Zero Suit Samus Questions & Answers

[Maestro_]

So consensus then. Thanks guys.

 

[Spaghetti]

guys not sure if this is a thing or if its purely placebo on my part

but i find that if im below the stage and to the left of the ledge and upb and roll the left analog in a right quarter circle it has a higher tendency to snap to the ledge? (and roll to the left if to the right of the ledge)

 

[pichuthedk]

Thanks for the response tesh guess i was dazzled to notice ,

also spaghetti you might right maybe its just based on proximity from the ledge cause ive done that before...well most likely everyone has.

and sigh i was trying cook something up for v115 involving dream laser but i realized its most likely going to be futile and result in getting my,hopes up T.T

 

[infiniteV115]

guys not sure if this is a thing or if its purely placebo on my part

but i find that if im below the stage and to the left of the ledge and upb and roll the left analog in a right quarter circle it has a higher tendency to snap to the ledge? (and roll to the left if to the right of the ledge)

I have no idea what you're talking about but our upB always tethers to the edge under 3 conditions
1: We're upBing without holding up + away from centre of stage (straight up or up+towards centre of stage will cause us to tether to the edge)
2: We haven't tethered to the edge more than 3 times since the last time we were on the ground.
3: We're not too far (this distance doesn't change)

 

[NickRiddle]

Don't forget being under + further than the ledge.

 

[infiniteV115]

What?
You mean under the ledge, but below the stage itself (ie under and 'inside' the stage?)

 

[Heero Yuy]

I'm with V. I don't tap jump b/c Utilt OoS is much, much easier with it off. That, and it also annoys me when I use my 2nd jump on accident.

Anywho, my question is... How do I approach a Falco? Every player I face seems to choose Final Destination, which I BELIEVE gives them the laser camping advantage.

Edit: Herp derp I didn't even realize you were talking about that days ago until now.

 

[Maestro_]

Only times you should use 1 dsmash and then follow up is
-To do the dsmash chain
-Sometimes in dubs
-At low %s if you know you can do dsmash --> nair --> fair on the opponent (pretty sure it's not guaranteed but some opponents suck)
-If 1 dsmash puts them at the perfect % to DAL but 2 gives them too much damage, and you know the DAL will be the higher % followup
-Dsmash --> stage spike/regular spike/footstool offstage
-Gimmicky stuff like the ROB infinite/banana infinite/etc

Otherwise you always use 2 dsmashes --> followup, unless you're going for triple dsmash --> followup (usually uair or airdodge read into something else) at high %s

Just noticed this post... Are you saying it's never the best option to 1 dsmash --> runback turnaround side b? Because I use that to kill near the edge fairly often. Especially when they're off stage slightly.

 

[infiniteV115]

Well if you know it's going to kill then obviously it's fine, I was just saying that you shouldn't do dsmash x1 --> something else because in like almost every scenario you have enough time for 2 dsmashes


But actually on that note you shouldn't dsmash x1 --> anything as a kill (except uair) onstage against a good player, because this can happen. Mr.R was doing that to Quik all day that tourney. 9B did it to Nick Riddle too.
But it only works if you hit them while they're in stun right next to the ground. So if you don't want that to happen, just wait for them to pop out and time your kill move accordingly and it won't work. So if you wait for them to pop out then again dsmash x1 is fine.

Edit: Also I'm pretty sure you get more knockback with dsmash x2 --> bair/fair2 if they're fresh than dsmash x1 --> sideB.

 

[NickRiddle]

What?
You mean under the ledge, but below the stage itself (ie under and 'inside' the stage?)

Yes, that.

 

[infiniteV115]

You can still grab the ledge if you're like a very tiny bit inside the stage. I think it depends on the angle.
Or obv if it's a stage you can go through then you can grab it a lot through the stage.

 

[Maestro_]

But actually on that note you shouldn't dsmash x1 --> anything as a kill (except uair) onstage against a good player, because this can happen.

Glad I didn't find that out the hard way...
Thanks.

 

[pichuthedk]

So before I forget again I've be meaning to ask since this happens to me a lot.
How do I avoid getting the blind spot of Zss' grab?

The amount of times poor Zss has had the derp look on her face in front of someone I was sure I would land the grab on dying seconds later or taking around 30% unnecessarily.

Are there certain conditions that cause this to happen i.e the stun animation people are in from lasers/down smash?

Right now that is one of the more important things i'd like to work on as it happens enough to discourage me from grabbing sometimes.

 

[Tesh]

If there is a hitbox video/gif for ZSS take a good look at where the blindspot is. Aside for the hitbox that just plain goes around tall characters, keep in mind that you should never try to grab characters using low ducks/dtilts or flattened out landing lag animations (like sonic, kirby, puff, snake). The line it grabs in is pretty slim so don't try to grab people slightly above or below you. Shorter characters can sometimes just stand there and your grab will miss (ivysaur wll kill you at 40% if you miss a grab)

Try to tipper your grabs, if people are close enough for that not to be an option, you could just shield drop and punish with something faster than your grab.

 

[Donyoku]

Edit: Herp derp I didn't even realize you were talking about that days ago until now.

Its all good, and why Herp Derp?? lol

Anyways, I see some ZZS using the F-air and connecting it more often in some videos without a d-smash type setup (ie. Nick Riddle, Salem, QuikSilver). I'm wondering what is the spacing like on that because when I try it if I pull back to much I only get the first hit of it or I get to close and just push the person away with the first hit of it. How do I go about getting both hits of the F-air and is it better to try at lower percents or higher? (Situation is that your opponent is in the air with you).

 

[infiniteV115]

You're not supposed to pull back with fair. To get both hits, ideally you do a rising fair, jumping into/towards the opponent.
It usually doesn't work if you're not rising but it does sometimes at low %s, however you still have to be moving towards them.

It's generally easier to connect both hits at lower %s, cause at higher %s the first hit sends them too far away. I'd say do short hop fair until like 80% or so (give or take some % for weight/size of the character) and FH fair afterwards.

 

[pichuthedk]

So a few more questions any suggestions for zss dittos, Aside from the obvious who can troll the other harder?
It's one of my favorite matchups but at the same time one of my most feared matchups.

Because I know how much dsmash and up air hurts...I guess I should throw in the fact that v115 always know where to aim that side-b of his D: .

As for stages to counter-pick I would assume stages you think you play better on since the obvious worst stages are the same.

I suppose I'll just have to work on my weakness for next time we meet since V115 out classes me in just about everything(mobility , stage gimmicks , Character control ect..) XD.

 

[Spaghetti]

if you're bad with the suit pieces pick lylat

because **** lylat

why do all my pieces fall off when i do anything with them

 

[Tesh]

Well everything slopes outward, so even if your juggle pieces up and down, they will roll off of the edges. I hate that stage as Wario too (unless im fighting ZSS).

 

[infiniteV115]

The middle portion won't send your items off unless the ship is tilting

 

[Tesh]

Isn't the ship almost always tilting?

 

[infiniteV115]

I don't believe so

 

[pichuthedk]

mmM so tourney this weekend and im kind of wondering for ways to kill the double dsmash habit i have when i miss or it's shielded.
I'd prefer to avoid being punished as often as i am

 

[1PokeMastr]

Know when it'll hit, and when it won't hit.
If you know it'll hit, go for it.
If you know it won't hit.. like.. miss/ hit shield, don't go for it.

It's like know when you can SHDL -> BDacus with Falco.
You have to know when the lasers will hit.

Good ruck!

 

[Demna]

Any ideas how to ledge-cancel with Zero suits' side B?

 

[infiniteV115]

Press down when the tether is connected to the ledge
Also works for her upB

 

[pichuthedk]

what happens when the person in facing is a troll like you and mind ***** me into thinking it will hit aka i downtilt you, you retreat a bit so i have to adjust for dsmash .

Then you laser to b dacus me. Zzzz always learnin the hard way aren't i . Well i have a goal of 200$ to reach by the weekend so i can get a new controller tired of these 2nd rate relics i am using.

also i better not be ******** and forget to save replays again.

 

[1PokeMastr]

I'll force the save. :>

 

[Demna]

Press down when the tether is connected to the ledge
Also works for her upB

It works sometimes and doesn't other times. Is there a specific timing/position to when/where the tether has to be to press down?

 

[pichuthedk]

I think it definitely is just down like V115 said you can do it before she swings down all the way to when shes hanging on the edge just be careful with the whole fast fall issue if you get trigger happy, Since you might normally want to try and do something with the cancel like pretend your recovering high but fall a bit due to cancelling and re tether at a lower angle

 

[infiniteV115]

It works sometimes and doesn't other times. Is there a specific timing/position to when/where the tether has to be to press down?

Lmao it definitely works all the time. I don't know how, but you're not doing it right. Press down better.

 

[Demna]

Press down better.

I literally laughed for 5 minutes straight after reading this
Best advice ever

 

[Heero Yuy]

I don't get the little combo-punish you do after Dsmashx1 on a character with <40% health. How does it work, again? SH Nair and...?

 

[Demna]

I don't get the little combo-punish you do after Dsmashx1 on a character with <40% health. How does it work, again? SH Nair and...?

You can connect falling aerials to 1xDsmash. However, I recommend 2xDsmashes as it rackes up more damage and can be connected to any aerial of choice. (Fair recommended for max dmg)

 

[infiniteV115]

Under 40% your best bet is to dsmash x2 --> fair (both hits), because it does 39%.

 

[pichuthedk]

I've managed to land nairs on x2 dsmash targets, I guess the falling on depends on the enemies percentage range though. A little practice and you'll get it down

 

[pichuthedk]

zzzZ 13th place why do you haunt me so zzzz. I had 9th place . I get internet on Wednesday so i shall try to upload some replays on the video critique section in the mean,time,can i get some,diddykong pointers i did much better then,i thought,i would i lost a set vs redx and then i faced kobg metal i beat his shiek game one which i was really proud of despite my track record vs him. But then he changed diddy and i feel like,i threw game 2 even though i lost 1 stock 1 stock . Thenya i must have gotten demoralized game 3.

i also lost 10$ mm vs tin man. Although i did alot better then,i expected. Due to his vast exp vs v115 .

 

[infiniteV115]

Yeah you were doing pretty well against Tin, I saw. If you can come to more smashfests I might be able to help you out

 

[pichuthedk]

Ok sounds good that's exactly what i needed to hear in the depths of my despair .
i actually am going to upload some,replays tonight or tomorrow morning
will be a shiek match
game 2 with tin,
game 2 with redx
don't really know what else will go up those are my concerns at the moment

 

[pichuthedk]

Ok sorry to double post but here I'm currently uploading a friendly and game 1 in LB with kong metal i'll do game 3 later since he changes to a different character i really felt like kicking myself for not getting game 2 was super close but i threw.
15 min remamining on upload or something,.
http://youtu.be/mLzeroC6yQw
so Nick already pointed this out but for some reason my recording is playing back like 50% slower.
if anyone has any tips about fixing that it would be appreciate it