Advanced Olimar Discussion (Start of Big Update 5/6)

[BlackWaltzX]

Oops! It looks like YouTube removed my video because I used a song by Ayumi Hamasaki. I liked that song...

Anyways, I re-uploaded the video with a new song.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI-xOGZVUZw (1:22)

As you can see, Olimar's jab has priority over another Olimar's forward-smash.

Aw, thanks HollaAtchaBoy. But may I ask what I did that made you love me?

If you were blue, you should drop down and go up with an uair while on edges. (Or fair) Basic tactic for characters.

 

[Steck]

How is Olimar vs. D3 or Ike?

 

[ne_Ziggy]

Ike = easily gimped. He's very slow too, lots of laggy attacks leaving you free to rush in and attack.

Can't give very good advice against Dedede though, but there are vids in this topic. They're the Me vs. Dope vids.
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=168865

 

[pesticide]

there are good ikes out there though that arent easily gimped. ike is probably an easier matchup, but not easily gimped really...

 

[nevershootme]

How is Olimar vs. D3 or Ike?

olimar vs D3 in my opinion is an even matchup, but pain in the butt to kill due to his heavy weight nature. of coruse you gotta outsmart your opponent and pray that you don't get gimped. waddles aren't much of an issue if you side smash and giving it a slight delay of the pikmin traveling it's intended distance towards D3 (the pikmin hitting the waddle and then flying to D3).

but whatever you do, do not roll behind D3 or else he'll d-smash at the right time. I ate deaths at 100%

 

[Dr. Hyde]

True get back here and update!! lol jk, but seriously either this needs to be sticked or updated, one or the other.

EDIT BTW Zelda definitely has a fair match against Olimar.

 

[shrinkray21]

i miss true as well

 

[Dotcom]

Hey, Everyone here should add to the Olimar Player Finder, if we can we should try to get it stickied.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=172527

 

[HollaAtchaBoy]

True is MIA and that makes me a sad ****** in a spacesuit.

 

[Dotcom]

epic fail double post soooo sorry.

 

[Pyronic_Star]

yea, tru had to go away for a tournament, i'm not sure when he'll be bak

 

[pesticide]

yo protoman. u dont need to post about another thread almost 2 times in a row. we know about the olimar player finder thread.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

Pictochat and Brinstar are good stages for Olimar. Pictochat because it's tiny enough that you can kill at low%'s, and let's face it, if you are off the stage further than the borders of it, you are probably dead anyway. Brinstar because if they try to gimp you, you can bounce off the lava and still live.

And if you aren't convinced that Norfair is a good stage for Olimar, ask anyone who was at Cat Fight's tournament about the Norfair match...

 

[DanGR]

hey rapid, got videos of the matches? I'd love to see them.

 

[OlimarFan]

hey rapid, got videos of the matches? I'd love to see them.

*off topic*

There's a video of Gazelle defeating Mr. X in an online match.
Whether Gazelle's opponent truly is Mr. X....that's a mystery.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

hey rapid, got videos of the matches? I'd love to see them.

I wish...

it seriously was amazing.

 

[MattDel]

really nice guide... i was wondering about the tether recovery though... i always make sure i have a purple, but it never seems to work for me... is there something i'm missing maybe?

any help would be appreciated, since it's really a bad chink in my game :/

 

[scalpel]

*off topic*

There's a video of Gazelle defeating Mr. X in an online match.
Whether Gazelle's opponent truly is Mr. X....that's a mystery.

It is Mr. X. His nickname on SSBB is Nexon, and he uses "MR. X" as his character-specific nickname. I usually like to save the replays of my matches and then capture the replay footage afterwards, and unfortunately, the replays do not show the players' nicknames. A couple of clues that support his identity: 1) Mr. X always uses the generic Olimar costume with the red antenna, and 2) he tends to wave-dash into moves, a lot. You can see him wave-dashing in my video at 0:43 to an up-air.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI-xOGZVUZw (0:43)

Watch Mr. X's other matches, and you will see these subtle cues in his playing style, too.

Keep in mind that Mr. X and I played loads of matches before the one I captured. The way I played against him in the previous matches was different from the video. I kept getting full-stocked! Then, I totally changed the way I used Olimar against him and explored. That's why I posted the video here. I wanted to let everyone know that tilts and jabs are extremely effective against Olimar opponents, and that Olimar's jab deflects forward-smashes from Olimar opponents. Also, the beginning animation of the down-tilt can deflect forward-smashes, too, when Olimar pushes forward. When Olimar retracts backwards, though, he is vulnerable to getting hit.

 

[scalpel]

really nice guide... i was wondering about the tether recovery though... i always make sure i have a purple, but it never seems to work for me... is there something i'm missing maybe?

any help would be appreciated, since it's really a bad chink in my game :/

You know, after playing Olimar for a while, I still am not able to tether recover effectively. I believe this is something that all Olimar users experience. Yes, there are ways to increase the chances of tethering successfully. Throw a purple Pikmin at the edge-hogger, and hitting the edge-hogger with a forward-air or up-air. If worst comes to worst, and you cannot do any of these, you may aim your Pikmin chain at the edge-hogger and spike him off of the stage.

In spite of these options, tether recovering is still an absolute problem for me. I'd say 90% of all of my deaths have been tethering failures. The only real way for an Olimar user to avoid tethering problems is to just play excellently, and not allow the opponent to knock Olimar off of the stage. Olimar users can make up for the tethering problems through their performance. That's what makes Olimar such a difficult character to use. Olimar users have to work twice as hard as any other character in battles, because one moment, Olimar may be in the lead with 3 stocks and 20% damage. The next moment, Olimar is left with 1 stock, due to tethering failures. Watch any match from a major tournament. You will see that this is not an uncommon occurrence. Think of it this way. If there is an Olimar with 20% damage, and his opponent is at 100% damage, the Olimar player is not in the lead. At any given time and percentage, the Olimar could be pushed off of the stage and die from tethering failures.

That's why you see such a big divergence between incredibly bad Olimars, and incredibly awesome Olimars. There aren't many in between. Olimar players just have to be extremely good in order to perform as well as an average tournament player using a different character. It's analogous to ethnic minorities in the United States. They have to be better than average in order to be considered average for their ethnicity.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

Good DI helps make up for recovery. If you DI extremely well, you won't die off the top, and off the side you'll be able to 2nd jump back. Also be very careful with how and when you use the 2nd jump. Because for all intents and purposes, that second jump is your recovery. Smart players know this and have ways to bait you into using it prematurely. If you aren't careful, you are just as likely to die at 20% as you are at 200%...

But yeah, the tether recovering is still an absolute problem for everyone. I have seen some really good off stage mindgames used to bait players into leaving the edge, though. And if your opponent isn't near the edge (due to being dead or not paying attention) you can still get back.

 

[scalpel]

Here's another video of me playing against MR. X's Olimar.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLz5bkeAXSY Gazelle (Green Olimar) vs MR. X (Generic Olimar) 2

If you watch the match, you can see how tilts and jabs are instrumental to winning in an Olimar vs Olimar battle. He who uses tilts and jabs more effectively, wins. Many attacks from different characters take priority over Olimar's Pikmin. Examples include Yoshi's smashes and special attacks, some of Wario's aerials, Wolf's forward-smash, and some other attacks. Olimar's tilts and jabs are another example of having higher priority over Pikmin attacks, and that is shown in the video above.

 

[Jarri]

Looking good, Gazelle. Who is Mr X on Smashboards?

 

[DanGR]

Week 2 is on board. Here's the link: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=172222

 

[MattDel]

ah... thanks for the advice with the tether... i was wondering if it was just me or something...

 

[DarkStraw]

I dont find the tether to be that unreliable, they have to be pretty powerfull to knock me off at 20%.
I dont use the purple pikmin trick alot, but alot of things that can help are:

Make sure you keep alot of pikmin around if your playing heavy characters or if your getting to a high percent.

Counter pick stages

dont fool around when you get knocked off, if your in range UP+B immediatly then press jump or whatever to get to the stage as quick as possible.

make sure you keep the ways to you jump on to the stage varied, dont be predictable....
You can jump/roll/attack, and you can jump off the ledge (just to the side a bit) and forward air back on.
you can jump on and use your nair, you can jump on and use your air doge etc etc etc.

If your playing someone who can be really agressive when you get off the edge (metaknight/marth) then try your best to stay near the middle of the stage, at least when your getting into high percents.
If someone like marth uses his side b to try and force you to the side just roll back to the middle or airdoge, ive played marths that do that and its annoying as hell, be aware of that kind of crap.

 

[Helios42]

From my experiences playing olimar, pictochat actually favors him. Granted that I don't main olimar (he's a semi-main for me), but I've never lost a match when I'm olimar on pictochat. Most of the time, it's flat and simple, which is what olimar likes. Some of the drawings give more stage space, which allows olimar to recover. Some more helpful aspects of pictochat are the spikes, the boat, and the box-like pyramid. All of these make brawling difficult, as such, most people will just sit there and wait for these things to disappear. When I'm olimar, these give me excelent opperunities to gather all my pikmin, pluck more if I need to, and figure out what order they're in. All in all, pictochat generally favors olimar, and should at least be a middle stage, if not one of his best.

 

[Noraa]

Does any one find them selves pressing buttons for the next attack before the last ones animation is done making your olimar seem slow?

 

[Excellence]

Nice work so far!

The only hard match up I've had was Mr. Game & Watch, I couldn't get past the spam Back-Air. He had to do a full jump, because I didn't leave my front open, I try to counter with Up-Smash, but we all know Key > Up Smash.

Anyway, I destroy Wolf players, it may just be me, but I don't think he's hair. Forward Smash is easy to grab.

 

[Kashakunaki]

Actually, Helios, I was going to say that I played on Pictochat with Olimar yesterday and it seemed good.

It is a wide area so you can stay on the stage easier, and if I'm not mistaken it has an average cieling. The only thing I don't like is the (usually) lack of platforms because platforms make Uair and Upsmash just that much more awesome.

 

[OlimarFan]

Nice work so far!

The only hard match up I've had was Mr. Game & Watch, I couldn't get past the spam Back-Air. He had to do a full jump, because I didn't leave my front open, I try to counter with Up-Smash, but we all know Key > Up Smash.

A suggestion: Stick to Olimar's ground game.

 

[shrinkray21]

Actually, Helios, I was going to say that I played on Pictochat with Olimar yesterday and it seemed good.

It is a wide area so you can stay on the stage easier, and if I'm not mistaken it has an average cieling. The only thing I don't like is the (usually) lack of platforms because platforms make Uair and Upsmash just that much more awesome.

I bring my opponents to pictochat in tourneys...its a great olly stage.

 

[BlackWaltzX]

Nice work so far!

The only hard match up I've had was Mr. Game & Watch, I couldn't get past the spam Back-Air. He had to do a full jump, because I didn't leave my front open, I try to counter with Up-Smash, but we all know Key > Up Smash.

Anyway, I destroy Wolf players, it may just be me, but I don't think he's hair. Forward Smash is easy to grab.

Like Fino said, ground game. Though, if he uses key, short hop into an up air. It defeats key everytime.

 

[Jarri]

Didn't really know where to post it, but I read in the Falco-boards an Olimar-defeated Sethlon (godly Falco) at AZoneTwosteP. I went through all names and couldn't find anyone particular that I know off the Olimar-boards, so I wonder who it is.

 

[Thai Warrior]

Didn't really know where to post it, but I read in the Falco-boards an Olimar-defeated Sethlon (godly Falco) at AZoneTwosteP. I went through all names and couldn't find anyone particular that I know off the Olimar-boards, so I wonder who it is.

I read that DSF knocked him out? He was using snake. Lol

 

[Jarri]

Yeah, DSF uses Snake most of the times it seems. DSF and some Olimar (of which I don't know the name) kicked out Sethlon.

 

[Thai Warrior]

Yeah, DSF uses Snake most of the times it seems. DSF and some Olimar (of which I don't know the name) kicked out Sethlon.

Oh ahah lol i see. What was the tourny name?

 

[Jarri]

AZonetwo Step.

 

[Jarri]

The Olimar was JKAZE (Justin Kamikaze).

 

[joeysmash]

Zelda is hard as hell, a good one will din fire spam, and if you try to spam pik toss, the shild thingy (don't remember name) its her be move. then her ariels have A LOT of priority which is hard agianst olimars arieals.

 

[BlackWaltzX]

Zelda is hard as hell, a good one will din fire spam, and if you try to spam pik toss, the shild thingy (don't remember name) its her be move. then her ariels have A LOT of priority which is hard agianst olimars arieals.

You can nair through her fireballs.
You can down+B if she reverse latches or do nair to kill your pikmin.

Everything else I can't mention much without anyone mentioning it beforehand.