Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
A few of the people you listed below me, as well as a few you didn't list at all, are either definitely better than me or have more substantial tournament results.
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Who are the Top 10 Players of 2012?
- Thread starter Ryobeat
- Start date
Jockmaster
Smash Ace
So humble Fly...
ruhtraeel
Smash Ace
I haven't seen Lucien play recently so I dunno how good he is
and I dunno how good Europe is, they would **** us all at PAL
and I dunno how good Europe is, they would **** us all at PAL
GhllieShdeKnife
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Jan 21, 2010
- Messages
- 687
you sir, are incorrect by a large margin. good day
D
Deleted member
Guest
the more you know.
racism seems like such a part of american culture that i'd assumed the rest of the world had just moved on. americans really don't get much of a point of reference concerning racism in other countries. at least not that i know of.
tarheeljks
Smash Lord
off topic: see soccer matches for examples racism outside the usa
so this post is not flagged as spam, lucien is very, very good. has beaten shroomed/sfat recently
so this post is not flagged as spam, lucien is very, very good. has beaten shroomed/sfat recently
Lot of white supremacy coming out of the immigration stuff in Scandinavia recently
On topic, Armada proves once again why he's #1, but anyone who still says he's unbeatable needs to be ***** in a lake of boiling excrement by chimpanzees with barbed phalluses. Forever.
On topic, Armada proves once again why he's #1, but anyone who still says he's unbeatable needs to be ***** in a lake of boiling excrement by chimpanzees with barbed phalluses. Forever.
-ACE-
Gotem City Vigilante
well I was going to say he's unbeatable... but now that you done said THAT...................
lol
edit: PP got this
lol
edit: PP got this
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
1. Mango (fanboy forever)
2. Armada
3. Dr. PeePee
4. Hbox
5. M2K
6. Kirbykaze
7. Unknown522
8. Hax
9. Kage
10. Javi
This is really hard... Anyway, just my opinion, and i couldn't make up my mind after top 5, soooo... Feel free to disaggree.
Oh and on the note of european football, I was in germany during the eurocup this year... When they lost to itally, a bunh of people went and took a **** on a local pizza store. For the next few weeks they ate note ice cream, pizza, or pasta.
Also many germans dislike turkish people, like.. A lot.
I was very surprised because I always viewed racism as a very american thing and I thought it would be significantly less prevelant in European countries, but its definitely still there.
2. Armada
3. Dr. PeePee
4. Hbox
5. M2K
6. Kirbykaze
7. Unknown522
8. Hax
9. Kage
10. Javi
This is really hard... Anyway, just my opinion, and i couldn't make up my mind after top 5, soooo... Feel free to disaggree.
Oh and on the note of european football, I was in germany during the eurocup this year... When they lost to itally, a bunh of people went and took a **** on a local pizza store. For the next few weeks they ate note ice cream, pizza, or pasta.
Also many germans dislike turkish people, like.. A lot.
I was very surprised because I always viewed racism as a very american thing and I thought it would be significantly less prevelant in European countries, but its definitely still there.
Ryobeat
Smash Ace
How would DJ Nintendo rank these days? He;s been winning tournament after tournament in EC, he beat Jman im pretty sure.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
I though jman was basically retired?
-ACE-
Gotem City Vigilante
Jman retired from thinking he had a chance at being a top player is more like it.
Warhawk
Smash Lord
I really don't think Kage should be in the top 10, especially not above Shroomed and Wobbles.
I think there should be a more focused discussion. We already know who the Top 5 are. Mango, Armada, PP, Hbox and M2K are locked in.
Who's the definitive 6th? Can we even tell yet? I would lean toward Shroomed. KK is another candidate. Javi cannot be included because of the poor sample size, so he's off in the smog for now.
Who's the definitive 6th? Can we even tell yet? I would lean toward Shroomed. KK is another candidate. Javi cannot be included because of the poor sample size, so he's off in the smog for now.
Froggy
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2012
- Messages
- 2,448
- 3DS FC
- 3110-7430-0100
The gap between 5th and 6 is large enough that a definitive 6th doesn't really matter. The only player who may be on par with the top 5 is Javi. And we have no idea when we'll see him at a u.s tourney again.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Javi beat one person in the top 5 so he's possibly their level? I call shenanigans. I beat HBox (who did phenomenally at APEX) and Javi outplaced me by all of one spot. And it's pretty clear I'm not the same level as them...
:/
:/
See, what you dont understand KK is that Javi is from Mexico which, unlike Canada, is another country. And being from another country and doing reasonably well at a tournament clearly makes you one of the top players in forever.
think you meant "between 5th and 6". And I say it totally does matter. nyeh.
Your logic is "we don't know much about this guy, so we can assume he's very good"
I would think "we don't know much about this guy, so we can assume nothing" is more logical.
Beating a top 5 player in one set does not grant you possible top 5 player status. We would have to grant Wobbles, Lucky, Fly, Zhu, Amsah, Zgetto, Lovage, PC Chris, Taj, Cactuar, Silent wolf, Jman and Eggs the same status because they have accomplished the same.
D
Deleted member
Guest
i don't think javi is top 5 in the world, but i'd definitely put him in the top 10. he's really, really good.
That said, we shouldn't count Javi out of the running. If he repeated his performance a couple of times (beating m2k/mango/armada/hbox), he'd certainly be top 5 level. From what we've seen, he very well might.
We need more data, is all.
We need more data, is all.
I just wanted to quote myself because I speak the truth. Top 5 for Javi is premature at this point (he only beat one top 5 player!) but top ten is not unfathomable.
I don't understand why there is still debate about javi being in the top ten. He beat, I believe, pp, lovage, and hax (all top ten material), cactuar and vanz (top 15 like material), and Kdj.
To say that Javi does not belong in te current top ten is kind of silly I think. I understand that Javis performance at Apex could very well have been an anomaly, but there is no evidence that is actually was. He beat many strong players and until it is proven otherwise, he is top ten material.
Froggy
Smash Champion
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- 2,448
- 3DS FC
- 3110-7430-0100
The difference between you and Javi is that we know your limitations(at the moment anyways), while we don't know Javi's. You may or may not be a better player than Javi, most people have you right outside their top 5 lists anyways
Sorry for the typo.
I'm not assuming Javi is very good because we don't know him. I'm assuming he's very good because for his performance at Apex. I never said Javi is top 5, just that he is the only player who is potentially at their level. I agree that we should see more of him before rushing to judgment.
And just as a side note, half those players you listed have not accomplished the same.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Man, being from another country is so OP in MD rankings. Like, seriously. Fly Amanita beats HBox and M2K at DGDTJ and loses to like Lucky and Mango I think? And what does he get? A pat on the back. Javi beats a single top level player? Oh my god he's like top 6 material.
Screw you, Melee community. Like, seriously. One top player in a bracket + filler. I've done runs like that before. Taj has done runs like that. Shroomed has done runs like that. So many people have done this crap before.
I dunno. Just makes me scratch my head when people do a run that many others have done before but it counts way more for them.
@ Mow - He's very good. Top 10 is plausible.
@ Froggy - Bend over and I'll show you my limitations.
@ Battlecow - Yes. We need more data.
Screw you, Melee community. Like, seriously. One top player in a bracket + filler. I've done runs like that before. Taj has done runs like that. Shroomed has done runs like that. So many people have done this crap before.
I dunno. Just makes me scratch my head when people do a run that many others have done before but it counts way more for them.
@ Mow - He's very good. Top 10 is plausible.
@ Froggy - Bend over and I'll show you my limitations.
@ Battlecow - Yes. We need more data.
Prince_Abu
Smash Lord
im feelin a kk vs javi mm
A pat on the back? Fly, shroomed, and taj have been considered multiple times in this thread for top ten. No one disputes them potentially being a top ten player.
EDIT: and you are virtually a lock between shroomed and yourself for #6 it seems. How are your guys' accomplishments being slighted?
Double edit: How can you consider who Javi beat outside of pp as "fillers?" That is silly in itself.
EDIT: and you are virtually a lock between shroomed and yourself for #6 it seems. How are your guys' accomplishments being slighted?
Double edit: How can you consider who Javi beat outside of pp as "fillers?" That is silly in itself.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
yo I just posted that list of the top of my head, no real though was put into it.
After KK, I was just pullin' names.
I honestly just wanted to talk about european racism without being completely off topic.
After KK, I was just pullin' names.
I honestly just wanted to talk about european racism without being completely off topic.
unknown522
Some guy
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I'm just saying the community did not jump on the pen1s of Fly, Shroomed, or Taj after they did similar if not better runs at similarly tough tournaments. Nobody said, "Oh my so <so-and-so> is clearly at the level of M2K!" People are actually putting Javi higher than M2K in some of these lists. Like, gimme a break.
One top player + filler. Good filler, mind you, but at least when Armada came over he had the decency to beat 2 (arguably 3) of the 4 top players at the time in one run.
One top player + filler. Good filler, mind you, but at least when Armada came over he had the decency to beat 2 (arguably 3) of the 4 top players at the time in one run.
Yes, putting Javi above anybody in the top five is rather ignorant. Not recognizing Javi's skill as a potential top ten also is.
Max?
Smash Champion
Who cares what the peons think? Anyone who has half a brain knows you're ridiculously good at this game, and most of the people who are making these lists have never been to a ****ing tournament anyway. And in general, screw the community. Bunch of whiny, immature, overweight *******s
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
As a side note, I legitimately thought AesirGod was trolling because he had Kage in a top 10 list so I ignored his list completely for the purpose of this thread 
Europhoria
Smash Lord
IIRC the highest "ranked" player Javi beat besides PP was Lovage, who he also lost a set to in bracket. Or maybe Hax would be higher, whatever. It's no one that I feel Fly/Taj/Shroomed/etc. aren't competitive with, or would have similar sets with.
I also can't help but get the feeling that if M2K didn't forfeit and Javi had to face him instead of Hax he would have gotten 7th and we wouldn't be talking about this at all cause he'd never have placed well at any big tournament.
Screw you people wetting yourself cause he does a lot of multi shines or thinking trying to read a roll makes him top 5.
I also can't help but get the feeling that if M2K didn't forfeit and Javi had to face him instead of Hax he would have gotten 7th and we wouldn't be talking about this at all cause he'd never have placed well at any big tournament.
Screw you people wetting yourself cause he does a lot of multi shines or thinking trying to read a roll makes him top 5.
Jockmaster
Smash Ace
totally agree
thats why I think past the top five its pointless, there are just general gray areas of skill ranking
There's the top 5 (Armada, Mango, PP, HBox, M2K)
Then the people who ALL could fill out the rest of the top ten, which are many players (KK, Shroomed, Wobbles, Fly, Javi, Lucky, Lovage, Hax, S2J, etc etc there are tons)
Then a group just below that, and so on. Putting numbers on people below the top few is pointless and pure conjecture. Any of the players I put in that sub-top 5 group could beat another on any given day I believe, and very possibly knock off one of the top 5, though the odds aren't in their favor
There are still subtiers within that KK, Shroomed, Wobbles, Fly, Javi, Lucky, Lovage, Hax, S2J, Taj etc. group.
Shroomed and KK sit at the top of that pile. I have no idea who the next little clump of 2-4 people would be made up of.
Shroomed and KK sit at the top of that pile. I have no idea who the next little clump of 2-4 people would be made up of.
- Joined
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wobbles is up there
Chroma
Smash Apprentice
KK kind of won the thread. Javi's crazy good (and has been for a long time), but putting him above everyone else contending for the top 10 automatically based off of APEX isn't solid at all.
Taj and Shroomed's runs at Genesis were demonstrably better than Javi's at Apex, even without considering how M2k's forfeit to Hax affected the bracket. I also don't think that Javi had the clearly strongest performance (outside of the very top players) at Apex: Wobbles beat Unknown (who proceeded to murder Losers' before losing to Shroomed for 9th), Darc, and M2k before losing to PP and Hbox. KK beat Eggz, Eggm, MacD (consistently underrated "top 10" player who beat Amsah and Zhu and took 9th) and Hbox before losing to Mango and Hbox in a rematch. There are a lot of strong players who have consistently turned in performances of a comparable caliber at nationals, and it's reasonable to say that Javi's on their level. This is extremely impressive by itself, and we'd need additional data to suggest anything more.
I'd be interested to see what PP thinks of Europe as a whole - they're probably better than their collective tie for 33rd at Apex represents.
Taj and Shroomed's runs at Genesis were demonstrably better than Javi's at Apex, even without considering how M2k's forfeit to Hax affected the bracket. I also don't think that Javi had the clearly strongest performance (outside of the very top players) at Apex: Wobbles beat Unknown (who proceeded to murder Losers' before losing to Shroomed for 9th), Darc, and M2k before losing to PP and Hbox. KK beat Eggz, Eggm, MacD (consistently underrated "top 10" player who beat Amsah and Zhu and took 9th) and Hbox before losing to Mango and Hbox in a rematch. There are a lot of strong players who have consistently turned in performances of a comparable caliber at nationals, and it's reasonable to say that Javi's on their level. This is extremely impressive by itself, and we'd need additional data to suggest anything more.
I'd be interested to see what PP thinks of Europe as a whole - they're probably better than their collective tie for 33rd at Apex represents.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
Yo its totally cool, I'm pretty bad at this game, so feel free to disregard my opinions in terms of melee ^^As a side note, I legitimately thought AesirGod was trolling because he had Kage in a top 10 list so I ignored his list completely for the purpose of this thread
For the bottom I really just needed names though and didn't want to think about it a lot... And Kage is definitely on the top 10 most boss smashers list, soooooo
Divinokage
Smash Legend
I'm that badass, and you know I have defeated certain players considered in those top 10 before. =)As a side note, I legitimately thought AesirGod was trolling because he had Kage in a top 10 list so I ignored his list completely for the purpose of this thread