Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[Rickster]

daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayum gorl

I'd like to believe, but I have a hard time answering the question "Who is Zelda better than?"

I think Nairo's done enough at this point to show that even if she's bottom of bottom she's still usable though. Either that or he's just exposing everyone's matchup knowledge badly, anyway.

Instead of looking at it like "which chars are we better than", I look at her as being roughly on par with a majority of the cast (read: not top tiers). But imo there's no way we're bottom this time. Low at worst, but I think we have a good shot at mid, especially if we keep discovering techs like the Love Jump v2.

 

[Macchiato]

daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayum gorl

I'd like to believe, but I have a hard time answering the question "Who is Zelda better than?"

I think Nairo's done enough at this point to show that even if she's bottom of bottom she's still usable though. Either that or he's just exposing everyone's matchup knowledge badly, anyway.

SHe's better than

 

[Berserker.]

SHe's better than

Lol

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

SHe's better than

Zelda better than Ganon?

****, that's new to me
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Farorae]

SHe's better than

Wot

 

[Gay Ginger]

I look at her as being roughly on par with a majority of the cast (read: not top tiers).

I have a very hard time believing this

 

[Berserker.]

I have a very hard time believing this

It kinda helps that while 50% of the cast hasn't been used in a tournament, Zelda has been used and she's won at most occasions when she is used

I guess I'm a sucker for results

 

[Rickster]

SHe's better than

Ok that's pushing it a bit far sis...

I have a very hard time believing this

So Beserker pretty much said what I was gonna say, lol. But I don't know what else to say except that I think she's on par. But we all have differing opinions, which is just fine.

 

[Gay Ginger]

It kinda helps that while 50% of the cast hasn't been used in a tournament, Zelda has been used and she's won at most occasions when she is used

I guess I'm a sucker for results

I'm basing my feelings mostly off of For Glory matches that I've played so I admit my opinion might not be too great, but it just seems that Zelda has more weaknesses than most of the cast. Whereas I feel a lot of the cast is relatively balanced between strengths/weaknesses, Zelda has crippling flaws that I just don't see present in most other characters...

 

[Lavani]

Instead of looking at it like "which chars are we better than", I look at her as being roughly on par with a majority of the cast (read: not top tiers). But imo there's no way we're bottom this time. Low at worst, but I think we have a good shot at mid, especially if we keep discovering techs like the Love Jump v2.

That's one way to look at it, I suppose.

I tend to break smash 4's cast up into thirds when I compare it though, and I don't see Zelda being in the upper two thirds.

SHe's better than

 

[Lozjam]

SHe's better than

Whoa whoa whoa there. Hold it.
First, Ganondorf is better than Zelda, no question about it. We have seen significant tourney results, buffs, and a true knowledge of play style.. We also have better MU's that are less polarizing than Zelda's. Also, Shulk and fricken Diddy Kong? Shulk hasn't been doing that great, but people haven't learned his true potential, but fricken Diddy Kong! That thing is upper mid at the very worst!
Listen, I respect you as a player, but you are being extremely foolish and stupid. You have to be real whilst looking at things, but that doesn't mean you can't be optimistic either. This is just foolish.

 

[Farorae]

It kinda helps that while 50% of the cast hasn't been used in a tournament, Zelda has been used and she's won at most occasions when she is used

I guess I'm a sucker for results

Honestly I think it's because the few who use her are actually dedicated to her, so not as many people are going to pick her up as those who will just pick sheik/diddy,etc just bc they are top tier

 

[Berserker.]

To be fair, Jr. can't do **** against anyone's shield bubble

Shulk hasn't been doing that great, but people haven't learned his true potential, but fricken Diddy Kong! That thing is upper mid at the very worst!

Diddy's top tier at worst

Shulk can't be doing that great when we haven't seen one in a while so basically, he hasn't done anything. This is why I've been wondering why people have such a godlike opinion on him

 

[Ffamran]

Play with Stereo Surround Sound. It is one of the most amazing experiences ever.

I hate FPS's, I never play them, yet I love the Prime series. Why? Prime isn't a first person shooter. It is an exploration, action, puzzle, and adventure game that is in the first person perspective. Yeah, there's shooting, but it definitely isn't like a FPS. Defeating Enemies is like a puzzle, like in the 2D metroids, so the actual shooting isn't exactly the main focus. If you like 3D Zelda's, you are most likely going to adore Metroid Prime.
Also, Metroid Prime has to be the most atmospheric game I have ever played.

I think you'd love Mirror's Edge and A Story About My Uncle then. Maybe the Thief games too. Perhaps The Elder Scrolls and Fallout 3 and onwards games too. Maybe the Deus Ex games? They're less about shooting/combat and more about exploring, parkour, and thievery.

 

[Furret]

Soo, I got laid off today. Actually, about half of the people in my job did. Oil is doing very bad and yeah.

If you guys don't hear from me in the next month or so, I'll probably be living in a cardboard box.

guess this is what happens after I leave for a few hours. Not to be an airhead, but I am one of those people who believes everything works itself out in the end. You'll get on your feet, so long as you work for it

Figured fsmash had a high enough launch angle to survive with DI up and toward the stage, but lol ok close enough


Generally I hate alcohol

And I abhor anyone that drinks just to get drunk

But rum is just delicious

i'm more of a rum and coke kinda person

ugh my internets not working well

my game cube wasn't working one day, after 20+ minutes, I punch it and it started working. Oh I love old nintendo

 

[Macchiato]

Whoa whoa whoa there. Hold it.
First, Ganondorf is better than Zelda, no question about it. We have seen significant tourney results, buffs, and a true knowledge of play style.. We also have better MU's that are less polarizing than Zelda's. Also, Shulk and fricken Diddy Kong? Shulk hasn't been doing that great, but people haven't learned his true potential, but fricken Diddy Kong! That thing is upper mid at the very worst!
Listen, I respect you as a player, but you are being extremely foolish and stupid. You have to be real whilst looking at things, but that doesn't mean you can't be optimistic either. This is just foolish.

Diddy kong was a joke lol

 

[Berserker.]

That list was a joke lol

Fixed

 

[Ffamran]

SHe's better than

Hey, hey. Hey. I resent that as a SSB4 Falco mod and @ Lozjam 's probably going to give you a lecture about the Almighty, Beloved Neko-Lord King of Evil Shenanigans III. I also defend underdogs like Wii Fit Trainer - WOO, go TKBreezy! - and Meta Knight - people asked for him to be nerfed and now they're complaining about it... As for Samus, well, I like Samus. I mean, she has a missiles and bombs! Who doesn't like explosions?! Poyo's Kirby is hilarious and GimR's Mr. Game & Watch is outrageously funny. And Ike's well, Ike.

See? See?! SEEEEEEE!!! Lozjam just gave you a lecture!

Whoa whoa whoa there. Hold it.
First, Ganondorf is better than Zelda, no question about it. We have seen significant tourney results, buffs, and a true knowledge of play style.. We also have better MU's that are less polarizing than Zelda's. Also, Shulk and fricken Diddy Kong? Shulk hasn't been doing that great, but people haven't learned his true potential, but fricken Diddy Kong! That thing is upper mid at the very worst!
Listen, I respect you as a player, but you are being extremely foolish and stupid. You have to be real whilst looking at things, but that doesn't mean you can't be optimistic either. This is just foolish.

 

[Lavani]

i'm more of a rum and coke kinda person

me too

I mean I could drink this straight but it's both cheaper and tastier to mix it

To be fair, Jr. can't do **** against anyone's shield bubble

Diddy's top tier at worst

Shulk can't be doing that great when we haven't seen one in a while so basically, he hasn't done anything. This is why I've been wondering why people have such a godlike opinion on him

I still don't know what to think about Koopalings because they have some crazy **** and some exploitably vulnerable stuff as well, and I haven't seen enough tournament results to consider where they belong. I wouldn't exactly be surprised if they're worse than Zelda, but I'd like to think disjoints never go out of style.

Most of the Shulk hype is fueled by his massive range, low landing lag nair, and versatility due to Monado Arts I'm sure. People don't consider the frame data.

Mega Man/Wario/Meta Knight/Ike were the main ones that made me smirk.

 

[Cenizas]

Plus, Samus does have the best victory theme in the game. I dunno if Zelda can compete with that.

 

[Macchiato]

Plus, Samus does have the best victory theme in the game. I dunno if Zelda can compete with that.

Her sass can

 

[Berserker.]

There's a reply in the Rosalina Mu thread @ Macchiato

Do your thing again

Most of the Shulk hype is fueled by his massive range, low landing lag nair, and versatility due to Monado Arts I'm sure. People don't consider the frame data.

That's what I'm thinking but there are those times when people overblow how his frame data is bad which makes him bottom/low tier. Shulk has lag. That's like, instant-not godlike anymore. Shulk's great though because he has a lot of things going for him but he has some noticeable disadvantages like being combo fodder, his recovery being easy to gimp, and his lag (High tier-Mid tier range sounds reasonable at this moment) but not top tier. Lmao

 

[Soul.]

Whoa whoa whoa there. Hold it.
First, Ganondorf is better than Zelda, no question about it. We have seen significant tourney results, buffs, and a true knowledge of play style.. We also have better MU's that are less polarizing than Zelda's. Also, Shulk and fricken Diddy Kong? Shulk hasn't been doing that great, but people haven't learned his true potential, but fricken Diddy Kong! That thing is upper mid at the very worst!
Listen, I respect you as a player, but you are being extremely foolish and stupid. You have to be real whilst looking at things, but that doesn't mean you can't be optimistic either. This is just foolish.

>diddy
>upper mid at worst
cool story bro 10/10 for effort though diddy will never get out of top tier

Brawl Diddy > Smash 4 Diddy though

 

[Cenizas]

Her sass can

Not if you have a regal trumpet posse making everything you do sound that much cooler.

 

[Rickster]

Lol what's happening in that MU thread...?

 

[Macchiato]

There's a reply in the Rosalina Mu thread @ Macchiato

Do your thing again

I'm on it

 

[Lavani]

There's a reply in the Rosalina Mu thread @ Macchiato

Do your thing again

That's what I'm thinking but there are those times when people overblow how his frame data is bad which makes him bottom/low tier. Shulk has lag. That's like, instant-not godlike anymore. Shulk's great though because he has a lot of things going for him but he has some noticeable disadvantages like being combo fodder, his recovery being easy to gimp, and his lag (High tier-Mid tier range sounds reasonable at this moment) but not top tier. Lmao

Psych's pretty great

And yeah, reasonably I see Shulk being somewhere in the 15~30 range. Frame data bad, massive disjoints good, recovery bad, monado arts amazing. Really basic analysis but it feels like it averages out somewhere around (upper-)mid.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I'd like to believe, but I have a hard time answering the question "Who is Zelda better than?"

Mii Swordfighter.

Maybe.

 

[Berserker.]

I recommend everyone to STAY away from using Diddy. I was thinking for several hours on whether I should second this guy or not because his throw combos felt so villainous and satisfying to land.

STAY AWAY FROM DIDDY. You'll feel like a maniac

Lol what's happening in that MU thread...?

I can smell that the MU thread will stay with the Zelda discussion until one of them give up

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

SHe's better than

I needed a laugh tho and you delivered, thx Macchiato :^)

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

SHe's better than

Decided to fix it for the sake of fixing it

 

[Lavani]

Mii Swordfighter.

Maybe.

I think swordfighter gets more crap than he deserves.

But yeah, maybe.

 

[Ffamran]

The only thing I like about Shulk is that his Monado Arts reminds me of Dante's Style switching in Devil May Cry 4.

Ha, I found the video that introduced me to Kara no Kyoukai. Here's the song from Kara no Kyoukai that's used in the DMC4 Truestyle Tournament video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7480ZmNOB98.

I recommend everyone to STAY away from using Diddy. I was thinking for several hours on whether I should second this guy or not because his throw combos felt so villainous and satisfying to land.

STAY AWAY FROM DIDDY. You'll feel like a maniac

I can smell that the MU thread will stay with the Zelda discussion until one of them give up

Y'know what's funny? I actually don't know how to use Diddy. The only thing I know about Diddy is D-throw and attempting to land a Uair. Usually, I go for Bair instead and try to land Uairs when people are in the air for some reason. Monkey Flip... yeah, I screw up the move a lot. The Villager, though, takes the cake for I have no idea how the **** you work, followed by Duck Hunt, Olimar, and Rosalina & Luma. Add Jigglypuff to the hodgepodge crew mostly because it just feels weird not having a recovery aside from Rollout. This comes from a player who can do well with Peach, one of the, if not the most technical character in the game.

 

[Nammy12]

I recommend everyone to STAY away from using Diddy. I was thinking for several hours on whether I should second this guy or not because his throw combos felt so villainous and satisfying to land.

STAY AWAY FROM DIDDY. You'll feel like a maniac

I finally faced a Diddy online who knew how to do the Hoo Hah.
I got rekt.
I tried him out in training mode.
Why does this character seem so easy?

 

[Lozjam]

To be fair, Jr. can't do **** against anyone's shield bubble

Diddy's top tier at worst

Shulk can't be doing that great when we haven't seen one in a while so basically, he hasn't done anything. This is why I've been wondering why people have such a godlike opinion on him

The thing about Shulk, is he has so many variables to keep track of. I've nearly finished unlocking the potential of my Ganondorf, and my Link is coming along. Once I have those characters down, I am going to focus on Shulk, I have a pretty good feeling, that the amazing power Ganondorf mains get with hard reads will unlock Shulk. I feel people in the Smash 4 community in general underestimate the power of hard reads.

I think you'd love Mirror's Edge and A Story About My Uncle then. Maybe the Thief games too. Perhaps The Elder Scrolls and Fallout 3 and onwards games too. Maybe the Deus Ex games? They're less about shooting/combat and more about exploring, parkour, and thievery.

I really like Fallout, and ES is very iffy for me. But I like Metroid Prime games(and Zelda games) a lot better.

Hey, hey. Hey. I resent that as a SSB4 Falco mod and @ Lozjam 's probably going to give you a lecture about the Almighty, Beloved Neko-Lord King of Evil Shenanigans III. I also defend underdogs like Wii Fit Trainer - WOO, go TKBreezy! - and Meta Knight - people asked for him to be nerfed and now they're complaining about it... As for Samus, well, I like Samus. I mean, she has a missiles and bombs! Who doesn't like explosions?! Poyo's Kirby is hilarious and GimR's Mr. Game & Watch is outrageously funny. And Ike's well, Ike.

See? See?! SEEEEEEE!!! Lozjam just gave you a lecture!

BAHAHAHAHA!
My King must be defended in his right to the throne! If you would like, I could go more in-depth as well. BAHAHAHAHA!

 

[Lavani]

All of diddy's buttons combo into other buttons and he has inexplicably low startup/endlag on surprisingly strong and disjointed attacks

I'm not sure what's more confusing; that he didn't get nerfed in 1.0.4, that it took people this long to figure out he was dumb, or that 1.0.4 actually buffed him.

 

[Berserker.]

Y'know what's funny? I actually don't know how to use Diddy. The only thing I know about Diddy is D-throw and attempting to land a Uair. Usually, I go for Bair instead and try to land Uairs when people are in the air for some reason. Monkey Flip... yeah, I screw up the move a lot.

I'd chain as much b-airs as I can off from d-throw. Also u-throw -> u-air is the ****. At higher percentages, go for d-throw -> u-air. Monkey flipping + banana = broken. D-throw -> f-air is nuts. Diddy's f-air is legit stupid. After using Diddy, I'd say this is the best f-air in the game by a massive margin. Sheik's f-air is nothing compared to Diddy's f-air

Why does this character seem so easy?

Because he really is easy to use. As for Shulk vs Diddy, I think I've said my piece. Buster/Speed. Respect some moves, unfortunately. Spot dodge. Mid-range strictly/don't rush down/don't play defensively etc. Stuff

 

[Macchiato]

Decided to fix it for the sake of fixing it

I think swordfighter gets more crap than he deserves.

But yeah, maybe.

I needed a laugh tho and you delivered, thx Macchiato :^)

 

[KuroganeHammer]

SHe's better than

help

 

[Lavani]

Diddy's f-air is legit stupid. After using Diddy, I'd say this is the best f-air in the game by a massive margin. Sheik's f-air is nothing compared to Diddy's f-air

I am just going to quote this by itself to make sure people read it.