K.C. Cloud
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2006
- Messages
- 750
Yo shiz, just a general question, but how often do you use the C-stick when you play?
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Who needs help with Combos, Damages, Advanced Tactics for Falco, etc.
- Thread starter DaShizWiz
- Start date
mathos
Smash Champion
C-stick rolling ftw!
Volrec
Smash Lord
When i watch falco videos, and someone starts a pillar, when the person DIs to the right for example(fox) and in PC chris/bombsoldier videos, do they do 2 wavedashes to the right into a DAir-> Shine, or 1 wavedash to the right into a running jump->Dair->shine? I cant make it out.
Oh, and i dont get pillaring practice, no one to DI from my shines >.>
Oh, and i dont get pillaring practice, no one to DI from my shines >.>
Ryan-K
Smash Master
depends on how far they go
you should never really count or keep numbers in your head just do enough so that it will work.
you should never really count or keep numbers in your head just do enough so that it will work.
I'm not sure about PC Chris, but in all of the bombsoldier vids I've seen where he shine comboes fox, he is only wavedashing to l-cancel the shine, afterwhich he just runs to catch up with the DI. Doing two wavedashes after a shine, in my opinion, is excessive.
TheKneeOfJustice
Smash Lord
@ Shiz. Does it make a huge difference from being fully independent of the c-stick as opposed to using it for a majority of your attacks?
DaShizWiz
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2005
- Messages
- 2,283
Well, TheKneeOfJustice I use the C-stick a just for aerials and smash attacks because it feels comfortable to me. But what ever feels comfortable to you guys, do it. Because everyone plays different, lol.
For example: To wavedash out of my shield I use the control stick. To wavedash around I use X and R. And to jump I use the Y button.
It all depends what feels comfortable to you.
I think it does make a difference being fully dependent on the C-stick, in my mind theres just some things you can't do without the C-stick. For me I use C-stick > A button.
For example: To wavedash out of my shield I use the control stick. To wavedash around I use X and R. And to jump I use the Y button.
It all depends what feels comfortable to you.
I think it does make a difference being fully dependent on the C-stick, in my mind theres just some things you can't do without the C-stick. For me I use C-stick > A button.
Abulize
Smash Journeyman
Haha, that's weird to me but you seem to do well in your matchesDaShizWiz said:
. I only use the Y button for WD, jumping and waveshinig. The only time I use the control stick is for lhdl and shine > b-air. I call it The ShizWiz when I play my friends 
. But when doing regular shine combos I use Y so maybe I'm the weird one .EDIT - I'm trying to get into the habit of JC grabbing with X but it feels a lil' weird. I use to use the control stick to do it but it's not as reliable compared to using Y or X. . . to me at-least.
Abulize
Smash Journeyman
Yeah, I'm debating on which one to use. I'd use Y as long as I never hit A by accident. How comfortable I am with the controller doesn't matter so much to me because I'd grow into it except for jc shining with my pointer and middle fingerLol, I use Y for everything besides wavedashing basically. I also use Y for jc grabs, try that way, it works best for me maybe you too.
. How do you do your jc shining because I read you've done 16 in a row. I heard this one method of sliding your thumb from B to X but is that speed dependent or is there a rhythm involved?Holy Ji
Smash Apprentice
Is it a little uncomfortable for any of you to switch your hand position, or stretch your fingers to reach buttons that are further away?
I can't waveshine for my life. I need advice plz.
I can't waveshine for my life. I need advice plz.
mathos
Smash Champion
You shouldn't need to switch your hand position or stretch to reach any buttons. Unless you have abnormally small hands. Its about moving fast and knowing timings.
DaShizWiz
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2005
- Messages
- 2,283
Yeah what Mathos said, I'll help you out with Waveshining as soon as I can, I'm going to be gone for the weekend, so anyone who can answer anyone elses questions please do. To do JC shining, I slide my Fingers from Y to B. Don't do it from B to Y, trust me lol. But you have to have good timing, you'll get the hang of it after a while .
.Abulize
Smash Journeyman
Alright, I'll try it Y to B. I'll also try to answer questions for people if they ask. I know quite a bit but not inside and out.
mr_joey132
Smash Ace
I haven't read anything here, only the first post... so sorry if this question was asked already.
Shizwiz, what buttons (control stick, Y, X) do you use to jump out of your shine as fast as possible at:
-jump cancelled shine (on the stage)
-jump cancelled shine (in the air)
-waveshining
-pillaring on a shield
I seemed to be faster with the control stick than with X.... (I always use X)
And for waveshielding, isn't this a good way?: shield, hold R all the time, control stick like this: " / " and then press X and then A..
And how do you short hop Bair out of a shield? I always air dodge -_-
Shizwiz, what buttons (control stick, Y, X) do you use to jump out of your shine as fast as possible at:
-jump cancelled shine (on the stage)
-jump cancelled shine (in the air)
-waveshining
-pillaring on a shield
I seemed to be faster with the control stick than with X.... (I always use X)
And for waveshielding, isn't this a good way?: shield, hold R all the time, control stick like this: " / " and then press X and then A..
And how do you short hop Bair out of a shield? I always air dodge -_-
Miharu
Smash Hero
Hmm, I don't know what Shiz uses, but this is what I think most people use.
For JCing on the ground, Y/X is used over the control stick.
For JCing shines in the air, say for shine -> bair, I use, and I think Shiz uses control stick to cancel the shine, and cstick to perform the aerial.
X/Y are probably used for waveshining and pillaring.
For JCing on the ground, Y/X is used over the control stick.
For JCing shines in the air, say for shine -> bair, I use, and I think Shiz uses control stick to cancel the shine, and cstick to perform the aerial.
X/Y are probably used for waveshining and pillaring.
Holy Ji
Smash Apprentice
I use the control stick to jump out of the shine, but anyone got any suggestions for how to waveshine?
mr_joey132
Smash Ace
k, thx... but, last week I played a good Falco on my first tournament, he's shine combo's look faster then mine -_- (I practise against CPU's) (against falco i use waveshine --> Dair) and I got shieldgrab'd all the time :| Does anyone know what I have to do against that?
shine after the Dair comes out too late if I do it..
shine after the Dair comes out too late if I do it..
Nurok
Smash Lord
practice.
usually, you're not l canceling. Its the same problem i used to have.
practice L canceling against a shield, and soon enough, youll be able to l cancel against it.
Also, you can go through the shield to the other side, and Utilt. This usually works, because the person taskes off their shiled when you're on the other side.
usually, you're not l canceling. Its the same problem i used to have.
practice L canceling against a shield, and soon enough, youll be able to l cancel against it.
Also, you can go through the shield to the other side, and Utilt. This usually works, because the person taskes off their shiled when you're on the other side.
Abulize
Smash Journeyman
You need to work on l-canceling. Your shine should come out right after you land the d-air. There's only one frame where someone can grab you when doing a shine combo and if he did it all the time you're most likely not l-canceling properly.
Kashakunaki
Smash Master
Howdy, DaShizWiz. Long time no talk. You probably don't even remember me, XD. Well, I decided I'd pick up Falco, and I want to get the basics right so I don't mess up anything in the future and have to redo or learn anything.
I'm having a slight bit of difficulty with the Short Hop Laser. Often when I try to do it too quickly I just **** the gun, but never shoot the laser (Also, I use X to short hop). So, how do you recommend I fix this problem? I've thought of three alternatives. What I usually do is wait a second to fastfall, so this slows down my SHL but I usually get it out and can aim it relativelyw ell. Just practice like all hell to go from X to B quicker. Or should I switch to Y for the SHL because it is closer to B? Or is there something else?
Next is shine combos, like down air > shine > down air > shine > etc. I think there is some sort of trick I'm missing here or I'm still just too noob to do it. Are there certain characters you can't shine combo? Is their a timing thing? For example, do I have to wait until the pinnacle of my jump before I Dair so I can fastfall to the ground and shine them? How can I properly predict DI and use DI to my own effectiveness? Sorry for all the questions, but shine combos have been really frustrating me.
Thank you in advance, DaShizWiz. I still find it odd that you're my Falco idol, KeepSpeedN is my Fox idol, and SmashMac is my Dr. Mario idol and I didn't learn you were all brothers until after the fact XD.
EDIT: Also, this is a more general question, not necessarily Falco related. But when should I use the control stick for aerials and the C-Stick? That always confused me. Control stick seems so much quicker and easier, but I know C-Stick definitely has it's perks. As of now I only use C-Stick aerials for short hopped Uairs, that way I don't jump again, but even then I sometimes have a hard time. For example, when I try to string together a Uair combo with Dr. Mario, I'll often do a Fair or Bair because I don't hit the C-Stick right.
I'm having a slight bit of difficulty with the Short Hop Laser. Often when I try to do it too quickly I just **** the gun, but never shoot the laser (Also, I use X to short hop). So, how do you recommend I fix this problem? I've thought of three alternatives. What I usually do is wait a second to fastfall, so this slows down my SHL but I usually get it out and can aim it relativelyw ell. Just practice like all hell to go from X to B quicker. Or should I switch to Y for the SHL because it is closer to B? Or is there something else?
Next is shine combos, like down air > shine > down air > shine > etc. I think there is some sort of trick I'm missing here or I'm still just too noob to do it. Are there certain characters you can't shine combo? Is their a timing thing? For example, do I have to wait until the pinnacle of my jump before I Dair so I can fastfall to the ground and shine them? How can I properly predict DI and use DI to my own effectiveness? Sorry for all the questions, but shine combos have been really frustrating me.
Thank you in advance, DaShizWiz. I still find it odd that you're my Falco idol, KeepSpeedN is my Fox idol, and SmashMac is my Dr. Mario idol and I didn't learn you were all brothers until after the fact XD.
EDIT: Also, this is a more general question, not necessarily Falco related. But when should I use the control stick for aerials and the C-Stick? That always confused me. Control stick seems so much quicker and easier, but I know C-Stick definitely has it's perks. As of now I only use C-Stick aerials for short hopped Uairs, that way I don't jump again, but even then I sometimes have a hard time. For example, when I try to string together a Uair combo with Dr. Mario, I'll often do a Fair or Bair because I don't hit the C-Stick right.
linkmastersword
Smash Lord
lol at that post above me
you are going to make dashizwiz write for about an hour to answer those questions, even though they are all very good questions.
I'll help him out and try to answer the one about shl, because I press x and not y.
you need to develop some sort of rhythm when you do it, so it can be consistent. you need to press b very quickly after the short hop, then you need do the smallest hesitation before you fast fall. we are talking like fractions of a second here.
anyways the end result should be that you end up short hoping, lasering, then fast falling so the laser stays low, if you are good you can get it lower than a standing laser every time to hit those crouching sheiks.
Just execute in that order, create a rhythm in your head when you do it so it stays consistent, and if you want to approach or fade away while shling, you will be able to as long as you have your rhythm down. good luck with that, if you want to practice it, go to practice mode, assign the cpu to jump mode, and keep him in place as long as you can, if you get good you can approach and keep him in place, it's harder to retreat and do this however because the spacing gets longer between shots.
once you get that down switch the cpu to a character like pichu, then try it out again.
hope you improve, I know I still need to work on mine as well.
you are going to make dashizwiz write for about an hour to answer those questions, even though they are all very good questions.
I'll help him out and try to answer the one about shl, because I press x and not y.
you need to develop some sort of rhythm when you do it, so it can be consistent. you need to press b very quickly after the short hop, then you need do the smallest hesitation before you fast fall. we are talking like fractions of a second here.
anyways the end result should be that you end up short hoping, lasering, then fast falling so the laser stays low, if you are good you can get it lower than a standing laser every time to hit those crouching sheiks.
Just execute in that order, create a rhythm in your head when you do it so it stays consistent, and if you want to approach or fade away while shling, you will be able to as long as you have your rhythm down. good luck with that, if you want to practice it, go to practice mode, assign the cpu to jump mode, and keep him in place as long as you can, if you get good you can approach and keep him in place, it's harder to retreat and do this however because the spacing gets longer between shots.
once you get that down switch the cpu to a character like pichu, then try it out again.
hope you improve, I know I still need to work on mine as well.
Abulize
Smash Journeyman
For the shine combo part. There are other ways to start the combo just to let you know. Some characters it's difficult to shine combo. With floatier characters you have to use u-tilt such as Marth. And don't expect to combo a Samus . As for the DI. There is no way to full predict someone's DI 100%. Different people will DI different ways as their mindgame. If your shine combos aren't that great on platforms and they notice they might go for a platform. That's just an example but there is no real way to fully predict someone. I'll let Shiz help you out on the timing or whatever because he can shine combo a lot better than me .
As for aerials get into the habit of using the C-stick. It helps out a lot if you want to do a retreating aerial and keep moving away from your opponent. It feels more comfortable to use the C-stick but it's all preferences.
. As for the DI. There is no way to full predict someone's DI 100%. Different people will DI different ways as their mindgame. If your shine combos aren't that great on platforms and they notice they might go for a platform. That's just an example but there is no real way to fully predict someone. I'll let Shiz help you out on the timing or whatever because he can shine combo a lot better than me .As for aerials get into the habit of using the C-stick. It helps out a lot if you want to do a retreating aerial and keep moving away from your opponent. It feels more comfortable to use the C-stick but it's all preferences.
Kashakunaki
Smash Master
Thank you very much for the tips guys. I'll have to practice my short hop laser. As for the shine combos, I'm still pretty confused on those. Honestly, I don't think I really know how to do them right. I'm going to go check out the shine guide after this post.
As for the C-Stick, you think I should practice using it for all aerials (other than Nair, of course)? Again, it just seems like it would be slower.
As for the C-Stick, you think I should practice using it for all aerials (other than Nair, of course)? Again, it just seems like it would be slower.
Nurok
Smash Lord
Once you practice using the c stick enough, you'll see yoruslef going faster and faster.
all you have to do is practice l canceling(like dair to shine, nair to shine, etc) while using the c stick- youll see yourself so much faster then usual.
all you have to do is practice l canceling(like dair to shine, nair to shine, etc) while using the c stick- youll see yourself so much faster then usual.
Kashakunaki
Smash Master
So, give me a comparison I can relate to. Is it like normal SHFFLs? You know, where when you first learn the technique, your game gets worse and slower, but as you get used to the technique it gets better. So your skill drops at first but ultimately raises, as is the case with most new techniques. Does everyone here use the C-Stick? I often find myself using the C-Stick for smashes too much. I don't remember the last time I charged a smash XD.
Also, I just finished reading the shine guide...... annnnd I don't think it really helped me =/
Also, I just finished reading the shine guide...... annnnd I don't think it really helped me =/
mathos
Smash Champion
I find it typical that when you try and implement a new strategy or tactic into your existing game it begins to adversely affect your gameplay, simply because you need to concentrate more on the tactic then actually fighting.
Once you get the new strategy down and imbedded in your memory (whether mental or physical) then you will start to see the improvements.
Once you get the new strategy down and imbedded in your memory (whether mental or physical) then you will start to see the improvements.
Kashakunaki
Smash Master
So, are SHL, pillaring, and shine combos techniques I can practice in training like wavedash and short hop? Or can I only really learn through combat with the techniques?
EDIT: Coolest. Thread. Ever. in your signature, Mathos.
EDIT: Coolest. Thread. Ever. in your signature, Mathos.
cHioNg_671
Smash Cadet
What is a pillar and how do you pillar?Sorry dont call me a noob bcuz i dont know whats pillaring. So plz help me people
mathos
Smash Champion
Pillaring is a shield pressure technique in which you short hop --> dair --> l-cancel --> shine --> jump cancel --> repeat. Ideally you're supposed to lower or break the opponents shield. If you need a better description there should be one in the guides at the top of the falco boards.
Kas: I know what an amazing thread. Jesus beats BS in tech skill easy
Kas: I know what an amazing thread. Jesus beats BS in tech skill easy
DaShizWiz
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2005
- Messages
- 2,283
Wow, I have a lot to read, which is a good thing . Don't worry guys, I'll reply very soon, right now I'm putting vids onto my computer, they're pretty good I'm pretty sure you guys will enjoy them, once I'm done with them I'll be glad to resume helping you guys . If anyone can answer other peoples questions please do .
.
. Don't worry guys, I'll reply very soon, right now I'm putting vids onto my computer, they're pretty good I'm pretty sure you guys will enjoy them, once I'm done with them I'll be glad to resume helping you guys . If anyone can answer other peoples questions please do ..Nurok
Smash Lord
Kashakunaki, The techniques you just mentioned are to be practiced not in training, but in melee(put a comp on lvl 1, or plug another controller in to be player 2 and let that character stand) while you just practice everything.
It took me at least 2 weeks to get it down, then another week to get all the SHFFLing down perfectly.
Falco is a rythmic character, and soon enough, you'll find yourself beating to your own falco rythm.(lol that sounds gay, but thats what I do)
Its all about practice, my friend
It took me at least 2 weeks to get it down, then another week to get all the SHFFLing down perfectly.
Falco is a rythmic character, and soon enough, you'll find yourself beating to your own falco rythm.(lol that sounds gay, but thats what I do)
Its all about practice, my friend
Binx
Smash Master
Dair Shine Shine Dair
Ok, I know you said thats how you break a shield, I dont know what you mean. Ok, so I shorthop, hit down on the c stick as soon as I leave the ground, then I fast fall it into their shield, or hopefully their face, but in this example I am going to say they shield, so then I L cancle, shine shorthop shine, double jump into another dair, that my friend always rolls out of, jumps and hits me, or whatever. Is that what you do? or do you dair, l cancle, shine jump wavedash down shine short hop dair?
Ok, I know you said thats how you break a shield, I dont know what you mean. Ok, so I shorthop, hit down on the c stick as soon as I leave the ground, then I fast fall it into their shield, or hopefully their face, but in this example I am going to say they shield, so then I L cancle, shine shorthop shine, double jump into another dair, that my friend always rolls out of, jumps and hits me, or whatever. Is that what you do? or do you dair, l cancle, shine jump wavedash down shine short hop dair?
Truedge930
Smash Apprentice
This might seem random, but does anyone do any exercises to help move fingers faster?
TheKneeOfJustice
Smash Lord
Play more? That's probably the best way to do it. It'll be a slow going though. I personally find Falco very demanding on your hands when he gets moving.
Bass.
Smash Journeyman
Shiz, I'm just curious. Do you play any other characters? Who if so?
DaShizWiz
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2005
- Messages
- 2,283
I do Dair to shine, Jc shine, to Dair and I repeat that. You have to jump and then shine real quickly so you don't jump out of your shine. Its Jump Canceling your shines so you can do as many as you want on the ground, I can do about 6 of those max when breaking their shield, its kinda hard.
Hey guys, I got up some vids, check em out I'll be adding more tommorow though so yea
Link: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=91166
Bass,
My next char is Fox, who some people think is even with my Falco. Then my third char comes Marth and Captain Falcon, they are both my third cause I'm pretty good with them. Next comes Ganon, and then Game and Watch. These are like my top 5 chars I use, they're pretty good though.
Edit: I'll get to others soon.
Hey guys, I got up some vids, check em out I'll be adding more tommorow though so yea
Link: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=91166
Bass,
My next char is Fox, who some people think is even with my Falco. Then my third char comes Marth and Captain Falcon, they are both my third cause I'm pretty good with them. Next comes Ganon, and then Game and Watch. These are like my top 5 chars I use, they're pretty good though.
Edit: I'll get to others soon
.