• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

"Yom-Bum!" The Yoshi Film Analysis Channel.

Nogzor'z

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
290
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
Pretty nice matches...
You say that he adapted quickly to you, but i think it's only because you became a bit predictable. Sheik caught on to your attempts to attack as soon at he has to land. Naturally, JP began to shield more often.
This would be your chance to mix up your attacks with grabs or neutral B to keep the opponent on their toes.
 

SheerMadness

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 18, 2005
Messages
4,781
Watched the 1st two Falco vids. You got some nice laser parries in. Falco's aerials are just as easy to parry so work on parrying those. And remember to parry everytime you jump, it's a good habit to have even when you're not intentionally trying to parry anything.

As for other parts of your game I can't help too much. Your Yoshi is better at everything aside from parrying, good stuff.
 

Mind Trick

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 11, 2006
Messages
670
Location
Amsterdam, NL
working on it ^^
(working on parrying EVERYTHING :flame:)

definitely more abusing of parry
less bair
less uptilt
more patience
less risks at edge
more grabs/neutral b
djc nair to grab standard at low %
less telegraphed djc attacks from fullhop

that's my list atm.
 

Nogzor'z

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
290
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
(working on parrying EVERYTHING :flame:)
Pretty much my main concren too, except that you're much better at it than me, ATM :p
Hopefully I can get parry down decently in time for tuscon tourney on the 16th

** Any chance im gonna see another yoshi there?
 

Mind Trick

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 11, 2006
Messages
670
Location
Amsterdam, NL
Crouching and holding a shoulder button while plugging in to eliminate light shield (on either R or L) helps a lot.

I'm thinking parry upsmash might be really good against a lot of stuff too, need to experiment with that some more.
 

yoshiiscool

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 30, 2005
Messages
352
Location
Murfreesboro, TN (east Pa during summer)
Parry upsmash is the easiest thing to do from a parry, and SO helpful. You should definitely try to implement that in first. I think I put it in the actual parry thread that it's pretty consistently the fastest way to get out an attack after a parry. I backed it up with some frame data, but I completely forget it now ^^.


Btw, how does eliminating light shield help for parrying? >.>
 

Nogzor'z

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
290
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
Well Mind Trick, Ill try to give some critique... Although my matchup experience against both ganon and ness are limited.

I LOVE how ganon is easy to combo and quite easy to edge-guard. You seemed to do well both in comboing and edge-guarding Ace's ganon. Just as a helpful hint... Perhaps you could use more grabs or, even better, Neutral B to stop any shield happy ganons who like to abuse Shieldgrab > D-throw.

Your matches with ness we're of similar problems. Exa's ness shield> grab quite a bit against you. Try mixing up reverse DJC Fairs with Reverse DJC Neutral B to avoid being shieldgrabbed due to a mis-spaced fair. Along the lines of eggs, How do they fair against ness' F-air. If they consistently hit ness through his common approach (short hop > F-air) then use eggs more often, i guess...
I can't stress enough though... Use grabs and Egg lay more often, especially if you see any habitual shielding by an opponent. Egg lay = free damage, a second to cool down and reposition yourself, and ( if your opponent can't waveland out of the egg or has trouble escaping in general) placing of the enemy in a position favorable to you.
And of course, grabs lead to tasty combos, on some characters.
 

darkgirku

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2007
Messages
252
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
Yeah, Egg Lay is has always been a very underrated move. Against Fastfallers, it can lead to an egg >combo if they don't know how to/can't instawaveland out > shield. And if they DO know to do that, then you just repeat egglay. Can really mess with people's minds and case em to get frustrated.

Against floaties, the little hop out that breaking out of the egg causes forces them up into the air, vulnerable to an easy egg throw or uair damage/comboes.

Also, Utilt is pretty laggy for shield pressure/followup after a fair/nair on a shield. try jab mixups shield pressure to spaced ftilts after you get someone into their shield. A nice little trick that seems to work nicely is jab/spaced ftilt shield pressure to shorthop late egg lay. They'll stay in their shield to try to block a nair/fair. =D

The last thing I want to mention is DJCCs. I saw you do it a few times, and it was cool. But remember to try and do it as a combo breaker. Almost like using luigi's and peach's fair to stop someones combo... except you simply hafta jump first. That, and you can use DJCC Uair instead of nair to instantly reverse the combo ! It's really not too hard. You just get used to jumping out of hitstun as soon as possible and waiting for the hit. If they get used to it and space away their hit from the djcc, you can even follow them with the nair, unlike peach or luigi.

good stuff tho =D
 

Nogzor'z

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
290
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
Well, Yoshido...
One thing I noticed quickly in your matches is the numbers of smashes, especially F-smash, you used. While Yoshi's F-smash and other smashes are quite useful with their range, pull-back, and knockback, they all have a decent amount of lag afterwards. I can see future matches where your opponents will avoid the smash attack and punish heavily. Please just use them with precaution.
Specifically for the Falcon v Yoshi matchup, but good Advice in general, Try moving around more... while staying in a comfortable position. Wavedashes, dashdances, and wavelands on platforms can be utilized greatly to make Yoshi much more difficult to chase and hit. This is important especially against Captain Falcon since he'll be the one "approaching" most of the time.
Also against Falcon (and other fast fallers), well timed up-angled F-tilt's can stop some of Falcons more abused approaches cold, especially against his Nair. Ftilt is also useful in comboing into many other moves, like into multiple DJC'd Uairs, at mid percentages.

*lemme try a similie here
Yoshi is a very swift and aerially mobile character, so make use of his ability and be as quick and annoying as a cockroach to throw your opponent off balance and lead them to make awkward choices.
 

yoshiiscool

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 30, 2005
Messages
352
Location
Murfreesboro, TN (east Pa during summer)
In addition to what Nogzy said, you also seem to rely on your shield a lot. That's a VERY bad idea vs grab heavy chars since Yoshi has no aggressive way of getting out of his shield, so a good falcon will just wait it out and always get a grab if they catch you in it. Another thing, if given the option for a guaranteed f-smash or d-smash (like comboing into them) always go for the d-smash, as it has the better KO potential, and sets up better for edgeguarding due to it's lower angle of trajectory.
 

YOSHIDO

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 3, 2004
Messages
927
Location
Waukegan, IL
Cool thanks for the advice. I get a lil scared of doing wave lands because i allways get hit with up airs and such out of my second jump. But i spose instead of trying to sheild or parry try just moving to better positions. An I'm guessing I just need to start my wavelands and wavedashes earlier than the captain starts his jump to out range the stomp and other answers.
 

V3ctorMan

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Messages
2,261
Location
Sierra Vista AZ
^ sorry ^

Allrite sorry about the delay... Here you all go... I still have some more Vs Axe/Taj, but I assumed.. many of my vids vs Axe have already been seen.. so I'll choose more accordingly.. Have vids vs AZ's Best Falcon.. and AZ's best Peach =p.. Comment/critique/enjoy... <3 Yoshi players.. (atm prolly AZ's best Young Link too) XD..

Allrite Enjoy! :)

vs GamerGuitarist (Falcon)

Game 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_OjsunF4jg
Game 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIY3dFTRfB8

vs Silly Kyle (Peach)

Game 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ow6upXzaqB0
Game 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_3epXI9dmg ---> Pretty cool supershield. <3
Game 3 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o68nLmuOr1A
Game 4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmBNcgfoL-o


vs GamerGuitarist (Young Link)

Game 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIKJV3dr1C8
Game 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlCeUfrIsEo
Game 3 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SoRHm6Nf54


Hope everyone enjoys! ^^; I'm gettin there ^^;
 

Nogzor'z

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
290
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
I originally posted this in the Ask Vman thread... but I feel it has more belonging here (since it is the film analysis channel.

Yes V3ctorman... watching your shield pressure makes me jealous.

I noticed an interesting use of Egg lay off the ledge that you were using. Im not sure how to comment on it but I think I might go ahead and trying it out a bit myself.

The matches against silly kyle were great. I love the peach v yoshi matchup myself and hope to play his peach more in the future.
Might I add that on the defensive against a peach who is also on ground level and they are, in a sense, using FC aerials as a means of defense; try using an egglay at around mid shorthop height, even if its not DJC'd. I find it hits more often than not since Peach's aerial and ground movement aren't incredibly fast.
Also...It would've been awesome if you'd have caught that beam sword in match 3 v peach.

I can't really say much about the Young link matches, for i have pretty much no experience against Y.link.
Perhaps hitting his shield with tilts isn't the best idea, since his grab will probably still reach you, even if properly spaced.

Awesome matches overall, I liked the Yoshi v Peach matches the most. You two were all over the place. )
 

yoshiiscool

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 30, 2005
Messages
352
Location
Murfreesboro, TN (east Pa during summer)
Lol tec, we call it supershielding or parrying. It's pretty much the same concept as a powershield, in that it has no shieldstun, and the timing's about the same, but Yoshi can abuse those first frames of his shield by jumping out of it. So he just anticipated the f-air, and parried it into a DJC n-air.

lrn2Yoshi, bro.
 

Reptar

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 11, 2010
Messages
111
Location
401 REP
Hey im a new 401 Smasher, I was going to post this on a Q & A thread but I didnt see one. I just wanted to try out Yoshi and wanted to know If you could give me some tips and tell me what I should be practicing. I know the basics such as wave-dashing/landing so you dont have to take it easy =]. Please and thankyous
 

darkgirku

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2007
Messages
252
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
For yoshi, I guess just get really comfortable with his movements. Learn how and why he turns around (or doesn't) when you double jump, get used to exactly when to double jump to get you where you wanna be.

Learn how to try to avoid shielding the wrong way (unless you're parrying). If you hafta shield, keep it to a minimum and get out of it as soon as you can. Know that you can attack pretty quickly out of a roll (dsmash or jab, etc)

Get good at combo DI. Since yoshi can be combo'd pretty well, you must learn how to DI away from combos as best as possible. Then you can use your jump at the last second to escape it and possibly even start your own combo. (know about his super armor frames when he jumps and how to exploit them)

Theres a buncha other stuff, but I think most if it comes with getting used to his movement. yoshi can be pretty quicky and tricky to keep track of for the opponent, especially on platform stages, so learn to waveland around on platforms consistently.

After you get comfortable/good with his wacky unorthodox movements, you can start learning bread n butter combo moves like Bair leading into tilts and uairs.

also common approaches you can use like Bair or a quick reverse double jump canceled nair/fair.

And of course the more advanced stuff like parrying or double jump cancel countering.

Lol this is unorganized, but if you need a better explanation don't hesitate to ask P:
 

Reptar

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 11, 2010
Messages
111
Location
401 REP
"Yea I definately understand where your coming from with the whole get comfortable with his movements because they are rather unorthodox. While watching V3ctor play you start to realize how important being able to waveland about is on the plats with the yoshinator. For now im just waveland slide on the plats of yoshi story and battlefield and get comfortable with it. By then hopefully V3ctor or another yoshi main can post the b & b's of yoshi's offense for me. Thanx DGirku"


November 17th, Im good with Yoshi's movements now, if anyone is paying attention to this thread, I use nairs, bairs, utilts, f tilts, annnnd f smash, any others I should be using in Yoshi's arsenal?
 

V3ctorMan

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Messages
2,261
Location
Sierra Vista AZ
Sorry everyone works been a bit stellar for me... I'll have some new videos soon.. and i'll do anything I can to help out ^^ sorry again.
 

Reptar

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 11, 2010
Messages
111
Location
401 REP
V2ctorMan is baaack ^_^, think you could give me a synposis of yoshi? i was also wondering what you do when your yoshi looks like it airdodges then nairs, is it like a djump cancel?
 

V3ctorMan

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Messages
2,261
Location
Sierra Vista AZ
^^ hey sorry.. umm I copied and pasted this same advice that I gave to my friend Teczero.. so here go
When I have free time and not procrastinating, I'm totally hitting up your Yoshi thread/VM wall.

Best expect <3333333

Oh and you're awesome thanks :)

Actually if you don't mind can you gimme a list of things to practice? Like techniques and stuff. I guess I should start getting used to his movements anyway.




Well, you definetely, wanna at least get a very, very solid feel for him... He's COMPLETELY unorthodox, his movement(s) are so unique to the rest of the cast, and of course.. you'll need to get "used" to "receiving damage to give damage" or DJCC (double jump cancel counter).. I recommend try getting use to the timing(s) of all his moves, to see what kind of "style" of Yoshi you'd like to play... The tricky, patient yoshi's such as Nogzor's, Svampen, leffen, yoshiiscool, many others are simple examples.. or the flashy, overtechnical, aggressive Yoshi, like myself, fumi, and i'm sure there are others ... =p

or of course making a mix of the two.. ^^ just do simple things such as these... ^^ biggest, and most notable thing you should practice...is Yoshi's shield... get used to it's properties, and how it works... :) since his shield is very, VERY different from the cast.. both good, and bad best part = no shield stab, hard to tell difference between, light shield/normal shield.. worst part = obviously no Jump oos (bar parrying)
 

Reptar

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 11, 2010
Messages
111
Location
401 REP
Thank you very much, I have some counter questions for your advice, such as, how can i DJCC? and taking damage to give damage part, do you mean like crouch tech and downsmash? annd yes i have to get used to his sheild, i really dont get it haha, but the movements are coming naturaly with time
 

darkgirku

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2007
Messages
252
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
By taking damage to give damage, he means like...

getting hit while you're in the air at low damage before you use your double jump and them immediately using your double jump to follow the opponent and hit back with your own aerial ( i think lol. Crouch canceling into down smash is good too. Not crouch teching, as that'll prly make you get hit again.) [V3ctorman can prly explain his thoughts on this better tho P: ]

...or by doing a DJCC... To do this, you have to be hit during your double jump. After you get hit, you can double jump cancel into an aerial of choice.
This means that you must try and use your jump right before you think the opponent is going to hit you with something. So you Jump > get hit> Aerial.

You can also use DJCCs to break out of combos. Just practice using your jump right after your hitstun ends. You can turn the combo back on the opponent like this lol. Just be careful at high damages, because instead of getting a free hit/combo, you might get gimped to death because an attack breaks your DJ at higher percentages. This means you gotta know which attacks break your DJ earlier than others, like FALCOs SHINE or marth tippers, lol.

As for yoshi's shield, One handy trick is to light shield to slide away from pressure lol. You can light shield, unknowingly to your opponent, in many ways. either use a trigger button if your good at that, or press and hold z while your in attack lag (like, during an L cancel). You can also Lcancel with z if that helps. Also, you can start holding z during any other attack on the ground (d tilt, d smash, etc)
 

Reptar

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 11, 2010
Messages
111
Location
401 REP
basicaly i need to know a little of every character then, so i know i wont be gimped, because some matchups might be easier to gimp me then others
 

V3ctorMan

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Messages
2,261
Location
Sierra Vista AZ
Hey, everyone let's try to get this thread up, live, and hot again.. ^^ that'd be cool.. anyway.. small update on some videos... ^^ I hope everyone likes! <3

New Yoshi videos - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=damWQ7OHjdw

ALSO:
- Yoshi players and anyone/everyone.. who wants.. I'm going to update the OP, and turn it also into a Film Compilation thread... for all the Yoshi players, New and old.. to view/watch/learn from all of the Yoshi players etc... Something familiar with the Ultimate movie collection i did in the Mewtwo forums...

I think this would be a good idea.. to use as reference for all the players.. ^^ and could really boost our thread... (hopefully) so If you don't mind.. I'm gonna post.. any/most of the Yoshi videos I find on youtube.. and the player(s) behind them.. to make an ultimate collection kinda thread too.. :)

If you DON'T want to be included, or certain matches included etc... than just lemme know.. and I'll not include the certain matches.. etc..

Mind Trick? Moo? Nogzor? Leffen? You all think this is a cool idea?.. I'm a get started.. msg ^^ Yoshi boards need some action ^^
 

leffen

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 30, 2008
Messages
2,032
Location
Stockholm, Sweden
Yeah lets go ;D I definitely support the idea :d

I think we should hold a weekly matchup discussion type of thingy, esp since most yoshi players all seem to have those few matchup they hate while others tend to love the very same matchup.
If you guys like the idea I could start it up : ) I would suggest starting with fox / falco / puff and then going down the tierlist.

I also think we should compile a guide on the new / technical aspects of yoshi, a complete parry guide, shield pressure guide etc.

Oh and that aim / skype convo thing totally needs to happen!
 

darkgirku

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2007
Messages
252
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
Weekly discussion focusing on certain matchups sounds good/fun lol

And yeah, an up to date compilation of yoshi vids would be nice =D

Edit: V3ctorMan, I just watched your new upload vs rook, And it was really good. Seriously, you look like you keep getting so much better each time you put up a new vid! Keep at it man, I was impressed with a lot of that stuff
 

Nogzor'z

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
290
Location
Flagstaff, AZ
Sounds great, both the Film Compilation idea and the matchup discussions.
Not only would it help make the yoshi boards a bit more active, but it'll also give me incentive lurk less and post/discuss more.
 

V3ctorMan

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Messages
2,261
Location
Sierra Vista AZ
*sigh* allrite it took a few days to get them all uploaded.. but I have all the recent videos.. I've had uploaded... please any/everyone.. please take a gander at em.. and lemme know any advice... (specially with Luigi) that's such a weird matchup.. ><' anyway here you all go... ^^ Enjoy!

Vs Rooktionary (Fox) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=damWQ7OHjdw
Vs Nicknyte (Ganon) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4lF4lWVwnQ
Vs Nicknyte (Luigi) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmwX65FKkak

Hope everyone likes... ^^

Rate/Comment/Critique/etc.. ^^
 
Top Bottom