For punishing things/ baiting the opponent, a pivot walk + fsmash (since it gives fsmash a little slide) will give more "range" than a stutter stepped fsmash from a fox trot.


@ToZ Mikehaze uses it? Lol I haven't actually seen any of his videos yet, but that's cool... I thought no one actually used it XD

 

[Angel.M <3 C:]

Depends for what reason...

Fox trotting can be predictable since you move a certain interval each time, but you can pivot out of a fox trot to stutter step a fsmash or something if you want to bait you opponent and then punish with a fsmash or something...

Pivot walking is faster than fox trotting, and is more mobile because unlike fox trot, you can jump any time to perform an aerial or such. For punishing things/ baiting the opponent, a pivot walk + fsmash (since it gives fsmash a little slide) will give more "range" than a stutter stepped fsmash from a fox trot.


@ToZ Mikehaze uses it? Lol I haven't actually seen any of his videos yet, but that's cool... I thought no one actually used it XD

You NEED to see mikehaze. He's amazing. :D and this is coming from a east coast biased player.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Mikehaze is definitely my favorite Brawl Marth.

 

[LuLLo]

Hey people,
I picked up Marth a month or 3 ago, I've posted vids of me in the vid critique thread and have improved on the advices given, but now comes the next step: I've got a large tourney coming in the Netherlands on the 5th of July. I plan to go Marth mostly, along with my other mains Ike, Snake and occasionally Captain Falcon if I'm feeling confident.
But anyways, my question to you is:

Do you have any tips?

And by tips I mean Marth Specific tips, it's my first time playing against a large amount of people I've never played (in Brawl, been to Melee tourney), so are there any things you think I should keep in mind while playing Marth for the first time at a tourney? Or should I just play and see what it brings?

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Hey people,
I picked up Marth a month or 3 ago, I've posted vids of me in the vid critique thread and have improved on the advices given, but now comes the next step: I've got a large tourney coming in the Netherlands on the 5th of July. I plan to go Marth mostly, along with my other mains Ike, Snake and occasionally Captain Falcon if I'm feeling confident.
But anyways, my question to you is:

Do you have any tips?

And by tips I mean Marth Specific tips, it's my first time playing against a large amount of people I've never played (in Brawl, been to Melee tourney), so are there any things you think I should keep in mind while playing Marth for the first time at a tourney? Or should I just play and see what it brings?

Marth specific? I've never been to any official tourneys, but here's what I know for sure:
Don't sleep the night before. It's a Marth tradition.
Raid KFC during your break for lunch, if you have one.
When you use someone's move/combo/strategy: yell their name.
Oh, and lay off the C stick at high percents. People tend to do that and you could take 15-40% everytime you whiff a smash. DSOoS or space some aerials unless you're sure you've got a guarunteed smash.

k?

 

[Fizzle]

If it's your first tourney, don't go there expecting to win it. Try your hardest, of course, but focus more on improving your game. Tournies are the best place to get better and fix your mistakes. Get there early and play tons of friendlies. The more people you play the better you'll be next time.

Other than that, just swing your sword around and stuff and you'll do fine.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Lol yeah just work on getting as much experience from friendlies at the tourny as possible. This will be more worth it than worrying about trying to do well in the tourny.

A few things I can think of to keep in mind while playing Marth:

Remember, if you need a time during a match to calm down or think, then you can always "stall", not as in actually stalling, but simply doing things like not approaching the opponent or at least staying out of his range, or even planking with Marth's Up B (Marth is pretty good at planking).

Also, don't do any risky moves, and take your time, especially if it's a close match.

Be patient.

While the opponent is dead, you might want to just quickly practise some techniques, such as stutterstep a fsmash to get the timing right or trying one of the variations of DB to get the timing right for it. You can even go dash off the edge and do an immediate edge hog, to get the timing right (messing up a dash-edgehog during a match would be really really bad XD).

When hit by a multi-hit attack, rememeber to DI and SDI out of it, and don't just let it hit you. Remember to momentum cancel with fair whenever you're hit at a high percent, even if you think you would make it without it. It keeps you closer to the stage so you can land quicker, giving the opponent less time to keep you up, and also you may occasionally die from an attack that you may have thought you'd survive...

Make sure you know the tourney rules inside and out so things will go smoothly

@ToZ lol.
Yeah listen to ToZ, he's TOTALLY right.

Oh, and lay off the C stick at high percents. People tend to do that and you could take 15-40% everytime you whiff a smash. DSOoS or space some aerials unless you're sure you've got a guarunteed smash.

Unless, of course, you have, throughout the match, found that the opponent is very bad at dodging moves or makes very dumb moves... or just sucks against spammy smashes XD.

 

[Pleather]

This is just something I kinda found interesting, so I thought I'd mention it here.

Pretty much everyone knows about the triple jump glitch, which happens when you Up B to the ledge, then try to land back on the stage. Unless you auto cancel an aerial, you suffer quite a lot of landing lag; the landing lag that you previously bypassed by Up B'ing to the ledge, IIRC.

Anyways, I was experimenting with dancing blade stalls in training mode, to see how much distance you gain my doing DB1 right after a jump, and I came across what I believe to be another side effect of the triple jump glitch. I'm really not positive, but it seems like the only logical reason. I was doing this all on New Pork City, for maximum airtime, from that ledge up and to the left of the swinging ship, and down to the breakable bridge at the bottom. Numerous times, after DB1'ing, I would lose a very large amount of (horizontal) aerial mobility. It got to be a problem in my testing of DB1 stalls, so I decided to try and figure out what it was. After about 5 minutes, I was on the verge of giving up, when I decided to try out one last theory. And so far, it seemed to be correct. Whenever I would Up B to that ledge above the ship, and then jump right from the ledge, into the DB1 stalls, without landing anywhere, I would get that strange loss of horizontal mobility. However, if I Up B'ed to the ledge, and landed anywhere, and only then proceeded to DB1 stall on the way back down to the bridge, I would be able to maneuver in mid-air just fine.

It's really not important as far as I can tell, but it seems as if using the first slash of dancing blade on the way down, before suffering the triple jump glitch landing lag, will make the game give you the same horizontal aerial mobility that you would get if you were falling in the helpless state.

I just thought I would share this here, because if that isn't the reason for the loss of aerial mobility, I would like to figure out what it is, so that it doesn't happen to me in a match. I also thought it was kinda interesting. :].

 

[Wizard Of Seraphym]

huh.

that coupled with the ledge talk earlier reminded me of some wtf kills i've seen (they weren't with marths but still)

 

[Pleather]

huh.

that coupled with the ledge talk earlier reminded me of some wtf kills i've seen (they weren't with marths but still)

I don't know if you were talking about my post, but I realized that it's hard to explain anyways, so for anyone who doesn't get it, you can just try it for yourself; go to New Pork City in training mode, and up B to the ledge (which is marked by the red arrow below), then jump right from the ledge, without landing on anything, and jump, then DB1 (just like a normal dancing blade stall), and try to move horizontally in the air on your way down to the ground at the bottom.

Again, I'm still not sure if my explanation is right, and/or if you will get the same results as me.

 

[Wizard Of Seraphym]

oh i get it.

so you just fall strait down huh? could that kill you or do you grab the ledge on the way down?

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

This is just something I kinda found interesting, so I thought I'd mention it here.

Pretty much everyone knows about the triple jump glitch, which happens when you Up B to the ledge, then try to land back on the stage. Unless you auto cancel an aerial, you suffer quite a lot of landing lag; the landing lag that you previously bypassed by Up B'ing to the ledge, IIRC.

Anyways, I was experimenting with dancing blade stalls in training mode, to see how much distance you gain my doing DB1 right after a jump, and I came across what I believe to be another side effect of the triple jump glitch. I'm really not positive, but it seems like the only logical reason. I was doing this all on New Pork City, for maximum airtime, from that ledge up and to the left of the swinging ship, and down to the breakable bridge at the bottom. Numerous times, after DB1'ing, I would lose a very large amount of (horizontal) aerial mobility. It got to be a problem in my testing of DB1 stalls, so I decided to try and figure out what it was. After about 5 minutes, I was on the verge of giving up, when I decided to try out one last theory. And so far, it seemed to be correct. Whenever I would Up B to that ledge above the ship, and then jump right from the ledge, into the DB1 stalls, without landing anywhere, I would get that strange loss of horizontal mobility. However, if I Up B'ed to the ledge, and landed anywhere, and only then proceeded to DB1 stall on the way back down to the bridge, I would be able to maneuver in mid-air just fine.

It's really not important as far as I can tell, but it seems as if using the first slash of dancing blade on the way down, before suffering the triple jump glitch landing lag, will make the game give you the same horizontal aerial mobility that you would get if you were falling in the helpless state.

I just thought I would share this here, because if that isn't the reason for the loss of aerial mobility, I would like to figure out what it is, so that it doesn't happen to me in a match. I also thought it was kinda interesting. :].

I don't know if you were talking about my post, but I realized that it's hard to explain anyways, so for anyone who doesn't get it, you can just try it for yourself; go to New Pork City in training mode, and up B to the ledge (which is marked by the red arrow below), then jump right from the ledge, without landing on anything, and jump, then DB1 (just like a normal dancing blade stall), and try to move horizontally in the air on your way down to the ground at the bottom.

Again, I'm still not sure if my explanation is right, and/or if you will get the same results as me.

While I appreciate your contribution... You may want to clean up your post a bit. It's difficult to understand. The location is understood but the rest is shaky. Try using terms such as "aerial hop" for the second jump and "ledge jump" for pressing "Y" on the ledge and when you're performing DB (either on the ascension, descension or apex). Also simplify your post. While we appreciate the detail, simple and to-the-point is often better.
For example, if I was explaining how I spike I would say:
"Facing the middle of the stage, full hop>aerial hop(/footstool)>dair on the ascension>DS back onstage"
as opposed to:
"While standing look away from the edge, jump off of the stage and the line yourself up with the other character so you will hit them or footstool them when you jump. Then do a jump and down aerial them immediately. Move horizontally towards the stage with your joystick and press up and B to sweetspot the edge or get onstage."

Same thing, but more simple. Please understand, this isn't to belittle or insult you. This is just some help since you seem new around here =D

And don't be so formal. Most people don't even post with correct punctuation and full sentences. Loosen up a bit ^,^

AND!
Welcome to the Marth Boards. I hope you improve and have a good time here.

ANDDD!!!!!
dabuz

 

[Pleather]

Thunder of Zues, don't worry, constructive criticism is definitely appreciated, and I apologize for the long posts. On the whole formal thing, I get where you're coming from, and I recognize I'm often more formal than I really need to be. I thought about it, and I won't post any of the reasons here, just know that I do this on purpose, and do loosen up when I feel like it, it just isn't very often. :/.

Again, I apologize for being so unclear, as you can see, I'm still pretty new here, but I'll try to simplify my explanation a bit.

Okay, so;
DS up to the ledge marked by the red arrow
FH to the right
Second jump, and immediately after, DB1
then try moving around in the air, and notice how hard is to move horizontally

I hope that isn't over-simplified, but I think I did a pretty good job.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

No, formal posts make you look more intelligent XD.

Anyway, you did a good job explaining, a ton better than others, especially those with lower than 50 posts. Good English made it easy to read. But yeah like ToZ said, theres just a couple names you might want to change around to make it easier to understand.

I'll try this out for myself so I can understand it hands-on :D.


Thanks for the contribution.
And welcome to the Marf Boards!

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Thunder of Zues, don't worry, constructive criticism is definitely appreciated, and I apologize for the long posts. On the whole formal thing, I get where you're coming from, and I recognize I'm often more formal than I really need to be. I thought about it, and I won't post any of the reasons here, just know that I do this on purpose, and do loosen up when I feel like it, it just isn't very often. :/.

Again, I apologize for being so unclear, as you can see, I'm still pretty new here, but I'll try to simplify my explanation a bit.

Okay, so;
DS up to the ledge marked by the red arrow
FH to the right
Second jump, and immediately after, DB1
then try moving around in the air, and notice how hard is to move horizontally

I hope that isn't over-simplified, but I think I did a pretty good job.

If I recall corectly, it is the same principle that makes B moves ruin a momentum cancel. I'm sure Shaya knows more, because Shaya knows everything, but I usually don't need to move horizontally after DBs anyways since I'm either stalling Into a fair or ledge grab.

No, formal posts make you look more intelligent XD.

Anyway, you did a good job explaining, a ton better than others, especially those with lower than 50 posts. Good English made it easy to read. But yeah like ToZ said, theres just a couple names you might want to change around to make it easier to understand.

I'll try this out for myself so I can understand it hands-on :D.


Thanks for the contribution.
And welcome to the Marf Boards!

Obviously, it's perfectly fine to post "formally." I just don't want him to think it's necessary.

 

[Pleather]

If I recall corectly, it is the same principle that makes B moves ruin a momentum cancel. I'm sure Shaya knows more, because Shaya knows everything, but I usually don't need to move horizontally after DBs anyways since I'm either stalling Into a fair or ledge grab.

Ah, I did forget about the momentum cancel troubles that arise when you use a b move. But yea, I just found it interesting, the fact that no one has witnessed this in a match only shows how situational the problem is.

And thanks Ragnarok, and if you can't get this to happen, just ask, it might be something else causing it.

 

[Shaya]

Aerial acceleration is helped a lot through dashan before jumping; while it isn't as effective as melee, it's still there.

As you aren't getting a similar boost from a ledge jump; plus with DB1 stunting horizontal movement ever so slightly as well you get slow displacement.

Are you sure this doesn't happen if you do all this stuff without dsing?

 

[Fizzle]

I'm not sure the DB1 has anything to do with it. Try this:

DS to the ledge and hold right to fall. Try to move around. You'll get the same result.

Now run off the ledge (don't DS) and do the same thing.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

I'm not sure the DB1 has anything to do with it. Try this:

DS to the ledge and hold right to fall. Try to move around. You'll get the same result.

Now run off the ledge (don't DS) and do the same thing.

^ B move.

It's specials. They slow your aerial momentum after use.

dabuz hylian sliq

 

[Wizard Of Seraphym]

well except for SB but we all knew that already.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

well except for SB but we all knew that already.

Which will still screw up your movement if you have backwards momentum (Unless you do RSB...)

dabuz hylian sliq

 

[Punishment Divine]

Which will still screw up your movement if you have backwards momentum (Unless you do RSB...)

dabuz hylian sliq

you forgot bowyer and lain

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

you forgot bowyer and lain

There's a huuuuuuge list. I'm just using those three.

dabuz hylian sliq

 

[Tennet]

Bowyer quit brawl/ changed the password on his acc and email to something random.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Obviously, it's perfectly fine to post "formally." I just don't want him to think it's necessary.

Oh ok I get it .



You also forgot about Anther .

What Boywer quit? How do you know? You sure?

 

[Tennet]

Well let me link you to his post in the MI thread...

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=7686135&postcount=17855

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Oh wow that really sucks Thanks for the link.