Official 4BR Tier List v1.0 - Competitive Impressions

[Nidtendofreak]

@ARISTOS Besides Ryuga pulling Ike out along with his Corrin in the one tournament result I've seen from him recently, not a clue. Most of the Ike population has moved over to Discord which I'm not doing due to having a good 6/7 skype chats that get 500-4000 posts a day and I can't handle another chat program on top of that so I'm no longer up to date on things. Ryo seems to have kinda fallen off the face of the earth as far as I can tell.

I do know that San won a local tournament, but it only had 70ish people + only top 6 or so were noticeable so it wasn't recorded in Das Koopa's rankings. SM was at EVO, got to the final around of pools before ending up facing off against uh... I think it was the Japanese Diddy Kong that came over. A few European results trickle in for Ike as well.

Ike's results have pretty much always been hot and cold throughout SSB4's lifespan. Its another cold spell, though now we actually get the occasional Japanese Ike result nowadays.

 

[san.]

In other news, what has happened with recently? Haven't seen him since San's performance at GOML.

PS: Don't take that extra shot of tequila, not worth it

I've only been competing locally, and my local scene can't really garner more than 70 players at max at tournaments. Not going to see much of me unless Toronto has a bunch of nationals in a month again. Too tired from work to travel a lot.

Waldo from NYC is going to more events, and hopefully Ryo with his new sponsor gives him the opportunity to attend more events.

Other than that, you're not going to see much of him (There are sparse usages, such as A and Nojinko in Japan, and various other decent players like Stark, Jage, Yoh, etc). If you don't care about grappling, it's more effective to pick up Cloud.

 

[juddy96]

Nexus 2 - Ottawa, Ontario (103 entrants)

1) Blacktwins The Roster
2) SuperGirlKels
3) Holy
4) Deathorse
5) JPeds
5) DarkAura
7) Venom
7) QB

https://smash.gg/tournament/nexus-2/brackets/13368/38996/130563

 

[Ffamran]

Rosa's eighth in jump height. Top 4 are Falco, Geninja, Zss and Luigi in that order but that's still really good.

Are you using the rankings from ssbwiki: http://www.ssbwiki.com/Jump#Jump_height_ranking? I'm basing Rosalina's jump height on kenniky and Masonomace's study: http://smashboards.com/threads/jump-height-rankings.412187/. It's outdated like ssbwiki's, but tells the story more by trying to provide values for jump heights. According to this thread, jump rankings without buffs or debuffs i.e. without moves like Lightweight or Monado Arts, it's Falco at first, Greninja at second, Luigi and ZSS at third, and Diddy, Mii Brawler (0/0) and (0/50) -- I don't know what that means, but I'm assuming low weight / small Miis --, and Rosalina at fourth. Also, Sheik at fifth. With buffs and debuffs, Lightweight Palutena's first, Shulk with any of his Jump Art, default or customs, and Falco is third with everyone moving down accordingly. The values for those jumps in order are 11 jump, 14 double jump for Lightweight Palutena, 10 jump, 13 double for Jump Shulk, 10 jump, 12 double for Falco, 9 jump, 11 double for Greninja, 8 double, 11 double for Luigi and ZSS, 8 jump, and 10 double for Diddy, Mii Brawler (0/0) and (0/50), and Rosalina, and 7 jump, and 10 double for Sheik.

There's also a study of Up Special heights. Study implies that average Up Special height when used in the air is around 8 to 10 like Captain Falcon's Falcon Dive (9), Cloud's regular Climhazzard (9), Ganondorf's Dark Dive (9), the Links' Spin Attack (10), Mario's SJP (8), or ZSS's Boost Kick (10).

 

[Das Koopa]

SF5 Top 8:

Winners:
Bedgar v Dabuz
Wonf v Mr. R

Losers:
Javi v Serge
MKLeo v Regi

 

[ARGHETH]

Wow, apparently Leo lost to Wonf.

 

[Das Koopa]

yes, Wonf beat Leo 3-2.

I think Leo is making a mistake using Marth as much as he does. We'll see how it goes in Losers Bracket.

 

[ShadowGuy1]

yes, Wonf beat Leo 3-2.

I think Leo is making a mistake using Marth as much as he does. We'll see how it goes in Losers Bracket.

What character did Wonf use vs Leo.

Looking at who is left in winners this seems like Dabuz is going to be half of the grand finals.

 

[Das Koopa]

Wonf used Sonic for 4 games, was up 2-1. Leo went Cloud game 4, bodied Wonf's Sonic, Wonf went Bayo and edged Leo out.

 

[sedrf]

Lucario was a mistake
but seriously serge may be the best lucario in the world

 

[L9999]

Lucario was a mistake
but seriously serge may be the best lucario in the world

What did Serge did this time?

yes, Wonf beat Leo 3-2.

I think Leo is making a mistake using Marth as much as he does. We'll see how it goes in Losers Bracket.

Saca al Meta Naigt.

 

[Das Koopa]

What did Serge did this time?

3-1 vs. Javi.

Lucario's Aura strength is plainly on show the entire set and demonstrates how you never really have a lead against the character if the player is good. He becomes a deadly glass cannon that can and will kill, and Serge doesn't rely on the wonky Aura Sphere traps/gimmicks. He integrates them and uses all of the tools his character has.

Basically, if he nets a kill, a couple of grabs into aerials will more or less place you and your opponent in the same position. This has happened a bit today, like Richi reverse 3-0ing zomfg with Lucario.

EDIT: MKLeo bodying Regi atm.

 

[FeelMeUp]

Everyone enjoy seeing the #1 ledge trapper in the game go to work?

 

[Das Koopa]

Mr. R finally defeats Dabuz, 3-1.

Unless Leo gets reverse 3-0'd by Wonf I think we'll see a Mr. R/Leo runback.

Edit: Yeaaah no lol Leo bodied Wonf this time with Meta Knight.

 

[sedrf]

That poor sonic.
Dabuz vs leo right now

 

[FeelMeUp]

I want to see Dabuz practice MM for the MK MU but I fear MM is too complicated to keep maintained along with Rosa.

 

[sedrf]

game 5
leo vs dabuz
vs
edit: there is also mario/bayonetta
hee has practiced bayonetta before

leo wins 3-2

 

[Das Koopa]

Gotta be one of the most unexpectedly intense sets of the year

MKLeo 3-2 Dabuz

 

[Swamp Sensei]

v Serge

I'm telling ya.

His future is a counterpick character.

 

[Yonder]

I'm telling ya.

His future is a counterpick character.

Against who? Cloud? That seems to be the only top tier name floating around here that Zard does decent against. Unless there is more. Someone enlighten me, I know squat about Zard.

 

[FeelMeUp]

If the current 2 Sheiks had ZeRo's defensive game they wouldn't struggle so much with the MUs she's supposed to demolish :T

 

[Das Koopa]

MK Leo 3-0 Mr. R, 3-2 Mr. R. Leo wins Smash Factor 5.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Against who? Cloud? That seems to be the only top tier name floating around here that Zard does decent against. Unless there is more. Someone enlighten me, I know squat about Zard.

Zard does well against Cloud, Fox and Sheik.

 

[Nu~]

Can we talk about Meta Knight tho???

Those damage strings were downright INSANEEE

 

[Mr. Johan]

Remember when Meta Knights used to be dismayed and said Meta Knight was unviable because he lost his Ladder Shuttle Loop string?

Apparently Leo did.

But he also used Cloud which is basically the 11th Commandment at this point but I digress

 

[thehard]

Remember when Meta Knights used to be dismayed and said Meta Knight was unviable because he lost his Ladder Shuttle Loop string?

Apparently Leo did.

But he also used Cloud which is basically the 11th Commandment at this point but I digress

There is nothing more satisfying than watching a top player destroy someone's nerd essay on why X character sucks now

 

[Aaron1997]

Smash Factor 5 Results

1. SF HDG | MK Leo
2. Mr.R
3. DT | Dabuz
4. CS CO | Wonf
5. SC SF | Serge
5. SP | Bengar
7. SF | Javi
7. SF | Regi
9. K40Z
9. Daimy
9. SF | Richi
9. Joker
13. Salva
13. Question
13. Klein
13. Z0mfg

 

[blackghost]

less be real here the only stairway combo that was truly axed was luigi down b.
zss, bayo, mk all rerained theirs in varying degrees of effectiveness but they are all present on hard reads. next mk is a pure burst damage character.
lastly what is the base kb for mk bair? it hits like a truck

 

[Das Koopa]

Smash Factor 5 Results

1. SF HDG | MK Leo
2. Mr.R
3. DT | Dabuz
4. CS CO | Wonf
5. SC SF | Serge
5. SP | Bengar
7. SF | Javi
7. SF | Regi
9. K40Z
9. Daimy
9. SF | Richi
9. Joker
13. Salva
13. Question
13. Klein
13. Z0mfg

SAlva was Mewtwo, Question was Sheik/Mewtwo, Klein was Ryu, Serge won games with Charizard and Cloud.

 

[Kofu]

Smash Factor 5 Results

1. SF HDG | MK Leo
2. Mr.R
3. DT | Dabuz
4. CS CO | Wonf
5. SC SF | Serge
5. SP | Bengar
7. SF | Javi
7. SF | Regi
9. K40Z
9. Daimy
9. SF | Richi
9. Joker
13. Salva
13. Question
13. Klein
13. Z0mfg

I really don't know how Regi does it. Mexico has some really strong players but he still manages to get 7th at tournaments like this.

 

[Amadeus9]

I'm waiting for a certain outspoken former Meta Knight main to post an essay on why MK is still unviable at top level regardless of this tournament.

Love u bunbun bae

 

[freeziebeatz]

So what I got so far for this past weekend.

Spoiler: This Week

[/Sumabato for The Big House (Japan) (Category 2)
1st) Komorikiri
2nd) Shuton
3rd) Taiheta
4th) Choco
5th) T
5th) Hayato
7th) Kept
7th) Tea
9th) Songn
9th) Nietono
9th) Hiraku
9th) Shogun
13th) Tarantino
13th) Ikep
13th) Gackt
13th) Pichi]


Vitality (Florida) (Category 1)
1st) Dath
2nd) StaticManny
3rd) MVD
4th) Xaltis
5th) Myran
5th) 8BitMan
7th) TNF Child
7th) Eden
9th) Purple Guy
9th) Riot
9th) Hex
9th) Wormynugget
13th) Seibrik
13th) Tremendo Dude
13th) RoguePenguin
13th) Prince Ramen


Revelation 2016 (Post Pacific Northwest) (Category 1)
1st) Vinnie
2nd) falln
3rd) MJG
4th) JJROCKETS
5th) Calculus
5th) JFK
7th) Mr. Doom
7th) Regrahlt
9th) Sofa King
9th) BestNess
9th) Jesus
9th) DD
13th) Fabian
13th) Nero
13th) BANG!
13th) A-Fin


Nexus 2 (Canada) (Category 1)
1st) Blacktwins13
2nd) SuperGirlKels
3rd) Holy
4th) Deathorse
5th) Jpeds
5th) DarkAura
7th) Venom
7th) QB
9th) Darkwolf
9th) BreaD
9th) Killion
9th) DooM
13th) kurage
13th) Atlas
13th) Dunston
13th) Saber


Sonic Boom 2016 (Europe) (Category 2)?
1st) Rydle
2nd) Robo Luigi
3rd) Greward
4th) Pefo
5th) Marcbri
5th) SefiCompacto
7th) MonsterVL
7th) Slay
9th) Shiro
9th) El_Pitikla
9th) Pepo
9th) AndresFn
13th) El_Bardo
13th) Adrik
13th) Pocafeiner
13th) Orfen


Smash Factor 5 (Mexico) (Category 2)?
1st) MKLeo
2nd) Mr. R
3rd) Dabuz
4th) Wonf
5th) Serge
5th) Bedgar
7th) Javi
7th) Regi
9th) K40Z
9th) Daimy
9th) Richi
9th) Joker
13th) Salva
13th) Question
13th) Klein
13th) z0mfg

[/SPOILER]

 

[thehard]

Leo though. I want to hear more thoughts on him. He's got that aura of ever-present scariness when he plays. His play is so air-tight it's ridiculous and I hate that I forget about him just because there hasn't been a Mexican major in a while. He is so obviously one of the greatest.

He has one of the best combo games of anybody right now (I'm still not over his Marth/MK extensions) his juggles are ridiculous, (death ladders for days) his neutral is impenetrable (pps, foxtrots, dashdances, sticky walking, amazing perfect shields), I just can't deal with it. Hopefully we get to see him for TBH6 or G4.

 

[FeelMeUp]

Zard does well against Fox

Care to explain a bit?

 

[Amadeus9]

Care to explain a bit?

I think by well he means notably better than his other top tier mus. Which would make some sense to me mainly because flamethrower/jab/dtilt are really good against characters with poor jump in options (as an mk main i can attest to this)

 

[FeelMeUp]

I wasn't really expecting a winning MU. Just wondering what Zard has to make the MU better than 6:4

 

[ぱみゅ]

I wasn't really expecting a winning MU. Just wondering what Zard has to make the MU better than 6:4

https://youtu.be/njCX9y4X19s?t=3m18s
Not the whole story, but an important bit.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I wasn't really expecting a winning MU. Just wondering what Zard has to make the MU better than 6:4

To put it simply.

Range, weight, rage and the magical ability to punish linear recoveries.

https://youtu.be/njCX9y4X19s?t=3m18s
Not the whole story, but an important bit.

Serge dropped the ball there at the end, but yeah it isn't as one sided as one thinks.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Dugan won Defend The North 2016 with Fox. John #s, Sinji, Venia and a couple of other notable entrants were there but idk the exact results because smash.gg never updated the results.

 

[Pazx]

Dugan won Defend The North 2016 with Fox. John #s, Sinji, Venia and a couple of other notable entrants were there but idk the exact results because smash.gg never updated the results.

It was updated on Challonge! Results for this event as well as others that happened this weekend have been posted in the Summer of Smash week 9 thread.

Defend The North 2016 Top 16 (96 entrants)
1. G5 | Dugan
2. Ho3k | John Numbers
3. Ho3k | Dill
4. cR | dekillsage
5. DA | Sinji
5. ADHD
7. DMG | James
7. Circa | Jtails
9. Mutiny | Apple
9. Lax
9. ESE | Oatmeal
9. Ho3k | Deven3000
13. LoF | Blue
13. Ho3k | HelpR
13. Otacon
13. WindsReq ?