What do melee falcon players think of PM Falcon?

[Ace55]

Just ask Hax or Scar (or me) how they deal with spacies. you don't see them complaining......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WZn7EZmBskg

First 12 seconds.

I rest my case lol.

 

[MVP]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WZn7EZmBskg

First 12 seconds.

I rest my case lol.

He said
quote: "the hardest thing for falcon is a consistent spacie"

There's soooo many ways this can be interpreted...... but i didn't think he meant

No... no he doesn't. Unless 35-65 at best sounds decent to you.

......

but you do have a point, the matchup is an uphill battle vs TOP level, consistent, spacie players. i do agree on that...

(no aggression meant)

 

[BTmoney]

but you do have a point, the matchup is an uphill battle vs TOP level, consistent, spacie players. i do agree on that...

Mid level falco vs mid level falcon is free lol. I think it gets better at the highest level but it's still a bad, bad MU

 

[Power-Stunna]

I like PM Falcon. nuff said. He combos into anything. lol and the constant 180 turn trick falcon punch is quite amusing. haha. Not to mention the slight armor the falcon punch has. Yeah, I love it. nuff said.

 

[Nguz95]

Project M Cfal is sweet. He looks better, he feels almost the same, and I can do a few new tricks now! Overall, really smooth. Nair feels the same, knee is still awesome, and da pawnch is reversible. Very nice overall.

 

[standardtoaster]

falcon punch doesn't have any armor, power-stunna

 

[Ariyo]

Project M Cfal is sweet. He looks better, he feels almost the same, and I can do a few new tricks now! Overall, really smooth. Nair feels the same, knee is still awesome, and da pawnch is reversible. Very nice overall.

Nair doesn't seem to work for me in P:M. And the knee doesn't seem to kill as easily. Unless my friends just got unusually better at DI...

 

[bryu_1337]

Has anyone considered using the side b to grab the ledge from the stage as a moonwalk replacement? It seems fairly fluid when I do it but you can be hit while falcon is turning around to grab the ledge.

 

[GingaBread]

I feel like a big part of Falcon's supposedly weakened Nair is the sound. Tbh I played a lot more Brawl Falcon than I ever did in melee and I love PM falcon. That being said, going back from melee to PM I have a hard time seeing too much of a difference. The only thing that seems suspect to me is the size of the character model. I feel like he's a little smaller in melee, and that has a lot to do with his timing as far as wavelands, l-cancels, etc. Between that and the extra frame in his sh it makes him feel more tanky and clunky.

 

[GingaBread]

Also is it just me or does PM falcons slide/wd significantly shortly than melee?

 

[Psychoace]

yep moonwalk doesn't go as far.

 

[Nguz95]

I feel like a big part of Falcon's supposedly weakened Nair is the sound. Tbh I played a lot more Brawl Falcon than I ever did in melee and I love PM falcon. That being said, going back from melee to PM I have a hard time seeing too much of a difference. The only thing that seems suspect to me is the size of the character model. I feel like he's a little smaller in melee, and that has a lot to do with his timing as far as wavelands, l-cancels, etc. Between that and the extra frame in his sh it makes him feel more tanky and clunky.

I actually love the extra frame in his short hop. Maybe i'm being a little nooby, but I think the added consistency is a big plus. He definitely doesn't feel clunky to me. He feels pretty much the same.

 

[Spiffykins]

On the topic of Falcon buffs, I have a pretty clear idea of what I'd like to see. 1) Less landing lag after hitting aerial side-b. 2) Slightly less startup on dair. 3) Slightly less aerial (not landing) lag from nair. 4) Frame 2 first jab, possibly. 5) Different Gentleman. Not okay as is imo. 6) Smash64-like up smash.

If the wavedashing/moonwalk/aerial hitbox/etc complaints are legitimate, fixing those should obviously be the #1 priority. Even if it's just general mechanics tuning, Falcon relies on that type of thing more than most characters.

Thoughts? These all seem to me like reasonable buffs.

 

[DMG]

His jab does not need to be better in any way. Nair should not have less aerial lag (if you mean auto cancel window, like how Ganon has a huge window for his Nair) because that would make non FF Nairs a bit too safe for a character that flies that far. If you can SH Nair and not have any lag, it would make flying crossups safer. What he really could use is a maybe better ground game that doesn't involve grabbing. His tilts don't see much use, I'd rather buff that than work on areas where he's already semi godly.

Falcon has a very capable design. It's just not as dominant anymore.

 

[Spiffykins]

I'm not referring to the auto cancel window, I'm talking about the iasa, I suppose. Ex, if you full jump and nair, you could double jump and do another aerial sooner. This would give it a bit more utility than the usual short hop/SHFFL stuff. I've just always felt his nair takes a bit too long to recover from in the air.

His tilts all feel adequate to me. Dtilt is the only one I think could use a buff, I don't see how buffing the other two would really benefit him much unless they were redesigned. He's a highly aerial character already, he might as well stay that way, but I'd make an exception for a better up smash, which would partially patch the gap in his ability to combo/juggle FFers.

Also, I guess Falcon's jab being frame 2 would be pretty silly. As you said, making aerials too safe considering how far he can fling them is unnecessary.

 

[DMG]

If you could jump out of it from a SH approach though, logically it probably wouldn't have any lag from landing if you landed past that DJ window. Ganon in Brawl is like the exception lol

 

[Spiffykins]

I said full jump not SH

 

[Deleted member]

The nair feels a little funky compared to Melee

and I can space better in P:M than Melee

 

[DMG]

Falcon's legs in Melee looked like he was Earl Campbell or some ****. Nair visually looked like a meaty move. In PM his legs almost look scrawny. IDK if there's any actual difference these days but it doesn't "look" right.

 

[BTmoney]

Falcon sucks

 

[Nguz95]

Falcon sucks

Naw, Falcon beez money.
Seriously though, watch Strawhat if you feel like reconsidering Project M Falcon. The man is deadly.

 

[GingaBread]

I feel like 2.6 gave falcon back his moonwalk distance and made him feel faster

 

[DMG]

Yeah I am feeling something in the moonwalk department and it feels good

 

[210stuna]

I'm glad to read all the positive feedback on the new Falcon. I can't wait to edit this post when I try him out at the end of the month

 

[MVP]

2.6 falcon feels much much better than crappy 2.5b falcon

 

[Little Nemo]

I had Alien play (Oregon player) and he and I both agree Falcon is slower. Not just in comparison to other characters but actually slower. Otherwise he liked it. He mainly played other characters, though. Only like five games as Falcon.
Did 2.6 actually drop his running speed?

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I wish he had a better ground game, as of right now he's mostly only viable in the air, which leaves you with few viable moves, which quickly gets boring. Just making his D-Smash and U-Tilt come out faster would be a great improvement to his ground game, as of right now he's even slower than Ganondorf on the ground, which is pretty ridiculous.

 

[NaijaboyIrin]

He needs melee JC grab momentum back.

 

[Little Nemo]

Isn't Falcon mostly being good in aerial combat and Ganondorf being good on the ground make perfecr sense, though? It does to me anyway.
Starting to pick up Cpt. Falcon in Melee. Gonna check out P:M Falcon now that I know the character much better.

 

[GeZ]

Nair is exactly the same. I've made an ass of myself with the developer who figured out the clone engine by saying "but Nair feels different, I think it's different in some way" and having him reply something along the lines of "then your 'feeling it' is wrong. It's exactly the same as melee. We even put two TV's next to each other and ran them at the exact same time and they are exactly the same."

In regards to Falcon in P:M vs Melee, I feel that Melee Falcon could play more aggressively while Project M Falcon has to live in the neutral and get a feel for his opponent and their habits/ options before he dives in. I'm actually more of a fan of this playstyle than his old one as it makes the Falcon player disengage autopilot and really think about what their opponents doing compared to what their doing and how both of them react to each other. Basically I like that it requires/ rewards thought more so, and think he's better as a character because he's forced to do that. The only constraints keeping him from out performing his Melee iteration is the players who play him.

 

[Thor]

Quick note to people talking about CF's JCgrab being shorter - the Falco boards were complaining that Fire Bird was too short (some were saying extend it to Fox length - get real) but because of larger character models some stuff looks shorter but is the same. The best to check for this is dreamland - it LOOKS way smaller but the coders claim to have kept everything on it in terms of its dimensions the same and just resized characters models.

Thus my bet is that the JCG range is the same but CF's bigger model makes it LOOK shorter. Although that's not very helpful since other models are bigger which makes the screen seem like stuff is closer than it is... [This might also explain the moonwalking issues, I noticed the same thing playing Link and somewhat with CF as well.]

If nair is exactly the same and doesn't feel right, buff it somehow - make it "feel" like Melee, whether it's SFX, more damage, more hitstun, something. I love watching CF and all the CF mains talking about how he seems to have been lamed is lame because then I might see fewer CFs since he feels less awesome than he should.

 

[GeZ]

Quick note to people talking about CF's JCgrab being shorter - the Falco boards were complaining that Fire Bird was too short (some were saying extend it to Fox length - get real) but because of larger character models some stuff looks shorter but is the same. The best to check for this is dreamland - it LOOKS way smaller but the coders claim to have kept everything on it in terms of its dimensions the same and just resized characters models.

Thus my bet is that the JCG range is the same but CF's bigger model makes it LOOK shorter. Although that's not very helpful since other models are bigger which makes the screen seem like stuff is closer than it is... [This might also explain the moonwalking issues, I noticed the same thing playing Link and somewhat with CF as well.]

If nair is exactly the same and doesn't feel right, buff it somehow - make it "feel" like Melee, whether it's SFX, more damage, more hitstun, something. I love watching CF and all the CF mains talking about how he seems to have been lamed is lame because then I might see fewer CFs since he feels less awesome than he should.

I think you might be missing the point of the comment about Nair. It's exactly like it is in Melee. It doesn't get more Melee than it currently is.

 

[Thor]

I mean, if people don't like the real thing, fake it? That was my point - Melee version may be unsatisfying, so upgrade it? Then if it's buffed people might be like "Hey it's CF's nair!" Yeah they're wrong but... well I don't care that much, I'm just saying nothing is preventing the coders or whomever from buffing nair some so it seems more Melee-like, despite being less Melee-like. Eh, I'm still really unclear on what I mean, but whatever.

I do understand it is as Melee as can be, though. But if some CF mains drop him, then less CF mains = less CF stream time which is what I said would be lame.

 

[GeZ]

I mean, if people don't like the real thing, fake it? That was my point - Melee version may be unsatisfying, so upgrade it?

The Melee version doesn't need buffs. The move doesn't need buffs. It's already almost too good. I was just clearing up that they're the same as a lot of players complain that it feels different from Melee. As long as it's the same (frame data/ hitboxes) I don't think the move needs any altering. It really does a whole lot already.

 

[Thor]

Oh oops edited while you were quoting (facepalm). But yeah, okay. I mean I'm not that good with CF so it doesn't really affect me too much - I'll stick to reversing falcon punches when I mistime one in teams so that I don't KO my partner (XD).

 

[Crescent Monkey]

If you bother to choose Captain Falcon in teams, and actually post anything about him on these boards, then you like him enough to want to play as him, and are therefore destined to play as him for the rest of your smash career. Drop all your other characters immediately and commence practicing moonwalk

 

[Sixth-Sense]

SO GUYS please tell me how he feels in PM 3.0, does he feel any better? any smoother? oh and falcon kick can be b-reversed now!

 

[GeZ]

SO GUYS please tell me how he feels in PM 3.0, does he feel any better? any smoother? oh and falcon kick can be b-reversed now!

He feels ridiculously smooth now, more even than the change log can account for and I don't know why. It's awesome.

 

[Sixth-Sense]

He feels ridiculously smooth now, more even than the change log can account for and I don't know why. It's awesome.

oh god this is great! thank you so much (can't play at the moment) can't wait to use him

 

[Thamauturge]

Honestly, I'm so used to the buffs that PM gave him that its super hard to go back to Melee Falcon. I'm still proficient with him, but the lack of a super useful Falcon Kick / Raptor Boost completely shifts my playstyle into something else entirely.