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3 pretty advanced techs.

Tommy_G

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I don't care if you know these or not, but I'm going to post them here for everyone else to see. Advanced tech meaning either it takes practice to do or you can get punished hard if you mess up.

Tech #1 Firebird Cancelling...kinda.

Part one: This was in melee. You can grab the ledge with the firebird angled down. The only trick to it is you must let go of the control stick before you reach the ledge. Plays out as a pretty nice unpredictable mindgame to get back onto the stage. You can do it straight downwards too. If timed right, you can do one angled straight down to push someone off the ledge. Depending on how far you were it'll either just push them down into a ledge drop footstool or the final hit of the firebird will come out before you grab the ledge a stage spike them pretty hard.

[highlight]Why it's advanced: You mess up=you die. It's not very difficult though.[/highlight]

Part two: If you use firebird to the floor and time it so it ends as you hit the floor there will extremely little lag at the end of it. Same concept as horizontal firebirds.

[highlight]Why it's advanced: Hard to time the distance in between firebird bounce and freefall lag[/highlight]

Tech #2 IAPC-Immediate aerial phantasm canceling.

This is known that all Falco mains are able to cancel their phantasm anywhere. The reason why this is a pretty advanced tech is when you begin canceling it in specific points for approaches, comboing, or mindgames.

[highlight]Why it's advanced: Hard to stop exactly where you want every time.[/highlight]

Tech #3 Jab cancel shield pressure. This is something I've never seen any falco do.

A move in Brawl that allows for shield pressure?!?!?!
This move is either one jab or two jab into ground cancel into jab over and over again. If timed fast enough, the shielding opponent can not do anything other than roll, sidestep, or jump. They cannot attack out of shield. I had a friend of mine use MK's down smash out of shield and it couldn't come out fast enough. The only things that might beat it is bad timing, power shielded crazy attack reactions, or invulnerable attacks like MK's up B or Marth's up B.

Rolling behind allows you to turn around and start it all over again.
Rolling away sets up as neutral or defensive status...which is good for Falco.
Sidestep will mess up your timing in a good way. It will automatically make you triple jab combo, punishing the sidestep. Problem solved.
Jumping out of it takes disgusting timing. I've only seen computers do it. Besides you should grab them anyways before they roll or jump. I've only seen them jump at high %s.

Higher percentages allow for a slight bit more hitstun. That can help you jab into upsmash or down smash.

Falco's initial jab pulls him forward, so you can use the first jab to space and ground cancel it all of the way next to him to grab.

[highlight] Why it's advanced: The timing for it takes some practice. If you're even slightly off, you'll get punished[/highlight]
 

J4pu

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Mar 30, 2008
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WTF is going on here? advances in Falco's metagame? can't be, since the game has been out for a whole 9 months.
It's so strange how just these past few days quite a few new things came up, let's keep 'em coming.

anyways IAPC was known, but rarely practiced
I assume the Firebird cancel was known, idk, but I knew about it

the Jab canceling really being that effective was unknown to me, good stuff there
and of course I'm sure the other two are new to some people.
 

-Red-

Smash Cadet
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Nov 16, 2008
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Thanks guys, make it even harder for me to beat Sk92 -_-
 

Denzi

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I've known about the Firebird thing, I just started IAPCing recently, and I've never tried the Jab thing (I usually just Jab >> Grab).

IAPC is actually a lot more effective than one might initially think.
 

Hyo

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The firebird onto the stage things sounds a lot like QAC to me; but worse.

Can you really see any application? I mean, if an enemy sees you firebird, then can just boost smash you, no?
 

c0nd0r

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Messages
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umm, MK cant dsmash without dropping sheild. Characters like marth, mario, and many characters with a grab should be able to counter the jab thing...
 

XxBlackxX

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hmm i knew about the first 2, and i do iapc sometimes.
but i never done (or seen it for that matter) that jab canceling shield pressure. sounds pretty **** useful. (IF it works the way i see it in my head right now) ill be looking forward to trying some.
btw, cant they shield grab?
 

Tommy_G

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I was only shield grabbed once the entire day yesterday and that was when i stopped the jabbing and went for a grab myself. I figured it was due to bad timing or since grab is 4 frames slower, he just got really lucky with some crazy 1/15th of a second timing. You should grab them before they grab you. On the majority of the cast, grab release down into 3 first jabs (some even just two, unless they roll out) into grab works. Think about how much damage can you do with pummels from 80% with grab releases before they realize to roll out.

Higher percents = higher the slight knock up/hit stun. At percents over 100% Jab into Up smash should work if theyre not shielding. With Falco's broken jab range, it's definitely easy to catch them off guard.

Thing about characters using stuff out of shield is that they don't ever think of it(except maybe MK and marth) because they rarely need to use it. Once they start using it, you can learn to mindgame it and punish them for it. Even then it's possible that the jab comes out too fast and will hit them out of the Up B before hitboxes come out.
 

Fluke

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Wow very nice.

I knew about the first two. Gave up on Phantasm canceling since it was too difficult for me to do consistently anyway. But the jab sounds very nice.
 

Denzi

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On the majority of the cast, grab release down into 3 first jabs (some even just two, unless they roll out) into grab works. Think about how much damage can you do with pummels from 80% with grab releases before they realize to roll out.

Higher percents = higher the slight knock up/hit stun. At percents over 100% Jab into Up smash should work if theyre not shielding. With Falco's broken jab range, it's definitely easy to catch them off guard.

Thing about characters using stuff out of shield is that they don't ever think of it(except maybe MK and marth) because they rarely need to use it. Once they start using it, you can learn to mindgame it and punish them for it. Even then it's possible that the jab comes out too fast and will hit them out of the Up B before hitboxes come out.

That sound a lot better than I initially thought. I will have to try it sometime :)
 

Fluke

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Also, to cancel the lag of the firebird, or to at least see what it looks like.

Do a full jump. At the very peak, firebox EXACTLY DIAGONALLY DOWN. Easier to do on Final Destination to ignore platforms.
You should just get the firebird to finish right before you land, thus lag is gone from falling
 

gunterrsmash01

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regarding the jab cancel for shield pressure:

Dude, what kind of insane timing is required for this? I'm pretty sure i was doing it correctly, but the only things beating it were Wolfs shine, GW's jab, marths upb, mks downsmash..... im pretty sure its impossible for those moves not to break it out. maybe your friend who was tryin to downsmash didnt time it correctly? im positive i was doing it correctly but those moves listed above still break it.
 

Denzi

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A vid showing applications for/demonstrations of the Jab cancel pressure would be nice, cause I'm finding it difficult to get past some things as well.
 

§witch

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regarding the jab cancel for shield pressure:

Dude, what kind of insane timing is required for this? I'm pretty sure i was doing it correctly, but the only things beating it were Wolfs shine, GW's jab, marths upb, mks downsmash..... im pretty sure its impossible for those moves not to break it out. maybe your friend who was tryin to downsmash didnt time it correctly? im positive i was doing it correctly but those moves listed above still break it.
Do you crouch cancel your jabs? That may be the problem.
 

K 2

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I need to work on the firebird cancelling thing. I tried that out early when the game was released, but I kept on SD'ing, so I gave up on it.
 

Tommy_G

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The timing for the jab cancel it is insanely tight. Try to always go faster rather than slower. If you go too fast, it'll just make you triple jab combo. Triple jab combos are pretty safe. Remember to Jab, ground cancel(press down) then jab again.

MK's up B, Wolf's shine, and Marth's up b have invuln frames on start up. Those would probably beat the jabs because of that. Remember I'm just starting to do this so my timing isn't perfect either. Shield Grab might be able to beat it too, but because the range on falco's jab is so insane, we should learn to mix up between one jab and two(one pulls in slightly and two pushes away slightly)
 

XxBlackxX

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The timing for the jab cancel it is insanely tight. Try to always go faster rather than slower. If you go too fast, it'll just make you triple jab combo. Triple jab combos are pretty safe. Remember to Jab, ground cancel(press down) then jab again.

MK's up B, Wolf's shine, and Marth's up b have invuln frames on start up. Those would probably beat the jabs because of that. Remember I'm just starting to do this so my timing isn't perfect either. Shield Grab might be able to beat it too, but because the range on falco's jab is so insane, we should learn to mix up between one jab and two(one pulls in slightly and two pushes away slightly)
i guess i could say im getting slightly better. but can you put up a vid of it please?
 

Tommy_G

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I'll try to get a video up, but like I said, I'm not perfect at it....Also my wii is being fixed. I should have it sometime next week. Monday probably
 

Vlade

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I've pretty much learnt how to do the jab cancel now. All I have to do is find ways to implement it as part of my game.

Thanks Tommy_G for this.
 
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