Yoshi Matchup Thread

[ChronoPenguin]

Well this weeks discussion is obviously peach lawl.

 

[Kiwikomix]

I could have the "currently discussing" thing but I don't want to set it as weekly, cuz time limits suck.

 

[Gindler]

Yeah, and with the weekly people run out of things to say after 2 days so its 5 days of nothing.

 

[Shiri]

How about we set a "Current Discussion" note on the title and then discuss until we're done?

That way, we are free to switch to another character when we're ready without being unorganized.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

and put sponsered by ChronoPenguin >.>

 

[Serris]

May I see the reasons why Samus is at a 35-65 disadvantage against Yoshi, please?

I don't think she's as bad against him as people seem to think she is.

 

[Kiwikomix]

I honestly don't think so either, it's closer to an even matchup than I thought at first.
Zair is good enough to keep Yoshi from camping and Samus spams, though they can be easily beaten, force Yoshi to approach from the air.

 

[Serris]

Could just be my opponent, or me, but these two videos make the matchup look pretty even, if not in Samus's favor.

 

[Chaco]

Serris is good, but also a lucky *******. His wall of spam, emphasis on spam, keeps any Yoshi away. He knows what he's talking about.

 

[Naucitos]

Idunno, less lucky and more has lots of yoshi practice XD
Anyway, i agree with him that if anything its a slight advantage yoshi, my personal opinion was closer to 40-60, maybe 45-55. It needs to be looked into some more by people who aren't me though, especially since well placed nairs/bairs could theoretically shut down her projectiles

 

[Mmac]

I think it's closer to 6:4, but I've been pitching that for months

 

[Serris]

Yeah, but in whose favor? I've noticed that I've been able to destroy Yoshi's approaches with proper application of homing missiles and uncharged shots. Egg spam isn't really that much of an issue, either.

 

[Mmac]

Yeah, but in whose favor? I've noticed that I've been able to destroy Yoshi's approaches with proper application of homing missiles and uncharged shots. Egg spam isn't really that much of an issue, either.

You shouldn't because Bair can cut straight through Missiles and Charged shots without much problem

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Yeah, but in whose favor? I've noticed that I've been able to destroy Yoshi's approaches with proper application of homing missiles and uncharged shots. Egg spam isn't really that much of an issue, either.

If a Missile stopped Yoshi's approach, the Yoshi screwed up because Missiles should do almost jack squat if you just use them to stop his approach, Z-airs are much more useful for doing so. Missiles are more useful for yoshi (Imo) interrupting any defensive maneuver/ retreating he attempts.

After going against a Mario, I love Samus's missiles so much more (not to say that I like em >.>) simple and easier to go through.

 

[Chaco]

You shouldn't because Bair can cut straight through Missiles and Charged shots without much problem

Buh....not with this guy....9 missles in a row I counted once. XD You may break 4.

 

[Mmac]

That sounds more like a bet to me

 

[Serris]

That sounds more like a bet to me

Ready when you are, sir.

 

[Chaco]

That sounds more like a bet to me

I knew I could get you to play him. Come to our chat.

xat.com/NewSmashClan

 

[Serris]

Woohoo! 3 wins against 7 losses. If the number of matches won counted for statistics, I'd say Samus has gone down a bit. But her projectiles DO occasionally sneak through the back-air and cause problems to Yoshi.

40:60, Yoshi's favor.

 

[Ryusuta]

Aww... looks like I missed out on this action.

 

[Deleted member]

Woohoo! 3 wins against 7 losses. If the number of matches won counted for statistics, I'd say Samus has gone down a bit. But her projectiles DO occasionally sneak through the back-air and cause problems to Yoshi.

40:60, Yoshi's favor.

Owned =P

10mmacs

 

[Snowstalker]

I'd change

Falco: 3:7 to 5:5. The new fair spike really changes this matchup.
Captian Falcon: 6:4 to 5:5. I now believe the Falcon boards.
Samus: 65:35 to 6:4. The posts right now explain it.
Link: 3:7 to 4:6. The **** isn't that hard.
Lucario: 4:6 to 25:75. DEAR GOD, I hate this matchup.
Zelda: 35:65 to 5:5. That was agreed on quite some time ago.
Squirtle: 75:25 to 99:1. It's complete destruction, folks.

 

[Mmac]

Captian Falcon: 6:4 to 5:5. I now believe the Falcon boards.

We can't give in! It'll be bad for our reputation! IT IMPOSSIBLE FALCON SUCK AND GARBAGE LALALALALALLALALALALALALLAALALLALALAL I CANT HEAR YOU >_<

Lucario: 4:6 to 25:75. DEAR GOD, I hate this matchup.

At least someone finally thinks the same thing I do

Squirtle: 75:25 to 99:1. It's complete destruction, folks.

Yet nobody questions Ganondorf >_>

 

[Deleted member]

Squirtle is completely winnable for squirtle, i dont know what u guys are talking about. Its fine where it is. Squirtle still gots teh shell shifting which makes him really hard to grab, good aerial maneuverability, and good aerials. And a beastly dthrow.

Lucario is fine also, its bad but winnable.

 

[Snowstalker]

We can't give in! It'll be bad for our reputation! IT IMPOSSIBLE FALCON SUCK AND GARBAGE LALALALALALLALALALALALALLAALALLALALAL I CANT HEAR YOU >_<

We already have a bad reputation for whining about Yoshi being too low on tier lists instead of going out and proving it. A neutral against Falcon won't hurt, trust me.

 

[Gindler]

I wouldn't say lucario's too bad...maybe 3:7 bad at most. True I can't land my Uair for the kill or Usmash do to that ridiculous Dair. Or Fair spike for a kill, and all I can hope for is a Dair to an edgehog but just because yoshi's best kill moves (well where I get a good amount of mine) are gone doesn't make it that hard...although I think it's the worst matchup I can think of...

 

[ChronoPenguin]

We can't give in! It'll be bad for our reputation! IT IMPOSSIBLE FALCON SUCK AND GARBAGE LALALALALALLALALALALALALLAALALLALALAL I CANT HEAR YOU >_<



At least someone finally thinks the same thing I do



Yet nobody questions Ganondorf >_>

Ganondorf should be 9:1 his favor.
I mean we completely **** him in Brawl.
But he's cooler than us.

Also, Snowstalker said Falco to 5:5.

I highly disagree.
You need to remember that Falco almost completely shuts you down and the only real saving grace is the Chain Grab.
Now you get the CG but Falco is still present.
It's not a 0-death CG anyways so Falco can recover, you have to rack up that damage first >.> which gives him time to come after you.
This can't be a straight neutral match up.
If the CG was so broken it would be 4:6 yoshi, but it's not

It's not 7:3 falco anymore, but IMO it's 6:4 or 5.5:4.5.

 

[Snowstalker]

Ganondorf should be 9:1 his favor.
I mean we completely **** him in Brawl.
But he's cooler than us.

Also, Snowstalker said Falco to 5:5.

I highly disagree.
You need to remember that Falco almost completely shuts you down and the only real saving grace is the Chain Grab.
Now you get the CG but Falco is still present.
It's not a 0-death CG anyways so Falco can recover, you have to rack up that damage first >.> which gives him time to come after you.
This can't be a straight neutral match up.
If the CG was so broken it would be 4:6 yoshi, but it's not

It's not 7:3 falco anymore, but IMO it's 6:4 or 5.5:4.5.

Remember the 0% fair spike.

 

[Mmac]

We really need to overhaul this matchup thread, we really do.

 

[Ryusuta]

Yeah, this definitely needs to be updated a little, especially given a lot of new changes and discussion about the match-ups. Here's how I personally would put each of the individual matches (asterisks indicate a change):

* Wario - 8:2
* Ganondorf - 8:2
Jigglypuff - 6.5:3.5
* Ike - 6.5:3.5
* Squirtle - 6:4
Samus - 6:4
Bowser - 6:4
Captain Falcon - 6:4
Lucas - 6:4
Sonic - 6:4
* Donkey Kong - 6:4
Zero Suit Samus - 6:4
* Pokemon Trainer (Overall) - 5.5:4.5
* Olimar - 5:5
Fox - 5:5
Ice Climbers - 5:5
Kirby - 5:5
Pit - 5:5
:shiek: Sheik - 5:5
* Peach - 5:5
* ROB - 5:5
* Charizard - 5:5
Yoshi - 5:5 Ditto
* Link - 4.5:5.5
Diddy Kong - 4.5:5.5
Meta-Knight - 4.5:5.5
Pikachu - 4.5:5.5
* King Dedede- 4.5:5.5
* Ivysaur - 4.5:5.5
Ness - 4:6
* Mario - 4:6
* Luigi - 4:6
Snake - 4:6
Toon Link - 4:6
Wolf - 4:6
* Falco - 4:6
Mr. Game and Watch - 3:7
* Marth - 3:7
* Zelda - 3:7
* Lucario - 2.5:7.5

Feel free to question or discuss any of the changes I made. I definitely feel like a lot of the ones I changed need to be seriously reexamined, even if the end score isn't exactly as I pictured it here. Plus, I figure this is the best way to trigger more conversation on the subject. So, let's talk!

 

[Sharky]

Yeah, this definitely needs to be updated a little, especially given a lot of new changes and discussion about the match-ups. Here's how I personally would put each of the individual matches (asterisks indicate a change):

* Wario - 8:2 the only thing I may have against this is that it can be tricky to land a grab on him sometimes. I say 7.5-2.5
* Ganondorf - 8:2 agreed. Maybe worse. Lolz.
Jigglypuff - 6.5:3.5
* Ike - 6.5:3.5 Definitely more even than that. A proper Ike using that range can be pretty beasty. Doubt me? Play Kirk.
* Squirtle - 6:4 I thought it was good where it was, personally ^^
Samus - 6:4
Bowser - 6:4
Captain Falcon - 6:4
Lucas - 6:4
Sonic - 6:4
* Donkey Kong - 6:4 What was this before, even? I think even sounds right. DK just outranges Yoshi too much.
Zero Suit Samus - 6:4
* Pokemon Trainer (Overall) - 5.5:4.5 Wasn't this what it was before? lol
* Olimar - 5:5 Even sounds good here. We can mess up his pikmin, he can grab us.
Fox - 5:5
Ice Climbers - 5:5
Kirby - 5:5
Pit - 5:5
:shiek: Sheik - 5:5
* Peach - 5:5 Agreed.
* ROB - 5:5 I still think it's a disadvantage due to robocamper, but not much. I still say 4-5
* Charizard - 5:5 I always thought it was even.
Yoshi - 5:5 Ditto
* Link - 4.5:5.5 I knew it was more even than previously stated, but maybe not that even. 4-5, maybe 3.5-6.5
Diddy Kong - 4.5:5.5
Meta-Knight - 4.5:5.5
Pikachu - 4.5:5.5
* King Dedede- 4.5:5.5 Hmm...maybe 4-5. We don't really have a solid strength against him, after all. =/
* Ivysaur - 4.5:5.5 Ivysaur can be tricky, but I think even.
Ness - 4:6
* Mario - 4:6 Playing against a few marios lately, I actually agree with this.
* Luigi - 4:6 Really? It's at least even, I think. Maybe I haven't played a good luigi, though.
Snake - 4:6
Toon Link - 4:6
Wolf - 4:6
* Falco - 4:6 7.3 I say. He can really mess with your spacing.
Mr. Game and Watch - 3:7
* Marth - 3:7 Gah, just because he's got a fast sword, doesn't mean he's that hard to play. 4.5-5.5 is the worst I'll go here.
* Zelda - 3:7 Once you know when she's going to use her strong moves, this really shouldn't be that tough.
* Lucario - 2.5:7.5 He's a tricky one. >_>

Feel free to question or discuss any of the changes I made. I definitely feel like a lot of the ones I changed need to be seriously reexamined, even if the end score isn't exactly as I pictured it here. Plus, I figure this is the best way to trigger more conversation on the subject. So, let's talk!

replies in Cyan

 

[Mmac]

Yeah, this definitely needs to be updated a little, especially given a lot of new changes and discussion about the match-ups. Here's how I personally would put each of the individual matches (asterisks indicate a change):

* Wario - 8:2 Nah, 7:3 is as good as it's going to get. Anymore is just an overstatement
* Ganondorf - 8:2 Agree
Jigglypuff - 6.5:3.5 I think it's 7:3. Horizontal based attacks leads to Pivot Grabs, Pivot Grabs leads to Release to Uair. Release to Uair kills at 80%
* Ike - 6.5:3.5 No, Ike is at the most 5.5, and even that is pushing it
* Squirtle - 6:4 Personally he's at 7:3 and should be left at that
Samus - 6:4 Agree
Bowser - 6:4 Eh, I think he's a bit easier actually

Captain Falcon - 6:4
Lucas - 6:4
Sonic - 6:4 Agree with all 3

* Donkey Kong - 6:4 I just noticed this..... Probably not....
Zero Suit Samus - 6:4 I'm not too sure, but I played against a really good ZSS main and got my *** handed to me.... Then again, I don't play many ZSS's

* Pokemon Trainer (Overall) - 5.5:4.5
* Olimar - 5:5 Nah, We have too much on Olimar, and now we have a Release to Uair! 6:4 is fine
Fox - 5:5
Ice Climbers - 5:5
Kirby - 5:5
Pit - 5:5
:shiek: Sheik - 5:5
* Peach - 5:5 Agree with those 5

* ROB - 5:5 I'm not too sure. I still have too much troubles with them to say it's even, but it might be me
* Charizard - 5:5
Yoshi - 5:5 Ditto
* Link - 4.5:5.5 Nah, I think Link is being overestimated, but I know he's harder than Toon Link, and defentally not this easy
Diddy Kong - 4.5:5.5
Meta-Knight - 4.5:5.5
Pikachu - 4.5:5.5
* King Dedede- 4.5:5.5 I actually agree
* Ivysaur - 4.5:5.5
Ness - 4:6 I think Ness should be moved into the neutral area, most likely the 4.5. New Grab releases solve the killing issue

* Mario - 4:6
* Luigi - 4:6 On both I played against Matadors Mario, and I say that he's dead even as it goes. Luigi I personally think is slightly harder, but also in the Neutrals

Snake - 4:6 Until I can actually prove that both the Chaingrab and the Ledge Gimping tactics work, I guess we have to leave him at that

Toon Link - 4:6
Wolf - 4:6

* Falco - 4:6 I still think Falco is at the very least in the Neutrals now

Mr. Game and Watch - 3:7

* Marth - 3:7 Marth is by no means that hard. He's more in the 4:6 area

* Zelda - 3:7 I still don't think Zelda is that hard, but I haven't really played any yet

* Lucario - 2.5:7.5 I think Lucario is tough, but NOT THAT TOUGH!

Replies in Green (Yoshinator stole my Cyan ;_ ; )


I guess I should do my own Version too

* Ganondorf - 8:2
* Squirtle - 7:3
Wario - 7:3
* Jigglypuff - 7:3
* Bowser - 6.5:3.5
* Samus - 6:4
Captain Falcon - 6:4
* Falco - 6:4 (I went back and forth on it, and I just said screw it....)
Lucas - 6:4
Olimar - 6:4
Sonic - 6:4
* Zero Suit Samus - 5.5:4.5 (Still not sure though)
Ivysaur - 5.5:4.5
Pokemon Trainer (Overall) - 5.5:4.5
* Peach - 5:5
Fox - 5:5
Ice Climbers - 5:5
Ike - 5:5
Kirby - 5:5
* Mario - 5:5
* Meta-Knight - 5:5
Pit - 5:5
:shiek: Sheik - 5:5
* Charizard - 5:5
Yoshi - 5:5 Ditto
* Donkey Kong - 4.5:5.5
Diddy Kong - 4.5:5.5
* Luigi - 4.5:5.5
Pikachu - 4.5:5.5
* King Dedede- 4.5:5.5
* Ness - 4.5:5.5
ROB - 4:6
Snake - 4:6
Toon Link - 4:6
Wolf - 4:6
* Marth - 4:6
* Zelda - 4:6 (Need more fights on her)
* Link - 3.5:6.5
* Lucario - 3:7
Mr. Game and Watch - 3:7

I know my placement on Falco is going to stir something up <_<

 

[Ryusuta]

* Wario - 8:2 Nah, 7:3 is as good as it's going to get. Anymore is just an overstatement

If Wario could constantly stay out of grab range or the infinite was harder to pull off (it's not the EASIEST, but it's by no means difficult), I'd probably give him 7:3. But there's really nothing Wario can do that's 100% safe against Yoshi, and one grab equals death.

Jigglypuff - 6.5:3.5 I think it's 7:3. Horizontal based attacks leads to Pivot Grabs, Pivot Grabs leads to Release to Uair. Release to Uair kills at 80%

Personally, it's hard for me to say. You might be right about this, but Jiggly does still have the airborne pokes and will probably be looking out for shield/pivot grabs anyway. I'm willing to consider this.

* Ike - 6.5:3.5 No, Ike is at the most 5.5, and even that is pushing it

I'm not underrating Ike if that's what you're thinking. I'm speaking against non-Aether/F-smash-spamming Ikes that can poke, tilt, and know exactly what they're doing.

The problem is that Ike has no approach against Yoshi, unlike say, Marth. Once he's in range to do real damage, he's also in jeopardy of a chain. Yoshi's tilts are also devastating to him. The problem with a lot of Yoshis is that they think the air is always where Yoshi should be. On the ground against Ike, Yoshi takes at least a 5.5:4.5. 6.5:3.5 might be pushing it a little, but there's no doubt in my mind that this match is skewed in Yoshi's favor.

* Squirtle - 6:4 Personally he's at 7:3 and should be left at that

A lot of people do, but as a Pokemon Trainer secondary, I'd say that Squirtle isn't in as dire of straits as he's made out to be. On the other hand, he CAN be chained AND grab-released, so you could be right.

Bowser - 6:4 Eh, I think he's a bit easier actually

I did too, but Bowser is by no means helpless against Yoshi. He'll always have his trump card in a pinch, and he can do ridiculous damage up close. Yoshi is still in a good position against Bowser, but I'd say it's a firm 6:4 proposition.

* Donkey Kong - 6:4 I just noticed this..... Probably not....

Oh, I'd definitely give DK an even-to-disadvantage against Yoshi. Yoshi is one of the few characters that can occasionally out-tilt DK (especially down tilt), and his Pivot Grab is exceptional against him. Not to mention the grab-release options. DK still has HIS throwing options and some great tilts, power, and edge-guarding, but I'd still give the edge to Yoshi, in my experience.

Zero Suit Samus - 6:4 I'm not too sure, but I played against a really good ZSS main and got my *** handed to me.... Then again, I don't play many ZSS's

Actually, you're right. I'd give Yoshi a 4:6 disadvantage against ZSS, or possibly neutral. I just forgot to change it. Still, don't forget that Yoshi can still chain, edge guard, and play keep-away against her. I could see this being a 4.5:5.5.

* Olimar - 5:5 Nah, We have too much on Olimar, and now we have a Release to Uair! 6:4 is fine

Sounds good.

ROB - 5:5 I'm not too sure. I still have too much troubles with them to say it's even, but it might be me

I've had far too many R.O.B.s jammed down my throat lately for me to really worry about him anymore. R.O.B.'s biggest problem is that he has no freaking way to get Yoshi out and KEEP him there. R.O.B. is actually really BAD against Yoshi in an air-to-air battle (due to Yoshi's MUCH better air speed), especially when he's higher up. Yoshi's up air comes out MUCH quicker than R.O.B.'s neutral air (one of his big killing moves), and if R.O.B's down air beats it (it's still slower), he'll just get sent to the ground instead of getting KOed.

Although Yoshi has no OFFICIAL grab-release options against R.O.B, his grabs and throws set R.O.B. up nicely for Egg Toss barrages or ground-to-air attacks. R.O.B.'s keep-away game (his greatest asset) is still effective, but not nearly as much with Yoshi as with some of his bigger matches. I'd be remiss to give Yoshi the edge here (yet), but it's not even close to a R.O.B. advantage. I'd say it's dead even.

* Link - 4.5:5.5 Nah, I think Link is being overestimated, but I know he's harder than Toon Link, and defentally not this easy

Link's big advantage is range, projectiles, and the disjointed hitbox. Yoshi is pretty much even on approach and keep-away, and can out-poke Link and use pivot grabs up close. Again, I think the main problem is that people are playing WAY to aerial in fights like these, and should focus more on pacing the match.

Ness - 4:6 I think Ness should be moved into the neutral area, most likely the 4.5. New Grab releases solve the killing issue

Meh... Ness' back throw still has some crazy killing power, and his PK attacks and aerials are enough to give Yoshi a lot to worry about. I'd consider a 4.5:5.5, but I'm still thinking Ness has a little bit of an edge, here.

Snake - 4:6 Until I can actually prove that both the Chaingrab and the Ledge Gimping tactics work, I guess we have to leave him at that

Actually, I can consistently chain and semi-consistently gimp Snake players, too. But the fact remains that he's still freaking Snake. He's got all of his tilts, power, ATs, weight, and knockback against Yoshi. Just like Meta Knight, the miracle is that it IS a reasonable match for Yoshi, not that it isn't MORE of one.

Falco - 4:6 I still think Falco is at the very least in the Neutrals now

I can't go with that, I'm sorry. SHDL and Shine Kick absolutely KILL any Egg Toss strategies, and Falco is much more lethal up close, chains notwithstanding.

Mr. Game and Watch - 3:7

* Marth - 3:7 Marth is by no means that hard. He's more in the 4:6 area

You obviously don't play a lot of Marths, do you? His approach absolutely DOMINATES Yoshi, and he kills him even harder once he's on the inside. Yoshi's only hope is to try to land a few Egg Tosses and a couple of lucky throws and smashes. Marth completely takes Yoshi, hands down.

* Zelda - 3:7 I still don't think Zelda is that hard, but I haven't really played any yet

Although not as bad as Lucario, the problem with Zelda is that she's pretty much always in a good position to do a lot of damage against Yoshi and take very little in return.

* Lucario - 2.5:7.5 I think Lucario is tough, but NOT THAT TOUGH!

Lucario is, hands down, the single WORST match-up for Yoshi. There is no question whatsoever in my mind. Unlike Marth, who is at least relatively safe at a distance (though can still rush Yoshi down), there isn't a SINGLE CONCEIVABLE POSITION on ANY stage in which Yoshi could be considered at an advantage. Air-to-air, ground-to-air, air-to-ground, up-close, mid-range, far away... all across the board, Lucario is always in a better position than Yoshi to do damage. As Yoshi, I've played countless different players using innumerable different characters, and I've never had a more consistent problem with any of them than Lucario. I could BARELY give Yoshi a 3:7 against him, but make no mistake about it, this is a GOD AWFUL match.

 

[Gindler]

* Wario - 7:3 sure there's the infinite, but I noticed good warios avoid getting grabbed (guess they need to when almost everyone can release him for something
* Ganondorf - 8:2 Yeah he doesn't avoid grabs as easily and chain to Fair is killer
Jigglypuff - 6.5:3.5 I guess that's about right although jiggz sure is annoying
* Ike - 5.5:4.5 the more ikes I play I notice they don't get knocked off stage as easily as they used to
* Squirtle - 7:3 you all know why
Samus - 5:5 Zair having ultimate priority destroys my approaches
Bowser - 6:4 Good bowsers can do some ridiculous things, watch out for ledge cancelled bowser bomb
Captain Falcon - 7:3 He's C. Falcon...
Lucas - 6:4 Once I get him off stage he isn't coming back, i do tend to walk into Usmashes though
Sonic - 6:4 can't really approach with pivot but he is really tricky
* Donkey Kong - 5:5 I love Dair to footstool, Dsmash out of shield is too good and kills so well though
Zero Suit Samus - 6:4 gimpage
* Pokemon Trainer (Overall) - 5:5 Ivy's great at anti air, charizards Fair shreads heavy armor...
* Olimar - 6:4 pikmin aren't as useful...but of the annoying grabs
Fox - 5:5 I've played some good foxes and his shield pressure game is insane, oh Fair release doesn't work
Ice Climbers - 6:4 easily split up, then utter destruction because they can't move in the air while you're killing nana
Kirby - 4:6 One of my least favorite matchups but still real winnable
Pit - 6:4 I don't have much trouble with pit, don't know why
:shiek: Sheik - 5:5 sheiks surprisingly annoying
* Peach - 4:6 Float Dairs shield pressure is too good
* ROB - 5:5 Both lack kill moves, but ROB is in trouble when above yoshi, Uair FTW
* Charizard - 4:6 Hate his Fair
Yoshi - 5:5 Ditto I hate dittos
* Link - 3.5:6.5 I despise this matchup
Diddy Kong - 4:6 CG is worthless...
Meta-Knight - 4.5:5.5 One of my favorite matchups
Pikachu - 4.5:5.5 Too many pikachu's use SideB to recover...easy spike
* King Dedede- 5:5 Dair is too good, CG is kinda annoying
* Ivysaur - 4.5:5.5 great anti air
Ness - 4:6 Fair is like a wall, bthrow kill at 120
* Mario - 4:6 oh how I hate the cape
* Luigi - 4:6 Nair destroys all
Snake - 4:6 Utilt makes me use only eggs past 110
Toon Link - 5:5 his sword is too short to worry about
Wolf - 4:6 he's wolf, enough said
* Falco - 3.5:6.5 Don't touch my bread
Mr. Game and Watch - 3:7 Turtle Fsmash Dair
* Marth - 4.5:5.5 Marth has some trouble gimping in this matchup
* Zelda - 3:7 I feel like a walking lightning kick target
* Lucario - 2.5:7.5 best kill move (Uair) worthless+more powerful when hurt=not a good matchup. Doing double yoshi mains vs. double lucario mains teams almost made me change my mind. Two yoshi's flying around is like 10x's the pressure one can put on lucario though

 

[Ryusuta]

I'm loving seeing all these opinions on this. This can definitely make for some good discussion.

I have to agree with a lot of what you said, Gindler, but Marth is in no way that close to neutral against Yoshi. He is an absolutely brutal matchup, I'd say.

 

[Kiwikomix]

I was thinking about this the other day. Much of the info given on the first post is extremely outdated... so it may be time to trash the uber-detailed matchup listings and just write a paragraph or so on what to know.
Anyway, here's my input, because I know you've all been dying to hear it...
Wario: I think should this stay the same. He has enough tools to avoid getting grabbed, similar to how MK won't always run into your pivots.
Ganondorf: I have agreed on 8:2 for a while but I have been waiting for more input.
Jiggz: 6.5:3.5 still seems right here. She's a horizontally-based character, which Yoshi loves, especially when his grab outranges everything. In other words, she's a lot like Squirtle. However, she doesn't have the Squirtle limitations of a CG -> spike, so it isn't as bad.
Ike: Range range range. You could sit back and let him approach you, but even that won't stop him forever.
Squirtle: See Jiggz, but worse.
Samus: We seem fairly divided here, so I'll change it to 6:4 until we get some good discussion going.
Falcon: Yes, he's the Craptain, but I'll let Stocky tell you why it's not heavily in our favor.
DK: I'm going for a 4:6 here. Ftilt > Yoshi.
Kirby: Both boards have agreed it's 5:5...
ROB: Less than neutral, it's difficult to approach him and his aerials have great priority, no matter how slowly they start.
Link: It really is that hard. Find a good Link and play against him.
Falco: I'll change it to 3.5:6.5. Not sold on an advantage.

 

[Mmac]

I don't think this is going to work either. I think we have to go to the extreme and just start from scratch and make a Version 2. Lets just start out what we did before and discuss 2-3 Characters a Week.

We just need to get organized and discuss characters orderly. The discussion is just being a mess, and discussing every character at once isn't really the way to go.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Falco would never be a neutral match up (atleast now now) it's 4:6 definitely, Falco is still just that good.
Falcon is 6:4, it doesn't matter that he's Falcon, you can't just degrade a character like that, Falcon as it is now, is in no way shape or form 7:3.
Zelda should be 4:6
Link is like 4:6 or 3.5: 6.5
Ganondorf is 8.5: 1.5: if not more >.>

 

[Gindler]

True, my views probably scewed from not playing very many marths. and when i do I use egg lay alot for the aerial range...but yeah this thread might need just a total make over and start from scratch doing the multiple characters a week deal so i agree with you there mmac

 

[Sharky]

I propose making a series of character discussion threads, much like the SBR does, along with other character forums. It'd make this thread a lot tidier, and it'd keep new visitors from constantly making "how do I beat ___" threads. Just make a link to each thread next to the character in this thread's OP. =)

edit: of course we wouldn't make them all at the same time, so as to not drown out all the other threads that people post in. Just 1-3 per week or something would do.