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Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

ぱみゅ

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Let me answer that with another question: why is little Mac doomed to be bottom tier with horribly skewed MUs (with customs allowed)? Or how about why give pikachu a 0-death combo with paralizing jolts, etc? Why let villager plank when the ledge mechanics were designed to stop planking because it was BS in Brawl? Why make characters without jank customs drop in rank?
Little Mac actually gains a tool to deal with platform camping with one Side-Special Custom lol
Pikachu's stuff was nowhere to be seen unless the opponent screwed up.
Villager's ledge thing only won when the opponent didn't know how to play against it.
"Jank" is not a real word, STOP USING IT.

Overall customs make SSB4 more like Brawl: more campy, gimmicky, polarized MUs, with longer setup time, and less balanced than SSB4 vanilla.
The whole pro-custom argument seems to be "customs aren't OP so people can get used to them (true)" but not taking into account how much jankier they make the game. It was never about "banning customs" it was about "trying customs" because vanilla SSB4 is the original game. Pro customs (not anti-customs) people want to change the rules to make SSB4 less balanced and more janky.
Also, I can't take seriously an argument that implies Brawl is bad. Brawl isn't even the point of the argument.
welcome to the zelda social where we argue about customs despite zelda having irrelevant customs
Zelda si so irrelevant not even Zeldas talk about Zelda
 

Soul.

 
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Did my avatar reach new levels of cuteness or something.
---
Customs, Default, ****. What I said about a general consensus was a joke; we'll never reach that point. Default offers consistency whereas Custom Fighters turned on lets the other characters do their job better... except Zelda.

It's always cool to see the arguments though.
 

elusiveTranscendent

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So then they actually will matter when people start using them... Making the whole "you don't need customs" thing untrue.
But people have been using them...?
Why turn them off? Because they're not balanced whatsoever.
see here
People complain that customs are OP yet look at EVO's top 32 players. If I'm recalling correctly, only one player made it there using "jank" customs (CaptainAwsum). Plus, nobody has actually won a big tournament using said jank customs. DKWill nor CaptainAwsum, two of the most prominent players who use "broken" customs have yet to win a major tournament utilizing their strategies.
How are they unbalanced or gamebreakingly good if it's still fundamentally the same players reaching the top? I don't care much for customs, but that argument seems kinda bad when people still can achieve the exact same success even with customs enabled..?

People just need to stop whining about customs and have the community make a clear cut decision on what the standard should be. It's splitting the community up and it's annoying.
What's Zelda
idk some kind of instrument?
 

Macchiato

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Let me answer that with another question: why is little Mac doomed to be bottom tier with horribly skewed MUs (with customs allowed)? Or how about why give pikachu a 0-death combo with paralizing jolts, etc? Why let villager plank when the ledge mechanics were designed to stop planking because it was BS in Brawl? Why make characters without jank customs drop in rank?

Overall customs make SSB4 more like Brawl: more campy, gimmicky, polarized MUs, with longer setup time, and less balanced than SSB4 vanilla.
The whole pro-custom argument seems to be "customs aren't OP so people can get used to them (true)" but not taking into account how much jankier they make the game. It was never about "banning customs" it was about "trying customs" because vanilla SSB4 is the original game. Pro customs (not anti-customs) people want to change the rules to make SSB4 less balanced and more janky.
"Janky" "Jank" "Pro-Customs people WANT to change rules to make SSB4 less balanced and more janky" "Like brawl"
 

Koiba

코이바 ❤
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I have a feeling that if I say something y'all gonna explode at me 'cause it's custom talk :drflip:
 

SBphiloz4

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One glass of white wine, red wine and champagne today at a family dinner.

I dedicate all three glasses to @ Macchiato Macchiato for not being loyal to one character, banning Zelda and sending her to the shadow realm, and BAN•EVERYTHING :secretkpop:
 
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The only problem I have with customs aside from logistics is its timing. The game hasn't even been out for a year, and we're expanding a meta we have yet to understand. Frankly I don't blame people throwing out words like "jank" ,because how are we all supposed to adapt to changing rulesets, new MU's, new mechanics, new characters, new tech, etc. in ten months on top of new movesets for every character that are not accessible from the get-go? We don't even know our own characters. Sure, we know the general gameplan for most, but newer things are constantly being developed and that's in the default meta.
Example:
I just found a footstool combo with the back hit of up tilt
Back hit of Up Tilt - Footstool -Sour Dair or Bair
Probably already found but I'm learning:secretkpop:
I don't think customs should be banned, but I think it should lay on the down-low until we can stabilize the already polarized community.

I'm curious @Seagull Joe considering you stance on customs, would you agree?
 
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Macchiato

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The only problem I have with customs aside from logistics is its timing. The game hasn't even been out for a year, and we're expanding a meta we have yet to understand. Frankly I don't blame people throwing out words like "jank" ,because how are we all supposed to adapt to changing rulesets, new MU's, new mechanics, new characters, new tech, etc. in ten months on top of new movesets for every character that are not accessible from the get-go? We don't even know our own characters. Sure, we know the general gameplan for most, but newer things are constantly being developed and that's in the default meta.

I don't customs should be banned, but I think it should lay on the down-low until we can stabilize the already polarized community.
Wow, a person talking about customs that actually making sense
 

Koiba

코이바 ❤
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One glass of white wine, red wine and champagne today at a family dinner.

I dedicate all three glasses to @ Macchiato Macchiato for not being loyal to one character, banning Zelda and sending her to the shadow realm, and BAN•EVERYTHING :secretkpop:

3:15

Purple Realm :secretkpop:
 
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Ffamran

The Smooth Devil Mod
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Oh yeah, I forgot that Macchi switched mains again. Poor Wii Fit Trainer... The sad part is if she had Fox's Down Smash, it might be more useful and have more range. :p
 
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NekoJubei

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I just found a footstool combo with the back hit of up tilt
Back hit of Up Tilt - Footstool -Sour Dair or Bair
Probably already found but I'm learning:secretkpop:
 

BJN39

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Re: the title

The Zelda social does not take an official stance on customs by the thread title, and any true Zelda gorl should understand the joke behind the title. Good day and proceed with your usual activities.

BAN•ZELDA

:secretkpop:
 

ぱみゅ

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If we try to add customs later, people will be like "it's too late to change the meta now".

That's pretty much what happened to Brawl Meta Knight.
 

Soul.

 
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I've said before that I'm indifferent for both default and customs. They are a good idea, but had they been implemented to the games better, we wouldn't be in this mess.
A custom side meta would be no less different than default. Unless I'm a stupid ****, customs would be more prevalent there. But we all know we want a unified meta. With the constant arguments and giggles I fail to see that unified meta being a thing.
 

ぱみゅ

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Oh yeah, I forgot that Macchi switched mains again. Poor Wii Fit Trainer... The sad part is if she had Fox's Down Smash, it might be more useful and have more range. :p
Saving that gif.
Now Golden Time feels hit me once again.
 

elusiveTranscendent

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I've said before that I'm indifferent for both default and customs. They are a good idea, but had they been implemented to the games better, we wouldn't be in this mess.
A custom side meta would be no less different than default. Unless I'm a stupid ****, customs would be more prevalent there. But we all know we want a unified meta. With the constant arguments and giggles I fail to see that unified meta being a thing.
soul.

ily
 
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LancerStaff

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But people have been using them...?

see here

How are they unbalanced or gamebreakingly good if it's still fundamentally the same players reaching the top? I don't care much for customs, but that argument seems kinda bad when people still can achieve the exact same success even with customs enabled..?
Gamebreaking, no. Less balanced, most certainly. Saying that just because people beat them without using them is like saying Brawl MK is okay because you beat one online. It's freakin' stupid.

You said it yourself... They're not entirely understood, so good players that aren't experienced with them aren't using them. Take a guess what happens when they do start using them.
 

Macchiato

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I'm p sure I'm a Zelda main at this point. Once I heard that I'm going to a tournament, I've changed to Zelda right away. I'm a Zelda main that refuses to be one lol.
 

Jestar

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While everyone argues about customs, I'm just sitting here waiting for the day Wolf Flash gets upgraded from being a custom move to becoming a default move.
 

elusiveTranscendent

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Gamebreaking, no. Less balanced, most certainly. Saying that just because people beat them without using them is like saying Brawl MK is okay because you beat one online. It's freakin' stupid.

You said it yourself... They're not entirely understood, so good players that aren't experienced with them aren't using them. Take a guess what happens when they do start using them.

Meh. I don't really care about carrying on this discussion at this point. Sorry..? o ~o
While everyone argues about customs, I'm just sitting here waiting for the day Wolf Flash gets upgraded from being a custom move to becoming a default move.
Where the hecko is Wolf and why isn't he back yet
 

Rizen

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Little Mac actually gains a tool to deal with platform camping with one Side-Special Custom lol
Pikachu's stuff was nowhere to be seen unless the opponent screwed up.
Villager's ledge thing only won when the opponent didn't know how to play against it.
"Jank" is not a real word, STOP USING IT.


Also, I can't take seriously an argument that implies Brawl is bad. Brawl isn't even the point of the argument.
You're just dodging my points.
Little Mac is completely nonviable with customs. With customs the jank rises to the top.
Can someone please post the game where pikachu (maybe ESAM?) used paralizing jolts to 0-death the opponent? I think it was a finals. Anyway, this reminds me of the Brawl phrase "don't get grabbed"; there's a reason ICs were the undisputed 2nd best character. They got grabs.
Villager's planking became the key element of his metagame. I didn't say it wasn't possible to beat.
Jank, powerful exploits, call it what you want. The point is at high levels of play you must abuse exploits as much as possible. The metagame will revolve around camping and exploits rather than good fundamental play.

Great completely ignore my other points because I implied brawl is bad.
(Overall customs make SSB4 more like Brawl: more campy, gimmicky, polarized MUs, with longer setup time, and less balanced than SSB4 vanilla.
The whole pro-custom argument seems to be "customs aren't OP so people can get used to them (true)" but not taking into account how much jankier they make the game. It was never about "banning customs" it was about "trying customs" because vanilla SSB4 is the original game. Pro customs (not anti-customs) people want to change the rules to make SSB4 less balanced and more janky.)

PS
Brawl was bad, extremely janky with chain grabs, planking, grab releases and only a handful of viable characters. SSB4 is better because it lacks that stuff.
 
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Ffamran

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While everyone argues about customs, I'm just sitting here waiting for the day Wolf Flash gets upgraded from being a custom move to becoming a default move.
Meanwhile, Lucina, the inferior Marth. Meanwhile, worse than a Melee clone, Dark Pit. Meanwhile, Zelda and Samus. Would you rather just be a custom move or horribly designed characters who stain their franchise's name? :p
 
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