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Character loyalty is a *****, after all.
MK not being a common character also benefits her.
To be fair she's probably the only character that manages to be a top tier despite having more than a couple of questionable matchups, but that's probably down to Luma being, well, Luma.
, hell people are now putting roy as bottom tier character only because "there need to be a bottom tier characters",are considered high tier characters and all of them have severely -1 or -2 against the top tier, metaknight fits that description very well. in the bracket would fight who are -1 or -2 for rob prepatch, is difficult but winnable, but wait the mario has who is -3 for R.O.B, if the zss is at the same skill as the R.O.B then he would have a difficult time even if the player is not at the same skill, so yes is better if a character has several -1, because you dont lose at the CSS.
Disagree and in fact it's the opposite because having many -1s as opposed to many 0s and one -2/-3 means you will likely exhaust yourself in bracket trying to fight all the -1s as opposed to 0s. It's also easier to pick up a CP to fight your one or two awful matchups as opposed to fighting 5+ slightly bad matchups.But then was is the point of the tier list and not only that perception is a thing that the smash community is very bad at, ie:
About the matchups is obviously that having several -1 matchups is better that having few -3 or -2, because you can't lost at the screen select if you have -1, that is not the case with a -3 or -2, example a
It's not that simple. Rosalina is considered a top tier character despite -2/3's vs MK and Cloud. How common the MU is also matters a lot. For example, Rosa's MK MU doesn't hurt her in the grand scheme of things because MK isn't a frequent pick. OTOH, Cloud is her biggest issue due to her bad MU vs him and how wide-spread he is.But then was is the point of the tier list and not only that perception is a thing that the smash community is very bad at, ie:
About the matchups is obviously that having several -1 matchups is better that having few -3 or -2, because you can't lost at the screen select if you have -1, that is not the case with a -3 or -2, example a
I vehemently disagree with this. Meta Knight is not easy to combo in this match up. If Mario grabs you at 0% with no rage the most he can get is 22%. If he has 3% or more, like from a Fireball, Meta Knight just needs to SDI and jump out of the strings. The fact that he has so many jumps is what allows him to avoid being combo'd.The Mario MU was already relatively even in 1.1.4, so it's perfectly reasonable that it is losing for MK considering his loss of the ladder. MK being a fast faller who lacks a frame-3 aerial makes him highly susceptible to Mario's combos. It's not unusual for MK to be taken from 0-60% in that MU. With the reduced damage on uair and MK's worsened combo potential at mid-percents, Mario's damage racking ability is generally more reliable. It was 50-50 before because Mario had better tools to win neutral but lost in terms of reward and KOing, but now he gains more reliable reward off of his set-ups.
However, MK still wins overall in the KOing department, so he will often have the chance to live long and make use of rage. Theory isn't in MK's favor, and results aren't either, as Tyrant opts for his Diddy secondary in that MU, and Ito got 3-0'd by Zenyou last they played.
At Fresh Saga, Tyrant went all MK aside from the LF set against Void. He didn't use Diddy because he didn't encounter the Mario MU (at least not in top 32). And why he didn't use Diddy against Trela beats me.
It's very likely MK's toughest MU, but of course, it isn't nearly as difficult as 1.1.4 Sheik. 55-45 or 60-40.
C0rvus Cloud is also pretty similar to Mario in that he's highly common as well.
Two characters go roughly even. A patch rolls in and one is nerfed. It only makes sense that the match-up slides into the favor of the un-nerfed character.
Also the TLOC 1K in Dallas on Saturday. Probably gonna break 100
This actually is not exactly how it works. Even if the matchup was even before, it could still be relatively even now. MK mains have to play a real neutral now, which they didn't have to before (no offense it's kinda just true). I feel like many MK mains are conflating this with matchups actually being bad when they have to play the actual game.
MK's weakened punishes are actually high-lighting his issues. Other top tiers could always exploit the holes in an otherwise-great neutral game, namely the above-average landing lag on his aerials and his lack of a projectile making him unable to force approaches. Most of them went even/lost to him because even with superior neutral games, he overall surpassed them in reward.
I wonder how viable this makes Dk and Bowser against Bayo. They were among the list of characters with good grabs that might have given here some trouble before it was pointed out that they were super combo food. Assuming perfect Di on this combo what other kill combos will she land and how long would it take her to kill these two?
Maybe it's not a problem with "normal" fighting games but I'm used to it. Pokken for example, Braixen can't use her Sunny Day buff at all against Mewtwo (unless he literally jumped into a Flamethrower or Fire Blast) without getting taking a Hyper Beam to the face, and as far as I'm aware people think Pokken's pretty balanced. Then there's things like Suicune' Mirror Coat, which is basically a SSB counter but only for projectiles and can be used on reaction to punish most projectiles for a ton of damage.
Unless the aspects of the character that was nerfed are not relevant or significant. If the Mario knew how to DI the combo you could only kill him from 31-33% with sour spot Shuttle Loop. Damage was nerfed yes, but players were using sub optimal combos to get Mario into that window, and never properly labbed other alternatives.
These people use him as mains and place better a bigger tournaments than you said.
/ Nietono / Daiki / Shogun / Komorikiri / Gomamugitya / Taiheita / Macho / HIKARU / ikep / Nga / Pasutaa / DoubleA / Takera / kept / haru / Kei / Smasher / Nagahari / Rizeasu / Karuha / Take / Kisha / Omochi / Tsu~ / Umiushi / AGO。 / Nojinko / JUN / Mazinger / Ranperu / Ninomiya / Karamity / Ruri / Gaither / Gungnir / Haya
Tyrant opts for Diddy in this MU and Ito got steam-rolled vs Zenyou. Idk about you but that doesn't ring like it's an even MU to me. This discussion about theory is important, but theory doesn't mean much unless you can support it with results and so far results indicate the MU is in Mario's favor and not by a small margin.
Why does this happen? Wow does Mario win this?
If two different players of the same character have trouble in the same MU, then, trust me--it may sound crazy-- it's credible that the MU might just be losing.
Duh.
Care to justify your claim rather than just making statements...?
John Numbers made a follow up to esam's video on di ing bayo's up air.
