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Zelda Counters ____?
- Thread starter Locke426
- Start date
COHEED AND CAMBRIA
Smash Ace
I would say zelda would counter a jiggs but if the jiggs knows the matchup against the zelda the zelda is screwed. And the ice climbers i never did that match but when i play Jigglypuffs if my Fox didnt cut it my zelda always did. But i Play with Ohio's best zelda everyday so my jiggs doesnt lose to his zelda .
D
Deleted member
Guest
zelda's only free win IMO is roy. take that however you wish.
COHEED AND CAMBRIA
Smash Ace
LOL Yeah in MM with roys i go Zelda and ****ed them up lulz!
Zone
Smash Champion
I dunno, I do equally as good vs luigi's and Samus' as I do Roys.
Cosmo!
nerf zelda's dsmash
false false false false false false false false false
i've done this matchup for money in tournament finals
its a 3-7 matchup
COHEED AND CAMBRIA
Smash Ace
I think Zelda can destroy jiggs i mean 4% cant beat zelda's But i do believe if a jiggs knows the matchup the zelda is ****ED
Tamoo
Smash Master
jiggs is terrible for zelda, they dont even need to know the matchup, just know about the fair and bair and jiggs can get round her
I find luigi quite easy for zelda
I find luigi quite easy for zelda
Zone
Smash Champion
I totally agree, he's pretty easy to outspace, he doesn't have an anus load of combos to bestow on your Zelda. You beat him in the air with range horizontally, and your disjointed up-air beats his aerials when he comes from above. So he mostly has to do majority of his crap from the ground like wavedashing @ you with his shield. Since Zelda's grab is slow as balls this is closer to one of his safer options. not only does it add that luigi's spot dodge is pretty pimp, to avoid the grab.
*To add*
Granted I say Samus' are EZ, I still haven't played Hugs in 1v1. Which is like the True Samus.
COHEED AND CAMBRIA
Smash Ace
Impp Beats watty
Its even as it can be...for luigi that is
It only favors luigi slightly because he can actually combo zelda real well if he gets inside her (which isnt hard because hes constantly moving)
Jigs is a NOT a free win
Ice climbers is considered a "soft" counter because youd be suprised how hard is to control two characters when ones getting kicked relentlessly right after the other.
But like luigi, ice climbers can destroy impatient zeldas once they are inside.
Icy's you can pressure. When you land a kick on their shield, l cancel forward smash or down smash. You can certainly keep those two at bay. Jab is pretty wicked against luigi and Icy's because their wavedashes go so bloody for and it just sort of gives them the "Hey buddy back up while I kick you" motife. <--not sure thats a word
Jiggs you like want to be very patient with your kicks. Like dont even bother baiting close range or just spamming unless you want to instil fear.
You out range jiggs basic aerial game. Wait till they do somthing where they can get some priority and range. Like most jiggs will go for pounds on your shield or somthing cause thats good against floaties. But you have plenty of time to retaliate with a good ol wholsome kick.
Believe and always kick. Thats the way its done.
It only favors luigi slightly because he can actually combo zelda real well if he gets inside her (which isnt hard because hes constantly moving)
Jigs is a NOT a free win
Ice climbers is considered a "soft" counter because youd be suprised how hard is to control two characters when ones getting kicked relentlessly right after the other.
But like luigi, ice climbers can destroy impatient zeldas once they are inside.
Icy's you can pressure. When you land a kick on their shield, l cancel forward smash or down smash. You can certainly keep those two at bay. Jab is pretty wicked against luigi and Icy's because their wavedashes go so bloody for and it just sort of gives them the "Hey buddy back up while I kick you" motife. <--not sure thats a word
Jiggs you like want to be very patient with your kicks. Like dont even bother baiting close range or just spamming unless you want to instil fear.
You out range jiggs basic aerial game. Wait till they do somthing where they can get some priority and range. Like most jiggs will go for pounds on your shield or somthing cause thats good against floaties. But you have plenty of time to retaliate with a good ol wholsome kick.
Believe and always kick. Thats the way its done.
JMOAN
Smash Apprentice
I main Sheik, but I always go Zelda against ICs and Jiggs.
When I'm Sheik, I find that ICs can do too many grab combos, and I have a hard time getting around CC-rest Jiggs players.
But with Zelda, against ICs, they usually can't handle the bair. If you hit them defensively (shield attack, jump back, bair), then usually you can hit Nana before she can shield, which always makes the ICs player worried. That being said, I usually switch to Sheik when it's down to just Popo, if I can find a free moment. Sadly, this method fails the moment the ICs player realizes he/she can just spam icicles and force you to approach.
Zelda against Jiggs works out surprisingly well if you can remain PATIENT. I find that I usually have to play by reaction rather than aggression in this match up. If Jiggs tries to SH bair/fair Zelda, you can usually shield and immediately jump in with a bair before Jiggs can do anything to get away. You have to be quick, but the heels definitely come out quick (and close) enough. Zelda jumps, gets in air on frame 7, and the bair hits on frame 5. That's not taking into account shield stun, but even so, it's certainly faster than the 22 dead frames that Jiggs has before she can interrupt her own bair. If you can make the Jiggs player feel as though his/her wall of pain is completely gone, it can be completely demoralizing. The match can be a slow and agonizing process for both parties, I must admit, but I've always been OK with just waiting while my opponent approaches me...
Of course, I wouldn't call either of these matches a sure win by any means. You gotta work for it. (For what it's worth, M2K refused to play my Zelda with his Jiggs in a friendly at Event 52 because "This is a bad matchup for Jiggs." I know M2K is not known for his pro-Jiggs skillz, but still...)
When I'm Sheik, I find that ICs can do too many grab combos, and I have a hard time getting around CC-rest Jiggs players.
But with Zelda, against ICs, they usually can't handle the bair. If you hit them defensively (shield attack, jump back, bair), then usually you can hit Nana before she can shield, which always makes the ICs player worried. That being said, I usually switch to Sheik when it's down to just Popo, if I can find a free moment. Sadly, this method fails the moment the ICs player realizes he/she can just spam icicles and force you to approach.
Zelda against Jiggs works out surprisingly well if you can remain PATIENT. I find that I usually have to play by reaction rather than aggression in this match up. If Jiggs tries to SH bair/fair Zelda, you can usually shield and immediately jump in with a bair before Jiggs can do anything to get away. You have to be quick, but the heels definitely come out quick (and close) enough. Zelda jumps, gets in air on frame 7, and the bair hits on frame 5. That's not taking into account shield stun, but even so, it's certainly faster than the 22 dead frames that Jiggs has before she can interrupt her own bair. If you can make the Jiggs player feel as though his/her wall of pain is completely gone, it can be completely demoralizing. The match can be a slow and agonizing process for both parties, I must admit, but I've always been OK with just waiting while my opponent approaches me...
Of course, I wouldn't call either of these matches a sure win by any means. You gotta work for it. (For what it's worth, M2K refused to play my Zelda with his Jiggs in a friendly at Event 52 because "This is a bad matchup for Jiggs." I know M2K is not known for his pro-Jiggs skillz, but still...)
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Jiggs-Zelda does indeed sound like an agonizing match-up. Especially if the Jiggs just wavedashes around your shield and ducks. There's literally nothing Zelda can do to a crouching jiggs. >_<
I'm always tempted to roll when Jiggs is crouching next to my shield. But I know I'll get rested if I do.
I'm always tempted to roll when Jiggs is crouching next to my shield. But I know I'll get rested if I do.
elvenarrow3000
Smash Master
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2007
- Messages
- 3,308
Wavedash down and dsmash!
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
I know right? The problem is, before your wavedash finishes, you'll already have gotten utilt rested.
elvenarrow3000
Smash Master
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2007
- Messages
- 3,308
I dunno how many people can recognize a wavedash straight down fast enough to utilt you out of it.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
They wouldn't have to. It would be enough to assume that you were going to jump out of your shield in some shape or form and to put out the utilt proactively.
elvenarrow3000
Smash Master
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2007
- Messages
- 3,308
Oh yeah, Zelda does have that awful grab...
JMOAN
Smash Apprentice
I feel like if Jiggs is just CCing you, you can just wait it out too. Like I said, I play super super defensively against a Jiggs. I almost never make the first move. So, if the Jiggs was CCing me to death, I guess I would just sit and wait more. I'm not too worried about d-tilt. If she jumps and bairs, then I go back to my original strategy. Maybe a jump back heel would work? I don't know. I never ran into a Jiggs that wanted to CC really close to me without doing anything. Usually, they lose patience before I do and try to wall of pain, and then I bair them.
Then again, I haven't played Mango or Hungrybox ever, so I'm sure they would show me the error of my strategy.
Then again, I haven't played Mango or Hungrybox ever, so I'm sure they would show me the error of my strategy.
Zone
Smash Champion
I've played hungrybox in Zelda vs Jiggs.
you'd think i can just keep back-air'ing jiggs, or fair and try to outspace. Well when you miss, and jiggs gets in. Jiggs has a nasty number of combos, and can rest you out of your recovery when you land, or just edgehog you.
you just make it sound like jiggs is so easy to outspace.
Also Jiggs will make it back into the stage most of the time with her ability to fake you out. While on the other hand when you're recovering you're limited to mixing it up not nearly has much as jiggs can. will you sweet spot the edge? will you try and land your up+B so you edge cancel a platform(This option is not always up to bargain you need to be above it to begin with and most of the time have your jump so you can perfectly set urself up for it.
Since zelda's moves may come out kinda fast, they end really slow. making a number of her normally useful moves less liable. What do you think will happen if you wiff, up tilt? up smash? Nayru's love? upair? You'll get rested. Although I wouldn't say completely don't even bother with these moves. But you can't toss them out as often as you'd like say if you were playing against a spacie or Ganon or something.
like i'd try to uptilt when I thought hungry was going to do a falling up-air. And he instead jumped DI'd away and then DI'd back in, fell into me with a rest just in-time.
Play hungry or mango or darc, I promise they'll show you the errors of your ways :D
But I dunno I feel like it's slightly more in jiggs favor. and I believe this is VERY HIGHLY level dependant.
small death zones are alot more tolerable for zelda. Dreamland 64... is gay for Zelda. Jiggs needs to die at like 60%, so you can think "Alright 3-4 kicks = 1 stock"
Jiggs has way more options than just wall of pain, crouch cancel. What about fake b-air approaches to keep you in shield. He lands behind you and just simply grabs. Next time he repeates the same step but instead jabs to crouch under your kick to jump into your missed kick and rest.
you'd think i can just keep back-air'ing jiggs, or fair and try to outspace. Well when you miss, and jiggs gets in. Jiggs has a nasty number of combos, and can rest you out of your recovery when you land, or just edgehog you.
you just make it sound like jiggs is so easy to outspace.
Also Jiggs will make it back into the stage most of the time with her ability to fake you out. While on the other hand when you're recovering you're limited to mixing it up not nearly has much as jiggs can. will you sweet spot the edge? will you try and land your up+B so you edge cancel a platform(This option is not always up to bargain you need to be above it to begin with and most of the time have your jump so you can perfectly set urself up for it.
Since zelda's moves may come out kinda fast, they end really slow. making a number of her normally useful moves less liable. What do you think will happen if you wiff, up tilt? up smash? Nayru's love? upair? You'll get rested. Although I wouldn't say completely don't even bother with these moves. But you can't toss them out as often as you'd like say if you were playing against a spacie or Ganon or something.
like i'd try to uptilt when I thought hungry was going to do a falling up-air. And he instead jumped DI'd away and then DI'd back in, fell into me with a rest just in-time.
Play hungry or mango or darc, I promise they'll show you the errors of your ways :D
But I dunno I feel like it's slightly more in jiggs favor. and I believe this is VERY HIGHLY level dependant.
small death zones are alot more tolerable for zelda. Dreamland 64... is gay for Zelda. Jiggs needs to die at like 60%, so you can think "Alright 3-4 kicks = 1 stock"
Jiggs has way more options than just wall of pain, crouch cancel. What about fake b-air approaches to keep you in shield. He lands behind you and just simply grabs. Next time he repeates the same step but instead jabs to crouch under your kick to jump into your missed kick and rest.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
So I've reached the conclusion that Zelda dittos are the funnest mirror match-up in the game. 
Zone
Smash Champion
I'd have to strongly disagree lolSo I've reached the conclusion that Zelda dittos are the funnest mirror match-up in the game.
My favorites are Falco or Falcon Dittos. I sometimes fancy a Link Ditto
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
I guess lol. I know that I certainly hate Marth and Fox dittos.
The thing about Falco and Falcon dittos is that they can be played so gay.
I don't know about link dittos. I guess they're alright.
Zelda dittos are just hilarious, though. Trading kicks, etc. Fun stuff.
The thing about Falco and Falcon dittos is that they can be played so gay.
I don't know about link dittos. I guess they're alright.
Zelda dittos are just hilarious, though. Trading kicks, etc. Fun stuff.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
If they crouch the D-smash, go nowhere because they're ducking and Zelda's D-smash has no knockback, and then F-smash, Zelda has traded down immensely. That assumes Puff can't recognize the big fluffy clouds near her feet and jump --> Rest on her, too, knowing fully well that a shielding Zelda can literally hit nothing on Puff at all.
I don't know much about this matchup except that Zelda's shield becomes less useful than it usually is. Because she uses shield --> kick a lot in other matchups, I think losing her ability to do so hinders her. But others tell me otherwise.
Shadow Huan
Smash Champion
How about Mewtwo?
Big+light? lol
Emmy's beaten my Mewtwo with Zelda. Not that she ***** but still. It's a stupid match up with lots of awkward spacing...
Big+light? lol
Emmy's beaten my Mewtwo with Zelda. Not that she ***** but still. It's a stupid match up with lots of awkward spacing...
JMOAN
Smash Apprentice
Just to clarify, I do NOT think that Zelda has the advantage in either the Jiggs or the ICs match up. I think that Zelda is at a certain disadvantage, I just happen to prefer the match up over Sheik vs. Jiggs or Sheik vs. ICs (since I main Sheik). Since I prefer the match up with Zelda, it's nice that my main also has my "counter" character built in.
So, in general, I think Jiggs should be able to win. I know Jiggs has more options than just WoP or CC, but those tend to be the two most common strats I see from a lot of Jiggs players in normal tournament.
Obviously, once you start talking about Hungry or Mango, I'll lose. But, I hardly think that's a fair assessment of how well Zelda does against Jiggs in GENERAL. I mean, if you're Zelda loses to Mango, I think that's less a problem with your Zelda and more a problem with the fact that you are playing Mango and your name is not Kage. Ditto with Hungry.
I was just outlining something I found to have worked against most of the tournament Jiggs players I have seen.
Also, to address the Samus counter pick thing... Spaceballs also dislikes Zelda, and I have beaten him a few times in the match up =D (Course, he returned the favor with some interest...) I don't really understand why he doesn't like the match up. It seems to me that if Samus spams missiles and camps, then it is very difficult for Zelda to approach.
EDIT: <3 Spaceballs.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
But you can Naryu's love and power shield those missiles.
ihavespaceblondes
Smash Master
Spamming missiles and camping is for neckbeards.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Zelda vs Samus just doesn't happen enough. Already there are no Samuses out there. There are even fewer Zeldas. Lol.
Din's fire is pretty versatile. You can use it to disrupt Samus' bomb recovery, can't you?
Din's fire is pretty versatile. You can use it to disrupt Samus' bomb recovery, can't you?
Cosmo!
nerf zelda's dsmash
zelda vs samus is too fun i do that matchup a lot with a friend of mine
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Wow.
Anyway, I'm guessing all you need in that match-up is kick out of shield.
So simple, yet so effective. Lol.
Anyway, I'm guessing all you need in that match-up is kick out of shield.
So simple, yet so effective. Lol.
Zone
Smash Champion
I've been overdosing myself on Starcraft Lately... haven't touched melee in weeks.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Zelda vs Luigi GO GO GO
COHEED AND CAMBRIA
Smash Ace
Umbreon mow beat mangos jiggs in a MM with his zelda thats what M2k told me. IS THIS TRUE MOW is THIs TRue!
Zone
Smash Champion
If true, When?