Wonderland Mafia GAME OVER: Town/Independent Win!

[Omni]

It's not a Mafia ploy, Cacti. Do you find my play pre/post announcement of the message scummy in any way? Even if you had an explanation I find it funny that you'll start explaining things when you're on the plank but fail to do so when someone else is on.

I simply want you dead for quickhammering Steel and ending the Day prematurely. Mainly principle. Given that we already got one mafia down, if you flip town we'll just lynch Marshy next.

@Tom: Are you getting on the Cacti wagon or not?

 

[Tom]

As a lynch "on principle," this lynch is TERRIBLE. No, I'm not going to get on it. Why would I? I trust Cacti and know him to be innocent.

----

@Omni, Chaco, Nicholas, Junglefever, Xiivi: Look at it from this perspective: Marshy is claiming vanilla townie. Cacti is claiming backup watcher and says that he saw Marshy visit the dead Gheb, which Marshy argues against. We can either lynch Cacti and risk losing the claimed backup watcher, or we can lynch Marshy and risk losing a claimed vanilla townie. Uh, hello? There shouldn't even be a debate on that. We obviously have a mislynch. We get the same amount of information from both lynches, but we do not risk losing the claimed backup watcher that I found trust in and believe he is innocent.

With a claimed backup watcher alive, and the claimed doctor alive, they will have to repeatedly produce evidence that could show future contradictions. With a vanilla townie alive, he has absolutely nothing to prove and his claim could not come to bite him in the butt later. They will also be required to protect the important roles, further allowing more information, because there is no more mafia roleblocker.

----

Chaco, you are unable to claim "un CC'd doc," because an un CC'd doc has NO MERIT in a game with a confirmed watcher and a claimed backup watcher. How do you even think it does?

To confirm some things, I never said that I was not the Mad Hatter, that was a misinterpretation by Junglefever and has been corrected.

Nobody should hammer, because this should not be today's lynch. We should be lynching Marshy today, and if you are Town aligned and do not recognize this, then you seriously need to reconsider and look at what I posted above.

 

[Omni]

Where did Marshy claim vanilla townie, Tom?

 

[Tom]

vote cacti silly scumbag. only way this isn't a fakeclaim is if there's a framer or i'm a miller who wasn't told. it might be the case since i'm white rabbit and my posting restriction is that i have to be the last to post each day but a watcher, a backup watcher, governor and doctor is malarkey

sorry. this looked very much like a vanilla claim to me. says theres an option to be a miller (millers, if they dont know they are millers, are told they are townies), and he posted his posting restriction but nothing more.

 

[Xiivi]

I'd rather lynch scumfever, but if we're going to go down the kneejerk path I'll hammer whichever of Cacti/Marshy gets to L-1.

Anyone have anything they're wanting to say that can't be done in our twilight phase before I end the day? [Would like to hear responses from Omni, Scumfever, Nick, and Chaco.]

Tom what you are arguing is what I mentioned as my reasoning for wanting to lynch Marshy over Cacti was before, but it's quite clear people are in favour of a Cacti lynch (which I still believe is still a kneejerk reaction from Cacti's hammer being a quicklynch). It's funny how after I make my post saying I'll hammer once someone gets to L-1 that Omni and Nick quickly place their votes on Cacti.

But as is, the only people not voting on one of the two are Scumfever and myself. Even if both of us were to vote for Marshy, the Cacti lynch would go through anyway. I don't see reason to prolong this debate when it's clear no one is moving to a target other than one of these two and the people already voting are deadset one way or another. And it appears we're going to have to kneejerk from Cacti to Marshy instead of Marshy to Cacti. (Provided the lynchee flips town.)

 

[Omni]

Relax, Xiivi. Do you not see the obvious question being posed? You're the one that seems quick to end the Day. We just commenced a proper wagon.

Marshy, are you claiming vanilla townie?

 

[Circus]

Anyone have anything they're wanting to say that can't be done in our twilight phase before I end the day?

I suppose it's only fair for me to say that, now that The King of Hearts is dead, there will be no time specifically set aside for Twilight anymore. You can continue to post after a hammer, obviously, but once I post the Day ending flavor, the game will immediately shift to the Night phase.

My bad for not stating that earlier.

 

[Tom]

Omni, it is day 3. it only takes 5 to lynch. there is no need for a bandwagon. i would be far more comfortable if i actually understood why nicholas is voting cacti and i would be a lot happier if you and chaco didn't seem so far out there. you seem to be out for blood against cacti for a reason that is only acceptable on the surface. he hammered early, so? the lynch seemed going to happen anyways, and nothing about hammering early makes him scum. chaco is mr. self protect claimed doctor and im sorry but i still do not believe he is a doctor, especially with a watcher flip and the claimed backup coming from cacti.

omni, i feel like you ignored my two paragraphs about the lynch because you didnt address them, even after i put your name on it. what do you think about them.

 

[Omni]

If Xiivi was scum, that could have been a viable tactic/excuse to quickhammer... but not anymore!.

Thanks!

 

[Tom]

If Xiivi was scum, that could have been a viable tactic/excuse to quickhammer... but not anymore!.

Thanks!

lol whatever omni. weird.

also, xiivi, you shouldn't hammer. i am determined to know exactly why they are lynching cacti. if he is lynched i basically wasted that because i could have tried to see if i could have found someone else trustworthy instead of him.

i specifically thought of cacti because of this kneejerk situation and if i found him to be trustworthy, i would post that so he would not be lynched. now, i did that, AND he posted to have guilty information on Marshy... and you are all voting Cacti? this is garbage.

 

[Omni]

Omni, it is day 3. it only takes 5 to lynch. there is no need for a bandwagon. i would be far more comfortable if i actually understood why nicholas is voting cacti and i would be a lot happier if you and chaco didn't seem so far out there. you seem to be out for blood against cacti for a reason that is only acceptable on the surface. he hammered early, so? the lynch seemed going to happen anyways, and nothing about hammering early makes him scum. chaco is mr. self protect claimed doctor and im sorry but i still do not believe he is a doctor, especially with a watcher flip and the claimed backup coming from cacti.

omni, i feel like you ignored my two paragraphs about the lynch because you didnt address them, even after i put your name on it. what do you think about them.

- What do you mean by Chaco and I being so far out there?

- Cacti did a few things. He has been coasting most of the game, and he quicklynched Steel without EVER giving the explanation he said he would. That has been my biggest issue and it's pretty **** important. If I say I'm going to explain my thoughts on a certain person, don't, and then hammer them I should be having my *** ridden the next Day.

To be honest, Tom, I think you're afraid of Cacti being lynched. I find it interesting that you don't find Cacti scummy in the least bit despite your "investigation". If you are scum, you could easily claim that you have "an investigative role" without claiming said role by chance of counterclaim. From there, you just choose a person you believe isn't the Indie (although the Indie will not argue with you if you chose him) and your select a scum buddy as the second "clear" person. A few things bothered me about you:

1.) The letters seem to be addressed by you.
2.) Your suspicion on Chaco whom I feel is safe at the moment.
3.) The fact that you said in several posts that you feel I may be lying about the message I received. Slightly meta here but I feel the town Tom I know would be all over that. Whether you agree or disagree with me on this point doesn't matter since that's my perception of you.

Anyway, I don't trust you, Tom, and I find Cacti to be more scummier than Marshy. I'd rather lynch the scummier character [Cacti] to see what his flip results. If he flips town, Marshy can die. If he flips scum, you can die.

Any more questions?

-----

Oh, but I do agree Nick needs to speak the **** up.

 

[Omni]

Altho, and this just came to my head, I can totally see Chaco bussing his partner early in D1.

Sounds like a Chaco kinda' tactic. =D

But nah, can't act on gut feelings like that at the moment. Too much scum everywhere else.

 

[Tom]

- What do you mean by Chaco and I being so far out there?

- Cacti did a few things. He has been coasting most of the game, and he quicklynched Steel without EVER giving the explanation he said he would. That has been my biggest issue and it's pretty **** important. If I say I'm going to explain my thoughts on a certain person, don't, and then hammer them I should be having my *** ridden the next Day.

To be honest, Tom, I think you're afraid of Cacti being lynched. I find it interesting that you don't find Cacti scummy in the least bit despite your "investigation". If you are scum, you could easily claim that you have "an investigative role" without claiming said role by chance of counterclaim. From there, you just choose a person you believe isn't the Indie (although the Indie will not argue with you if you chose him) and your select a scum buddy as the second "clear" person. A few things bothered me about you:

1.) The letters seem to be addressed by you.
2.) Your suspicion on Chaco whom I feel is safe at the moment.
3.) The fact that you said in several posts that you feel I may be lying about the message I received. Slightly meta here but I feel the town Tom I know would be all over that. Whether you agree or disagree with me on this point doesn't matter since that's my perception of you.

Anyway, I don't trust you, Tom, and I find Cacti to be more scummier than Marshy. I'd rather lynch the scummier character [Cacti] to see what his flip results. If he flips town, Marshy can die. If he flips scum, you can die.

Any more questions?

-----

Oh, but I do agree Nick needs to speak the **** up.

I simply cannot understand what would motivate you two to act the way you are if you are town. in chaco's case, he did great day 1, and then hes fudged it all up and isnt convincing at all. his claim was totally bogus out of nowhere and i dont see why there would be a doc when there is a watcher. for you, i really do not find your terrible drive to lynch cacti for his hammer to be smart, i find it to be stubborn and since i cant explain it, it is out there. also, this whole letter thing has been a complete weirdo and out there, i dont trust marshy at all, and you and him are the ones who have gotten the letters, so it puts me off.

the "claim an 'investigative role' without being specific to avoid a counterclaim" is weak and you know it. You should know what my role is by now. If not, you're ********, but at LEAST you know my favorite flavors of icecream. I severely doubt there is a single person who doesnt know what role i am, and i havent ever claimed it because the Queen of Hearts isn't dead yet.

your point about the letters seeming to be addressed by me is dumb also. why would I put my own name on an incriminating letter.

your meta on me is weak and i dont even know where you got it from. possibly Grammys mafia where KevinM sent me letters but he sent them ONLY to me and no one else. so yeah, it looks like youre just reaching for a 3) there to fit your awful 1) and 2)

no, i do not want to lynch cacti, because he will flip town. im seriously going to hate you all forever, the ones of you who are townies and are just dumbfooting your way through this game. i sure hope its marshy+nicholas/junglefever and not either chaco or omni.

chaco's roleclaim is unbelievable because i believe cacti to be town and therefore watcher+backup would leave no room for any more roles based around making good on mafia kills. also, his claim was really, really bad, and he is thick as hell. but keeping him alive means i cannot die, because theres no roleblocker, so im not going to push that, ESPECIALLY when i have cacti-town here saying that marshy visited gheb.

 

[Omni]

it's not dumbfooting. it's looking at it from another point of view. get your head out of your *** and realize just because someone sees things from a different perspective doesn't make it a dumb perspective.

you want marshy dead and you suspect me and/or chaco.
i want cacti dead and i suspect your and/or omis.

you're judging marshy based off your investigation on cacti of finding him clear.
i'm judging based off overall scumminess. cacti reeks of it (not as much as omis).

different paths to hopefully the same end route. you'll obviously disagree with me because my path includes being very cautious of you.

 

[Omni]

still waiting for marshy to confirm his claim.

 

[Xiivi]

lol SWF acts like if we don't spend the entire time going in circles then we've wasted the day

omni what do you consider a quickhammer anyway? why is cacti at L-1 anyway if we're worried about quickhammers? what explanation did you want from Cacti? his reasoning was all OMGUS, sorry if that wasn't sufficient, but I don't think Cacti has the calibur for much more (sorry Cacti!)

I don't see the lynch changing at this point. I see Tom arguing the same stuff about why we should be lynching Marshy instead of Cacti (it's all good stuff) and I see everyone else wanting to lynch Cacti from kneejerk. It's funny how people go "fastest day 1 to 2 combo eva!" and get mad at Cacti for ending the day. I'll admit I was guilty of it too, but you people are so tunnelvisioned you aren't willing to believe his claimed investigation results enough to lynch his guilty result first even when he has a claimed innocent on him.

And you know what, after seeing his nameclaim and seeing his reaction to Marshy's note, I'm pretty sure he's telling the truth about it. unvote: vote: Marshy With scumfever V/LA until Sunday, we're gonna have all the time in the world! :D

his fav ice creams are peppermint or chocolate like, what don't you guys understand

why don't you guys see anything
you guys should really see these things, even if they are backwards

tl;dr
buddy toM buddy toM we have so much in common!

Omni
Omni

Cacti always plays his way into these dumb or scum scenarios.
Marshy always plays good.

oh guys in case I didn't make it obvious I lied about my favourite ice cream
it's not mint it's chocolate chip

alright let's go town!

 

[Tom]

lol SWF acts like if we don't spend the entire time going in circles then we've wasted the day

omni what do you consider a quickhammer anyway? why is cacti at L-1 anyway if we're worried about quickhammers? what explanation did you want from Cacti? his reasoning was all OMGUS, sorry if that wasn't sufficient, but I don't think Cacti has the calibur for much more (sorry Cacti!)

I don't see the lynch changing at this point. I see Tom arguing the same stuff about why we should be lynching Marshy instead of Cacti (it's all good stuff) and I see everyone else wanting to lynch Cacti from kneejerk. It's funny how people go "fastest day 1 to 2 combo eva!" and get mad at Cacti for ending the day. I'll admit I was guilty of it too, but you people are so tunnelvisioned you aren't willing to believe his claimed investigation results enough to lynch his guilty result first even when he has a claimed innocent on him.

And you know what, after seeing his nameclaim and seeing his reaction to Marshy's note, I'm pretty sure he's telling the truth about it. unvote: vote: Marshy With scumfever V/LA until Sunday, we're gonna have all the time in the world! :D

his fav ice creams are peppermint or chocolate like, what don't you guys understand

why don't you guys see anything
you guys should really see these things, even if they are backwards

tl;dr
buddy toM buddy toM we have so much in common!

Omni
Omni

Cacti always plays his way into these dumb or scum scenarios.
Marshy always plays good.

oh guys in case I didn't make it obvious I lied about my favourite ice cream
it's not mint it's chocolate chip

alright let's go town!

this has to be like the greatest post ever made on swf in a mafia game for like a hundred reasons

just lynch marshy holy ****. someone claimed to have an innocent on him and he claimed to have a guilty on marshy, AND we have a mislynch or two since its day 3 and scum is down 1 man.

 

[Omni]

unovte

Vote: Marshy

k, but only cuz Xiivi pulled out the Aladdin card

 

[Circus]

Off with their heads!:

Marshy (4): Cacti, Tom, Xiivi, Omni
Cacti (3): Marshy, Chaco, Nicholas1024

Not voting (1): Scumfever

Deadline: Sunday, December 6th, at 11:59:59pm, EST

With 8 alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.

 

[Tom]

Marshy look into my eyes and tell me you are not scum:

 

[Omni]

*die s*

 

[#HBC | marshy]

i was claiming vanilla

this reeks of traitor play and cacti is so obviously banking on tom bailing him out and connecting me to omni. omni and i made up the notes? what? we'd either have to "keep getting notes" or give it to our scumbuddies. it's just a dumb plan. also i haven't been talking about it and only did when pressured

@Omni, Chaco, Nicholas, Junglefever, Xiivi: Look at it from this perspective: Marshy is claiming vanilla townie. Cacti is claiming backup watcher and says that he saw Marshy visit the dead Gheb, which Marshy argues against. We can either lynch Cacti and risk losing the claimed backup watcher, or we can lynch Marshy and risk losing a claimed vanilla townie. Uh, hello? There shouldn't even be a debate on that. We obviously have a mislynch. We get the same amount of information from both lynches, but we do not risk losing the claimed backup watcher that I found trust in and believe he is innocent.

With a claimed backup watcher alive, and the claimed doctor alive, they will have to repeatedly produce evidence that could show future contradictions. With a vanilla townie alive, he has absolutely nothing to prove and his claim could not come to bite him in the butt later. They will also be required to protect the important roles, further allowing more information, because there is no more mafia roleblocker.

----

Chaco, you are unable to claim "un CC'd doc," because an un CC'd doc has NO MERIT in a game with a confirmed watcher and a claimed backup watcher. How do you even think it does?

this game has no semblance of balance if there's a watcher backup watcher and doctor. chaco's been confirmed since he was 2nd on the riddle wagon. you think timid chaco scum started this game planning to bus his partner? even after you watched him in ff7? cacti's the scum between those 3 and if you're cop stop trusting sanity so much yeesh

 

[Cacti]

Not backup watcher, universal backup I think. I wasn't given my role (backup watcher) until d2.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

you're still scum

 

[Xiivi]

Chaco is V/LA along with Scumfever now.

And Nick is barely active.

Marshy we're gonna need you to pull a Hando. <3

 

[Xiivi]

oh snap, Nick just V/LAed too

go team!

 

[Tom]

that is ridiculous... 3 of 8 V/LA...

 

[Circus]

go team!

You say "Go Team!" too? How did I never know how rad you were?

But this is a lot of people to have out of commission all at once, especially since at least two of them might not be able to say anything before the deadline. Would you guys like the deadline extended so that Jungle, Chaco and Nick can get some last minute thoughts in, or would you rather just get toDay over with? I'm debating whether or not it would actually be better/worthwhile to extend the deadline or if that's just needlessly stretching things out.

 

[Xiivi]

Well even if scumfever, nick, and chaco oppose a Marshy lynch, it'd happen anyway due to deadline rules.

So we can let this game be inactive for like a week and then have a week of discussion with them in it and they could try to swing the Omni vote.

Omni is like, the Sandra Day O'Connor of this game.

 

[Tom]

rather just get toDay over with

 

[Omni]

who is Sandra Day O'Connor wtf? if you're saying i'm the pivot then hell yea

remember chibo: the pivot is always clear

but nah im not going to change my vote this time. despite cacti being on my really want to kill list, marshy is claiming townie therefore he is expendable. we're ahead in the game with riddle dying so like i don't mind wagering a 50/50 gamble if the result nets us mafia the next day (and potentially mafia buddies)

i know u dont wanna get lynched and all marshy, but u should see that this plan of action is pretty solid. from your point of view, you may feel like your innocent and can make arguments based on scenarios that may be true but everyone elses we dont know for sure. we do know that a potential backup tracker may have caught you red-handed and we do know that a possible investigative role may have found cacti innocent. thats a lot of "evidence" that can be proven once you flip.

soooooo no, circus, end the Day cuz i hate waiting

 

[#HBC | marshy]

i hate waiting too. 3 of my voters who aren't cacti are active so they can switch to scumti before deadline

 

[Omni]

huh, theres me, xiivi, tom, and cacti on you. doubt that they're going to switch.

then chaco and nick are v/la.

so if u intend on persuading people to change their votes u should say something new. if not, just hammer yourself so we can move on

 

[Omni]

oh, there's scumfever who replaced omis. who does he have his vote on

 

[Omni]

yeah, he voted xiivi

anyway, jungle, do you mind bussing your partner for us

 

[#HBC | marshy]

i meant that you xiivi and tom are active so can all switch to cacti. that way we don't have to wait so long

 

[Xiivi]

jungle is v/la too omni, he can't bus right now

 

[Omni]

uh marshy do you not see that you're the play from an outside perspective

the best play that is

 

[#HBC | marshy]

actually unvote cacti vote marshy

self-HAMMAH

 

[Xiivi]

woah

mind has been blown that marshy actually did that

<3 marshy