About ankokus tier list

[Yerka90]

The other day I was searching for tier list on several games that I play (Street Fighter, Tekken and belive it or not there is an tier list for Call of duty 4 ) And then I decided to look up for SSBBs tier list. And boy was it a strange list. I was not suprised that MK and snake would be a S tier but there where several character that I never would thought would be on a S tier or A tier.

So my reason for creating this thread was can you guys answer why characters like DDD and diddy kong is an high tier? And why is Samus so far down on the list (Dont worry Ankoku im not mad at you, Im not mad at all. Just curious). I take myself, Xyro and Tudor for prime examples that Samus is a very good character in right hands (well every character is but I like Samus ).

Heres the character that I was curious about:
Wario
falco
Diddy kong
DDD
And of course why Samus is so far down on the tier list

Please post an argument or a video link not just for example "cause DDD is good" or something like that

 

[Yerka90]

Oh I forgot the link to the Tier list http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=236407

 

[mountain_tiger]

Here are the basic reasons:

Wario: His super high air speed and high priority and fast aerials mean he has one of the best air games of all (Second behind MK in fact). He also has a decent ground game, with a godo mix of fast pokes and power moves, and he has some nice finishers and a good edgeguarding game. Oh, and he also has a great recovery.

Falco: One of the main reasons is his chaingrab to Dair spike. Most characters can escape, but some can't, and nonetheless his chaingrab racks up a lot of damage. In addition, his lasers are great for stopping approaches, and his attacks are generally fast and good for comboing. He also has a couple of good finishers as well.

Diddy Kong: The vast majority of it comes from his bananas. he can glide toss lock you if you don't watch out, and follow up with almost anything he likes. Other than that, he's a combo machine with his dahs attack, and he has a decent air and grab game.

King Dedede: His chaingrab is the main reason, as it can rack up 20-30% damage on all characters bar the 10 lightest, and even then he can still tech chase. Other than that, he has a very useful projectile, a very powerful Bair, a quick and strong UTilt, and a great grab game outside of his chaingrab too.

And finally...

Samus: Samus has arguably the least killing power in the game. Bair only kills well if you sweetspot it, which is hard to do, and after that only FSmash, charge shot and DTilt kill below 140% reliably. This gives your opponent more time to damage you. In addition, she gets infinited by King Dedede, her floatiness makes her very easy to juggle and she gets destroyed in close quarters.

 

[kalle3004]

The other day I was searching for tier list on several games that I play (Street Fighter, Tekken and belive it or not there is an tier list for Call of duty 4 ) And then I decided to look up for SSBBs tier list. And boy was it a strange list. I was not suprised that MK and snake would be a S tier but there where several character that I never would thought would be on a S tier or A tier.

So my reason for creating this thread was can you guys answer why characters like DDD and diddy kong is an high tier? And why is Samus so far down on the list (Dont worry Ankoku im not mad at you, Im not mad at all. Just curious). I take myself, Xyro and Tudor for prime examples that Samus is a very good character in right hands (well every character is but I like Samus ).

Heres the character that I was curious about:
Wario
falco
Diddy kong
DDD
And of course why Samus is so far down on the tier list

Please post an argument or a video link not just for example "cause DDD is good" or something like that

I'll go over them in the order you posted them:

Wario: Great aerial game, good matchups (AFAIK), lives long, the waft (wario can reliably kill each minute because of that)

Falco: CG, lasers (I don't know that much about Falco)

Diddy kong: banana's (they make quite the difference in his matchups)

DDD: CG, good air game, strong, good projectile

Samus: bad in close combat, projectiles are outclassed by other characters (snake, for example), lack of killing power

So, yeah, that's it.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Heres the character that I was curious about:
Wario
falco
Diddy kong
DDD
And of course why Samus is so far down on the tier list

First off, its a backroom tier list, not just Ankoku's.

Let's go.

Wario is fast in the air, has heavy weight, good DI options and just great moves. He is impossible to grab, his killing options are plenty and he's just king.

Falco has an incredible long range game, can keep opponents at distance, rack damage fast and be very intimidating and return to being relaxed in a matter of seconds, often throwing opponents off. He's just a pain to fight.

Diddy is high cause he has nanners, he has good aerials, a good ground game, a naner lock on the whole cast -2. his bananas create such a great stage control and diddy can wreck so hard from just 1 trip, he's fast and he can rack damage like crazy. If he also had abit more killing power he'd be higher... can't have everything, right?

D3 is up there 'cause he's heavy, he has great range on all his attacks and he has some good recovery. If a D3 knows how to DI you wont kill him any time soon, D3 can gimp some characters with bairs, and bair is just an overall awesome spacing moves.
Oh and chaingrabzzz.


Samus is low cause shes overall easily avoidable by alotta characters, sure she might be good but others are better. She can be countered by alotta characters and that's why she's not high enough. There are just better characters deserving a high spot.

 

[Garquille14]

That's the official tier list from the Brawl Back Room, not Ankoku's. He just posted it.

Just for clarification.

Wario - Super mobility, fantastic aerial game, great recovery ability

Falco - Great lasers, a chaingrab up to ~50% on many characters, generally good attacks

Diddy - Bananas are why he is amazing. They allow various assortments of setups and combo potential

DDD - Doesn't like to die, great aerial game, very strong chaingrab, effective projectile

Go here for more indepth summaries:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=162420

 

[Kitamerby]

Tudor never really placed all that well in the first place. He did okay, but he never really took like top 5 unless it was doubles, which for some reason Tudor is even more of a beast than usual in.

I'm serious. Never play against Tudor in doubles in tournament. You WILL regret walking up to that wii.

Hilariously though, he ***** out of state people, similar to FOW but not as extreme. Nobody knows **** about how to handle low tiers nowadays.


...He also quit. ;-;

 

[Pichu4SSB4]

Wario: He's too good.
Falco: He has teh chaingrab.
Diddy Kong: He's got bananas, don't **** with him.
DDD: Read what i said about Falco pl0x
Samus: She sucks... i'm suprised she didn't even go below Jigglypuff yet.

 

[teluoborg]

I take myself, Xyro and Tudor for prime examples that Samus is a very good character in right hands (well every character is but I like Samus ).

You said it yourself : every character is good in right hands.

A tier list doesn't take account of the player's skill (or does it ? Tournament results are a factor, but still...), it's mainly about the strenghts and weaknesses of the characters and how they match with the rest of the cast.

 

[Tarmogoyf]

This should be discussed in the very thread you were talking about. AKA, it doesn't need it's own thread.

 

[Tudor]

Samus: bad in close combat, projectiles are outclassed by other characters (snake, for example), lack of killing power

So, yeah, that's it.

I will admit Samus can be less than average in close combat if she is not in control, but if you know what you are doing Samus can rake up damage so fast in close combat it's scary (check out some top name Samus's combo's or if you need to, any of mine).

Her projectiles are some of the best, you can short hop homing missile cancel and buffer almost any attack (such as dtilt if they are close).

Samus has a sick spike to kill ^^


I'm sorry but I dissagree about her placing, Samus even counterpicks any big character (like DK) and can even counterpick snake, I know I beat some big name snakes at the vegas tourney SIN.

It doesn't affect me where she is on the list, honestly the lower the better (because it makes me look better) but I think she is not represented correctly....

Tudor never really placed all that well in the first place. He did okay, but he never really took like top 5 unless it was doubles, which for some reason Tudor is even more of a beast than usual in.

I'm serious. Never play against Tudor in doubles in tournament. You WILL regret walking up to that wii.

Hilariously though, he ***** out of state people, similar to FOW but not as extreme. Nobody knows **** about how to handle low tiers nowadays.


...He also quit. ;-;

Awww those are some hella nice comments, thank you! I didn't quit though, it's just harder for me to find time to play, lucky for me brawl doesn't take much to remember how to play ^^

 

[tuestresfat]

Am I the only one who thinks Falco and Wario should be lower on the tier list...?

They're good... but not 3rd and 4th in my opinion wario gets totally ***** with his horrible grab release anyway.
I would rank D3 above them.

 

[phi1ny3]

Grab release...
That would be a very determinate factor if wario wasn't that hardest character to grab even at highest levels of play.

Also, it isn't Ankoku's as much as it is the SBR's.
Samus lives long, does good damage, and decent projectiles, but things like killing and tool supremacy hurt her (although I feel she has room for improvement).

 

[Darxmarth23]

Dude.

You gotta chill.

I would say that if you want some insight on the chars you listed you should visit the video thread of those character boards. You'll see some interesting matches of players who are at the top of their characters meta game. Then you can make newer and more refreshed comparisons.

Later Homeslice

 

[lax guy5]

Wario: AMAZING aerials! Second only to MK. Plus, pretty good ground game. Also, great recovery.

Falco: In my opinion, overrated. But super fast, good grabs, a good amount of kill moves for light and fast character like him, and lasers are hard to predict.

Diddy kong: The main reason he's this high on the teir list is his bananas! Plus glide toss and how quickly he can get around!

DDD: Best chaingrab in the game (banned in some tournements), incredibly difficult to K.O., good recovery, and a nice projectile to go along with it.

Samus: He has EXTREMELY low killing potential! (Some say worst in the game!) Can easily be picked apart by characters like MK and DDD.

Hope that answers your question!

 

[:mad:]

Wario: AMAZING aerials! Second only to MK. Plus, pretty good ground game. Also, great recovery.

Falco: In my opinion, overrated. But super fast, good grabs, a good amount of kill moves for light and fast character like him, and lasers are hard to predict.

Diddy kong: The main reason he's this high on the teir list is his bananas! Plus glide toss and how quickly he can get around!

DDD: Best chaingrab in the game (banned in some tournements), incredibly difficult to K.O., good recovery, and a nice projectile to go along with it.

Samus: He has EXTREMELY low killing potential! (Some say worst in the game!) Can easily be picked apart by characters like MK and DDD.

Hope that answers your question!

Wario's aerials are decent, pretty good at best. His best one, Dair, is fairly easy to DI out of, Nair's just fast, Uair's a pretty good killer, Fair's pretty bad, Bair's laggy. His ground game's fine, not the reason why he's 3rd, though.

Samus is a woman, by the way.

 

[pizzapie7]

Samus is a woman, by the way.

NO WAI.


Samus has basically no kill moves aside from the charged shot (which can be avoided 99% of the time) and her bair (which is hard to sweetspot and also avoidable for the most part). She's also easy to combo in the air.

 

[Commander_Beef]

DDD -effective projectile

Coming from a King Dedede main, it is a great projectile but it's also the laggiest projectile in the game, it can be easily punished. It's a good projectile but it doesn't match Snake's grenades, Falco's lasers or Pit's arrows...

 

[:mad:]

NO WAI.


Samus has basically no kill moves aside from the charged shot (which can be avoided 99% of the time) and her bair (which is hard to sweetspot and also avoidable for the most part). She's also easy to combo in the air.

You really didn't need to address the woman part, since you obviously already know.

Charged Shot should never be used as a killer because it's pretty **** bad at killing. Bair, Utilt, Fsmash, and Dair are all so much better.

 

[Tudor]

Ok i think the problem is you guys have never played a good Samus...

That must mean there are not a lot of good Samus's but still, she can be good.

I've beaten people who main Mk and Dedede and are VERY well known (i'm not a name dropper though).

Samus deserves better, but that's ok, you guys will just be very unprepared when you play a good one ^^

 

[demonictoonlink]

God I want to play Tudor...
If we ever meet, we need Samus Dittos then TL vs. Samus!

 

[lax guy5]

Wario's aerials are decent, pretty good at best. His best one, Dair, is fairly easy to DI out of, Nair's just fast, Uair's a pretty good killer, Fair's pretty bad, Bair's laggy. His ground game's fine, not the reason why he's 3rd, though.

Samus is a woman, by the way.

Haha oops! I know she's a woman/ Shudda put an "s" before that "he".

 

[Tudor]

God I want to play Tudor...
If we ever meet, we need Samus Dittos then TL vs. Samus!

I'd love too!!! I'll be at evo if you wanna hang out then ^^

 

[Supreme65]

I came hear to make friends and have fun with the game. I don't really care about ankoku's tier list or characters MU cuz u won't get the same results everytime you fight someone different. To me it's not the character that makes the teir list and MU. The players decides that

 

[Gates]

I'm very glad you bumped an old thread to tell us that.