Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
Ken has played PM and is a fan of it.
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What do the Melee Legends think of P:M?
- Thread starter Wingflier
- Start date
| Kailex |
I smell like salty coins and milk
Pm is slowly taking over melee, bit by bit...
Viceversa96
Banned via Warnings
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2012
- Messages
- 413
We don't need the legendary Melee players because we now are making P:M legends. What do brawl players think? I saw Salem having fun with Zelda.
Anther
Smash Champion
PM got me to start playing all three games again, with Project M being my favorite :D.
I know I'm not a melee legend and all.. but yeh ;x.
I know I'm not a melee legend and all.. but yeh ;x.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2008
- Messages
- 26,545
This so hard lol. I'd love to see high level Melee players develop a character's metagame. We've seen it already with Armada's Pit, Silent Wolf's Wolf, Professor Pro's Snake, various people messing around with Mario, and recently M2K's Mewtwo. It's awesome and really entertaining to see a good player apply their skills to an undeveloped character, but if they don't, others will rise to the occasion, because this game has several things that Melee doesn't. The PM community has gotten by with piggybacking on Melee's for a while now, and there will always be a lot of mingling especially at dual-game tournaments, but since 2.5's release the community has and will continue to grow and gain independence. Low Tier City and Nerd Rage were pretty big PM-only tourneys, and I'm seeing plenty more sprout up in various regions. PM is here to stay and anyone who wants to become a part of it are welcome to do so, but it doesn't hinge on a certain subset of players picking it up.
Viceversa96
Banned via Warnings
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2012
- Messages
- 413
Some people say P:M runs of Melee's steam. Is that true? I'm hoping that it gains it's own hype and tournament scene. Like I know P:M is in tournaments but I would love to see more P:M only tournaments. This is a different game with a lot of potential.
tbh I got into competitive smash b/c someone told me of project m and I thought it was pretty neat
which is to say, project m got me to look at melee, not the other way around
which is to say, project m got me to look at melee, not the other way around
I think a lot of them are waiting for the game to be entirely finished so that balance is finally stable. Most are quite open-minded. I've only met one or two individuals who hated the game at first sight. One of them was pissed because of Falco's Knockback stacking in an earlier build. He did not even listen to me when I told him that it was a known issue in the progress of being fixed. Otherwise, I think they find the game interesting, but I can understand that they would want to wait until matchups are stable.
We certainly could use more feedback, but I understand.
We certainly could use more feedback, but I understand.
Scarlet Bean
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Sep 18, 2013
- Messages
- 193
lol this thread
Papa+Stone
Banned via Administration
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2013
- Messages
- 450
Ken has the biggest biceps Ive ever seen on a smasher, and that is why I respect him. Marth has some nice arms on him as well, like the same size as ken, I wonder if thats why ken plays marth
Nguz95
Smash Lord
Papa+Stone
Banned via Administration
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2013
- Messages
- 450
Is that what black people look like? I have only read about this species
This basically.
The beginning of Smash just ended, the bulk of the history is just beginning. Everyone from new players to Armada understands this and what comes with this if they bother to look at it enough.
Smash is 'known' now. The community is 'stable' now. The things are in place to begin not only a great history, but a dynasty.
The battle against Sauron ended and the people took the ring, lost it in the water, found it and brought there and back again...
Only very recently did anyone realize what the 'Ring' really was, and that the journey only began, the fellowship has only just began uniting...
Edit: After notifications regarding this post, I looked back on it to see it was probably the worst grammar and punctuation, etc, that I've had in a post on the forums in a LONG time...
IT IS THE BEGINNING OF MY DEMISE INTO COMMON-HOOD AWARENESS AMONG THE BRETHRENAND FELLOWSHIP
I have never played against him in tournament.
We did play some friendlis when I was in UK on my way to EVO.
We played 8 friendlis in Snake vs Pit where we both won 4 games each (plus I won once vs his Squirtle but that's not his main).
So nope that is not true. I would like to fight Professor Pro in tournament cause Im sure it would be great matches =D
But not really sure what that is for kind of rumour.
If Professor Pro makes it to the next Beast (not sure when it will be) that can possibly be a chance when we play against each other
We did play some friendlis when I was in UK on my way to EVO.
We played 8 friendlis in Snake vs Pit where we both won 4 games each (plus I won once vs his Squirtle but that's not his main).
So nope that is not true. I would like to fight Professor Pro in tournament cause Im sure it would be great matches =D
But not really sure what that is for kind of rumour.
If Professor Pro makes it to the next Beast (not sure when it will be) that can possibly be a chance when we play against each other
Sixth-Sense
Smash Ace
i'd like to speak my mind on the PM community, and this is coming from a melee player who absolutely loves PM and thinks its the future of the Melee scene and brawl scene.
its been months that i haven't posted anything, and i've just been lurking around everywhere, watching and reading and reading and reading, and i have to say i'm disappointed in the PM community, or better yet, the behavior i've seen the last couple of months have been nothing short of childish and just a general lack of sense
i don't know how to explain it too all of you, but even when people that are part of the top brass like SB tell everyone they are welcome, now i actually feel like i'll get hated on just bc my main is a spacie, i felt welcome, better yet i felt like i was just a demo away from finally migrating to PM for good and actually be part of a new growing community that doesn't have X amount of years already established, I've never felt bad in my small melee community but i feel like i can't contribute to anything in any meta-game and actually become a driving force in my country to lead on new players, it was a different feeling from PM, i feel like all of these new characters and well the game itself has so much untapped potential that maybe i could help out and really change things in the brawl scene where i live.
i've read it everywhere "Melee players hate PM", "all the melee players i've met say PM is ****", "they say PM is just a side-event, a side show for the main event", and "melee players say its not worth it/they can't change sapcies/x character is too broken or isn't smash-like" and "they all say you can't change that bcuz melee"etc.
Where does all this hate come from? It reminds me of brawl players that constantly whine about the melee community hating on brawl 5 years after it was released, and the fact that people just didn't care anymore after the first year and went back to melee, its dumb and just kinda ignorant, the PM community is the bridge between melee and brawl, both type of players from both games are finally coming together in, what i thought, would be a harmonious unification that has been long awaited thanks to this game, but i personally DO NOT feel welcome anymore, i feel like i'm "that" melee guy that still plays melee over PM, and if you guys take Mango as our representative then your just looking for an excuse to whine
Why exactly do you think these people don't play PM like all of you do? Bc they think it sucks? Bc they think its un-smash like? Bc they think that it has to be a carbon copy of maylay? No, its bc the game still hasn't properly emulated the melee engine, it still doesn't feel as fast nor responsive as Melee, theres not that satisfying on-point control that you have over your character, its just not there, so of course melee players still prefer melee over PM. Not only that, i was actually frustrated with lots of them bc they didn't seem to understand that PM is an on-going project, and that hey maybe the next demo to come out it'll feel like melee enough, and that the PM team are focused on balance and emulating melee's incredible engine, while also creating something that is just its on thing, don't get me wrong, the PM devs have made something that is utterly the greatest smash game ever, but as of late i've seen that PM players seem to care more about characters than mechanics and special modes and etc. i would really really really like to use Falcon and falco again the way i use them in melee, not just some strange copies that feel like they've gained several pounds in the wait between melee and brawl.
I'm actually glad Vigilante said what he said, it gave me some hope and well he understands the big why, and its the only reason that i'm posting this bc it feels like i actually have some backup in a place where i started feeling alone.
*sigh* nonetheless, i adore PM, i have mad respect for the PMBR, knowing all of this has been done in their spare time is just mind-blowing, and it seems like every demo is at least 10x better then the last, not only that they just get better and better at balancing while creating a fun a unique character, hell 2.5 was great for like a month, then it just got a little stale with some characters and then i once again went back to melee, then 2.6 came in and i was blown away by what they had done with characters like Link, bowser, lucas, lucario, sonic, DDD etc. not to mention that i was just ****** my head around the fact that they released MK for the first time, and yet he feels perfect and he feels very very fair to use and to fight against, oh and fun too. I'm a guy that has to practice alone in melee, i've got another friend that use to play with me, but he quit melee, but last year his interest in smash reignited after i showed him PM, i bought a Wii just to play it, bc i just had to, and now with 3.0 around the corner, this very same pal of mine has decided to sell his PS2 to but a Wii, and who do i have to thank for that? The PMBR of course and PM itself, i'm gonna help him buy it with any money that is left, my point is what Melee fails to do in so many aspects of keeping people with its characters and balance, it makes up for it with the engine and that fast-paced action, but even then, it seems like melee isn't for everyone, it seems like it wasn't for my friend. But take a look at PM, a brawl mod with melee as an inspiration that lacks the years of community contribution to the respective scene and meta-game, a mod that is still in demo and still has many many many things to work out before going gold, a mod that isn't just as easy as popping a disc in the tray and starting it, and a mod that is in a general community that lacks sponsors of any kind, even with all of that, even with everything that is still left to be done, PM managed to make my friend a smasher, and probably my future training partner
PM is the greatest thing to happen to Smash, and the PMBR is the most professional mod team that i've seen since never, and as such, i hope and wish that the PMBR become examples, role-models of how to treat players from all three games, a neutral team with a clear goal in mind that are unbiased, and i'd like a change in this community regarding the melee hate i've seen the past 3-4 months, and i'd like if the PMBR turn into the reason why the PM community is so friendly and accepting (in the near future i hope)
all in all, just wait, PM will be just as big as CS, and i thank you all for what your doing
For the record, Sixth Sense, I made this thread just to know what the Melee Legends thought of Project M. I didn't want or expect it to turn into a meditation on why we don't need the approval of the Melee vets. I agree with you that even if they don't accept us, we should do our best to accept them.
Let's be honest, we will NEVER perfectly emulate Melee's engine, and also being honest, I don't even know why we would want to. At some point people will have to make a choice. Yes, they can continue playing both games, but they will have to put most of their effort into mastering one game or another. If we are hostile to them now, then when Project M really begins to shine, they'll look back to their negative experiences and want nothing to do with it.
We can't help it if many of the Melee players dislike us, but we can be accepting of them regardless.
Let's be honest, we will NEVER perfectly emulate Melee's engine, and also being honest, I don't even know why we would want to. At some point people will have to make a choice. Yes, they can continue playing both games, but they will have to put most of their effort into mastering one game or another. If we are hostile to them now, then when Project M really begins to shine, they'll look back to their negative experiences and want nothing to do with it.
We can't help it if many of the Melee players dislike us, but we can be accepting of them regardless.
PMS | LEVEL 100 MAGIKARP
Hologram Summer Again
This honestly really annoys me too, especially when people treat the clone engine thread as the smash four speculation threads all over again. I'd rather have current broken mechanics and balance fixed rather than adding new characters or turbo mode or expanded item viability or an improved storyline.
To be frank, I was kind of disappointed in the fact that melee low tiers (especially roy, because he is much less of an individual character than mewtwo is) were added to the game rather than yoshi or samus being ready. I know that programming issues could have prevented them from being released, and also it was probably just more time efficient to please the audience with roy and mewtwo than release unbalanced and incomplete characters. However, mewtwo looks really well done, so I hope that it'll be all good and that project M can transcend beyond the original games it was based off of in the manner of TF2 and CS.
ItalianStallion
Smash Journeyman
I can't remember exactly what thread it was (I think it was a thread in the Melee boards), where Melee players were asked what would get them into PM. This thread was set up very innocently, where the question was designed to gain honest feedback from the Melee players and their mindsets for not putting more time into PM.
Some of the responses were very valid. Some were waiting on their favorite character to be added. Some were waiting on the rest of the engine fixes. Some wanted to wait til it went gold so they could practice it without fearing too many future changes. Some even brought up valid complaints about certain aspects they didn't like, not that I agreed with them, but they were valid complaints nonetheless.
A surprisingly large portion of the responses were quite the opposite. Some were short and to the point with things like, "I will never get into it cuz Melee will always be better." Other responses were more like attacks saying things like "I hope the PM scene dies so it doesn't get in the way of the Melee scene at tournaments." Some even wrote large posts attacking the game for less valid reasoning and many also attacked the PMBR themselves. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I was just explaining why you might find people who are more prone to disliking a large section of the Melee community.
Basically, a significant portion of the Melee community did say they didn't play PM because it sucked, or because it wasn't Melee, etc.
That being said, of course there are plenty of PM board members who could use attitude adjustments. And many also hate on Fox and Falco. Sadly, some extend that hate to Fox and Falco mains. Some may even claim playing Fox and Falco takes little to no skill. These kinds of things would make a spacie main feel unwelcome. And it probably should get toned down.
The way I see things, the space animals will end up getting slightly nerfed/redesigned. They'll probably keep the core game of them intact, but will nerf their unusual power when compared to other cast members (Falco dair, Fox usmash/uair). However, they might also buff them slightly to compensate, like giving them a usable fair. If you are OK with this slight redesign, and you understood that the PMBR would only go through with this if they believed it would make a more balanced and competitive game, then you're not the target of this spacie main hate. Again, I agree the hate shouldn't exist or manifest itself as it does currently.
Though I agree the spacies hate is getting ridiculous, you seem to be purposefully censoring yourself from mentioning how terrible the Melee community has behaved towards other games, too.
Your Brawl example is easily the worst one. It starts with a rhetorical question 'where does all this hate come from', to which everyone seems to know the answer except for you. Do you really think Melee players have stopped hating on Brawl and moved on ? Here's a counterexample. No, the trolls did not move on. There would be no problems if they did. If you want things to get better, be proactive and shut the trolls up in your own community. Only then can you tell others they suck. It's not always the others' fault.
But since people always only remember the last part of a post and you'll think that I'm just a confrontational douchebag, allow me to reiterate.
The spacies hate is getting ridiculous. SB started something which is amazing, the independence of PM from its mold, but at the same time terrible, the hate of PM players from said mold.
As I said, we can't control the way Melee players treat us (or Project M), but we can choose how we treat them.
People don't like change, it's just a fact of human nature. The best way to bring people around is to treat them nicely, even if they won't afford us the same courtesy.
People don't like change, it's just a fact of human nature. The best way to bring people around is to treat them nicely, even if they won't afford us the same courtesy.
By the way, why all the spacies hate anyway?
I don't see them doing disproportionately well in tournaments. In fact, in most P:M events I see, it's JCaesar with Rob just crushing everybody. I don't think I've EVER seen him lose with that character.
Is the "evidence" that these characters too powerful simply anecdotal, or is there some statistical evidence to show that they are better than the rest?
I don't see them doing disproportionately well in tournaments. In fact, in most P:M events I see, it's JCaesar with Rob just crushing everybody. I don't think I've EVER seen him lose with that character.
Is the "evidence" that these characters too powerful simply anecdotal, or is there some statistical evidence to show that they are better than the rest?
DrinkingFood
Smash Hero
SB doesn't like spacies therefore nobody likes spacies
They represent everything bad about melee and SB is still suffering from PTSD of melee DK vs falco
But today for only a five dollar donation to PMBR, you too can help fight post falco depression by funding anti spacie technology
They represent everything bad about melee and SB is still suffering from PTSD of melee DK vs falco
But today for only a five dollar donation to PMBR, you too can help fight post falco depression by funding anti spacie technology
SmashAmass
Smash Journeyman
As a person who trained in Project M, I can safely say it is the perfect medium! Still, it's understandable where Pro-Melee vets would not like it, since it obviously is not as smooth or fast paced yet. At this point though, I think it's crossed a happy medium and will probably be unbelievable in 3.0! I just hope the focus goes towards re-balancing and tweaking current characters and mechanics, rather than fitting the new characters into the roster (or perhaps both).
Sixth-Sense
Smash Ace
I don't think your a douche, but calm down, the 5-6 trolls do not count as the entire community (unless you want it to), there's always gonna be trolls in any community imaginable in any shape or form, i do know the answer and the answer is exaggerated, in the thread that asked "what do you guys think about PM?" i went through the entire thing and was disappointed by the responses, but the majority was basically "it doesn't feel like melee" give any of those haters PM that's nigh-on indistinguishable in feel to melee and if they still complain then that's just them.
Oh and i'd appreciate it if you wouldn't just outright think i'm NOT doing anything to clear things up, i have and will continue in doing so, and for the record, I'm a SMASHER not just a melee player but a SMASHER and you are too, there is no "your community" unless you feel that way, and that's what i've tried to say with PM, they are starting to have attitude problems that make it seem like there not part of smash but a completely independent community.
just saying'
PMS | LEVEL 100 MAGIKARP
Hologram Summer Again
I think most of the melee hate comes from the fact that some P:M players feel as though some members of the melee community are being exceptionally close minded by not playing P:M simply because it's not melee. They feel that melee players who do that are purposely keeping the smash community from advancing, by not supporting P:M. They feel that the melee players are doing this because it benefits them to do so, so they can be at an advantage in the smash community and that they can continue to have success without having to learn a new metagame or play non-spacie characters.
I dunno if that's true, I'm just speculating about their motives.
I dunno if that's true, I'm just speculating about their motives.
Sixth-Sense
Smash Ace
yeah man my bad, but you gotta speak your mind sometimes, and i just had to oh and never ever ever say NEVER, lets reallllly be honest, the clone engine seemed way and i mean WAY more impossible to do than emulate melee's engine, and as far PM is going, each demo feels 10x better than the last in every aspect, hell form 2.5 to 2.6 falcon felt a lot faster and his nair is just almost there to being melee "Yes, they can continue playing both games, but they will have to put most of their effort into mastering one game or another." See, this is the big WHY PM should emulate melee's engine to the point its unnoticeable, bc for example, i for one wouldn't have to alternate between PM falcon and melee falcon at all, it would JUST be PM falcon bc its the same thing, i wouldn't have to switch, i as a open-minded player i wouldn't have to choose one or the other bc PM would be the complete package and several goodies to go with it. This means that i can put all of the effort i put in just spamming tech skill with fox in melee to lucario or lucas or DDD, AND i STILL have the option to use fox and enjoy him the same way i do in melee. well enough, i've said what i wanted to say, and again sorry about dragging your thread into this (not my fault though it turned into that)
\Apples
Smash Journeyman
Dope and Vidjo both like it. I hear Dope's been playing D3 and Vidjo hasn't played a character that isn't ZSS in over 3 months; says he loves her more than his almighty Princess. If he didn't have other ambitions, he said he'd completely come back to Smash just for Project: M.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2008
- Messages
- 26,545
I wish it didn't bleed into like every thread even where it isn't relevant. There's plenty of things to discuss about PM that's unrelated to the spacies or character balance/design, but for whatever reason these days I see it popping up in all kinds of threads for no reason. :/
DrinkingFood
Smash Hero
but you got what you wanted SB
won't be long before we can just remove them from the CSS in total rebellion against melee
won't be long before we can just remove them from the CSS in total rebellion against melee
Mithost
Smash Ace
Asked Dr.PP about Project M on his Reddit Ask Me Anything, this is what he had to say.
You can find it here: http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/c...is_dr_peepee_toplevel_super/cd0wvdd?context=3
DrinkingFood
Smash Hero
Nice to see PP is being rather open minded about it, even if he is hesitant. Might as well count that as one for us as well... P:M has a tendency of not disappointing in the long run.
GamerGuy09
Smash Master
People who don't respect or like Project: M aren't true Smash fans and are afraid of change. Project: M is better than Melee in my opinion because it adds more variety and better balance. Mario and Bowser were in the finals! You couldn't get that in Melee if you even tried. It shows how much they care fro Smash, and are adding brand new characters like Roy and MewTwo to Brawl because of the old smash fans.
Fortress
Smash Master
The only things Spacey-related that I have opinions about, are the Kevins, and Wolf's insane (almost obscene) reach on his F-Smash, plus the fact that I feel like I'm stunned for an eternity when I'm hit by his aerials.
Those are about it. On the whole, the entire cast thus far (spacies and all) is enjoyable to play as and against. If I can take on Falco with Link, then I feel like I'm playing a game I'm more comfortable with. Though, I don't think it'd hurt me to practice Melee every now and again and see what I can't glean from it.
Those are about it. On the whole, the entire cast thus far (spacies and all) is enjoyable to play as and against. If I can take on Falco with Link, then I feel like I'm playing a game I'm more comfortable with. Though, I don't think it'd hurt me to practice Melee every now and again and see what I can't glean from it.
GamerGuy09
^That statement isn't accurate, even for formality's sake.
Being a true smash fan and being afraid of change are related in essentially no way at all.
^That's called an accurate statement.
Edit: Fortress
Wolf F-Smash has a lot of sour-spots and is actually quite obscure to hit with it in a functional way that would make it better than doing almost anything else in that position. It's either worth hitting with the tipper-hit only, for kill purposes/knock-back, or doing something else entirely.
He's also fast, so hit-stun on aerials may seem longer since he can move to the moon and back, and still hit you before you can move at all.
^That statement isn't accurate, even for formality's sake.
Being a true smash fan and being afraid of change are related in essentially no way at all.
^That's called an accurate statement.
Edit: Fortress
Wolf F-Smash has a lot of sour-spots and is actually quite obscure to hit with it in a functional way that would make it better than doing almost anything else in that position. It's either worth hitting with the tipper-hit only, for kill purposes/knock-back, or doing something else entirely.
He's also fast, so hit-stun on aerials may seem longer since he can move to the moon and back, and still hit you before you can move at all.