Your worst match up?

[Pentao]

Browsing the Lucario boards, I get a lot of mixed reactions from people. Some say Lucario's got his really bad match ups, some say he's pretty much got an answer to the entire cast somewhere. So in your personal opinion and experience, when you play as Lucario, who do you have a tough time against?


Personally, I have not yet played against someone who I felt was beating me due to a character match up, but I have lost to people who I felt were just... flat out better than me.


I don't particularly enjoy the R.O.B. match up. I always have issues going in against R.O.B.

 

[chaos_Leader]

I feel like I've done this before already...

Ah yes, I have!

Here's my experience so far with that:

Captain Falcon is one of them for sure. He easily outmaneuvers Lucario's zoning tools, can use his high-speed mobility punish from well outside Lucario's reach, chain together long, hurtful strings of attacks, and on top of that has the means to easily KO Lucario well before ludicrous-aura kicks in.

Link is another tough one. He throws all sorts of projectiles at us, some of which will eliminate a full-charge high% aura sphere (boomerang/bomb) so we can't simply overmatch the projectile spam like we can vs. Samus and Mega Man, and there's also the Hylian Shield that can make getting an AS/FP past all those projectiles moot anyway. The Master Sword makes closing into melee range a real pain for Lucario since we're not exactly endowed with great mobility/rushdown tools. And to top it all off, Link's KO power is excellent, and the moves he does it with are relatively easy to execute, easy to land, and hard to punish. In the hands of a good, smart player, Link is an absolute nightmare for Lucario to deal with.

I've had some trouble with Wario (that fat little turd). Again, he's one of those heavy, hard-hitting characters, with pretty good aerial mobility, and presents a small target, which makes zoning vs. Wario trickier than larger foes. He's not quite as obnoxious as Captain Falcon or Link, but still a challenge for Lucario.

Rosalina+Luma can be tough in the hands of a good player who keeps the pressure on Lucario, but Lucario comes pretty well equipped to answer Rosaluma, better than most of the cast in-fact. MTI's covered the finer points of that MU better than I could.

tl/dr: Captain Falcon (ugh, mobility and hurt), Link (ugh, projectiles and sword), and Wario (ugh, Warioness)

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Personally I do not feel like we have any bad matchups.

I have three matchups that I can get particularly aggravated on though.

Ness: When they do nothing but Dash Attack and FAir and try to spam grab.

Sheik: Needle spam and Bouncing Fish.

Lucario: oh the dreaded ditto. When the worse Lucario wins due to Aura... I've learned though that you just gotta keep 'em offstage and it should be more manageable after the recent patch.

 

[Steam]

ness, sheik, rosalina are the 3 I can say we definitely lose.

We should start matchup discussions too by the way.

 

[RT]

Sheik is not a bad matchup imo. The fact she can't kill as easily anymore only makes it Brawl tier matchup-wise.

I never thought it was in the first place.

 

[chaos_Leader]

ness, sheik, rosalina are the 3 I can say we definitely lose.

Personally, I say it's not that bad on all three of these.

Ness has the means to mess up Lucario if played carelessly, but it's by no means a rout. The PSI magnet doesn't shut down AS/FP entirely, but merely limits their use, similarly when against reflectors. In fact, it gives Lucario baiting potential. There are a few things Lucario has to watch out for; grab KOs, baseball bats, certain aerials; but nothing that can't be avoided.

I actually have had generally little trouble vs. Sheik, even before the patch. Needles can be annoying, but that's about all they are. They're not particularly dangerous, and I haven't been in a situation where they've been successfully used as a major setup. Sheik players also tend to telegraph their KO moves a mile away, plus Lucario is near impossible to gimp offstage, meaning ludicrous-aura comes into play pretty much every match.

Rosalina is one of those matchups that can be really annoying for Lucario if we let it be so, but really, Lucario is actually far better equipped to answer Rosalina+Luma than much of the rest of the cast. Aura Sphere gets severely limited, partly because of swirly-gravity pull, partly because of the Luma in the way (Personally, I think Luma is a perfectly valid target to remove if Lucario can do so safely). Force Palm, once it gets a range boost, will pass through Luma and hit Rosalina, similarly to how it passes through Pikmin to hit Olimar, plus it can't be swirly-gravity pull absorbed.

In all of these, it's really just a matter of being patient, and not falling into the dangerous situations these characters want to set up against us. Lucario just needs to play his game against them, and not their game.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Personally, I say it's not that bad on all three of these.

Ness has the means to mess up Lucario if played carelessly, but it's by no means a rout. The PSI magnet doesn't shut down AS/FP entirely, but merely limits their use, similarly when against reflectors. In fact, it gives Lucario baiting potential. There are a few things Lucario has to watch out for; grab KOs, baseball bats, certain aerials; but nothing that can't be avoided.

I actually have had generally little trouble vs. Sheik, even before the patch. Needles can be annoying, but that's about all they are. They're not particularly dangerous, and I haven't been in a situation where they've been successfully used as a major setup. Sheik players also tend to telegraph their KO moves a mile away, plus Lucario is near impossible to gimp offstage, meaning ludicrous-aura comes into play pretty much every match.

Rosalina is one of those matchups that can be really annoying for Lucario if we let it be so, but really, Lucario is actually far better equipped to answer Rosalina+Luma than much of the rest of the cast. Aura Sphere gets severely limited, partly because of swirly-gravity pull, partly because of the Luma in the way (Personally, I think Luma is a perfectly valid target to remove if Lucario can do so safely). Force Palm, once it gets a range boost, will pass through Luma and hit Rosalina, similarly to how it passes through Pikmin to hit Olimar, plus it can't be swirly-gravity pull absorbed.

In all of these, it's really just a matter of being patient, and not falling into the dangerous situations these characters want to set up against us. Lucario just needs to play his game against them, and not their game.

I know how to play against Ness and Sheik. I thought this was a thread for matchups that we dislike.

Get Ness offstage and he has to struggle to get back.

If you take the PKT2 hit he will not go as far with his recovery. I do not suggest attempting anything like that once you are past 30% though. I dislike playing cheaply outside of tournament though.

Sheik is easily comboed and can't kill us for a while. Sheik's Needles aggravate me the most on WiFi when I can't shield 'em on time.

Even if I've memorized these matchups... I can still get frustrated, lol.

 

[|RK|]

For some reason... Mario.

It's strange, but Mario's are usually my weakness.

 

[centauri_]

For some reason... Mario.

It's strange, but Mario's are usually my weakness.

^ I also have found incredible trouble against Olimar. One pikmin can can cancel out a max charged aura sphere and his range is very deceiving. Am I the only one having trouble with him?

 

[|RK|]

^ I also have found incredible trouble against Olimar. One pikmin can can cancel out a max charged aura sphere and his range is very deceiving. Am I the only one having trouble with him?

He is annoying for Aura Sphere, but I love his Pikmin throw. Like Mega Man's Crash Bomber, he gives me a free DT (except unlike Crash Bomber, I don't have to count, and I can use it pretty much whenever).

Unless he uses a Purple Pikmin, he usually doesn't bother me too much.

 

[Pentao]

Well, in the case of customs, neither Piercing or Snaring Spheres lose to a Pikmin toss, so there's always that. Piercing can also sweep away any stray Pikmin as well.

The main thing with Olimar, at least for me, is that his air-to-air game is only so-so. While it hits hard, it doesn't feel like it's got that much range, and it has power fluctuations all the time. You mainly want to be careful if Olimar has a set up like Red-Red-Purple or Red-Blue-Purple, since these are all fairly hard hitting. Olimar hates being put in a defensive position, especially if he's lost Pikmin. Keeping the pressure on him, I feel, is how you win the match up.

 

[Pitbuller26]

If we get to Super mode, Force Palm will generally kill his Pikmin will keep us safe. So if you see a line up you don't like and have the Aura and space to do it safely, unload the shotgun.

 

[Enrel]

I'm having so much trouble with Rosalina. It's hard for me to get in there at low %. At times I feel like I'm completely toyed with.

I can't seem to keep her pressured and tend to get combo'd. It's kind of frustrating at times. I do use Force palm when I'm at high % to poke and not deal with gravitational pull.

 

[jankanpo]

i went to a tournament today and had a really hard time against decent diddy kongs

i'm sure i just don't know the matchup well enough yet, but it felt pretty rough

 

[CaliburChamp]

Fox!!! The jab combos to up smash along with being careful with your Aura Sphere because of the threat of his reflector, he also is great at juggles and has a strong offensive presence that Lucario has difficulty dealing with. If he didn't have the reflector or kill moves from a simple jab, he would be much easier to deal with. I have to play entirely different against a good Fox player.

 

[Pentao]

Really fast characters like Fox, or Sheik are troublesome because of the pressure they can put on you. They can always run in and out of your striking range, and they have reliable punishes for nearly any of your missed reads. Though personally I think Fox is harder than Sheik since he's got a reflector to stall his fall and alter off-stage chases. Plus he can KO much faster with Up-Smash reads or up-air. I dunno, I find Fox more annoying than Sheik.

You can't really use Aura Sphere at far ranges against Sheiks either since they can bouncing fish over them, but at least you don't need to worry about your AS returning and KOing you.

 

[DomBadZZZ]

I played a few Dededes, and got absolutely bodied recently, hes hard to pressure with all that range, he can combo from grabs, and kills quickly, maybe idk the match up yet but it was brutal, also his nair can get him out of juggles/ fair strings easily

ROB also has alot of the same characteristics

 

[Fr0sty-Xen]

Despite people been saying how much this match-up is in Lucario's favor, I have a hard time with Samus for some reason. Her constant waves of missiles along with amazing grab range, great combos from grabs, and an odd rolling animation which is a lot slower than I'm used to along with her charge shot being stronger than Aura Sphere for a pretty long time makes Samus a big issue for me.

 

[Enrel]

Despite people been saying how much this match-up is in Lucario's favor, I have a hard time with Samus for some reason. Her constant waves of missiles along with amazing grab range, great combos from grabs, and an odd rolling animation which is a lot slower than I'm used to along with her charge shot being stronger than Aura Sphere for a pretty long time makes Samus a big issue for me.

I feel like a Samus that mixes stuff up is a lot harder to fight than normal. It's just one that can keep you unable to read what they're doing and all that fun stuff.

 

[Pentao]

Despite people been saying how much this match-up is in Lucario's favor, I have a hard time with Samus for some reason. Her constant waves of missiles along with amazing grab range, great combos from grabs, and an odd rolling animation which is a lot slower than I'm used to along with her charge shot being stronger than Aura Sphere for a pretty long time makes Samus a big issue for me.

That rolling animation is actually REALLY punishable by our dash attack, and it's so slow she rarely gets to punish us from a successful roll. Those awkward rolls can really restrict her dodging options as well. From the ledge, she has some strong options to cover herself with her z-air, f-air, and charge shot, but if she's not charged, you can show that jumping back onto the stage from the ledge is a horribad idea just by force palming or firing a sphere at her. Eventually they'll wisen up, so go for them air to airs or anti-airs.

You're pretty much only going to die to a fully charged shot or back air most of the time. If they use their forward smash for whatever reason, always be ready to punish it, because unless they did it from across the stage, you usually have time to punish it with a force palm grab, and at higher percents this means you KO them.

 

[Kenith]

I don't know why, but for some reason I was getting my ass handed to me by Robin earlier today. I kept trying to dodge his aerials but got hit by literally every single one. The guy playing him wasnt really that good, either. He just gave me a really hard time.

 

[Saxophoneoftime]

Lucario has no bad matchups if you ain't a *****.

 

[Karnu]

I struggle with Rosalina the most

 

[Golden Sun]

Rosalina - Can take your high aura sphere away
Diddy Kong - You know why
Sonic - Too fast and can trick you MAJORLY, he's so fast you wont have enough time to react to his moves
Ness - dthrow fair fair and PSI magnet for aura sphere
R.O.B. - A giant shield againt Lucario
Pikachu - Too fast and his thunder jolts mess up a lot of players, even if you shield, you WILL eventually get hit, people are already having problems against a good Pikachu, like Meta Knight, Kirby, ETC
Megaman - A wall
Link - Wall
Toon Link - MAJOR wall, considering how fast he is and is basically a faster Link with the "same" attack power in his projectiles
Villager - Hard to even try and hit him, he can slingshot shorthop you all day, and he will grab your aura sphere.
Fox - You probably know
Palutena - You know why

 

[blaze1216j]

Rosalina is definitely a bad match-up with Lucario, and I see that a lot of you agree to that.

 

[Ulevo]

Despite people been saying how much this match-up is in Lucario's favor, I have a hard time with Samus for some reason. Her constant waves of missiles along with amazing grab range, great combos from grabs, and an odd rolling animation which is a lot slower than I'm used to along with her charge shot being stronger than Aura Sphere for a pretty long time makes Samus a big issue for me.

Lucario should have no issues playing against Samus. DT will basically shut down her missile and charge shot game. The only answer she has to your DT is a PS in to grounded Up B, and that puts her at huge risk if she whiffs, which is easy considering you can mix up DT both in the variant you use and where you decide to use it. Even if you don't land the DT and she blocks, it poses no risk to you. As far as close quarters is concern, you will beat her out frame data wise. Her jab is horrible, you can hold shield and PS the second hit. As long as you don't succumb to the jab mind games, you'll do fine. She also has a very hard time securing kills, which plays favorably in Lucario's advantage.

 

[Auramaniji]

&.
I feel you kinda have to play the waiting game and try to land a safe hit without getting punished. Not to mention the range of the attacks that they can hit you with.

 

[Zeriora]

Lucario.......................

 

[Meek Moths]

i cant beat zelda she reflects my aura balls any help? pls

 

[Zee'mmoro]

For me, it's Rosalina and Diddy Kong. Rosalina has that black hole of absorption, and her plush little Luma can get in the way of Aura Spheres. When they're far apart together and you make a mistake, they can combo you with two down smashes. Diddy Kong is just 2fast2quick for me, especially when he throws you up and starts attacking with UAir, though it can be dodged once you get the timing down.

 

[Aphistemi]

even without gravitational the luma will take the shot, (Since 90% of the time the luma is in front of her), she can outspace lucario in some cases with the luma, grabbing for follow up combos/damage is a pain.. you have to be extra patient with her and punish on her lag moves, feels like a bad matchup to me.

I personally struggle with this matchup. he forces you to be impatient which is bad for lucario. AS can stop his spin dash but its not like he can't jump while in spin, spacing is hard with his kind of speed. annoying to play against.

This character lol. he outzones you extremely badly, Try using a fully charged AS on him and see what happens, Duck hunt will spawn a 2 bit guy to take the hit. now that you got passed all his tools and you are at like 90% or more, and he knocks you right back to the end of the stage, you think now you can go through all his tools with a high damaging AS right? nope the 2 bit guys will take the hit yet again and its like hitting a wall, no matter how high your damage is and Duck hunt can just hide behind them, set up a can and zone you out more until he feels comfortable in the damage he dealt and K.O you, For me personally extremely hard matchup.

 

[Pitbuller26]

With Duck Hunt, he can't kill us. If you have the lead, play lame as **** against Duck Hunt. His approaches aren't the best and are very easy to react to. High Percent Force Palm make a good zoning tool against Duck Hunt when he's forced to approach us.

I've noticed the most consistent character besides Diddy is Rosalina. I wish I could give advice in that matchup but I can't since I'm lost in that matchup as well. Everything Rosalina does angers me.

 

[V1cegrip]

no pitbull! no anger! . hallo. rosa gives the whole world trouble.

 

[Steam]

We hard counter duck hunt because as soon as we're above 100% our sideB flame completely shuts his neutral game down. it beats all 3 of his projectiles and hits him from half stage. forcing him to approach us and our aura roid rage.

 

[We Are GX]

Because of his hit lag and disjointed hitboxes taken away, i feel like the olimar matchup got 10x harder. But overall Rosalina and Villager are the biggest pains in my ass whenever i play lucario.

 

[LuckyDuck]

Pretty much any character with a reflector or projectile absorption is tough. Just keep the AS firing at low percentages and bait the AS at higher percentages(100+). I practice regularly against a villager and a Rosalina main and they are by far the most annoying to me if zoned correctly. Mario is really terrifying with the cape and combo strings as well. Just make reads and play it smart once you get the Aura Juice flowing.

 

[Karnu]

I struggle vs

 

[DomBadZZZ]

Apparently people CP lil mac against lucario I haven't played a good one in awhile but it makes sense with the low killing %

 

[Pentao]

Well after a while since I've said I had difficulty with the R.O.B. match up, I think I'm okay with it now. Though, that may just be due to the lack of many competent R.O.B. players I've played in the time span, but I don't feel so stumped anymore.

I do, however, struggle like hell against Rosalina. And not just with Lucario, with pretty much everyone I play. And one of the other characters I play (Meta Knight) actually has a pretty favorable match up against her, so even if Lucario does or doesn't beat her, I'm pretty sure this is just an issue I have as a player against a certain character.


Aside from Rosaluma, both Pits give me a bit of trouble. I have a tough time contending with the disjointed hitboxes that both Pits bring. While they usually can't KO me very easily, I struggle to get hits in.

 

[Typhlosion09]

A mirror match against another Lucario is annoying for the fact that you always have a 50/50 shot of winning, at least that's how it feels for me. Nobody's ever actually in front in a Lucario v Lucario until it's over. Other than that, personally I find ROB way too annoying. ROBs will only seem to use lazers and gyros, and when I get close they use fast-fall N-airs. In other words, ROB beats me from a distance and close range. Other than that, there isn't too much to complain about for the rest of the cast.