Q&A Zero Suit Samus- Quick Question, Quick Answer Thread

[Otterz]

if b-throw does combo into d-special do you know what % it works at?

To be honest I'm not sure if its a true combo, but if they aren't expecting it and don't air dodge its a free stock. There are sometimes my friends say they can't air dodge but I can't remember the percents, sorry. Maybe 40%~50% depending on weight/rage? Maybe someone more knowledgeable about this can help.

 

[Peahnuts]

It does actually true combo if they're DI'ing into the stage at a certain percent range, varies quite a bit character to character. But I don't think it true combos at all on certain characters like Pikachu. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[MoosyDoosy]

Do you use tap jump Shaya? If so, I made a video of a really easy way to buffer all SH aerials. Works great for SH Fairs OoS, I do them quite often using this.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHnTF4GQQDA

Sorry for bringing this up from 2 months ago, but do you srsly use tap jump? I've always been pondering whether I should make the switch or not to button input jumps. I’ve been using tap jump ever since Brawl and I’ve basically had no trouble with any inputs. Like, I even do wavedashes and SHFFLC with tap jump when I play Fox in PM. I get pretty much the same aerial mobility that I see people do with input jumps. Only thing that’s a pain is fast falling SH aerials. o.O Really pondering the switch.

 

[Otterz]

It does actually true combo if they're DI'ing into the stage at a certain percent range, varies quite a bit character to character. But I don't think it true combos at all on certain characters like Pikachu. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Ha! Of course it doesn't on Pikachu!

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

It does, and it works even if they don't DI. The only way to actually fully avoid it at all percent is to DI down.

 

[Project Crysis]

I would just like for someone to tell me when it might link together. Also is down throw up-b and actual thing?

 

[Otterz]

It does, and it works even if they don't DI. The only way to actually fully avoid it at all percent is to DI down.

Really? My friends can always airdodged it, and I'm pretty sure I'm getting the move out ASAP. It's still good as a mixup though.

Also bumping the "is Down Throw to UpB a true combo" question, I'm not sure and I'd like to know. Sometimes it feels good and others it feels like it won't ever combo.

 

[NeoSeth]

Dthrow to Boost Kick does true combo; it depends on DI and how you set up into it. You might have to dash forward before the jump, jump straight away, double jump but Up B super quickly after starting the double jump... there are variables, but it is definitely a thing.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

Really? My friends can always airdodged it, and I'm pretty sure I'm getting the move out ASAP. It's still good as a mixup though.

Also bumping the "is Down Throw to UpB a true combo" question, I'm not sure and I'd like to know. Sometimes it feels good and others it feels like it won't ever combo.

bThrow > flip kick definitely has a true combo percentage range without DI. I do it fairly often.
dThrow > uSpecial is DI dependant but can be a true combo. It's also guaranteed on all fat characters even at kill percent, no matter the DI.

 

[Otterz]

bThrow > flip kick definitely has a true combo percentage range without DI. I do it fairly often.
dThrow > uSpecial is DI dependant but can be a true combo. It's also guaranteed on all fat characters even at kill percent, no matter the DI.

I guess I've wavered away from that percent range then, cause I used to get it consistently. I'll lab it later and find it out for Sheik. This can be tested with the Training Mode combo counter right?

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

I guess I've wavered away from that percent range then, cause I used to get it consistently. I'll lab it later and find it out for Sheik. This can be tested with the Training Mode combo counter right?

yes

 

[Otterz]

yes

I cannot for the life of me get Training Mode to count this as a combo. I've tried numerous percents and even did some shenanigans with the Gamepad and I've air dodged every one. I tried Sonic as well and the results are the same. Unless the CPU automatically DIs down it appears to be air dodgeable, maybe you hit it on unsuspecting opponents (like I do). I really hope I'm wrong because this is a great kill combo.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

I cannot for the life of me get Training Mode to count this as a combo. I've tried numerous percents and even did some shenanigans with the Gamepad and I've air dodged every one. I tried Sonic as well and the results are the same. Unless the CPU automatically DIs down it appears to be air dodgeable, maybe you hit it on unsuspecting opponents (like I do). I really hope I'm wrong because this is a great kill combo.

Just tested it and you're right.
I swear to god that used to be a true combo around 50%
And I still land it so goddamn often, even against high level players

 

[[SKS]Jarp]

Can jab 1 - - > jc up b be shielded?

 

[NeoSeth]

Can jab 1 - - > jc up b be shielded?

Pretty sure it can.

 

[David Viran]

Can jab 1 - - > jc up b be shielded?

It depends. If you hit them while in the air with jab 1 then it's guaranteed on most of the cast. From the ground tho it only truly works on ness and rosa. We should really look into jab 1 -> utilt.

 

[Otterz]

It depends. If you hit them while in the air with jab 1 then it's guaranteed on most of the cast. From the ground tho it only truly works on ness and rosa. We should really look into jab 1 -> utilt.

Utilt is only one frame faster than UpB (3 compared to 4) so unless its that close of a margin that we're missing it by I'm not sure it would work either. However, Utilt is definitely safer than UpB, its a good idea.

 

[David Viran]

One frame can make all the difference.

 

[Otterz]

One frame can make all the difference.

Thats true, I'm not to keen on the frame data stuff, but I've always been a strong doubter of following up after Jab 1 in general. Seems like too much endlag to me.

 

[pichuthedk]

Jab 1 > boost kick should be a mix up I've noticed that I pretty much never do that because I hate being one of those RCO bois when I get him from using up B and whiffing.

HOWEVER when ever I do think in my head "mk so i'ma jab and then up b?" IT WORKS EVERY GOD DAMN TIME.

I swear it must be a series of fortunate attempts or I've stumbled onto but a small fraction of the @DeLux way.

"live by the boost kick die by the boost kick" T.T

Edit* wednesday.

So the strangest thing happened today, I hit a sheik holding the ledge with downtilt.
This kind of has me curious as to whether we can get a list of characters that can murdered this way , Although I could just be ignorant and everyone can be hit from down tilt.

 

[Shaya]

So just putting it out there, but paralyzer is 7 frames safer on shield than it was before at all charges.

 

[jset818]

Hey guys, sorry if this has been asked before. I did a search and couldn't find anything.
When playing against a ZSS, what direction should I DI for the ZSS's upair string? And what direction for the upb boost kick?

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

Hey guys, sorry if this has been asked before. I did a search and couldn't find anything.
When playing against a ZSS, what direction should I DI for the ZSS's upair string? And what direction for the upb boost kick?

Regarding the uAir combo, you should change up your DI to make the ZSS guess how she is supposed to uAir. You need to DI the boost kick down to survive longer at the top.

 

[A17]

So I've heard one commentator says how he's dumbfounded how people still don't know how to DI ZSS's boost kick.

I am one of these people. If I'm caught with the 1st hit box while she is in front of me should I SDI backwards and upon the last kick DI down? If she executes the kick below me, can I SDI out before the last kick connects? And if she executes boost kick when her body is right up against mine, am I pretty much screwed?

I use Link if that helps.

I've seen this question asked previously and the most common response is "it depends"... well I've given examples so I'm hoping someone can fill me in on a concise answer. Thanks.

 

[Jaxas]

So I've heard one commentator says how he's dumbfounded how people still don't know how to DI ZSS's boost kick.

I am one of these people. If I'm caught with the 1st hit box while she is in front of me should I SDI backwards and upon the last kick DI down? If she executes the kick below me, can I SDI out before the last kick connects? And if she executes boost kick when her body is right up against mine, am I pretty much screwed?

I use Link if that helps.

I've seen this question asked previously and the most common response is "it depends"... well I've given examples so I'm hoping someone can fill me in on a concise answer. Thanks.

Alright, so there's 3 parts of boost kick.

The first part is the first hit: if you can SDI+DI this away from ZSS, it can make the rest of the move completely miss.

The second part is all of the weak, rising hits. These you can't really DI much, but it's essentially a 50/50 between in front of ZSS and behind her. If she calls you on which one you pick (or you have a large hurtbox like ,,, etc), you're getting hit.

The third part is the final kick that has a ton of knockback; if this hits, you're going for Survival DI rather than escape DI. Long story short, you wanna follow this:
- Hit at Center Stage: DI Down (angles you down more)
- Hit near the Top Blast Line: Down & Away (angles you down more)
- Near the Side Blast Line: Down & In (angles you up more)
- Hit near the Corner: You're just kinda dead


If any other ZSS mains could verify this that'd be great

 

[Kurri ★]

Would anyone mind explaining how Down-B's hard spike works? Every time I try I either end up doing the soft-spike or the regular kick.

 

[David Viran]

Would anyone mind explaining how Down-B's hard spike works? Every time I try I either end up doing the soft-spike or the regular kick.

When you do the kick out of flip jump there is a spike hit box at the end of her foot. So you pretty much have to space the kick.

 

[Kurri ★]

When you do the kick out of flip jump there is a spike hit box at the end of her foot. So you pretty much have to space the kick.

I just did it three times in a row, thanks!

 

[KuroganeHammer]

What are my best options out of dthrow from 0-30%? Feels like I get punished for hitting uair from some characters.

 

[KingDaiGurren]

Hi (not a ZSS main in any way) but was wondering, why don't ZSS players utilize her crouch more? Not sure how low she gets or even if you guys really need it since she's such a good character anyway but still it feels like her crouch would be useful to a certain extent.

 

[T-bone1]

Hi (not a ZSS main in any way) but was wondering, why don't ZSS players utilize her crouch more? Not sure how low she gets or even if you guys really need it since she's such a good character anyway but still it feels like her crouch would be useful to a certain extent.

One reason might be that we don't have super fast d-tilt. Other characters who frequently utilize their crouch seem to be the ones that frequently d-tilt from their crouch.

 

[KingDaiGurren]

One reason might be that we don't have super fast d-tilt. Other characters who frequently utilize their crouch seem to be the ones that frequently d-tilt from their crouch.

Isn't her down tilt like the swooping kick thingy? I thought that came out relatively fast or was the average speed of most dtilts

 

[T-bone1]

Isn't her down tilt like the swooping kick thingy? I thought that came out relatively fast or was the average speed of most dtilts

I'm not saying it's terrible, but d-tilt comes out at frame 8 and has significant cooldown. It may be alright in certain situations, but it can be punishable. Compared to a lot of other characters, the risk/reward tradeoff for ZSS using a d-tilt is much less favorable.

 

[Peahnuts]

Isn't her down tilt like the swooping kick thingy? I thought that came out relatively fast or was the average speed of most dtilts

The startup is fine, it's the endlag that stops dtilt from being a common tool - when it's basically a less useful version of ftilt and also doesn't lead into anything. In saying that though implementing more crouch/crawl state is something to be explored, if C-stick is set to tilt too we can do any tilt out of a crouch or even jab for some cheese.

What are my best options out of dthrow from 0-30%? Feels like I get punished for hitting uair from some characters.

At low %, uair does indeed have low enough hitstun that some characters can punish you for using it with fast aerials. Fair is a better choice & does more dmg, or you can do a bair as well depending on their DI. Though with rage on certain characters, you can get the uair>uair>upb at under 30%.

 

[David Viran]

I like dtilt kind of because she goes so low during it. Low enough to duck under needles.

 

[Honor]

I have been having trouble since the patch hitting Fox with dthrow to uair to uair? When I dthrow Fox he seems to bounce straight up now instead of slightly in front of me. I've adjusted the timing of my uairs but it's a pain and much much harder to get the uair to boost kick combo.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

What are my best options out of dthrow from 0-30%? Feels like I get punished for hitting uair from some characters.

I always go for bAir or fAir, depending on the size of my opponent. Both are true combos from 0 to way above 30%.

 

[Otterz]

I have been having trouble since the patch hitting Fox with dthrow to uair to uair? When I dthrow Fox he seems to bounce straight up now instead of slightly in front of me. I've adjusted the timing of my uairs but it's a pain and much much harder to get the uair to boost kick combo.

You sure Fox isn't just DI ing in? That is the position someone ends up if they DI our Dthrow in, regardless of character.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Can you chain multiple U-Airs out of D-Throw at low percents? I seem to be having a hard time doing that, for some reason. They either get time to airdodge or attack. Am I supposed to mash it?

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

Can you chain multiple U-Airs out of D-Throw at low percents? I seem to be having a hard time doing that, for some reason. They either get time to airdodge or attack. Am I supposed to mash it?

If you have no rage, you can't do that before ~32% depending on the character.
Go for bAir/fAir out of dThrow instead.