3/29-3/30 Hard Knocks Brawl - Orlando

[C@sH Mooney]

Well, once again, Cash Mooney has to john about housing. Thanks guys. =/

 

[Vijin]

Mooney you can stay with u want
Melbourne will be there!

 

[LaughterIsDeadly]

I'm working on the brackets right now. As someone stated before, each station will have it's own mini-tournament going on to make things smoother. Every station will have a name, and we'll put a list up as to who's playing at which station, things will hopefully go a bit smoother.

Does that mean it'll work sort of like pools? what are you doing about losers bracket? are you just going to let winners play out then handel losers? what if other stations finesh way ahead of time, or what if some are lagging behind?

 

[C@sH Mooney]

oh

that'd work I guess

but you guys are pretty far, not sure if I can find a ride.

edit:nvm, my mom said she won't drive to melbourne.


Can anybody else house me for this?

 

[Dumpster]

I'm going to try and stagger start each station so that when one is just about to finish up, I can start the losers bracket on it.

Orginally the tournament was set up for 64 people on 8 Wii's, but with the overwhelming response from both the SB forums as well as our normal customer base, we opted to double the size of the tournament to 128 to better accomidate everyone who wants to join. With that in mind, we're expanding our Wii inventory to 10 specifically for the tournament.

Although the Smash community is adament about having friendlies, as a legitimate business we would never ask customers to bring in their own TV / Wii for any gaming. Even with 5,000 square feet devoted to our gaming center, the liability of customers bringing in their own equipment is too great, and therefor unacceptable.

Please remember, this is our FIRST tournament for Smash Brothers. We know the community was supportive, dedicated and tight knit. We're doing our best to make sure this tournament is enjoyable for all, but we also want to learn from this.

Sunday should be kick arse, but the NEXT tournament will be even better. We're here to stay.

 

[Fenrir VII]

I'm going to try and stagger start each station so that when one is just about to finish up, I can start the losers bracket on it.

Orginally the tournament was set up for 64 people on 8 Wii's, but with the overwhelming response from both the SB forums as well as our normal customer base, we opted to double the size of the tournament to 128 to better accomidate everyone who wants to join. With that in mind, we're expanding our Wii inventory to 10 specifically for the tournament.

Although the Smash community is adament about having friendlies, as a legitimate business we would never ask customers to bring in their own TV / Wii for any gaming. Even with 5,000 square feet devoted to our gaming center, the liability of customers bringing in their own equipment is too great, and therefor unacceptable.

Please remember, this is our FIRST tournament for Smash Brothers. We know the community was supportive, dedicated and tight knit. We're doing our best to make sure this tournament is enjoyable for all, but we also want to learn from this.

Sunday should be kick arse, but the NEXT tournament will be even better. We're here to stay.

What you don't seem to realize is this:

If this first tourney doesn't go well, there won't be a successful next tournament. Look up the response on a Lan center called Extreme-play...that should suffice as proof



Using your language, having a tournament with no matches outside of strict tournament matches is unacceptable. I'm telling you right now that it won't fly for anybody involved. We don't come to these tournaments only for the tournament....I'd even say that's not the main reason. We want our friendlies...we want to have fun playing the game, too.

You are not asking us to bring setups, we are saying that we ARE bringing setups. I don't see how that is any liability of yours.

 

[Frames]

It's not that people are forced to bring wii's, it's that people WANT too. I understand there is some risk involved, especially when dealing with a large scale event like this, but if people choose to bring their stuff, then it's their own fault if it gets stolen or damaged. People enjoy doing friendlies in between matches. If you decide to let people bring wii's in the future, that would be a great way to attract people, since some people show up to tournaments just to play with other people. Regardless of the decision, this will be a good event.

 

[Finch]

Although the Smash community is adament about having friendlies, as a legitimate business we would never ask customers to bring in their own TV / Wii for any gaming.

Seriously, gigs usually has around 10 setups and is 1/3 the size of this tourny. Not even ALLOWING us to bring setups means we will not get to play friendlies at all and as a result this tournament won't be that fun. If you want to be a successful large venue there is no way you can just provide all the setups yourself, especially for the first tournament.

Also, don't expect the local casual players to show up every time after this one. A lot of people will go to one or two, get owned, and not come back. Your dedicated customers for these tournaments will be from smashboards, so you need to listen to us. That's just how it is.

 

[Fenrir VII]

What is bothering me about all of this is the fact that you have probably the best venue I've ever seen, and through either your lack of forethought or ego....one of the two....you are on the verge of ruining this tournament and ruining your credibility as a tournament location. There are a large number of locations that have died as tournament locations simply because of a seeming lack of caring by the management.

I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but some things need to be brought up. First of all, we ARE the Fl Smash tournament community. A large number of us have been attending these things, as well as discussing rules for them, for a number of years now. Yes, Brawl is a new game, but the same website that developed Melee's basic ruleset is still here for Brawl. Just the truth.

It bothers me that with this excuse of "well, it's our first tournament", you have basically disregarded every single bit of advice (advice that we are able to share through a large bit of experience) without second thought. That is simply not the work of a good tournament director.

I'm sorry for this...I will still b e coming to test out this venue...but I must say, I don't have high expectations. Perhaps in time you will learn that listening to the knowledgeable in the thing you are running a tournament for is wise.

I personally hope this doesn't flop...I hope it goes well. I'd hate to see a great venue go to waste.

 

[C@sH Mooney]

You've got a stubborn tournament organizer that doesn't want to listen to his customers. That obviously doesn't help.

Dumpster, if anybody knows what they are talking about, it's Fenrir.

If I can't play friendlies, and teams does not go on, I won't be attending this event. among others. I was intending on bringing at least 3 people with me as well

 

[Frames]

Dumpster, if anybody knows what they are talking about, it's Fenrir.

tru .

 

[Gindler]

Dumpster, I didn't get a conformation email! But I paid the 12 dollars monday, so I have no idea what's going on, can you help me out?

 

[Dumpster]

Dumpster, I didn't get a conformation email! But I paid the 12 dollars monday, so I have no idea what's going on, can you help me out?

PM me your email address. I'll run through the transactions and see what happened.


--

On the big thing of my TD'ing that's going on. I find it a bit disapointing that some of the people on the boards are saying that I'm not listening to the community. I believe it was most of SB that asked for the following that I adjusted:

-Extended from 64 to 128 people
-Online entry
-Full Character Selection
-10 Wii's that we're using (upped from 6)
-Time / Stock adjustment
-Cash prizes over $1000
-Stage Selection
-Double Elimination

Double Elim and upping to 128 are the two main reasons we went to 10 Wii's. If this wasn't a DE tournament, we could be done in no time, and we'd have all night to have friendlies. I hear what you folks are saying, but the way we set this tournament up adjusting to almost all of the suggestions from the community, we've left ourselves little room for friendlies. I'm not saying there will be none. If you guys are desperate, we could drop down to 8 Wii's and have 2 just for FFA friendlies. I hate to be blunt, but there will be no room for customers to bring their own stations in (for this tournament).

I'm by no means saying that, in the future, there will be no friendlies at all the HardKnocks tournaments. We've definatly learned from this tournament that for the next one, we're going to cap it at 64, or perhaps run a 2 day event so that everyone will have plenty of time for friendlies. Beating the dead horse, but again it's my first Smash tournament. I've run CoD4 / Halo / GoW / WC3 / DotA / CS / DoD / SC tournaments (EDIT= Also softball / football / baseball tournaments). Good for me right? None of them want to bring in their own setups for friendlies. That's because all the gamers on that end are just there to win. I have honestly been suprised how close this community is. The only way I'll be able to prove myself though won't be with letting people bring their own setups to this tournament. Adjustments will be made though, and the next one will be much more user friendly.

I won't be suprised if we lose some favor with the SB community, but we're not going to stop running the tournaments. There will be more, and they will all have real prizes and be fun in the process. We'll learn from our mistakes and make them better.


**Edit** Be gentle on the ripping apart of the post. I know it's coming, it's happened every time ***

PS We're down to 15 slots.

PPS Gamestop Regional tournament is Saturday. Winner goes on to Cali. Come check it out if you're in the area.

 

[dguy6789]

Although there are a few things we would like such as friendlies, I will say that they have indeed listened to a lot of our requests already, and for that, I am grateful.

 

[Finch]

Yes, thank you for all you've done for us. We are demanding and the smash community is really different from games that have online play. We love tournament friendlies because we don't have the opportunity to play anyone whenever we want, which is untrue of any of the other games you listed you've run tournaments for. I supposed we can survive this one without friendlies.

Don't reserve Wiis for FFA friendlies. The only people that want to play FFAs are the ones who wont make it out of pools, and it would make the tourny much slower anyway.

 

[xYz]

this tournament is gonna be nuts!!

hey dumpster, are you going to have alot of chairs?
i dontl like to play a tournament match standing up.

 

[Luigi_Factor]

Don't reserve Wiis for FFA friendlies. The only people that want to play FFAs are the ones who wont make it out of pools, and it would make the tourny much slower anyway.

That is the most real thing I have read so far.

After reading this thread, I am disgusted at how many people call themselves Men, yet are able to complain better than any girl on Laguna Beach.

If you want Casual Matches, follow this simple guide:

1. Put TV in car
2. Get a 2 slot 800 watt Power Inverter
3. Hook wii + tv to power inverter
4. Hold hands and spoon each other as you can now play brawl outside
5. Thank me for pointing out how stupid you all are

Out of all the tournament threads and casual get togethers, this is the only one that doesnt offer the casual matches. Get those tears out of your eyes and move on. Either you are here to win money, or not.

My guess is... the louder the dog barks, the less vicious his bite.

we all know they are attending for the money. People will still flock here regardless if you have zero tvs for casual play or 100. They are just looking for excuses to say GB is better, because they let them spoon each other inside, in the AC. If i were going to this, I would NOT want to hear this relentless B.I.T.C.Hing about nothing.

STOP LOOKING FOR EXCUSES TO COMPLAIN!

I hear all the EMO kids play Guilty Gear... Seems right up your alley if you know what i mean Maybe if your lucky you can attend one of their "Lets cut ourselves over the painful life of SolBadGuy" Friendlies

 

[_Riot_]

After reading this thread, I am disgusted at how many people call themselves Men, yet are able to complain better than any girl on Laguna Beach.

If you want Casual Matches, follow this simple guide:

1. Put TV in car
2. Get a 2 slot 800 watt Power Inverter
3. Hook wii + tv to power inverter
4. Hold hands and spoon each other as you can now play brawl outside
5. Thank me for pointing out how stupid you all are

Out of all the tournament threads and casual get togethers, this is the only one that doesnt offer the casual matches. Get those tears out of your eyes and move on. Either you are here to win money, or not.

My guess is... the louder the dog barks, the less vicious his bite.

we all know they are attending for the money. People will still flock here regardless if you have zero tvs for casual play or 100. They are just looking for excuses to say GB is better, because they let them spoon each other inside, in the AC. If i were going to this, I would NOT want to hear this relentless B.I.T.C.Hing about nothing.

STOP LOOKING FOR EXCUSES TO COMPLAIN!

I hear all the EMO kids play Guilty Gear... Seems right up your alley if you know what i mean Maybe if your lucky you can attend one of their "Lets cut ourselves over the painful life of SolBadGuy" Friendlies

Your posts make me like you less everytime, i cant pin point why. Myabe its your sickly obvious "pro" statusssssss.

As for the case for this venue, i see alot of people confusing being professional with "ego", the fact is gigs is just a LAN center. Those arnt extreme in the whole "upholding a standard" in the way a actual business is concerned. Plus if the tourny fails, i hear they have sick *** laser tag. Seriously though, probably freindlies will be cut to a minimum, but the game play should be abundant, those on this forum should be the people who make it into the top 30 players considering. Which makes plenty of actual tourny matches. I think the only thing i can agree with luigi_factor is: Stop complaining. They will ultimately run their tourny in the way they think looks best for the customers, participants, and for their company image. If it fails im sure they will rectify it in the future.

 

[Luigi_Factor]

Thats cool buddy. You dont have to like me. I dont even know you! If I attend something, its to win the money. If you attend, because thats the only way you can play other people... So be it. We both have different goals. You play for fun, I play for money. Whatever floats your boat.

But remember girls, TRY not to be as annoying as possible to the tournament director. I hear its easier to sway them that way.

 

[C@sH Mooney]

That is the most real thing I have read so far.

After reading this thread, I am disgusted at how many people call themselves Men, yet are able to complain better than any girl on Laguna Beach.

If you want Casual Matches, follow this simple guide:

1. Put TV in car
2. Get a 2 slot 800 watt Power Inverter
3. Hook wii + tv to power inverter
4. Hold hands and spoon each other as you can now play brawl outside
5. Thank me for pointing out how stupid you all are

Out of all the tournament threads and casual get togethers, this is the only one that doesnt offer the casual matches. Get those tears out of your eyes and move on. Either you are here to win money, or not.

My guess is... the louder the dog barks, the less vicious his bite.

we all know they are attending for the money. People will still flock here regardless if you have zero tvs for casual play or 100. They are just looking for excuses to say GB is better, because they let them spoon each other inside, in the AC. If i were going to this, I would NOT want to hear this relentless B.I.T.C.Hing about nothing.

STOP LOOKING FOR EXCUSES TO COMPLAIN!

I hear all the EMO kids play Guilty Gear... Seems right up your alley if you know what i mean Maybe if your lucky you can attend one of their "Lets cut ourselves over the painful life of SolBadGuy" Friendlies

This may just be the best post you've made in over 6 years

congratulations.

 

[Fenrir VII]

blah blah blah

If i were going to this,


blah blah blah

So...why are you posting again?

 

[Luigi_Factor]

Thanks Cash! I hear I stole your spot as the #1 hated person in FL. Sorry, thats just the way the cookie crumbles.

I understand you may forget to wash your hands after doing a number two, but come on man. Thats really disrespectful, I gave you a perfect solution to your casual matches and there is no appreciation? Why do I even bother with you scrubs...

See, just because you say you are the quote-unquote "Top Dog" doesn't mean you can rule over everybody.

That is for me, and me alone.



EDIT ---> Word on the street is, that Fenrir is not as good as he claims. Maybe because he knows he sucks now, and needs all the practice he can get.

 

[C@sH Mooney]

Thanks Cash. I hear I stole your spot as the #1 hated person. Sorry, thats just the way the cookie crumbles.

shit, i could care less. take that spot, and keep it if you want hahaha

 

[Misto-Roboto]

Hey, due to an issue with my work schedule which I took every avenue to change I won't be able to make it. Will I be able to retract my spot along with the money I put down on it?

 

[Gindler]

PM me your email address. I'll run through the transactions and see what happened.


--

On the big thing of my TD'ing that's going on. I find it a bit disapointing that some of the people on the boards are saying that I'm not listening to the community. I believe it was most of SB that asked for the following that I adjusted:

-Extended from 64 to 128 people
-Online entry
-Full Character Selection
-10 Wii's that we're using (upped from 6)
-Time / Stock adjustment
-Cash prizes over $1000
-Stage Selection
-Double Elimination

Double Elim and upping to 128 are the two main reasons we went to 10 Wii's. If this wasn't a DE tournament, we could be done in no time, and we'd have all night to have friendlies. I hear what you folks are saying, but the way we set this tournament up adjusting to almost all of the suggestions from the community, we've left ourselves little room for friendlies. I'm not saying there will be none. If you guys are desperate, we could drop down to 8 Wii's and have 2 just for FFA friendlies. I hate to be blunt, but there will be no room for customers to bring their own stations in (for this tournament).

I'm by no means saying that, in the future, there will be no friendlies at all the HardKnocks tournaments. We've definatly learned from this tournament that for the next one, we're going to cap it at 64, or perhaps run a 2 day event so that everyone will have plenty of time for friendlies. Beating the dead horse, but again it's my first Smash tournament. I've run CoD4 / Halo / GoW / WC3 / DotA / CS / DoD / SC tournaments (EDIT= Also softball / football / baseball tournaments). Good for me right? None of them want to bring in their own setups for friendlies. That's because all the gamers on that end are just there to win. I have honestly been suprised how close this community is. The only way I'll be able to prove myself though won't be with letting people bring their own setups to this tournament. Adjustments will be made though, and the next one will be much more user friendly.

I won't be suprised if we lose some favor with the SB community, but we're not going to stop running the tournaments. There will be more, and they will all have real prizes and be fun in the process. We'll learn from our mistakes and make them better.


**Edit** Be gentle on the ripping apart of the post. I know it's coming, it's happened every time ***

PS We're down to 15 slots.

PPS Gamestop Regional tournament is Saturday. Winner goes on to Cali. Come check it out if you're in the area.

Yeah we are alot more tightknit than most other communities (good for us, right?)

But as for accommodation to stage selection

Stages for Counterpick:

* Mario Cicuit
* Bridge of Eldin
* Great Sea
* Norfair
* Frigate Orpheon
* Pictochat
* Green Hill Zone
* Yoshi's Island
* Rainbow Cruise

All of these levels are confusing to most of us on the board because things happen during the fight to interfere (flipping upside down, killer bombs flying at you, ships crashing, or having go karts coming at you) or are a walk off. So if you could take a final look at these levels and what most people think about them I'm sure we'll all be grateful. Thank you sir for everything you've already done btw.

and I was as gentle as I could be with the "ripping"

 

[Dumpster]

I've honestly debated in getting rid of all the counter-pick stages all together. It would solve a few issues with the levels that are in there anyway. I have until tomorrow to decide on that. Suggestions?

 

[Finch]

Counterpicks are fine. The game is new so every tourny is going to have different rules for stages for awhile, and we'll never make a good list until we try everything. Although I don't agree 100% with the list, this early in the metagame it doesn't matter. Just keep it.

 

[C@sH Mooney]

This should be your list.

3 stock, 6 minute time limit

STAGES:
RANDOM:
SmashVille
BattleField
Pokemon Stadium 1
Final Destination
Delfino Plaza
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)

COUNTERPICKS:
BattleShip Halberd
Onett
Corneria
Rainbow Cruise
Brinstar
Green Greens
Luigi's Mansion
Castle Siege
Lylat Cruise
Frigate Orpheon
PictoChat
Jungle Japes


BANNED:
Distant planet
Bridge of Eldin
Port Town Aero Dive
Mario Circuit
Temple
Yoshi's Island Melee
New Pork City
Warioware
Big Blue
Pokemon Stadium 2
Mushroomy Kingdom
Rumble Falls
The Summit
Norfair
Spear Pillar
75m
Mario Bros
Shadow Moses
Pirate Ship
Flat Zone 2
Elektroplankton
Green hill Zone

 

[Finch]

This should be your list.

3 stock, 6 minute time limit

STAGES:
RANDOM:
SmashVille
BattleField
Pokemon Stadium 1
Final Destination
Delfino Plaza
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)

COUNTERPICKS:
BattleShip Halberd
Onett
Corneria
Rainbow Cruise
Brinstar
Frigate Orpheon
SkyWorld
Green Greens
Luigi's Mansion
Castle Siege
Lylat Cruise


BANNED:
PictoChat
Distant planet
Bridge of Eldin
Jungle Japes
Port Town Aero Dive
Mario Circuit
Temple
Yoshi's Island Melee
New Pork City
Warioware
Big Blue
Pokemon Stadium 2
Mushroomy Kingdom
Rumble Falls
The Summit
Norfair
Spear Pillar
75m
Mario Bros
Shadow Moses
Pirate Ship
Flat Zone 2
Elektroplankton
Green hill Zone

lol skyworld. And Lylat being a counterpick. what an awful list.

 

[C@sH Mooney]

lol skyworld. And Lylat being a counterpick. what an awful list.

i missed skyworld. sorry

lylat cruise is a counter pick due to the bottom of the stage.

also the background is very distracting sometimes.

 

[?!?]

poke stadium 1 on random is horrible thats an obvious counter pick

 

[MysticKenji]

wtf PS2 is not ban-worthy at all
neither are hanenbow or pirate ship

 

[C@sH Mooney]

poke stadium 1 on random is horrible thats an obvious counter pick

why would that be counterpick? it's very neutral. One of the most neutral

wtf PS2 is not ban-worthy at all
neither are hanenbow or pirate ship

for PS2, air stage too good for certain characters, i.e. G&W's 0% uair kill. Conveyor level interrupts fighting too much

wtf is hanenbow

for great sea, too many interferences that often change the outcome for the game. Causes players to pay more attention to the backgrounds at some points than at the fight

 

[QDVS]

I think you should take off all the counterpicks!!!

That's my vote, only neutrals would be the most fair!!!

I'd be content with only these stages on:

Lylat
Final Destination
Battlefield
Yoshi's Story/Island (the SSBB one)
Smashville

 

[OTRU...]

hell yeah im with u andy

stages other than neutrals are way to gay, all of them, no exceptions... and i still think ps2 shouldnt be neutral

 

[C@sH Mooney]

Are you talking about my list or HardKnocks?

 

[Dumpster]

I think you should take off all the counterpicks!!!

That's my vote, only neutrals would be the most fair!!!

I'd be content with only these stages on:

Lylat
Final Destination
Battlefield
Yoshi's Story/Island (the SSBB one)
Smashville

This is just what I was thinking.

 

[dguy6789]

This is just what I was thinking.

Disagree completely. Brawl stages in general are more user friendly than Melee ones were. A tourney with only neutrals greatly makes things less interesting. This list works just fine for me.

Neutrals:

Battlefield
Final Destination
Yoshi's Island
Lylat Cruise
Smashville
Pokemon Stadium


Counterpicks:

Port Town
Norfair
Pokemon Stadium 2
Luigi's Mansion
Delfino Plaza
Castle Siege
Pirate Ship
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Green Hill Zone
Coneria
Jungle Japes
Green Greens
Bridge of Eldin
Rainbow Cruise
Brinstar
Onett
Yoshi's Island Melee
Distant Planet
Mario Circuit
Pictochat
Shadow Moses Island


Banned:

Big Blue
Skyworld
Mushroomy Kingdom
Rumble Falls
New Pork City
Summit
75M
Mario Bros. Old
Flat Zone 2
Hanenbow
Hyrule Temple
WarioWare
Spear Pillar

 

[Rohins]

Disagree completely. Brawl stages in general are more user friendly than Melee ones were. A tourney with only neutrals greatly makes things less interesting. This list works just fine for me.

Neutrals:

Battlefield
Final Destination
Yoshi's Island
Lylat Cruise
Smashville
Pokemon Stadium


Counterpicks:

Port Town
Norfair
Pokemon Stadium 2
Luigi's Mansion
Delfino Plaza
Castle Siege
Pirate Ship
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Green Hill Zone
Coneria
Jungle Japes
Green Greens
Bridge of Eldin
Rainbow Cruise
Brinstar
Onett
Yoshi's Island Melee
Distant Planet
Mario Circuit
Pictochat
Shadow Moses Island


Banned:

Big Blue
Skyworld
Mushroomy Kingdom
Rumble Falls
New Pork City
Summit
75M
Mario Bros. Old
Flat Zone 2
Hanenbow
Hyrule Temple
WarioWare
Spear Pillar

This list looks solid to me. Only changes I'd make (and honestly more out of personal preference) would be moving PS1 to counterpick and possibly banning shadow moses since you pretty much will just be spending time breaking walls.

 

[?!?]

pk1 is not neutral play a DDD in the rock level and see what I mean and the windmill is gay