Zelda Franchise Discussion

[SmashShadow]

Ghirahim is more similar to Vaati than Zant. It would at least make sense for him to return, seeing as he's the counterpart to the Mastersword. Ghirahim is strong, and death means virtually nothing in the Zelda universe. Zant is an ordinary Twili without Gannondorf. If he returned, it would be seen (and be, period) half-***ed. And, Demise isn't the main villian of Skyward Sword. He does nothing besides fight Link in the game. Litterally nothing. Your goal in the game wasn't stopping Demise's evil plot, it was Ghirahim's. I think I've made this comparison before, but saying Demise is the main villian of SS means you're saying that Palpitine is the main villian of the first Star Wars movie instead of Darth Vader.

While yes, it would make more sense for Ghirahim to make another appearance, the question is will he. At this point he's only been in 1 game and his future is definitely uncertain. This is where you draw the line between him and Vaati who's future is also uncertain but has had 3 appearances leaving his legacy in all those games.

Zelda is large franchise(16 different games excluding remakes). Out of all these games only a handful have actually been recurring.

They are:
Link
Zelda
Ganon(dorf)
Dark Link
Vaati
Tingle
Impa

Link, Ganon, Zelda and Dark Link are all playable with Tingle being an assist. This is why I think they will draw from this list of characters with the possibility of the Toon incarnations as well. Personally I'd like Impa to replace Sheik and Vaati to get in as I'm not fond of having a duplicate clone roster.

 

[Diddy Kong]

You all are blind and are sleeping on Ghirahims potential like "kabuto in naruto shippuden," until he came back as fu**ing DRAGON!!! Ghirahim is the movement now and when Sakurai first releases screenshots of him ill be back LMFAO......*snaps fingerz*.......(disappears)

Ghirahim was the movement when he was not yet Ghirahim, but 'Fabulous Debbie'. Yeah be sure to come back when Ghirahim is announced.

Spoiler

Bye.

Don't think Vaati is any likelier than Ghirahim though, maybe the opposite actually. Tingle however... Does seem quite likely. And heck, if Impa gets in, he can join as well for all I care. Same with Ghirahim. Though both seem unlikely now. Ganondorf is enough for a Zelda villain. Especially when he gets revamped.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Can't believe I'm getting myself into this...

Smash games tend to draw from the most recent generation of Zelda games for their inspiration. Hence Twilight Princess Link, Twilight Princess Zelda, Twilight Princess Ganondorf. Since there was no TP Sheik, and no prominent replacement for her, they used a concept model that came about during that game's development. Since there was no version of Young Link in TP and the closest replacement would be Colin (who did little besides get captured and be inspired by Link), they decided to pay attention to another section of Zelda games, the cartoony ones, for a version of Young Link. Thus came Toon Link.

Assuming the Wii U Zelda game is released after Smash 4 (which strikes me as likely), the most recent Zelda game will have been Skyward Sword (not counting the WW HD rerelease). And even if it comes out before, the two releases will probably be close together, so unless the Smash team is collaborating with the Zelda team, I think we'll probably see Skyward Sword characters, not Zelda U characters.

Thus, I think it's safe to assume we'll be seeing Skyward Sword Link and Zelda. Whether their movesets will change is a different question.

What, though, of Ganondorf? There was no Ganon in Skyward Sword. The main villain until the end was Ghirahim, and he hardly seems like a replacement for Ganondorf. There was also Demise, of course (play Skyward Sword already if that's a spoiler for you), and though he does bear many resemblances to Ganondorf, I don't know that Sakurai would see fit to replace the main villain with his predecessor in one game. So what will they do?

Wind Waker is being remade in HD on the Wii U. This provides the Smash team with updated models for Toon Link as well as a Zelda-based reason to keep him in the Smash franchise (nevermind Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks). If they decide to keep a young version of Link (which Sakurai has stated is important to him, and with which I fully agree), there's no doubt in my mind that they'll use Toon Link again. And that game had Ganondorf in it! If they used the Ganondorf from Wind Waker, it would solve the dilemma of Ghirahim or Demise as opposed to Ganon.

The only Zelda vet that leaves is Sheik. As in Twilight Princess, Sheik was not in Skyward Sword. Now maybe there will be concept models of SS Sheik yet again, and since Zelda games usually deal with story last, it's perfectly possible those models exist. But if not it comes back to the SS Ganon question: fabricate a model, or use a character who looks and functions similarly to the original character? The character I refer to here is, of course, Impa. Here's the problem with that though: Impa is an entirely separate entity from Zelda. A transformation wouldn't work; the closest it would be is a tag-team swap, which would just be silly (imagine if Diddy and Donkey Kong occupied the same character slot and you could swap between them at will by tagging one out). So the debate is: do they change Zelda's moveset so that she's a standalone character, and Impa takes Sheik's slot, also as a standalone? Or do they keep Zelda the same with a model they created for the game?

There is precedent for creating models. There was no 3D model of Pit before Brawl, no 3D Ice Climbers before Melee, no 3D Ness before Smash 64, among others. And I think they'd probably make that choice before they risked alienating Zelda/Sheik players. On the other hand, there are people who play Zelda OR Sheik, who I'm sure would benefit from having a down-B move. But another way to get around this would be to use Wind Waker again, and have Zelda and Sheik become Zelda and Tetra. Tetra could easily fill Sheik's role--hell, they could even have the same Final Smash they do in Brawl--and since originally there was going to be a Toon Zelda in Brawl, I don't find this possibility unlikely.

So my proposed list of Zelda veterans is as follows:

-Skyward Sword Link
-Toon Link
-Wind Waker Ganondorf
-Options for Zelda:
---Skyward Sword Zelda (transforms into SS-esque Sheik model)
---Skyward Sword Zelda (stands alone, Impa replaces Sheik as standalone)
---Wind Waker Zelda (Tetra replaces Sheik as transformation)

Personally I like the WW Zelda/Tetra combination best out of those options, but I can see it going any of those three ways.


And what of newcomers?

Setting aside the possibility of Impa or Tetra joining the roster, since they'd likely just be replacements for Sheik, I can see at most two more Zelda characters being introduced, for a total of seven. (I know that's a lot, but I wouldn't be surprised if more Mario characters weren't introduced as well [I think it's about time Paper Mario got in], and yet more Pokémon seems inevitable.)

The two Zelda characters I think are likeliest to join depend on what happens between now and the time Smash 4 is released. If a Majora's Mask remake is announced or released before then, I would not be at all surprised to see Skull Kid join the roster. I bring this up for a couple reasons. Firstly, he won that questionably legitimate Smash Bros. character poll last year. Second, since Majora's Mask is my favorite Zelda game, I'd love to see a rep from it. And third, he'd be a pretty unique character (and another villain). However, we already have a Wii U remake of WW confirmed, so they'd probably do MM on 3DS, and that won't happen at least until they release an original Zelda game on 3DS.

If they DO release an original Zelda on 3DS before Smash 4 comes out, we may end up seeing a character from that game represented. However, as we have no info about Zelda 3DS at the moment, I can't really speculate about who that would be.

If none of those games are released or announced before Smash 4 comes out, and the Smash team wants to add another Zelda character, they'll likely either turn to Skyward Sword or Wind Waker. Skyward Sword's likely characters are Impa, who I've discussed, and Ghirahim. Personally I'd love to see Ghirahim in. He'd fill a fairly unique role--skilled swordsman with magical capabilities as well--and so wouldn't really be a clone of anyone. And he had quite a big role in Skyward Sword. On the other hand, he has a similar position as Zant (thought he is more prevalent in his game than Zant was in TP)--being an antagonist throughout but not the final boss of the game. And he's only been in one game (though the same is true of Sheik). So I can see it going either way. I think if the Smash team wants to add another Zelda slot, he's the likeliest choice, but who knows if they will?

From Wind Waker, I think the likeliest choice would be Tetra, though I think she'd probably end up being a replacement for Sheik with a Wind Waker Zelda, not a new slot altogether. If they were going to add a new slot and wanted a Wind Waker character to fill it, the only one that springs to mind is Tingle, and I don't think they'd add him, for what are hopefully obvious reasons. You could make an argument for Orca, the old man with the spear on Outset Island, but he had a minor role and was only in that game, so he'd be an odd choice.


So here's my final list of what I think is the likely set of Zelda representatives and their incarnations. (aka tl;dr)

Veterans
Link:
Skyward Sword Link
Young Link:
Toon Link
Ganondorf:
Wind Waker Ganondorf
Zelda/Sheik:
1. Skyward Sword Zelda, Skyward Sword-esque Sheik
2. Skyward Sword Zelda standalone, Skyward Sword Impa standalone
3. Wind Waker Zelda, Tetra

Newcomers
Ghirahim

Skull Kid (if MM remake is announced before Smash 4)
or
Zelda 3DS character (if Zelda 3DS comes out before Smash 4)



Thank you for reading this!

 

[Diddy Kong]

Great analysis dude, and welcome to the forums and this thread!

 

[AnOkayDM]

Thanks. It's been a long time since I've been here...

 

[Diddy Kong]

Well, seems like you found a reason to come back no? Anyway, I do agree with your list on what to do with Zelda / Sheik / transformation character. But I do have to say, I find the Skyward Sword Sheik idea by far the least likely. I even posted a roster that had both a separate Impa, and a separate Tetra in it. Don't think a seprate Tetra is too likely, but a separate Impa however is.

Skull Kid however, would also be awesome, but I just can't see it happening. Unless of coarse, MM 3DS comes out, which it probably won't... Besides Zelda 2, it's one of the more 'cult games' of the franchise, and even though mostly anyone would support it, I still somehow doubt it'll happen. If it does however, we might not even see a character from it cause Young Link is the main character, and Toon Link would clearly take priority over him if they style Ganondorf after Wind Waker.

However, speaking of Zelda again, I see no reason not to go with BOTH option 2 and 3. Have a separate 'Hylia Zelda' a separte Impa and a Toon Zelda / Tetra. However, maybe it's more likely we'll have SS Zelda / Impa tag team and Toon Zelda / Tetra transformation character? If they gonna do it the easy way, and considering a Toon Zelda was planned for Brawl, this might also happen. I do agree with the general pool of characters though, but Skull Kid just seems very unlikely at this point. Which is a blasted shame.

Been saying it before around, but since you're new I can repeat myself but: damn, would I have prefered Skull Kid made it over Sheik ever since Melee. We could have a TP Skull Kid then in Brawl, with the flute and puppets and all, and nothing would really feel out of place (besides he's demoted to a mid boss- BUT WHO CARES? better than a non-excistant character I feel).

Be prepared however. Cause people like to disagree about Zelda rosters. And if you're a fan of these other series, same goes for Mario, Pokemon and Fire Emblem. People here, like at Gay***s, like to be as conservative as possible. Especially regarding cuts. Yes, even for Sheik.

 

[Little Nemo]

The OP oughta remove the "no longer relevant" reason for Tink since a remake of WW is being made.
I personally would cry if SSB4 used SS graphical style for Link. He looks so lame. Bland colors, dumb looking face, gross pants. Yucky. I want OoT 3D Link. Even TP style again would be
good.(even thiugh I dislike that as well)
And SS Impa is dangerously sickening to me. Both generally as a character and in her design. But obviously I'm the only Zelda fan to think this. Unless it was the old SS Impa.
I wonder what Sakurai wants. I bet the roster's already solidified by now if we're getting screenshots at E3. Even just rough screenshots. Unless Namco is challenging Sakurai to develop in a different way.

Even as a Zelda fan I feel the roster is perfect for Zelda. I don't mind more, of course. But I'd prefer a few more. Butbit most certainly does not need it.

 

[Diddy Kong]

You know, I always thought it would be a possibility to have the OoT3D characters in the 3DS version, and the 3DS version would basically have the exact same Zelda roster as in Melee.

While on the Wii U, there'd be Skyward Link, Skyward Zelda, Impa, Wind Waker Ganondorf, and Wind Waker Toon Link. Maybe with Wind Waker Zelda and Tetra as well. Cause it's the Wii U and all.

Maybe that way all can be happy?

 

[Little Nemo]

That would make me very happy, Diddy. Having WW Ganon makes up for the loss of Shiek.Though his moveset would need to be changed I think. Brawl moveset doesn't really work with his new body dimensions. And his twin swords sort of sound boring to me.
I'm hard to please. I don't really fit in a roster discussion thread. xD

I REALLY hope alternant skins are made. OoT Link <3 Also it'd be cool to get like Zelda 1 Link for Tink or Yink.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Well, seems like you found a reason to come back no? Anyway, I do agree with your list on what to do with Zelda / Sheik / transformation character. But I do have to say, I find the Skyward Sword Sheik idea by far the least likely. I even posted a roster that had both a separate Impa, and a separate Tetra in it. Don't think a seprate Tetra is too likely, but a separate Impa however is.

I always come back for the new Smash Bros. speculation. =P

Yeah, I dunno why, but I get the feeling they'll either have Zelda and Impa, or Zelda/Tetra. It'd be good to have all three, honestly (go female characters), but I don't see that happening.

Skull Kid however, would also be awesome, but I just can't see it happening. Unless of coarse, MM 3DS comes out, which it probably won't... Besides Zelda 2, it's one of the more 'cult games' of the franchise, and even though mostly anyone would support it, I still somehow doubt it'll happen. If it does however, we might not even see a character from it cause Young Link is the main character, and Toon Link would clearly take priority over him if they style Ganondorf after Wind Waker.

I wouldn't say it probably won't, though I guarantee it won't be out before Smash 4. =/ If they were to put in an MM character, it'd have to be Skull Kid, not that particular Link, as cool as the transformations would be (and the Fierce Deity for Final Smash!).

However, speaking of Zelda again, I see no reason not to go with BOTH option 2 and 3. Have a separate 'Hylia Zelda' a separte Impa and a Toon Zelda / Tetra. However, maybe it's more likely we'll have SS Zelda / Impa tag team and Toon Zelda / Tetra transformation character? If they gonna do it the easy way, and considering a Toon Zelda was planned for Brawl, this might also happen. I do agree with the general pool of characters though, but Skull Kid just seems very unlikely at this point. Which is a blasted shame.

Again, I just find it kind of unlikely they'll have a separate Zelda, Impa, and Tetra. I can see Impa being on her own and then a Zelda/Tetra, but somehow not the opposite, being very likely.

Been saying it before around, but since you're new I can repeat myself but: damn, would I have prefered Skull Kid made it over Sheik ever since Melee. We could have a TP Skull Kid then in Brawl, with the flute and puppets and all, and nothing would really feel out of place (besides he's demoted to a mid boss- BUT WHO CARES? better than a non-excistant character I feel).

Yeahhh, that would've been cool, though I've always liked that Sheik has been in. But I would've preferred them as separate characters, I think. TP Skull Kid wouldn't be the proper Skull Kid though--he'd look weird coming back without the mask.

Be prepared however. Cause people like to disagree about Zelda rosters. And if you're a fan of these other series, same goes for Mario, Pokemon and Fire Emblem. People here, like at Gay***s, like to be as conservative as possible. Especially regarding cuts. Yes, even for Sheik.

There's always something to disagree about with anything related to Zelda, be it the Smash roster or the timeline. =P

 

[Diddy Kong]

One problem I now realise with these version-exclusive rosters is Ganondorf's moveset. If they gonna base him on Wind Waker in the Wii U version, and on his Ocarina of Time self in the 3DS version, he'd be running around with two different movesets. Unless of coarse they'll make him a direct clone of Captain Falcon again in the 3DS version... But I doubt that's what people would want.

I don't think the twin swords would be boring at all. It opens up for a very defensive style for Ganon, which would suit him well, though I do see why you could find that boring. As some people just love how offensive based Ganondorf is in Smash, especially in Melee (me included :ganonmelee: ).

Solo Impa and Toon Zelda / Tetra could also work. But perferably I'd have them all 3 solo. I could live with Impa being coupled with Zelda however. And have Toon Zelda / Tetra as 'Luigified clones' to them. So Sheik gets a replacement in both Impa and Tetra. Though this leaves me with what to do with Toon Zelda to make her different from Skyward Sword's Zelda. Either one of them needs some changes. But I haven't got the clue what to do, and would prefer Phantom Zelda to keep away from this, as it's not even the same Zelda as in Wind Waker. All I can think of now is Light Arrows for Toon Zelda, and the Goddess Harp for Hylia. But they'd need more changes than that..

Hence why I went with the '3 separate girls' route...

 

[Little Nemo]

Tetra really has the potential to be an interesting character in my opinion.

I never though of a very defensive moveset. Two swords makes me think quick slices which is not what I want in Ganondorf. I mostly just want there to not be an over saturation of sworded characters.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Figure I should talk about this Skull Kid thing.

I don't see Skull Kid as likely. Like, at all. Even if MM were to get a 3D/HD remake(which I doubt it will), I don't see him as being all that likely. He's a villain(and not even the primary one at that) in one game, and a minor supporting character in two others. I just don't see him as likely at all.

There's really no likely Zelda newcomer in my eyes. Tingle has the appearances(and his own spin-offs), but he's also hated by a good chunk of the Western fanbase. Impa also has a number of appearances, but her appearance/abilities vary wildly between them, and she runs the risk of either replacing an existing character(which WOULD bring backlash), or being declared a clone. Vaati is the second most prominent villain in the series, but that ain't saying much, as he only has 3 games to his name. Ghirahim and Demise, regardless of their retroactive 'importance' to the series, are both one-shots. Really, Zelda has the same problem as Mario at the moment.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Same here. But I thought of the defensive part cause of how the boss battle against Ganondorf was in Wind Waker. It was REALLY hard to break his guard, at least, compared to other enemies where it was pretty damn easy.

Not only does Tetra have good potential for a moveset, I feel like she'd be a better Sheik replacement for special moves than even Impa would provide. Given Impa has the barrier, kung fu based attacks (based on the stance she uses when using that barrier) and magical attacks. She'd almost look more like Lucario in her style than Sheik lol. Whereas Tetra can use throwing daggers similar to the needles, and the Grappling Hook (which real pirates use a lot) to properly replace the chain attack. Other than that, I feel both Impa and Tetra would have a few moves 'borrowed' from Sheik.

I don't feel Zelda and Mario have a problem: just include the two characters who've been there from the start, both with major come-backs and plenty of moveset potential: Toad and Impa! Guardians of the princesses!

 

[AnOkayDM]

Solo Impa and Toon Zelda / Tetra could also work. But perferably I'd have them all 3 solo. I could live with Impa being coupled with Zelda however. And have Toon Zelda / Tetra as 'Luigified clones' to them. So Sheik gets a replacement in both Impa and Tetra. Though this leaves me with what to do with Toon Zelda to make her different from Skyward Sword's Zelda. Either one of them needs some changes. But I haven't got the clue what to do, and would prefer Phantom Zelda to keep away from this, as it's not even the same Zelda as in Wind Waker. All I can think of now is Light Arrows for Toon Zelda, and the Goddess Harp for Hylia. But they'd need more changes than that..

Hence why I went with the '3 separate girls' route...

Yeah, I'd prefer them all separate as well; however, I'd prefer Toon Zelda/Tetra over SS Zelda/Impa. It should definitely be one or the other, though, not all three, because otherwise it's gonna be a waste of space.

Figure I should talk about this Skull Kid thing.

I don't see Skull Kid as likely. Like, at all. Even if MM were to get a 3D/HD remake(which I doubt it will), I don't see him as being all that likely. He's a villain(and not even the primary one at that) in one game, and a minor supporting character in two others. I just don't see him as likely at all.

There's really no likely Zelda newcomer in my eyes. Tingle has the appearances(and his own spin-offs), but he's also hated by a good chunk of the Western fanbase. Impa also has a number of appearances, but her appearance/abilities vary wildly between them, and she runs the risk of either replacing an existing character(which WOULD bring backlash), or being declared a clone. Vaati is the second most prominent villain in the series, but that ain't saying much, as he only has 3 games to his name. Ghirahim and Demise, regardless of their retroactive 'importance' to the series, are both one-shots. Really, Zelda has the same problem as Mario at the moment.

No, me neither, not really, but if they made MM3D, he'd be more likely than literally any other Zelda character besides Ghirahim.

I don't feel Zelda and Mario have a problem: just include the two characters who've been there from the start, both with major come-backs and plenty of moveset potential: Toad and Impa! Guardians of the princesses!

Urgh Toad. =/

 

[Robert of Normandy]

I don't feel Zelda and Mario have a problem: just include the two characters who've been there from the start, both with major come-backs and plenty of moveset potential: Toad and Impa! Guardians of the princesses!

On the other hand, neither characters have more than supporting roles in most games(heck, Impa wasn't even originally in the games, she was just part of the manual). I just don't see any one Zelda(or Mario) character that stands out front of the likely newcomers.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Yeah I think I'd prefer Impa solo as well. She'd definitely make a better fighter solo than SS Zelda yeah, but she can always be part of her moveset somehow? As an actual tag team character that could interchange between moves?

However you'd look at it, even if they'd keep Zelda / Sheik, and give Sheik a Skyward Sword design, it'll always be the issue what Toon Zelda could do without being a direct clone of 'regular Zelda'. Hence why I think Impa solo is good enough for Skyward Sword, then maybe have Ghirahim as an additional Skyward Sword character?

Proposal roster:

Skyward Sword:
Link
Impa
Ghirahim

Wind Waker:
Toon Link
Ganondorf
Zelda / Tetra

Would even think about making Toon Link the Link where you start with, or you'd start with both Links and unlock all other fighters gradiately. Still, would feel kinda 'empty' to have Impa and Ghirahim, but not the one they protect / hunt after respectively: Skyward Sword's Zelda. She'd be more missed for a sence of 'story' than Toon Zelda would. And you wouldn't have the issue of a Toon Zelda being called 'Zelda' while the Link she pairs up with would be called 'Toon Link'.

That'd be a reason enough to maybe even leave Toon Zelda / Tetra alone. As another issue would rise: why seprate Impa while we still have a duo Zelda character around with Toon Zelda / Tetra. Would perhaps create the same problem of imbalance as Zelda / Sheik did. So to keep things as simple as it is I think this is more realistic:

Skyward Sword:
Link
Zelda
Impa

Wind Waker:
Toon Link
Ganondorf

I think I'll keep the roster in my head like this. As much as I'd like Tetra, Skyward Sword's Zelda would probably take priority over Wind Waker Zelda as the one called 'Zelda' in Smash. And it makes the most sence in a revamping sence of things. As we'd like Toon Link and Ganondorf to be as Luigifed and uniuqe as possible, Impa to be a good spiritual replacement for Sheik's playstyle with a best unique feel to make her worth her own spot, and revamp Link and Zelda so they're no longer as bad as in Brawl. Depending how that goes, Ghirahim could also join in, but that'd depend on roster size.

Get you don't like Toad though? Doesn't mather, taste may differ, and we're discussing Zelda anyway, not Mario so.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Skyward Sword:
Link
Zelda
Impa

Wind Waker:
Toon Link
Ganondorf

I can get behind that roster. And I think the problem with having Impa and Ghirahim is that they'd play pretty similarly. I imagine them both as quick, weak fighters with some possible magical aid, though Ghirahim would have a sword. Same deal would happen with Toon Link and Tetra--I think they'd play quite the same, especially if Tetra used that dinky cutlass she has hanging off her belt.

Get you don't like Toad though? Doesn't mather, taste may differ, and we're discussing Zelda anyway, not Mario so.

Not in anything he's ever been in, except a human (fungal) shield in Smash. Don't think he belongs in a fighting game and I don't think he'd have a particularly compelling moveset. I find him pretty irritating in everything. *shrugs*

 

[Diddy Kong]

Well, like Impa, Ghirahim could ALSO inherrit some of Sheik's style I think. Mainly in the way of projectiles, as his throwing daggers / things could be similary used as Sheik's needles. While Impa would get moves of her own. Ghirahim could also be kicking a lot in his aerials (think Sheik's N Air, B Air for example). Even on the ground he could have a move similar to Sheik's F Tilt, it's the move where he kicked Groose out of the way with.

I don't think Impa and Ghirahim would be similar at all, but I do see potential of both drawing from Sheik. Which'd be even better I think! Both be evolutions of a character's moveset, and presents both characters really well. I don't see where they'd otherwise be similar in, as Impa has the magic balls, barrier, possibly a Deku Nut and kung fu attaks while Ghirahim has a sword, a broad sword and black magic dagger attacks. Both COULD teleport though, and both might pretty much end up with similar statistics in speed, weight and jumping, but I think that only adds to their rivallity.

Toad can have nice moves though. I picture him doing a headspin propeller kick for example, and a few quick headbuts like Pikachu's AAA, or Squirtle's Up Tilt. He could also probably throw Turpins like Peach, have the Propeller Cap for Up B, and well... Yeah, basically be a standard light weight character, which is also fine, as not all characters need to be flashy new additions. Toad would be rather straightforward, but that doesn't make him less wanted for some.

 

[Zuby]

I seem to be alone in this, but I don't want Toon Zelda. I want Tetra to have a slot to herself. I just don't think Toon Zelda is at all necessary, unless it's being based on Spirit Tracks. But Wind Waker Toon Zelda? Irrelevant. Tetra can carry it by herself.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Well, like Impa, Ghirahim could ALSO inherrit some of Sheik's style I think. Mainly in the way of projectiles, as his throwing daggers / things could be similary used as Sheik's needles. While Impa would get moves of her own. Ghirahim could also be kicking a lot in his aerials (think Sheik's N Air, B Air for example). Even on the ground he could have a move similar to Sheik's F Tilt, it's the move where he kicked Groose out of the way with.

I don't think Impa and Ghirahim would be similar at all, but I do see potential of both drawing from Sheik. Which'd be even better I think! Both be evolutions of a character's moveset, and presents both characters really well. I don't see where they'd otherwise be similar in, as Impa has the magic balls, barrier, possibly a Deku Nut and kung fu attaks while Ghirahim has a sword, a broad sword and black magic dagger attacks. Both COULD teleport though, and both might pretty much end up with similar statistics in speed, weight and jumping, but I think that only adds to their rivallity.

Ghirahim would be more like Marth than Sheik, which is where the biggest difference between he and Impa would come from. I just think they'd both be very quick attackers, speedy runners, agile as all hell, and yeah, they'd both have teleports. The main difference would be weapon of choice.

Toad can have nice moves though. I picture him doing a headspin propeller kick for example, and a few quick headbuts like Pikachu's AAA, or Squirtle's Up Tilt. He could also probably throw Turpins like Peach, have the Propeller Cap for Up B, and well... Yeah, basically be a standard light weight character, which is also fine, as not all characters need to be flashy new additions. Toad would be rather straightforward, but that doesn't make him less wanted for some.

I can understand why people want him, and I'm sure he'd have a perfectly good moveset. I just don't think it'd be an interesting one, and more than any of that, I don't like him as a character. Never have.

 

[Walzern]

Why do people keep suggesting Ghirahim?

Spoiler

He was working for Demise. And Demise is to Ganon what Hylia is to Zelda.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I dont really suggest him, but cant rule him out.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Why do people keep suggesting Ghirahim?

Spoiler

He was working for Demise. And Demise is to Ganon what Hylia is to Zelda.

For the same reason people suggested Zant for Brawl? Though I gotta say he's probably much likelier than Zant ever was for a couple reasons. He's more well-liked than Zant and he's also more involved in the story of his game than Zant. Plus he's pretty awesome and he'd fit quite well in Smash Bros.

Now whether he makes it in is a different question...

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Why do people keep suggesting Ghirahim?

Spoiler

He was working for Demise. And Demise is to Ganon what Hylia is to Zelda.

Because he appears more often, and so is the antagonist more people remember. Also, some people just prefer his personality.

Spoiler

Also, Demise would likely just end up being too similar to ganondorf for my tastes

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

That sounds exactly like Zant from TP

 

[Diddy Kong]

Kinda doesnt he? Never said he was likely, but he could make a good fighter in Smash. His popularity declined a lot since SS's release however, or at least, I hear just about nothing from his 'many supporters' anymore. It really looks like Impa is the only choice for a new Zelda rep at this point.

 

[TheCreator]

Like I'm incapable of thinking that Impa will ever be in this game. Especially over a Toon Zelda/ Tetra.
To be honest I think to make Tetra a clone, you'd have to seriously TRY. She has so much obvious distinct move set potential. Toon Zelda could too, just like toon link could. But it would be harder.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Well, assuming Ganondorf gets the 'unique character treatment' and gets priority as a returning character over a newcomer as Toon Zelda & Tetra, I see no reason why Impa shouldn't be in next. As basically ALL Zelda characters are in serious need of revamping their movesets. Wether it be for balancing issues : Link & Zelda. Or making up new moves and playstyles : Toon Link and Ganondorf. Impa just stands for a standalone Sheik character. And thats something no other character could do. Plus she has moveset potential plenty. Even rivalling Toon Ganondorf in this mather as weird as it sounds.

Toon Zelda and Tetra can easily be added, but I don't think they'll get priority over Impa at all. Mainly cause Impa is you know, Sheik's spiritual succesor and all. I think they'd make her first, and then maybe look at the potential of adding in a new transforming Zelda. However, I don't think it's too likely they'd first split up Zelda and Sheik, by adding a separate Impa and Zelda and afterwards add in a Zelda / Tetra combo. That's kind of contradicting don't you think?

However, I really think a Skyward Sheik is nearly impossible to happen, but Zelda / Impa tagteam could work perhaps. That way, a Zelda / Tetra combo doesn't seem so odd as a newcomer.

 

[Little Nemo]

Skyward Sword Sheik would be awesome. I'm sure the same impossibility was said about a Twilight Princess Sheik. Shiek most certainly godeserves to get in. She's a veteran as well as has her own unique moveset. If you gave that to another Smasher just because she wasn't "relevant" or whatever they'd be pissed and probably want to burn your house down. o:
Shiek, despite being like... 14 years old? She has a pretty big fan base. Impa is just... Impa. She was kinda cool in OoT and in Skyward Sword she was a ***** until the end for reasons I won't give since they're spoilers.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Don't bother with spoilers, or use [spoiler ]-tags.

The same impossibility was said pre-Brawl though. However, there was no good spiritual replacement for Sheik back then. And remember Mewtwo, and how he still got cut from the roster despite being unique? Yeah, I remember that to.

If Impa would've been in Twilight Princess, be SURE of it she'd have replaced Sheik on the Brawl roster. Also, the Sheik concept art was still there. And there wasn't one for her in Skyward Sword. Plus, this time they'd intentionally leave Impa out for Sheik, just to make Sheik fit in? That's really going out of the way to fit in an outdated transformation character, who's not even a character in the first place, but a set of clothing.

What is her fanbase like though? Never heard of it. People just don't want her cut, cause they don't want cuts in general. It hardly has anything to do with Sheik herself.

Keep in mind, many said Sheik would be cut for Brawl as well. But now, people would assume she'll return, just because she returned for Brawl, while they don't even know the reason WHY she returned the first place.

 

[Ove]

Impa has a long story as well. I wouldn't mind her OoS/OoA design in Smash. Most likely they would go with the SS design though.

 

[TheCreator]

I want to just say straight up "Impa will not be in this game." because that's how I feel lol. In both wants and predictions. But for sheik, im pretty sure it will be a mixture of SS Zelda, and OOT sheik. Because of the remake and such.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Oracle Impa would be more of a Ganondorf replacement than a Sheik replacement though. Skyward Impa is the way to go. Plus, she has actual combat abilities. Outside of a manga appearance where slinging around life stock is apperantly worthy of a move...

Forgot that the remake of OoT still had Impa in it though?

 

[TheCreator]

I want cuts. Albeit only Jigglypuff, but I want a cut. Lol sheik has no reason to go anywhere



Yeah but Impa isn't princess Zelda. Sheik is.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Sheik was only Zelda in ONE game. 15 years a go, and never returned. Worse yet, in her only chance of returning in Twilight Princess, she got SCRAPPED from the story. Next major console release, Impa appears instead of her.

Jigglypuff had more reason to stay than Sheik, at least Jigglypuff is still around in Pokemon. She never went extinct or something. Plus, 64 veteran >> Melee veteran. Especially if said Melee veteran is just a Side character to the main character.

 

[Ember Reaper]

Sheik was only Zelda in ONE game. 15 years a go, and never returned. Worse yet, in her only chance of returning in Twilight Princess, she got SCRAPPED from the story. Next major console release, Impa appears instead of her.

Yet she's also in the OOT remake, which was released last year. .... 1 year. not 15.

Jigglypuff had more reason to stay than Sheik, at least Jigglypuff is still around in Pokemon. She never went extinct or something. Plus, 64 veteran >> Melee veteran. Especially if said Melee veteran is just a Side character to the main character.

bolded = yes

You do realize Sheik was revealed to be in Melee before Zelda? Go back and look at the trailer. The entire starting roster is revealed, save for Zelda. The newcomers revealed are Bowser, Ice Climbers, Peach, and Sheik. Not Zelda. If she's such a side character why was she revealed first?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Shock vallue. Same as Zero Suit Samus and Snake in Brawl. Plus, pre-Melee it was actually a good idea. Given that people would expect to see her face again in future Zelda games. Which never happened.

Remake or not, her sole role is extremely lackluster.

 

[Ember Reaper]

Remake or not, her sole role is extremely lackluster.

I strongly disagree with that. Whenever Sheik appears it was a "WOW" moment to me because I would get to learn a new song, and all of her appearances had some sort of life lesson that generally involved friendship of some sort. She had such strong words to say, that it was always emotional. No way could her role in OOT be lackluster

 

[Diddy Kong]

Words don't really make her fitting as a playable character I feel. And if anything, OoT styled Ganondorf would really be the best representation the game could get. As far as I know, he was way more memorable than Sheik was. And he also BY FAR was the most requested Zelda character pre-Melee. Young Link, Zelda and Sheik all got semi high votes (8) while Ganondorf was almost Bowser-level high (32). Still, everyone wants him WW styled now. Just giving you the idea of the Impact of a new Zelda game.