Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[BJN39]

...In FFAs? LW is junk because you're going to die in like two hits, SS is bad because it puts Palutena right where she doesn't want to be, and Counter's nice because somebody is going to attack you while you land.

...Eaux

I definitely missed the part where this was about FFAs.

brb I'm embarrasseT

 

[TTTTTsd]

I'll be up for the match in about an hour.

I'll be going through some of the Top Tiers as well, to see who I'm better with.

I'm not playing this early in the day. I just woke up fam

 

[meleebrawler]

You can be happy for Samus because this is the best her grab has ever been in Smash period.

Yes, I'm serious.

Well actually she has kill throws in 64 so that's something to consider.

 

[TTTTTsd]

Well actually she has kill throws in 64 so that's something to consider.

Everybody has those in 64 really. Only a few don't IIRC (64 is my fav Smash game ever).

But Samus's grab has been legitimately buffed quite a bit compared to prior entries in terms of frame data in this game. I really don't think it needs to get any better.

Personally after playing with the character, she's so close to being competent it hurts. All she needs is
- Fair hits at autolink angle (if it does already I can't tell)
- Jab1 goes into Jab2 properly (a really solid get off me option that isn't Up+B would be good)
- Super Missiles killing things would be nice.

I also kinda think Screw Attack should kill on-stage at like 130% and not just "near the blastzones or at really really high %s" but I don't know if that's a personal problem or not. I feel like she's close to something good though, very close.

Also EODM07 log onto Skype and we can start whenever you're ready-ish. I might be a bit off cause it's the morn but I'll pick it up as we play.

 

[Dinoman96]

They understand, they just don't care that much. They'd rather keep Sheik viable in FFAs instead of nerfing her for 1v1s, namely.



Nah. Uair/Usmash anything and everything that flies by, Warp to the other side of the stage if somebody tries to go for you. LW is a deathwish and Counter is actually kinda useful, SS is kinda useless but AM and RB are about equal I'd say, EF pretty much makes you a target for just having it, and ditching Warp in any situation besides like Smash Run is pretty dumb.

What am I reading here? Superspeed is useless? Counter is useful but Lightweight is a deathwish? Utter nonsense.

Warp is probably better for vertical recovery, but I prefer Jump Glide as it lets her make interesting approaches with her aerials.

EDIT: Ah, you were talking about FFAs. I kinda agree somewhat but in 1v1s these specials are necessary.

 

[Jaguar360]

I don't know. For one, Ryu's light Ftilt makes his foot partially invincible which no other character I know has. So, Captain Falcon, Fox, Falco, ZSS, Mario, Greninja, Luigi, and Samus basically all have angle-able, but not as safe Ftilts. Or something like how Yoshi's st. grab is frame 14, but his dash and pivot are frame 10 with about 46 and 44 recovery frames to his st. grab's 31. In a way, it's Greninja's situation where his st. and pivot grab is much slower than his dash, but have lower recovery, except in his case, st. grab has 13, pivot has 20, and dash has 27 which are overall lower than most characters.

Speaking of Yoshi, I have no idea what the point of his Ftilt is. It has short range, does 7% or 8% angled, and while it's fast at frame 5, and has 3 active frames, it has 38 total frames. That's 31 recovery frames. For a poke move, that's really bad. At least his Utilt and Dtilt have low recoveries at 16 and 13 which kind of justifies their short range as well... Still, they can be disjointed all they want, but he has like shorter than Mario range for tilts.

Yeah, I find Yoshi's f-tilt to be really outclassed by his other tilts in this game. Being able to angle it and do it on a pivot without perfect pivoting are saving graces for it, but it's still pretty useless even then. D-tilt outclasses it in spacing and U-tilt outclasses it as an anti-air and combo move. If it comboed into itself or other moves like its Super Smash Flash 2 incarnation for instance, I think it would have a purpose.

 

[LancerStaff]

Ah, you were talking about FFAs. I kinda agree somewhat but in 1v1s these specials are necessary.

Yeah, but that's the thing. Not everybody was designed to be good in 1v1s, customs or not. Actually, I don't think anybody was designed to be good in 1v1s. Jigglypuff has absolutely no way to function in 1v1 situations, and Palutena isn't some special snowflake just because her specials have different animations. I don't see anything that shows that she was designed around customs being on compared to any other character... She's a complete, fully functional character in FFAs, and that's all that matters.

 

[Dinoman96]

Yeah, but that's the thing. Not everybody was designed to be good in 1v1s, customs or not. Actually, I don't think anybody was designed to be good in 1v1s. Jigglypuff has absolutely no way to function in 1v1 situations, and Palutena isn't some special snowflake just because her specials have different animations. I don't see anything that shows that she was designed around customs being on compared to any other character... She's a complete, fully functional character in FFAs, and that's all that matters.

Fox is among the quickest and nimblest of the Smash Bros. characters. His speed is offset by low firepower, however, and he's better at one-on-one fights than melees with multiple foes. His Blaster is unique: it does damage but it doesn't make enemies flinch. His Fox illusion is best used as a surprise attack.

The above is from one of Fox's trophies in Melee.

And for the record, Sakurai has stated back at E3 2014 that the cast is balanced between different modes of play. It's not just simply FFAs, it's 1v1s, FFAs with items on/off, presumably team battles, etc.

http://nintendoeverything.com/super-smash-bros-for-wii-u3ds-live-blog/

Sakurai points out some chars are better suited for 2 vs 4 player and with or without items.

 

[LancerStaff]

The above is from one of Fox's trophies in Melee.

And for the record, Sakurai has stated back at E3 2014 that the cast is balanced between different modes of play. It's not just simply FFAs, it's 1v1s, FFAs with items on/off, team battles, etc.

It'd help if the trophy description wasn't a complete lie... Even before you get deep into the character his smashes are really powerful and he's otherwise good at controlling the pace of of the match. Actually, I wonder what it says in the Japanese version.

The overwhelming majority of the balance decisions are made for FFAs in general. Look at Diddy Kong... After the Uair nerf did he really need a Jab buff before Samus did? Not in 1v1s, but he did in FFAs. Look at Sheik and see how often her KO power has been shifted around and not simply removed. Look at all the random Wii U version nerfs like to Mac and DDD. All of these decisions had an overwhelmingly large focus on either balancing for FFAs or attempting to band-aid something in 1v1 without ruining them in FFAs. Nothing has been sacrificed in FFAs while 1v1s gets all the problems. I mean, it's clear as day that they don't think Smash will ever be remotely balanced for 1v1s.

 

[Rizen]

When did the Zelda social become the competitive impressions thread? It's freaking me out man!

 

[LancerStaff]

When did the Zelda social become the competitive impressions thread? It's freaking me out man!

Well actually the CCI isn't about discussing the design philosophy behind Smash but I get the picture.

 

[Ffamran]

Yeah, I find Yoshi's f-tilt to be really outclassed by his other tilts in this game. Being able to angle it and do it on a pivot without perfect pivoting are saving graces for it, but it's still pretty useless even then. D-tilt outclasses it in spacing and U-tilt outclasses it as an anti-air and combo move. If it comboed into itself or other moves like its Super Smash Flash 2 incarnation for instance, I think it would have a purpose.

At least it's disjointed since Yoshi's tail isn't considered a hurtbox.

I agree with most of the rest of your post, but I just want to point out that a lot of Yoshi's attacks are actually disjointed. Specifically, everything that uses his tail or tongue, his legs during usmash, and his head during fsmash.

 

[EODM07]

Will say TTTTTsd . Thanks for at least three hours of sparring with me.

Most of those matches were quite fun. And thanks for helping me picking a "Top Tier", for me to use. Even though some jank did happen in a few of them. Like me SDing on Smashville with Yoshi on the platform. :V (Also tried out Pikachu, now I know how it feels when you go Chu against someone. It feels like I'm being so sadistic. )

And I still dunno how to fight Ike at all, and I need to stop being an idiot against Samus and at least not contest against her DA. And Ryu scares me. ;~; (And thanks for scaring me from using Roy ever again.)

 

[KarmaCastle]

So I was just looking at my records on my 3ds.

BAN•DINS BAN•PHANTOM

Spoiler

 

[jahkzheng]

Maybe jahkzheng could give you some...

and me too. Shoutouts to Jestar

Edit: Why is it whenever I steal a page it has to do with jahkzheng...

Shoutouts to Flavius for the shoutout shoutout and a shoutout to Jestar for the shoutout inquiry that resulted in a shoutout and a shoutout to more shoutouts, #shoutout~

Now take your page steal. You're welcome~


Edit: ...or I will. How ironic.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Retsupurae

Before I looked this up I seriously thought it was one of Rosalindasraaslez119 & Tuna's messed up nicknames

 

[Gay Ginger]

Omg gorls.

I was at the dentist today getting a cavity filled and the weirdest thing happened. The dentist was injecting the Novocaine and she started shaking my upper lip (apparently she and other dentists there do it to distract you) and I lost it. I started laughing WHILE THE NEEDLE WAS IN MY GUMS. That made the dentist and the assistant start laughing, so, naturally, I started laughing harder until my laughter became uncontrollable. I didn't stop until she was done injecting the Novocaine (which takes a few minutes).

Apparently I'm the only person they've seen who's ever reacted that way lol.

 

[Jestar]

Shoutouts to Flavius for the shoutout shoutout and a shoutout to Jestar for the shoutout inquiry that resulted in a shoutout and a shoutout to more shoutouts, #shoutout~

Now take your page steal. You're welcome~


Edit: ...or I will. How ironic.

Too many shoutouts for me lol. Thanks for the shoutout jahkzheng . That page steal though...

Also I approve of the "Krystaltuna" avatar. Looking pretty sassy if you ask me.

Also I want to give a shoutout to the Flavius for being edgy and awesome and because I need an excuse to give a shoutout Flavius

Also this is my 1993rd post, which is also the year I came into existence so that's pretty cool.

Also 1993 was when the Star Fox series began which is cool since that series is amazing and is also amazing.

Also I'm aware of all the "also"'s I've used which was partially done on purpose.

 

[FullMoon]

Omg gorls.

I was at the dentist today getting a cavity filled and the weirdest thing happened. The dentist was injecting the Novocaine and she started shaking my upper lip (apparently she other other dentists there do it to distract you) and I lost it. I started laughing WHILE THE NEEDLE WAS IN MY GUMS. That made the dentist and the assistant start laughing, so, naturally, I stated laughing harder until my laughter became uncontrollable. I didn't stop until she was done injecting the Novocaine (which takes a few minutes).

Apparently I'm the only person they've seen who's ever reacted that way lol.

 

[Gay Ginger]

Have you gorls seen this?

BAN SANIC

 

[jahkzheng]

Too many shoutouts for me lol. Thanks for the shoutout jahkzheng . That page steal though...

Also I approve of the "Krystaltuna" avatar. Looking pretty sassy if you ask me.

Also I want to give a shoutout to the Flavius for being edgy and awesome and because I need an excuse to give a shoutout Flavius

Also this is my 1993rd post, which is also the year I came into existence so that's pretty cool.

Also 1993 was when the Star Fox series began which is cool since that series is amazing and is also amazing.

Also I'm aware of all the "also"'s I've used which was partially done on purpose.

Was trying to set Edgy or you up for a page steal but someone snuck in a post before me and suddenly it was mine, heh.

I like the Krystal art as well, hence it's my avatar. Also, I made it so of course I like it~

I haven't reached my birthyear in posts yet. That's right, I'm not nearly 1000 years old.

Unlike me who used the word "shoutout" only when absolutely necessary.

Have you gorls seen this?

BAN SANIC

Now find the one where Sonic misses and Zelda hits him.

Speaking of Sonic...

Spoiler

Shoutouts to Flavius

 

[Flavius]

Speaking of Sonic...

Spoiler

Shoutouts to Flavius

You've gone too far jahkzheng!

Not only are you continuing this fad but you associated me with

I cast thy into the sassT realm!

 

[Jestar]

Not only are you continuing this fad but you associated me with

I'm not sure what's worse, getting associated with cancer , ebola , or .

 

[jahkzheng]

You've gone too far jahkzheng!

Not only are you continuing this fad but you associated me with

I cast thy into the sassT realm!

What too edgy for you?
( ...shoutouts to Flavius )
Or is he not Edgy enough? Do I need to be drawing parallels to Shadow instead?~

Also, my avatar now has 5% more sass~

 

[Cress!]

I'm not sure what's worse, getting associated with cancer , ebola , or .

Let's call Avian Flu since falcons are birds and Avian Flu is deadlier/dumber than Ebola.

 

[FullMoon]

Have you gorls seen this?

BAN SANIC

Sonic confirmed swordsman

 

[jahkzheng]

Let's call Avian Flu since falcons are birds and Avian Flu is deadlier/dumber than Ebola.

That would make Swine Flu... since, you know, he's a clone of and the King of Porkness~

Incidentally, Ness really doesn't like him.

Spoiler

Obligatory Flavius shoutout~

 

[BJN39]

Have you gorls seen this?

BAN SANIC

Spoiler

Though I doubt Sonic would've hit Ike if he had been in his idle animation, instead of leaving forward in Fsmash endlag.

 

[Lavani]

Have you gorls seen this?

BAN SANIC

That reminds me of this

 

[2004Zilla]

Have you gorls seen this?

BAN SANIC

 

[GS3K]

Sonic is weird.

 

[Milo AKA Papa]

Got Zelda on random while playing a friend on Smash 4, and that was just a lot of fun. Never knew she was so fun to use!
But then i got 'em with the down air and up smash and finally understand why Zelda should be banned :[

 

[PGH_Chrispy]

Got Zelda on random while playing a friend on Smash 4, and that was just a lot of fun. Never knew she was so fun to use!
But then i got 'em with the down air and up smash and finally understand why Zelda should be banned :[

Dair combos are literally why my roommates don't let me play Zelda against them haha

 

[Cress!]

So one of my friends sent me a replay of him and another friend both playing Luigi and they spammed Nair.
They made a new Luigi Ladder, but with Nairs instead of Up B's. They died in sync.
I was confused the entire time.

Then he sent me a replay of him gimping a FG Little Mac. Show me something I haven't seen a few million times.
Like Zelda winning a match!

 

[KarmaCastle]

Got Zelda on random while playing a friend on Smash 4, and that was just a lot of fun. Never knew she was so fun to use!
But then i got 'em with the down air and up smash and finally understand why Zelda should be banned :[

Because literally every kill set up besides fsmash is hype af.

Lkicks, dair to up air, dair to lkick, dair meteor spike, elevators, snipes, some kind of crazy aerial string... Dtilt to uair, dtilt to lkicks, dtilt to dair (underrated), ledge cancels. I mean if Din's Failure nets a KO you get to taunt your opponent irl by commenting, "lmao did you really just die to Dins?". Phantom windbox gimps, don't even get me started.

Even simple things like dthrow to uair looks classy.

Nearly forgot the sparkle FX buff we got last patch. Zelda the type of gorl that eats that gold sheet-wrapped ice cream on a weekly basis.

 

[Lil Puddin]

Because literally every kill set up besides fsmash is hype af.

Lkicks, dair to up air, dair to lkick, dair meteor spike, elevators, snipes, some kind of crazy aerial string... Dtilt to uair, dtilt to lkicks, dtilt to dair (underrated), ledge cancels. I mean if Din's Failure nets a KO you get to taunt your opponent irl by commenting, "lmao did you really just die to Dins?". Phantom windbox gimps, don't even get me started.

Even simple things like dthrow to uair looks classy.

Nearly forgot the sparkle FX buff we got last patch. Zelda the type of gorl that eats that gold sheet-wrapped ice cream on a weekly basis.

Preach it, gorl!

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Let's call Avian Flu since falcons are birds and Avian Flu is deadlier/dumber than Ebola.

isn't sure what to think of this.

 

[Lavani]

isn't sure what to think of this.

Who?

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Who?

Ffamran , duh

 

[EODM07]

Afternoon girls. How's everyone doing?

Just did some rounds this morning, and the weather when I was doing them was absolutely terrible. I felt like throwing stuff in the bin. But I pulled through in the end.

And I'll put further practice into either Mario or Yoshi. :V

Spoiler: Yuri pic of the day~