Who's Canonically the Strongest Character in Smash?

[Murlough]

No, but it uses a lot of canon resources and does more research than I care to do. I didn't realize DK was as strong as he was till Death Battle explained it. Similar to Kirby.

Now if you're saying Death Battle's interpretation of Kirby's strength isn't canon because it used the Kirby anime.... I don't know if that means it's not canon. I have a 3D episode of the Kirby anime on my 3DS and nintendo gave it to me....

I love deathbattle. HOWEVER sometimes their research does not 100% lead to the conclusion of one character beating another. I'm pretty sure the anime doesn't count as canon either but It doesn't matter to me either way.

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

Bowser and Mario are within a similar size range. Kirby interacts with those who are similar to him in size. It's important to keep in mind that Kirby is 8 inches compared to the rest of the roster. That's really what works against him.



The only time Kirby ever moves hypersonic is with his jet ability. Although some tried to use the warp star as a way for Kirby to win, it doesn't appear to be his preferred method of combat, so it's ignored, just like Samus' gunship is ignored and Pit's great sacred treasure is ignored. Still, the jet ability takes a brief charge before flying at top speed.



Kirby cannot survive a planet explosion. He's never demonstrated that. Pop Star needs to be proved to be the same size as Earth. Assuming Shiver Star is a post-apocalyptic Earth is not enough.

What's so special about Necrodeus?

Spoiler: Triple Deluxe Spoilers

He,, and a bunch of other characters did in Triple Deluxe's Ending. Necrodeus is special because he almost defeated . That probably doesn't mean a lot, but still. Kirby didn't have to use any of his abilities to defeat him.

Well, can fly to other planets within seconds, and can keep up with him.
EDIT: Also about Pop Star's size, characters like ,,,,etc were all on Pop Star without becoming giants. Which makes me wonder about the Kirby characters' heights.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

I love deathbattle. HOWEVER sometimes their research does not 100% lead to the conclusion of one character beating another. I'm pretty sure the anime doesn't count as canon either but It doesn't matter to me either way.

Didn't Sakurai have a lot of involvement with the anime? If that were the case I don't see why it couldn't be canon

 

[Murlough]

Didn't Sakurai have a lot of involvement with the anime? If that were the case I don't see why it couldn't be canon

Don't ask me lmao. I'm just here. Ask the people in charge of this thread if it is canon.

 

[monzer]

Don't ask me lmao. I'm just here. Ask the people in charge of this thread if it is canon.

It doesn't matter that much, since most of the anime feats are questionable because the size/gravity of pop star is unknown.

 

[C3CC]

Wait

Can someone explain to me why some people say that Shulk is irrefutably the strongest character of all? Why? What does he have? I never played Xenoblade Chronicles...

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

Wait

Can someone explain to me why some people say that Shulk is irrefutably the strongest character of all? Why? What does he have? I never played Xenoblade Chronicles...

I'm pretty sure it's spoiler related though, unless you don't care?

 

[C3CC]

I'm pretty sure it's spoiler related though, unless you don't care?

Yeah, you can tell me. I don't think I'll be playing Xenoblade Chronicles in the near future... And if I ever get to play it, I will most likely forget hahaha so please, do explain.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

Yeah, you can tell me. I don't think I'll be playing Xenoblade Chronicles in the near future... And if I ever get to play it, I will most likely forget hahaha so please, do explain.

Spoiler

I'm not entirely sure considering I haven't beaten the game yet but I believe he kills a god and restarts the universe or something along those lines

 

[C3CC]

Spoiler

I'm not entirely sure considering I haven't beaten the game yet but I believe he kills a god and restarts the universe or something along those lines

Oh, ok. Thanks.

Spoiler

But Rosalina restarted the universe at the end of Super Mario Galaxy, too!

 

[Crystanium]

Spoiler: Triple Deluxe Spoilers

He,, and a bunch of other characters did in Triple Deluxe's Ending. Necrodeus is special because he almost defeated . That probably doesn't mean a lot, but still. Kirby didn't have to use any of his abilities to defeat him.

Well, can fly to other planets within seconds, and can keep up with him.
EDIT: Also about Pop Star's size, characters like ,,,,etc were all on Pop Star without becoming giants. Which makes me wonder about the Kirby characters' heights.

Meta Knight's ability to fly from planet to planet is a tad iffy. He seems to ever utilize this ability outside of one or two scenes, I believe. As for the rest of the characters you listed, those were cameos, not canon.

By the way, Samus' plasma beam from the 2D games produces far ultraviolet light. People are going to get severely burned. And this isn't going to be your typical sunburn.

"The last time I spoke about the plasma beam from the 2D Metroid video games, I mentioned the description given by the official Metroid Fusion Web site, which says, The Plasma Beam’s three lasers can easily cut through enemies, continuing on to take out even more foes.' [1] These lasers are the important aspect to the plasma beam’s penetrative ability because plasma doesn’t actually cut through anything, except in the case of plasma cutting. However, that type of plasma is appropriate for the plasma beams portrayed in Metroid Prime and especially Metroid Prime 3: Corruption, which can be used for plasma welding.

"I mentioned before that the plasma beam utilizes what’s known as a laser-induced plasma channel, and with the electrical discharge from the muzzle and along the beam itself, this would make it an electrolaser. I’ve been curious for a while on just how powerful the plasma beam is. Not only can it penetrate through multiple targets at once, this would require a lot of energy to penetrate and continue along its path afterwards. One way I thought about figuring out the amount of energy is by noting that the plasma beam is not referred to as “laser beam”. The emphasis has been on the fact that it’s producing plasma.

"In order to produce plasma from a laser, it would need to be capable of ionizing that air. There’s ionizing radiation and non-ionizing radiation. The former will be what I’m focused on. While I don’t know what type of laser is being used, I do have an idea of what it might be. It’s important to note that lasers aren’t restricted to visible light. There are two reasons for this. First, light technically refers to all electromagnetic spectra, not just visible light. Second, radio waves, x-rays and gamma rays are photons, not just visible light. Lasers may utilize infrared or ultraviolet, both of which are invisible to the naked eye.

Because a laser must ionize air in order to create plasma, we should find out the required ionization energy to remove an electron from nitrogen, which is what air is mostly comprised of. The ionizing energy of nitrogen is 1,402 kJ/mol. [2] Avogadro’s constant is 6.022140857 × 10^23 mol. [3] Dividing the ionizing energy over Avogadro’s constant gives us 2.328076 × 10^-18 kg m^2/s^2. Now we can find the wavelength of the laser. We’ll need Planck’s constant and the speed of light and divide it the amount of energy of ionizing energy of nitrogen. [4] [(6.62607004 × 10^-34 m^2 kg/s)(299,792,458 m/s)] / (2.328076 × 10^-18 kg m^2/s^2) is 8.53256 × 10^-8, or 85.33 nanometers. This places the laser under far ultraviolet."

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

I just realize how no one talked about 's Super Abilities in this thread.
In a Super Smash Bros. Nintendo Direct, Masahiro Sakurai, creator of the Kirby series, stated that the Ultra Sword is "capable of slicing through anything."
This is what the Flavor Text, the pause screen, said about it:
Packing pure destructive power, it's a Super Ability! Its name: Ultra Sword! It can rend the Earth as it destroys all in its path! Not to mention, can stop time with it. Also, he can even one-shot bosses with this power (he can do this with Snow Bowl as well).
Sources: 1. http://kirby.wikia.com/wiki/Ultra_Sword, 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch ,3..v=s2TH_oH2PsM,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoTYo50nqcM
And let's not get started with the Hypernova ability.

 

[monzer]

And let's not get started with the Hypernova ability

Hypernova has a lot of starting lag. It wouldn't help that much against most of the other top tiers.

 

[Doctor_Link]

I just realize how no one talked about 's Super Abilities in this thread.
In a Super Smash Bros. Nintendo Direct, Masahiro Sakurai, creator of the Kirby series, stated that the Ultra Sword is "capable of slicing through anything."
This is what the Flavor Text, the pause screen, said about it:
Packing pure destructive power, it's a Super Ability! Its name: Ultra Sword! It can rend the Earth as it destroys all in its path! Not to mention, can stop time with it. Also, he can even one-shot bosses with this power (he can do this with Snow Bowl as well).
Sources: 1. http://kirby.wikia.com/wiki/Ultra_Sword, 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch ,3..v=s2TH_oH2PsM,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoTYo50nqcM
And let's not get started with the Hypernova ability.

Only problem is, Super abilities are on a timer and have only ever been shown to be activated when he eats the super enemy of that type (or a hypernova fruit) or kills them. They cannot be stored , either, further reducing their utility.

 

[Munomario777]

Spoiler: Triple Deluxe Spoilers

He,, and a bunch of other characters did in Triple Deluxe's Ending. Necrodeus is special because he almost defeated . That probably doesn't mean a lot, but still. Kirby didn't have to use any of his abilities to defeat him.

The planet itself and everything on it went unscathed from the explosion. The explosion apparently didn't actually deal any damage to anything, for whatever reason. Ergo, Kirby surviving the blast doesn't mean anything (even the grass survived it).

Well, can fly to other planets within seconds, and can keep up with him.

Do you have a specific example of this (with a video accompanying it?)

EDIT: Also about Pop Star's size, characters like ,,,,etc were all on Pop Star without becoming giants. Which makes me wonder about the Kirby characters' heights.

Those were only cameos, as Dryn pointed out (they're less "important," for lack of a better word, than lore - such as the lore that states that Kirby is only eight inches tall).

As for the Super Abilities, that just seems like hyperbole (especially when we take into account that not everything is in fact destroyed by the sword, e.g. the ground).

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

Do you have a specific example of this (with a video accompanying it?)

Meta Knight's Speed Feats
http://gfycat.com/RigidGranularAntarcticfurseal, http://gfycat.com/ImprobableEcstaticIndigowingedparrot, http://gfycat.com/PlaintiveParchedKangaroo, http://gfycat.com/ResponsibleFirmAnole, http://gfycat.com/RemorsefulFancyAsiandamselfly, and http://gfycat.com/GranularAnguishedLadybird
Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/3kvexa/respect_meta_knight_kirby_games/

 

[Munomario777]

Meta Knight's Speed Feats
http://gfycat.com/RigidGranularAntarcticfurseal, http://gfycat.com/ImprobableEcstaticIndigowingedparrot, http://gfycat.com/PlaintiveParchedKangaroo, http://gfycat.com/ResponsibleFirmAnole, http://gfycat.com/RemorsefulFancyAsiandamselfly, and http://gfycat.com/GranularAnguishedLadybird
Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/3kvexa/respect_meta_knight_kirby_games/

I see. That's quite impressive -- do you have a clip of Kirby keeping up with Meta Knight at this high of a speed?

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

I see. That's quite impressive -- do you have a clip of Kirby keeping up with Meta Knight at this high of a speed?

I don't have a clip. But, I did find this: http://mythkirby2.deviantart.com/art/Kirby-Floats-Into-Fatal-Fiction-527730290
I also found this: http://www.deviantart.com/art/Meta-Knight-VS-Ridley-Prelude-524750743 and http://www.deviantart.com/art/Fatal-Fiction-Meta-Knight-VS-Ridley-524997599
I'm not sure if you will use these, but it's something.
Finally, I found this:

Spoiler: Passage from Fatal Fiction: Meta Knight vs. Ridley

Ridley stumbled back, as the thought raced through his mind that this opponent was far more powerful than any opponent he had fought before.

Edit: Can anyone tell me how is so high on the list despite having little to no feats.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I see. That's quite impressive -- do you have a clip of Kirby keeping up with Meta Knight at this high of a speed?

It it helps.

The cutscenes are just Meta Knight versions.

Kirby does the same things with the warp star.

 

[Munomario777]

I don't have a clip. But, I did find this: http://mythkirby2.deviantart.com/art/Kirby-Floats-Into-Fatal-Fiction-527730290
I also found this: http://www.deviantart.com/art/Meta-Knight-VS-Ridley-Prelude-524750743 and http://www.deviantart.com/art/Fatal-Fiction-Meta-Knight-VS-Ridley-524997599
I'm not sure if you will use these, but it's something.
Finally, I found this:

Spoiler: Passage from Fatal Fiction: Meta Knight vs. Ridley

Ridley stumbled back, as the thought raced through his mind that this opponent was far more powerful than any opponent he had fought before.

Knowing that Death Battle itself bends/breaks canon every other minute, I'm not quite willing to treat a Death Battle fanon as canon unless there are sources to back up these claims.

Edit: Can anyone tell me how is so high on the list despite having little to no feats.

In all seriousness, I have no idea other than "she's a goddess." (Which doesn't mean much, it's just a title/position of power.) And she has some neat, but limited, Powers.

It it helps.

The cutscenes are just Meta Knight versions.

Kirby does the same things with the warp star.

Care to provide evidence to back up your claim?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Care to provide evidence to back up your claim?

Here's the opening.

The rest are just cutscenes in Super Star.



What? You think I was trying to lie?

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

Knowing that Death Battle itself bends/breaks canon every other minute, I'm not quite willing to treat a Death Battle fanon as canon unless there are sources to back up these claims.

In all seriousness, I have no idea other than "she's a goddess." (Which doesn't mean much, it's just a title/position of power.) And she has some neat, but limited, Powers.


Care to provide evidence to back up your claim?

Most of Meta Knight's feats in the Death Battle fanon were on: https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/3kvexa/respect_meta_knight_kirby_games/
Might require some close reading.

 

[Munomario777]

Here's the opening.

The rest are just cutscenes in Super Star.

Cool, thanks.

What? You think I was trying to lie?

No, it's just that I prefer to see actual evidence before I put stock in claims.

Most of Meta Knight's feats in the Death Battle fanon were on: https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/3kvexa/respect_meta_knight_kirby_games/
Might require some close reading.

I have no idea where they're getting "light speed" from, lol. The rest is decent, but nothing that really stands out to me, to be honest.

This should come in handy though... : p

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

Cool, thanks.

No, it's just that I prefer to see actual evidence before I put stock in claims.

I have no idea where they're getting "light speed" from, lol. The rest is decent, but nothing that really stands out to me, to be honest.

This should come in handy though... : p

Last time,I checked couldn't fly to other planets within seconds. Even as Super Sonic.

The planet itself and everything on it went unscathed from the explosion. The explosion apparently didn't actually deal any damage to anything, for whatever reason. Ergo, Kirby surviving the blast doesn't mean anything (even the grass survived it).


As for the Super Abilities, that just seems like hyperbole (especially when we take into account that not everything is in fact destroyed by the sword, e.g. the ground).

Well, did casually cut a volcano in half.
http://gfycat.com/ReflectingInsistentAlbino

But,the explosion was visible from outer space.
http://gfycat.com/BogusFaintAsiantrumpetfish

 

[Munomario777]

Last time,I checked couldn't fly to other planets within seconds. Even as Super Sonic.

He can move at light speed. It really just depends on the distance between the planets.

(Technically, by the by, he could go any distance within seconds by stopping time.)

Well, did casually cut a volcano in half.
http://gfycat.com/ReflectingInsistentAlbino

That's all well and good, but we shouldn't use obvious hyperbole ("it can destroy anything") as an excuse to extrapolate.

But,the explosion was visible from outer space.
http://gfycat.com/BogusFaintAsiantrumpetfish

But as you can see from the link I provided earlier (in the post you just quoted), it didn't actually damage anything.

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

He can move at light speed. It really just depends on the distance between the planets.

(Technically, by the by, he could go any distance within seconds by stopping time.)

That's all well and good, but we shouldn't use obvious hyperbole ("it can destroy anything") as an excuse to extrapolate.

But as you can see from the link I provided earlier (in the post you just quoted), it didn't actually damage anything.

1.I never said couldn't move at light speed. Do you have a source of Sonic flying to a another planet?
2.Yeah, that makes sense.
3.If it wasn't a explosion, then what was it?
In this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaP4XONzP88
At around 8:33, the screen shakes, showing it made some kind of impact.
Maybe Pop Star is just much denser than Earth.

I'm sorry if I'm bothering you about this.

 

[Munomario777]

1.I never said couldn't move at light speed. Do you have a source of Sonic flying to a another planet?

Don't see why he couldn't. It just depends on the distance between them. (In his super form, he can fly in outer space; see Unleashed's opening for an example.)

3.If it wasn't a explosion, then what was it?
In this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaP4XONzP88
At around 8:33, the screen shakes, showing it made some kind of impact.

I never said that it wasn't an explosion, just that it didn't cause any actual damage to anything. (Then again, that would mean that it doesn't match the part of the definition of "explosion" where it says that explosions are destructive.)

Maybe Pop Star is just much denser than Earth.

This doesn't explain the fact that nothing on the surface took any damage at all, e.g. Kirby's house, the grass, flowers, trees, et cetera. (See 14:00 in that video you linked.)

 

[NintenZ]

Kirby...

Nuff' said.

 

[Dastardly Ridleylash]

Kirby is not the strongest character in Smash; Sonic has to be, bar none.

Let's take a look at Sonic's abilities.

Firstly, he can run at the speed of sound. For those not wanting to look that up, that means he'd travel a kilometer in 2.914 seconds. Basically, his top speed creates a sonic boom, which also creates a mach cone. Either way, anything colliding with him at that speed is basically as good as dead. For that alone, he's pretty nuts in terms of strength.

But that's not even his full power! Super Sonic is invulnurable, goes even faster than normal Sonic and is stronger to boot (he goes through asteroids without breaking stride!). Even with the versatility of Kirby's arsenal, Sonic still beats him out by virtue of being able to become invulnurable and being able to move at sonic speed. Sure, he needs Chaos Emeralds to do it, but he can summon them with a Final Smash anyways. Sure, he still dies to being crushed, but nothing in Kirby's arsenal could ever hope of being fast enough to crush Sonic. Not even the Warp Star!

That's not even getting into the stuff he doesn't use in Smash, like Hyper Sonic, the Elemental Shields and all the other nuts powers he gets.

There's a reason he's called the Blue Blur, and it's because he's essentially a walking jet plane.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Substitute Doll is the strongest video game character in history. There is no contest.

But seriously though, probably either Bayonetta or Rosalina.

 

[monzer]

This is just a random thought, but we should put the rpg characters in their own separate tier list as the mechanics from their games are so different.

Sure, he still dies to being crushed, but nothing in Kirby's arsenal could ever hope of being fast enough to crush Sonic. Not even the Warp Star!

The warp star has been able to travel Kirby around solar systems and even galaxies in seconds, though the counter arguement is that Kirby's universe is scaled down. The warp star travels much slower near the ground though.

But seriously though, probably either Bayonetta or Rosalina.

I agree with Bayonetta, but Rosalina is only as durable as Mario and would be one-shotted by most of the top tiers before she would have time to command the lumas to do anything.

We should try to focus on feats for the new characters now instead of trying to validate or disprove Kirby's feats. I feel that Kirby has caused so much controversy that's been slowing us down it would be best to just put him and the other characters from his universe in an N/A tier. Rosalina and Shulk are close to reaching that level too.

New tier list opinion

Spoiler

N/A-tier(arguement about feats taking up too much of the disscussion)


S-tier

A-tier

B-tier

C-tier

D-tier

F-tier

G-tier

H-tier

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Haven't been around since September.

Is there finally an answer?

 

[Munomario777]

Haven't been around since September.

Is there finally an answer?

No universal consensus ofc (there are bound to be disagreements), but evidence points to . Light-speed travel (ergo tons of force when he rams into something), near-invulnerability (Super Sonic), etc etc.

 

[randomtechguy142857]

@Cyn Who do you think the strongest character is in smash? Taking note that strength I think should be looked outside larger than the physical aspect. If you have the strength to achieve what you want to do and can find the means that is probably the best strength for you would overcome any obstacle.

For example, I would say that Samus is probably the strongest character. I think there is the ability to do what is needed and find the resources to get the job done.

In Xenoblade, the point of the ending is that Shulk and co. were strong enough to defeat a god in that they had the will to control their own destiny — that will allowed Shulk to find his True Monado and destroy Zanza. I haven't played enough Metroid to know how that stacks up, but the idea of Xenoblade is that Shulk had the strength to achieve what he wanted to do and find the means (which in this case was represented by the True Monado) to overcome the ultimate obstacle. In other words, exactly the definition of 'strong' you've given above.

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

I know a lot of people are going to disagree with me,but the Kid Icarus characters are not as powerful as people are giving them credit. They should be knocked down a tier or two, my personal opinion.
Anyway I think the top tier characters are (in no specific order): and maybe /.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I know a lot of people are going to disagree with me,but the Kid Icarus characters are not as powerful as people are giving them credit. They should be knocked down a tier or two, my personal opinion.

And why is that?

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

Even with the versatility of Kirby's arsenal, Sonic still beats him out by virtue of being able to become invulnurable and being able to move at sonic speed. Sure, he needs Chaos Emeralds to do it, but he can summon them with a Final Smash anyways. Sure, he still dies to being crushed, but nothing in Kirby's arsenal could ever hope of being fast enough to crush Sonic. Not even the Warp Star!

Monzer already talked about Kirby and his Warp Star, but you forgot about , a character who can fly to space and other planets in seconds.
Also, Meta Knight flew around his Solar System in seconds.

And why is that?

First of all, and cannot fly without the help of and/or Viridi , which means they not as powerful as usual and characters can not use outside help in these matches. Pit also gets tired after running for awhile, and needs to catch his breath.
Things people say to over hype Pit:
Pit destroyed the Lunar Sanctum, which is the size of the moon.
Pit didn't destroyed it by using brute force, he did this by defeating Arlon.
and have defeated Gods and tanked their attacks.
Yes, because these two characters are the only ones on the roster who have fought Gods... plus, they had help from Palutena and/or Viridi.
The gods in the Kid Icarus universe, while powerful in their own right,are a joke compare to characters in other universes. Heck, Hades, one of the most powerful characters in his universe,is only mountain level at best.
Guys like Magolor,Solaris,and Giygas could solo this universe with ease. Keep in mind, these characters had the power to destroyed not only planets, but their own universe (probably more).

 

[Munomario777]

Monzer already talked about Kirby and his Warp Star, but you forgot about , a character who can fly to space and other planets in seconds.
Also, Meta Knight flew around his Solar System in seconds.

On the other hand, Sonic can also freeze time and also teleport, two ways for him to move at practically infinite speed (any distance in literally no time at all).

 

[FEEHEELINGGS...Wo Wo Wo]

On the other hand, Sonic can also freeze time and also teleport, two ways for him to move at practically infinite speed (any distance in literally no time at all).

Yes, but Meta Knight can freeze time as well in Meta Knightmare Ultra, a sub-game in Kirby Super Star Ultra,when he uses the Mach Tornado.

 

[Munomario777]

Yes, but Meta Knight can freeze time as well in Meta Knightmare Ultra, a sub-game in Kirby Super Star Ultra,when he uses the Mach Tornado.

Are you sure it's not just a visual effect? It's quite common for time-freezing to be used to emphasize an animation - Kirby itself even does it in other places, e.g. Return to Dreamland's Ultra Sword. (Also, video evidence?)