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Who else is nervous about Brawl potentially sucking?

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Dylan_Tnga

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Originally Posted by Kirby King View Post
Actually, we could use a few less annoying threads on the first page, so if you guys are going to keep posting about things other than how Brawl might suck, I probably will close the thread.
I by no means want to sound rude or imposing, but I implore you to let this thread live, a lot of posts made here would just end up as useless threads or posts elsewhere, this thread has connected a lot of people and our insane off topicness actually can be focused like a needle at anytime given fuel

ie : an update, someones opinion, we discused the footfungus jump in detail earlier :p

So ya Im keeping this thread flame free and the mods have done a fine job getting rid of the spammers. I say let the thread live,

who's with me?
 

Joe Soup

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I by no means want to sound rude or imposing, but I implore you to let this thread live, a lot of posts made here would just end up as useless threads or posts elsewhere, this thread has connected a lot of people and our insane off topicness actually can be focused like a needle at anytime given fuel

ie : an update, someones opinion, we discused the footfungus jump in detail earlier

So ya Im keeping this thread flame free and the mods have done a fine job getting rid of the spammers. I say let the thread live,

who's with me?
Hear, hear!

Let's get back on topic before we get shut down.

No one's responded to my devil's advocate.......
 

Dylan_Tnga

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Update is in an hour, Im going to bed (gotta get up)

To the late nighters / whoever gets to see the update

Keep it on topic boys, haha, whether the update be something lame, or something t0tally sweet.

My guess : item

edit :

OMG read your post after mine. Same guess I swears... great post btw, I lol'd
 

Ogre_Deity_Link

Smash Lord
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Please let us keep this thread! It's our bastion from total idiots (and scrubs, depending on how you look at things...)

Oh and Brawll WILL NOT SUCK.

Thank you.
 

Dylan_Tnga

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Wow, that's incredible. That last part with Epona. What's funny, is that I've experienced that glitch, though it would just happen randomly because my N64 wasn't very well held together. One time, I was riding Epona when it happened, and Link disappeared, and then I was Epona, lol. It felt like that, cuz I was controlling her and there was nothing on her back. Eventually, (man I was having fun).
Do it man, and you can exploit this glitch in an awesome way...

when you lose your mastersword, you can use items on eponas back. Some of it will really glitch up the game. Also gorons attack you for some reason depending on what version you have, in my version (newer than 1st release) it doesnt happen.

Anyhow use the hookshot when you get it off eponas back, and... you'll be doing some awesome stuff, just trust me. ;)
 

Dylan_Tnga

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I think it will suck. It's gonna be slower than melee and that'll totally **** me up for about a month. Fortunately I will have the rest of my life to play, but that's a long time.
It will also suck because in a few years, I'll want a fourth.
Melee > Brawl ??

(Im convinced I will be stoic on that. Melee is awesome)
 

Neo-X

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Brawl would suck..if it got canceled. That would make Brawl the worst of them all. Uh..on topic, if Brawl happened to have loose controls, that would be pretty bad, and..if it had fourth party characters..that would REALLY suck..but be really freakin' cool at the same time :grin:
 

TheZizz

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Are the people here no longer afraid of Brawl sucking? I'd sooner expect the Second Coming.
 

Neo-X

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I don't think I can make it either! Too much fun! Totally destroying lv.9's as Marth is just too much fun! :psycho:
 

Shiko755

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What if?....................they unbalanced Ike and kept his speed the same as in FE and made him really powerful. (2 handed sword)

Now that I think about it everybody would be exploiting Ike's strengths. Thus, changing the name to Super Ike Brawl.......that would be the most messed up **** ever......

EDIT: omg 4chan is back
 

Dylan_Tnga

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Oh man if ike has a tipper why not main him. brawls gonna be in the air more right? Im sure the footstool jump is just the beginning of interactive techs and new aerial maneuvers.

So that big sword in the air will do damage but leave him open for attack, we have to know where the sweetspot of the sword is aproximatly.
 

HideousBeing

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It's hard for me to imagine Brawl outdoing Melee. My scrubby brother put something funny into perspective for me. (Unitentionally.) He excuses himself from poor performance in Melee by saying that it's clearly an imbalanced game and that he would rather play balanced games like StarCraft.
I began to think, 'Well, that's true, but though every race is seemingly balanced in SC, there are only 3 playable races. Terran, Zerg, and Protoss" Which brought me to think, "SSBM has (depending on your perspective) between 4 and 11 playable characters. In this case "playable" means capable of winning matches at the topmost playing level. I mean the TOP.
Can someone be great with Bowser? Yes.
Can they hope to ride to the top of OC3 with Bowser?
...
Exactly.
Some will say that the only characters that can win in the highest level of play are Fox, Falco, Sheik, and Marth.
Others will say that Peach, Samus, Captain Falcon, Ice Climbers, Jigglypuff, Doctor Mario, and Ganondorf can also compete with the best. I'm too inexperienced to say.
It just made me think, that though every character isn't "playable" in SSBM, even so, it has more playable characters than a game like StarCraft.

Then there's stages. Counterpicked stages can turn the game around in Melee. Stages also fluctuate in favor on StarCraft. Stages, or rather, maps, on StarCraft will favor Terran if they have too much high ground scattered about. A ranged unit shooting up a cliff has (I believe) a 70% chance to hit to unit up the cliff. This affects Photon Cannons and Sunken Colonies.
Can't Zerg and Protoss take advantage of cliffs too? Sure.
But Dragoons, Lurkers, and Hydralisks just don't have the effect or range that Siege tanks utilize to pound whatever area they overlook. Cliffs behind your resources on a stage automatically favor Terran. Siege drops behind the mineral line are deadly, easy, and worth it. This makes the non-terran player on a map like this have to go out of their way to prepare for a tank drop by their resource line.
Another trick that came to mind is how sometimes the minerals are pressed against the border of the map. Protoss can utilize this in the enemies base, in the early game, planting a Pylon at a choke formed between the map edge and minerals, and then place a Photon Cannon behind it, where no Zerglings or Zealots can reach it. Obviously this doesn't work against Terran, but this is a trick you can do really quick, and is possible just because of stage circumstances.
So StarCraft isn't much different than SSBM in that perspective either.

Meh, I tried to point this all out to my brother, but he's still too stubborn to accept it.
Me: "Think about it- there are 11 characters you can choose from and try out that are perfectly successful in competitive tournaments."
Him: "NO! I WANNA BE LINK CUZ HE'S MY FAV AND I ONLY WANNA PLAY AS HIM CUZ HE'S JUST SO COOL AND I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO CHOOSE A CHARACTER THAT I DON'T LIKE JUST CUZ IT IS BETTER CUZ STUPID NINTENDO DIDN'T BALANCE THEIR STUPID GAME AND LINK SUCKS SO BAD ON IT! IT'S A WONDER I'VE BEAT YOU AS MANY TIMES AS I HAVE WITH THIS CRAP CHARACTER! I HOPE THEY FIX ALL THIS IN BRAWL! I'M GONNA KEEP PLAYING LINK FOREVER AGAINST YOU CUZ HE'S THE COOLEST CHARACTER ON MELEE AND I HAVE AN EXCUSE TO LOSE WHEN I PLAY SOMEONE IN THE LOW TIER!" :psycho:

That last part was not said but was there. Yeah, I told him about the tiers and regretted it. I miss the days before my calling that to me and him there were no tiers and for all we knew, Mewtwo was the best character. We both agreed that Roy was cheap, because of course, Roy is just Marth except with Fire added. Ah how naive we were.

Anyway, the way I see it, is that if someone complains about the tiers or imbalance in Melee, they just need to switch their main to one of the top or high tier characters. To complain about balance and justify loss through the tiers, but not be willing to change to the "obviously better characters", that's just stupid.
After all, I finally had to do it.
It took a couple of tournaments, but now I see that I can't hope to get where I want to playing just Zelda. She's fun and great for scrub owning, but she's strictly for friendlies now. Sorry hon, I'm maining your alter ego now.
I find comfort at least, in that I will be able to accidentally transform in a match without thinking, "OhgreatI'mdeadI'mgonnagetraped."

Whoa. Just scrolled up here. Pardon the rant, and thanks for anyone having read it.
 

Ogre_Deity_Link

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Sorry HideousBeing, but as a total LoZ fanboy, I demand that Link gets some time in the spotlight. I refuse to play a character just because he or she is more powerful than everyone. I'll continue playing Link in Melee until the end of time, no matter how many matches it loses me.

:D
 

Drascin

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Well, perfect balance is basically impossible, but wanting your favorite character to be high tier is a perfectly normal desire. We all want to be able to use our faves, but we hate to be owned for it.

I mean, I play Mewtwo, I know what it's like :laugh:

But yeah, if you wanna get into a tourney and win it as opposed to simply play to have fun and get better, then whining about the tiers is going to get you nowhere. You'll have to adapt, sadly, because tier lists are just a reality of fighting games. At least Melee gives you 11 possible options. It isn't rare that only a 30% of the cast in any given game is actually competitive outside of being hard-counters.

But while I more or less agree with you, I'd certainly like to dream they could revamp a bit some of the low-tiers. I mean, someone is always going to be the best, but reduce a bit the distance, if you get what I mean? I'd like to be able to pick Mewtwo without people going "...you serious?" Although, since it's been years since I could play anything other than my friends, who are even worse than I am (which is a very high level of suckitude, mind you -_-u), it doesn't happen much anymore. The point still stands, though.

And @Ogre: **** straight. I have nothing to add. Have a cookie :)
 

Johnknight1

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I'll continue switching mains randomly, like how I went from Kirby, to Link, to Falco, to Roy, and finally to Fox in Melee. In sSB64 I went from Kirby to *sigh* Link, to Captain Falcon, to Mario. I've been all over the place! :laugh: I just go with who feels natural, and I'll probably be smart and have multiple mains this time, lol! :laugh:

Also HideousBeing [good points btw], Miyamoto hired a team for Sakurai that knew Melee inside and out, and i'm willing to bet one of their focuses late in the making of Brawl is tier balance. I could see a good tier balance actually, and Nintendo has said nothing but good about it. Sure Nintendo is making it, but in Reggie's E3 presentation, he basically backslapped Super Mario Sunshine [saying Super Mario Galaxy is the first true sequal and predessesor to Super Mario 64], and uplifted Brawl. I always found that point...very odd. Not sure wat it means, but I felt like throwing it out there.

I'm sure the tiers will be a bit worse, but don't expect overpowered characters like Pikachu and Kirby in SSB64. No, expect lots of not so great characters, like what would be low tier character.s ;) In other words, the mid to top tiers will be very close, while the bottom tiers will be very lowly, maybe even lonely due to lack of players/fanbase. Just a guess and a thought=my two cents. :)
 

Neo-X

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Speaking of mains..mine usually jumps from Link, to Young Link, to Marth, to Roy, to Fox, to Falco, to Zelda once, to Mario, and the last character I mained was probably Samus. AS YOU CAN SEE..I love to switch my mains.
 

Eaode

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Yeah, Well I also hope Brawl is a little more balanced. While around 10 characters is a good enough number, I'd like it to have at least 18 competitively viable characters, especially with around 40 characters.

I have a feeling Ridley is going to suck if he's in :(
 

psicicle

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I just play who feels natural. That generally leads me to playing high tiers, because the lower tiers just feel too weird to me for the most part.

I began playing ness because he was my main in SSB64, but his smashes got nerfed really bad (this is my roll to smash spamming era)

So I switched around until I settled on the ice climbers who had sweet fast smashes.

I secondaried ganon even though I didn't know about l-cancelling.

Then I went on the internet and after watching shined blind I decided to main fox because he looked awesome in the video.

I got decent with fox but now my main is the ice climbers again. I don't really enjoy playing fox because he requires too much techskill and my ganon is roughly the same level and I have more fun playing ganon.

Also, I never play ness, almost everything got nerfed badly.

Hopefully brawl won't have one character that is unbeatable through some unforseen complications. I'm kind of surprised that that didn't happen in melee, what with all of the new stuff found out that probably wasn't playtested.
 

Takeshi245

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I've already stated my reason on why Brawl won't suck. I even reserved it 2 days ago. Well, since Sakurai has balance in mind, the gap between characters won't be that huge. Also, the game looks awesome, and Ike's in it, who's a beast. So....yeah.
 

Shai Hulud

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Just because Ike has a sword doesn't mean he'll be good. Everyone seems to be overlooking this terrible *** character known as "Roy" and instead thinking of Marth...
 

Takeshi245

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Just because Ike has a sword doesn't mean he'll be good. Everyone seems to be overlooking this terrible *** character known as "Roy" and instead thinking of Marth...
If I play that game and Ike turns out he's a really bad character, I'll ditch for a better character. However, if he's good, then sweet. Also, isn't Roy better in his own game than in SSBM?
 

HideousBeing

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I'd like to be able to pick Mewtwo without people going "...you serious?"
I lol at that.

And Ogre Link, that's fine. You either have more dedication than me, don't dream of taking it high, or just haven't been playing long enough to decide that you realistically need to master a higher tier to hold merit in tournaments. You're story is too common. Really. In fact, your situation is just like Dylan's long ago if I recall. Dylan said he was once a never-gonna-let-him-go enthusiast for Link. Of course, he saw the light eventually :] . Funny that Link is the most common character for this scenario, though, I sort of see how that makes sense. Sorry if I'm sounding hostile, I don't mean to. I respect your dedication and stubborness, because of course, that's surely what yielded players like Aniki, Taj, Gimpyfish, and other famous low and bottom tier players.
 
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