Wobbling Compromise

[Roneblaster]

im tired of hearing about wobbling and match-ups

theres ****ing 5 IC players worth mentioning and most of they are top level players anyway.

come talk to me in a year when theres a flood of IC players all who wobble and have no business being in a tournament bracket but make it anyway.

all the arguments are the same as when this thread started. i will once again take my leave from this thread as nothing good or new has been said.

 

[EPsilon933]

come talk to me in a year when theres a flood of IC players all who wobble and have no business being in a tournament bracket but make it anyway.

Why limit/stop the success of a new player who plays as Ice climbers?

 

[TheZhuKeeper]

I think someone said this before, but there's no reason to not ban blobbling / JC wobbling / w/e the **** you guys are naming these infinites LOL. Anything that basically keeps an opponent locked in a grab is essentially "wobbling", I don't see why you would ban one but not ban the other (or the other way around).

Honestly, I think I wouldn't mind if wobbling helped Wobbles (and Fly!!) advance farther in the bracket because him paired up with really good players will probably set up for some of the best matches we've ever seen, especially against those who actually know how to fight against ICs. I'll just have to hope they're not on my side if that ever happens >_>

 

[adumbrodeus]

im tired of hearing about wobbling and match-ups

theres ****ing 5 IC players worth mentioning and most of they are top level players anyway.

come talk to me in a year when theres a flood of IC players all who wobble and have no business being in a tournament bracket but make it anyway.

all the arguments are the same as when this thread started. i will once again take my leave from this thread as nothing good or new has been said.

I'd LOVE to see that.


Seriously, it's ****ing ICs, there's no way that they can compete with the likes of fox, falco, marth, puff, and Peach.


The top tier in melee is too strong, even marth has trouble getting grabs against fox and falco, why should ICs get that grab?

 

[Ballistics]

I think someone said this before, but there's no reason to not ban blobbling / JC wobbling / w/e the **** you guys are naming these infinites LOL. Anything that basically keeps an opponent locked in a grab is essentially "wobbling", I don't see why you would ban one but not ban the other (or the other way around).

Honestly, I think I wouldn't mind if wobbling helped Wobbles (and Fly!!) advance farther in the bracket because him paired up with really good players will probably set up for some of the best matches we've ever seen, especially against those who actually know how to fight against ICs. I'll just have to hope they're not on my side if that ever happens >_>

Eh, then they need to change the ban to a ban on all ice climber infinites, because wobbling is not BLIZZOBBLING.

And if they do that I think we would get mad.

 

[TheZhuKeeper]

Eh, then they need to change the ban to a ban on all ice climber infinites, because wobbling is not BLIZZOBBLING.

And if they do that I think we would get mad.

Realistically nothing is going to get banned and anyone that isn't Peach / Ganon / etc is just gonna pray they don't get an IC in bracket LOL.

 

[Kyu Puff]

im tired of hearing about wobbling and match-ups

theres ****ing 5 IC players worth mentioning and most of they are top level players anyway.

come talk to me in a year when theres a flood of IC players all who wobble and have no business being in a tournament bracket but make it anyway.

all the arguments are the same as when this thread started. i will once again take my leave from this thread as nothing good or new has been said.

Good job refuting a single point... oh wait...

I'm tired of hearing stupid predictions not based in reality. Wobbling has been legal before (*gasp*) and what you're claiming never actually happened.

 

[pockyD]

who's to say they have no business being in the bracket? you couldn't beat a one-trick pony?

and also, it really can't happen like that since a flood of newb wobbling-only players would largely be forced to play each other and be unable to wobble

 

[john!]

just to clear up some misconceptions:

wobbling should be banned

IC's are a good character

Don't you always say that Falcon is a horrible character? Think before you say stuff like this.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Realistically nothing is going to get banned and anyone that isn't Peach / Ganon / etc is just gonna pray they don't get an IC in bracket LOL.

In the "ect" are most of the current melee players.

 

[Pengie]

Apparently some people are blatantly unaware of how a metagame works. Sure at first there is a possibilty of tournaments being flooded by ICs (a very slim one mind you) but afterwards that flood would be followed by an influx if more Peaches since she already destroys ICs. This would then prompt a rise in the number of Marth/Fox players and so on.

Keep in mind that this is only possible if the worst case scenario of a flood ICs in tournaments happens, which as I already stated is highly unlikely.

 

[BigD!!!]

peef, i said 6 or 7, and if you add in azn lep to your list (who is pretty good) thats 6

so you basically have 6 top level ice climber players out of (im gonna give a generous estimate here) 25ish total tournament going ice climber players

more than 20% of the people that play ice climbers in tournament are top level. thats the point i was trying to make. the possibility of the discovery of new strategies based on further usage of the character could lead to drastic improvements in the ice climber metagame, and their solidification as a top character.

for example, i think ice climber players in general under-utilize tech chasing. they say "wobbling only works if nana is right next to you and they are above 10%" but if you dthrow a fastfaller and actually actively tech chase them, nana should catch up to you by the second grab and that means that, not including any reaction based tech chasing which im sure is possible, you have a 1/4 chance of starting a wobble off of a grab even when nana isnt around. the only tech chasing ive ever seen ice climber players do, however, is guess something and charge dsmash.

 

[Zoler]

not written by me ... >.<

 

[P.C. Jona]

Realistically nothing is going to get banned and anyone that isn't Peach / Ganon / etc is just gonna pray they don't get an IC in bracket LOL.

idk about wc but tristate has that banned

and i like it that way

we all do

 

[Vro]

The compromise is pause DI.

 

[Ballistics]

Thats only holding tristate back. The people who allow wobbling and blizzobbling will be training to never get grabbed.

 

[adumbrodeus]

idk about wc but tristate has that banned

and i like it that way

we all do

Obviously not everyone does, in fact it seems the majority of people who are concerned about the issue don't like it that way.

If you meant all of tri-state... I'm tri-state, counter-example ftw.

 

[mastermoo420]

Thats only holding tristate back. The people who allow wobbling and blizzobbling will be training to never get grabbed.

This, in turn, will force all players to improve! Guys, unbanning any form of wobbling will better the melee community in the long run; do it.

 

[P.C. Jona]

who freaking cares

i cant believe you guys are still talking about this

its so stupid

no one is going to force it

or "opens someones eyes"

if a TO doesnt like it its banned

who gives a crap ughh

 

[john!]

^ that's why wobbling has been banned for so long, because of people like him who think "ic players are rare, nobody cares about them, let's just ban that nasty move of theirs even though they already suck, and forget about 'em".

i mean come on, ic's are top tier in brawl and their infinites are legal. and the odds of them becoming top tier in melee with wobbling are slim to none.

 

[Pengie]

Well obviously ICs care, in addition to all of the people who get fed up with the scrubby mentality among smashers that amounts to "lulz ICs r ghey cuz I got grabed n dey kiled mi ther sooooooooo ghey". Not to mention that these are the same people who are very vocal and pressure TO's into banning something that even they agree isn't broken. The TOs then ban wobbling for fear of it hurting the tournaments attendance and the cycle continues. We need more TO's to just man the fuck up, make wobbling legal at their tournaments and let all of the scrubs either stay home and complain, or go to the tournament and cry when their carelessness gets them wobbled.

Or maybe instead of bitching and moaning they'd learn to avoid getting grabbed and the entire smash community benefits.

 

[EPsilon933]

barlw players are so much better than we are.

 

[john!]

Well judging by the recent trend of hating on Peef, TO's won't exactly be racing to allow wobbling at their tourneys. Keep in mind that the majority of smashers play top tier characters and, and the ones that hate wobbling do so for purely selfish reasons. Allowing wobbling would hurt these top tier characters, benefit IC's, and also indirectly benefit IC counters such as Peach and Ganon, leading to greater character balance. This is a case where democracy fails hard just because most people don't want more competition to get in the way of their top-tier gayness.

 

[EPsilon933]

character balance

You know what low tier would probably benefit the most with wobbling legal? Zelda. She can play a pretty good game vs Ice Climbers. I'd say it's only like 60:40 in Ice Climbers' favor. If there's more Ice Climbers to get rid of the gayer characters like Sheik, Falcon, and Falco (all of which are ******** bullies to Zelda, like 80:20), Zelda could have a much easier time advancing to higher places. I'm shure this applies to a few other low tiers as well.

 

[john!]

I was honestly going to say Zelda but didn't want to get into a matchup discussion, because she's a very uncommon character. I play IC's vs. Zelda occasionally and it's not fun.

By the way, when I said "top tier characters", I just meant the top 5 (Fox, Falco, Sheik, Marth, Puff).

 

[EPsilon933]

I was honestly going to say Zelda but didn't want to get into a matchup discussion, because she's a very uncommon character. I play IC's vs. Zelda occasionally and it's not fun.

By the way, when I said "top tier characters", I just meant the top 5 (Fox, Falco, Sheik, Marth, Puff).

I'm just talking atm because I'm bored.

 

[john!]

hey, we have something in common lol



edit: besides the pokemon avatars

 

[Ballistics]

The players in favor and against the ban are now 25 to 67

I really don't think this thread can contribute anymore to opinion, thanks to everyone that posted, I'm really excited magus found a new infinite.

 

[EPsilon933]

The players in favor and against the ban are now 25 to 67

I really don't think this thread can contribute anymore to opinion, thanks to everyone that posted, I'm really excited magus found a new infinite.

Yeah, I really don't think anything will change or anything important will happen.

I'm really excited as well. Learning new stuff is always good.

 

[KirbyKaze]

EPsilon, it is my intention to throw this baby at you.

 

[EPsilon933]

EPsilon, it is my intention to throw this baby at you.

Should I catch it?

 

[KirbyKaze]

No.

No you shouldn't.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

KK, I never got to see you eat a baby. I am disappointed.

 

[PottyJokes]

reneblade is the mikehagger of america.

aka they're both dumb as sh*t

 

[EPsilon933]

reneblade is the mikehagger of america.

aka they're both dumb as sh*t

Easily agreeable. What do you think of PC Jona?

 

[KAOSTAR]

I don't think reneblade is trying to troll tho.

even tho I disagree with his arguments he isn't nearly as abrasive or as much an ***.

mike says things to rub ppl the wrong way intentionally.(even tho RB made that thread about warbling calling me and nintendude out for heavily disagreeing with nonsensical arguments lol. I typically find roneblaster to be much more amicable.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Easily agreeable. What do you think of PC Jona?

I think they're scumbuddies, Jona seems to be trying to defend him while at the same time not referencing him as a distancing tactic.


Out of the two, Rene seems the most scummy, so him first, if he flips scum we should probably lynch Jona.


Vote: Rene





Seriously though, tbh there are a lot of strong feelings on this issue and I think a lot of people are just arguing from feelings, much more then they normally would at least. I can't hold anyone's disagreement with me on this issue too much against them imo.

 

[Smasher89]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTHfcafE9ig

Example for something waaaaaaaaaaaaay worse then ICs grabinfinites that is closer to make the game unplayable (instead of the opposite which ICs infinites is, which in some way gives good argument to main a non top tier character)

 

[Tee ay eye]

m2k's been talking about that for a while, now

 

[BBQTV]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTHfcafE9ig

Example for something waaaaaaaaaaaaay worse then ICs grabinfinites that is closer to make the game unplayable (instead of the opposite which ICs infinites is, which in some way gives good argument to main a non top tier character)

this is why we have an edge grab limit