Social Zelda Social - Still the queen of Smash...and maybe queen of low tier for a decade, too. Shall we make it two?

[EODM07]

I'll say this. I'm glad that Zelda is now looking really freaking good. Hopefully she'll be viable now compared to her past renditions.

But my only complaint on her design overall, while I think is nice; is just her shoes. They just look off to me. :V

Also, there are some VODs by VGBC where they were having Exhibition matches, and some of them did use Zelda; specifically Larry Lurr and Nairo.

 

[Katy Parry]

We have Larry, Nario, and Leffen showcasing her for us. Literally couldn’t be better.

 

[Berserker.]

it's still possible to fall out of her f-smash and u-smash but that could be fixed (i hope it gets fixed)

 

[Alacion]

it's still possible to fall out of her f-smash and u-smash but that could be fixed (i hope it gets fixed)

It wouldn't be Zelda otherwise.

 

[「 Derk 」]

I love how she finally received all the fixes we asked for and people playing her decide not to use any of it and play her like a rush down character lol. I'd like to see some actual use of phantom slash and din's fire in neutral now that both are much better.

 

[Squii The Fish]

Ah ok

It’s just flashing before it starts, only one hit

It kinda looks like Dair is one long lingering hit box now. Especially from how soft that hit was, Link was able to up b pretty quickly after getting hit.

Ah ok maybe, if so I apologize for the misinformation.

 

[Alacion]

I love how she finally received all the fixes we asked for and people playing her decide not to use any of it and play her like a rush down character lol. I'd like to see some actual use of phantom slash and din's fire in neutral now that both are much better.

To be fair though not everybody plays Zelda the same way. I've always criminally underused her dtilt and phantom and am more inclined to go in.

 

[Gay Ginger]

Nevermind, I'm actually stupid and don't know how to add lmao

 

[otheusrex]

a couple of gyfs here... First one is of the fsmash multihits failing according to tradition
https://gfycat.com/AnxiousEvergreenFireant

second one is of dins fire being used to edgegaurd
https://gfycat.com/EsteemedUnselfishAustralianshelduck


so, with dins fire, even though it looks kinda easy to avoid directly, from what I've heard of the landing lag for directional airdodge (let's call it dAD), Zelda should be able to force people into unsafe landings like in the clip. The video showcases dsmash, but I think any quick move will be an option after forcing a dAD landing: dtilt and single jab might give better followups, for instance. Maybe grabs? This is assuming that the mario in the 2nd video wasn't jsut slow to react and was actually in landing lag.

 

[「 Derk 」]

Finally finished all these! The last one took forever because I had to recolor literally everything lol. Still not 100% happy with how the last one turned out but it was as close as I could get it.

Link for bigger images

 

[otheusrex]

My thoughts on Zelda:

Looks like a solid wall archtype, but this time around, actually functional with walling. Aerials are underwhelming for pressing the offense or comboing, but aSH (auto shorthop) looks to be devastating with her kicks, and her improved airspeed gives her flexibility with using aerials to zone.

https://gfycat.com/MisguidedNeatLeafcutterant
^nair is safe on PS (perfect shield) for instance. At least on some characters. Although, I think at most, this will be less about giving her frame traps and more about giving the Zelda main confidence to throw out attacks in order to defend vs certain options

 

[KlicKlac]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

There was a problem fetching the tweet

So Fallin is saying you get only one airdodge and if you do an directional airdodge, you get put in free fall (momentarily)

Have we seen players do more than one airdodge? Because this makes Dins' Fire really strong at edgeguarding if you only get one.

 

[「 Derk 」]

Only time I have seen multiple air dodges is if someone was hit so I think what they are saying is correct. Din's Fire is insanely good now if that's the case. It's not a matter of someone simple dodging it now. They still can obviously, but doing so leaves them vulnerable to follow ups, making Zelda's trap game amazing now. If you get someone offstage and force them to dodge Din's Fire to burn their dodge it's pretty much a free punish since they can no longer dodge you.

Edit: I don't think it's free fall after directional air dodging though, I think it's just a ton of lag. Pretty sure I have seen people do directional air dodge and then recover afterwords.

 

[DNeon]

For reference the free fall has been debunked

 

[BJN39]

Pretty sure people have been referring to directional air dodge as just having a ton of endlag. Think pit’s S4 Side B.

 

[Squii The Fish]

a couple of gyfs here... First one is of the fsmash multihits failing according to tradition
https://gfycat.com/AnxiousEvergreenFireant

Hey Elf Otheus can I steal dis gyfy and post it on twitter? ill credit yeah

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Zelda's new phantom seems really cool, I was thinking it could be used like a ledge trap for edgeguarding maybe? Like you can set it near the ledge while someone is recovering far out so they have something horizontal to avoid, which would force them to recover high or low. And you can combine that with Din's Fire and bc it seems faster now and with the new airdodge mechanics, they'll get hit or you can then try punishing them for airdodging after, which wouldn't be too hard because they were forced to recover in a certain direction and wouldn't have any airdodges left

 

[TearsforFears]

https://youtu.be/uQE9Y5ERvvs?t=13m40s

Here is Bill talking about the Phantom and a short hop lightning kick! I never new Bill was such a Zelda fan :o

 

[.Shìkì]

They really need to fix Zelda's smashes. A read this hard should not be invalidated by such stupidity.


Edit : Zelda v Link on tree house... So many lightening kick sweetspots. Could it be...?

 

[KlicKlac]

Treehouse staff showcased Zelda's new phantom. They didn't actually fight, but just went through the phantom stages.

It has 4 stages.
stage 1 - kick
stage 2 - punch
stage 3 - sideways slash
stage 4 - upwards slash

Some phantom properties that need to be tested:
-Health of phantom stages
-Windbox properties
-Wall properties
-Respawn time

EDIT: Now they are playing zelda in a match!

 

[Kyle B]

Treehouse staff actually showcased Zelda's new phantom.

It has 4 stages.
stage 1 - kick
stage 2 - punch
stage 3 - sideways slash
stage 4 - upwards slash

Time Edits: Zelda vs Link starts at 4:41:45
Yep, and she played her semi decently I could hear them actually become more interested as the match went on.
Some more sweetspot stuff:
Lightning kicks: 73-98.2 (15.2) bair [4:42:42], 112-137.2 (25.2) fair kills[4:43:26], 39-61.4 (22.4) fair [4:43:54], 21.7-43.6 (21.9) bair[4:44:23], 58.6-78.7 (20.1) bair[4:44:49]
F-air and B-air seem to mostly stay at 20-22, but outliers like 15/25 appear fairly often and worry me...I wonder what could be making the damage shift in the range of 10...?
Every F-air and B-air sweetspot is on frame 6
Wind sweetspots: 140.8-155.9 (15.1) Kills easily [4:43:35], 158.9-169(10.1) Kills easily [4:45:18]
Wind seems to still have that quality that when it hits an object it scales up (you can follow some sparkles to see Zelda traveling, and when it hits the train it shoots up at an angle, speeding up to recover lost time) [4:43:35]
Edited times for every action I detailed, the video decided to jump forward an hour randomly, so I had to redo it. Let me know if it happens again...

 

[Alacion]

Gasp! Did Bill Trinen abandon Rosalina for Zelda!?

 

[Kyle B]

ignore my comment lol, I'm deaf apparently, wish I could remove lol, new to commenting in this
Edit: Zelda board activity too op, my brain must have added in the part about him playing Zelda in melle *Shrug*
SuperEdit: Sorry Alacion lol...

 

[Alacion]

Nvm 10char

 

[McKnightlíght]

Ok so it does look like she'll be garbage unless they fix a ton before release, I'm relieved.

 

[CodeBlue_]

Ok so it does look like she'll be garbage unless they fix a ton before release, I'm relieved.

>Relieved

I'm sorry am I reading this wrong or are we on the next level of self-deprecation with Zelda?

 

[Gay Ginger]

Is it just me or did the Lightning Kicks seem to have less knockback? Or maybe it was just due to the stage being tough for Zelda as they mentioned?

 

[KlicKlac]

Treehouse demonstrated Zelda's new Phantom Knight, and later have a Zelda vs Link match.

You can see that the fully charged phantom can be released immediately or held for a second while Zelda moves first before it launches.

My guess is you press down b to start building phantom, and press down b again to launch it. Or just let the phantom complete and it fires after waiting a second.

 

[McKnightlíght]

>Relieved

I'm sorry am I reading this wrong or are we on the next level of self-deprecation with Zelda?

If Zelda was good then I would have no excuse for losing.

 

[KlicKlac]

If Zelda was good then I would have no excuse for losing.

Bro, when you choose to play a bad character, saying you lost because you play a bad character is not a good excuse.

 

[Luminario]

Treehouse demonstrated Zelda's new Phantom Knight, and later have a Zelda vs Link match.

You can see that the fully charged phantom can be released immediately or held for a second while Zelda moves first before it launches.

My guess is you press down b to start building phantom, and press down b again to launch it. Or just let the phantom complete and it fires after waiting a second.

I'm pretty sure they're just releasing B as soon as the Phantom is fully built. There seems to be a tiny window to release full Phantom straight away before it auto-cancels and it delays.
I really hope these small changes that we've asked for for decades now finally pay off and make her viable.

 

[KlicKlac]

I'm pretty sure they're just releasing B as soon as the Phantom is fully built. There seems to be a tiny window to release full Phantom straight away before it auto-cancels and it delays.
I really hope these small changes that we've asked for for decades now finally pay off and make her viable.

Yeah, it seems like there is really 5 phantom stages.
stage 1 - kick
stage 2 - punch
stage 3 - sideways slash
stage 4 - big upwards swing
stage 5 -delay, then big upwards swing

Now I want to know if zelda do perform any cancel while charging the knight. Like a shield or jump cancel that other characters with charging specials can do.

 

[TumblrFamous]

I know this was already talked about a little on the previous page, but this was dope as ****. And we need to discuss it more.

Literal queen of mind games.

 

[「 Derk 」]

The move looks very awkward when it's released early. Floating parts of the phantom looks like a bad mod from someone that took fixing Zelda into their own hands lol. Hopefully Sakurai fixes that in the final version. Put like a ghost phantom inside that equips the armor pieces or something idk.

 

[McKnightlíght]

Bro, when you choose to play a bad character, saying you lost because you play a bad character is not a good excuse.

Zelda chose me.

 

[Ffamran]

Zelda chose me.

I always knew Zelda was a thug.

 

[KlicKlac]

Zelda chose me.

A Zelda player should be hoping Zelda gets improved in Smash Ultimate. From your initial post, it sounds like you are playing Zelda because she is bad.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

A Zelda player should be hoping Zelda gets improved in Smash Ultimate. From your initial post, it sounds like you are playing Zelda because she is bad.

Well, yes that's precisely the reason he's playing her. It's not rocket science.

 

[McKnightlíght]

I hope she continues to be a dumpster fire. It's what makes her special.

 

[KlicKlac]

I hope she continues to be a dumpster fire. It's what makes her special.

Zelda definitely has gotten some buffs, but admittedly so has a lot of the cast, so I wonder where she will fall on the Smash Ultimate tier list.