What are Peach's bad matchups, and why?

[finalstain]

What are some of Peach's worst matchups, and what exactly makes them bad?

Also, at low %s is it possible to DI out of Peach's dair > uair combos?

 

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Metaknight, Marth, and Game & Watch are Peach's weak match-ups.

 

[Praxis]

I believe Peaches worst matchups are, in this order:

Falco, Game & Watch, Metaknight, Snake, Marth.

I'm not sure how to rate Falco- on paper, Peach destroys him, but with a certain playstyle she can't touch him. It's tough to explain, and I'd actually rather not give it too much publicity. But he's definitely her worst IMO.

Game & Watch, MK, and Snake are IMO 60:40. Marth, depends who you ask- some people put him at neutral, but he seems to be a common problem for Peaches, so I usually list him as a bad matchup.


Peach doesn't have any horrible matchups otherwise. Any other disadvantaged matchups are only slightly so (55:45).

 

[Dark.Pch]

Falco being the worst? No way dude. Cause of those lazors? Just do what I said to do in the other thread about his lazors and its a done deal. Then just fight him like you know how.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Peach doesn't have any horribly bad match ups. There's no hard counter against her and there's not move that screams 'Anti Peach'

...having said that, whilst she doesn't have any horribly bad match ups...she doesn't have that many horribly good match ups either. Most of them (especially when you get to the higher tiers) are even or slightly in favour of Peach/the enemy, meaning you can't just stick an auto-win-move tactic on as you have to work hard to win

 

[Niko_K]

Dark.Pch your cockiness needs to stop.

"Just do what I said to do in the other thread" - What you say is never the only option, and never the only right option. Stop acting like it is. Rationality pl0x.

I think Marth and GnW are Peach's worst match-ups.

This is completely based on spacing, a properly spaced Marth means good luck getting in. Same thing with GnW.

Falco is the least of her worries though. Easily gimped and combo'd by Peach.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Spoiler

Psst Niko...ignore feature remember? D:

Am I safe in saying this then?

I think one of Peach's biggest weaknesses is against characters that can outrange/outspace her. Her longest range move is her Fair but...it's kind of slow

 

[Niko_K]

Her longest ranged moves are

F-Tilt
Jab
D-Tilt

Fair isn't close

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

**** really?

I've always been under the impression it was D:
Woops

 

[Dark.Pch]

Am I safe in saying this then?

I think one of Peach's biggest weaknesses is against characters that can outrange/outspace her. Her longest range move is her Fair but...it's kind of slow

If Range is a problem for Peach against a character, just space and bait.
Thats what I do against Marth. You do not want to rush him. You make the fight easier for Marth. I play defensive against him. Last good Marth I played was at that tournament in VA, this dude is good as hell with Marth, and I played him agressive and got 2 stocked. And I been having trouble with other Marths cause of it. Marth will just all Peach's stuff with up-B out of the shield. That's one big reason you don't rush him. I been playing Marth a lil better now that I don't go all out on him. Thats how you go on about a good Marth.

Falco does not have that much range besides his reflector. His lazors just do as I just said, then if you know how to fight falco in general, then you are good to go. This is how I beat the best falco in N.Y in a tournament match. I also fought his Marth in a tournament match and I beat it by playing Marth as I just said.

G&W now to me (the new way I have been playing) does not bug me anymore. The Bair and Nair you can do out of. I have been doing that to all the G&W players I have been playing. And they are getting so pissed. You have to play him defensive and space like hell. (Yes you can even out space him)

2 things you have to do with Peach. Space or out range the character, or sometimes both. And this all depends on character you are playing. Then figure out if you have to go aggressive or defensive.

Also I can see that fools post, as I said, I am just ignoring him. it is really assuming.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

...I'm not implying it's something I have difficulty with, I'm merely pointing it out. If that was aimed at me, I appreciate your help but if I need help with Marth or Falco or whatever, I will ask thankyou

A combination of range and speed are Peach's issues imo is what I'm saying though. Which is why I think some of her worst match ups could be characters who have faster/longer ranged attacks such as Marth and MK and Snake. She can get around them with clever spacing and Turnip use but nobodies perfect. It seems a common trend that those kind of characters give her a harder time

Oh - to DI out of her Dair, I think you DI up. Then you can jump out/attack with something. I fight a DK who does that. It makes me sad

 

[Dark.Pch]

...I'm not implying it's something I have difficulty with, I'm merely pointing it out. If that was aimed at me, I appreciate your help but if I need help with Marth or Falco or whatever, I will ask thankyou

A combination of range and speed are Peach's issues imo is what I'm saying though. Which is why I think some of her worst match ups could be characters who have faster/longer ranged attacks such as Marth and MK and Snake. She can get around them with clever spacing and Turnip use but nobodies perfect. It seems a common trend that those kind of characters give her a harder time

Oh - to DI out of her Dair, I think you DI up. Then you can jump out/attack with something. I fight a DK who does that. It makes me sad

My post was about spacing and range against a character(s). It was not really directed to help you.

And usually the problem could be that she can't kill them well. Like check this out.

DK is heavy And wont Die so easy. So you are like "damm" And he is stronger than you are and can kill you well. But Look at this.

- You can rack up damage on him quick.

- out space him.

- options for approaching

- pressure him.

- Play him agressive or defensive *most important in my opinion*

This is how that Match up goes. Dispite 2 problems you can have with DK, look at what you can do about it. I usually look at it like this against other characters.

Snake is Not that good for her cause he can kill you well. And he is hard to K.O unless you gimp him. Also, he can make it really hard to get inside him. And All of his attacks (not included B moves) can kill you. Also he has great field control. He can take over the stage and still get at you, so you have to worry about his field set up as well as snake killing you in general or just fighting him. Now you already know what you can do to snake.

Meta is bad cause........Ha ha ha, I dont even think I have to explain this one. but just in case:
He beats you in the air, nuff said. And I believe he has more priority than you do. Can edgeguard you for days. And even though his has short range, his attacks are fast. so a good spaced meta will be hard to touch. And of course can combo and follow up well, even to death.

And Yea you DI up, I do it all the time when I fight Peach

 

[SleeplessInKyoto]

For me the worst matchups have been Metaknight, Snake and Game and Watch. This purely comes down to their ability to combat float very well, and having KO moves that will kill Peach at very early %.

Certain moves like Snake's U-Tilt can KO and combat float very effectively. Snake biggest problem is not his mindgames, but just his KO power. Peach can combat Snake's projectiles very easily with float, toad and her second jump, but because Snake can KO without batting an eyelid, it makes it a tough matchup. That, and he's the 3rd heaviest character in the game. Up-Smash and Cypher Gimping are definitely more handy here than F-Air.

Metaknight is ....well no explanation needed there. He's just Metaknight.

And Game and Watch, his turtle is ****ing annoying and so is his lagless, incredibly powerful smashes. That and the fact that he has such a good recovery.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

1) Game and Watch
2) Falco
3) Metaknight

Just because I consider Metaknight her third worst matchup doesn't mean I don't find mid level Metaknight's pretty easy to fight. But top level metaknights - Peach has, like, no approaches.

I don't find Marth hard at all. A personal strength more than character though. I guess I'd rate him at 4th just judging from how Peach in general does versus him. You can punish him easily for up b's ing out of shield by rolling as soon as you land. You'll dodge his UP B and punish him with any move you want.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Just because I consider Metaknight her third worst matchup doesn't mean I don't find mid level Metaknight's pretty easy to fight. But top level metaknights - Peach has, like, no approaches.

And this is why you are not suppose to approach metaknight in the first place. When I fight, I don't approach him. I let him come to me, and on his way to me, I can get like maybe 15-20% off him on turnips alone. Letting him come to you is the correct and safest/smartest way to fight him. Then get you spacing out there. You have more range then him. Then of course smart playing/mindgames nedd to take place.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I let him come to me too, but sometimes they will decide not to come to you. The Metaknight's I face just catch, f-air, up air, or f-tilt the turnips if I decide to turnip without approaching. If I decide to turnip and approach they UP b from the ground and the invincibility frames take care of the turnip and hit me at the same time.

Peach doesn't have more range the MK. MK's retreating back airs and retreating f-airs are wayyyy too much range for Peach to beat unless she predicts him fully. Peach has to predict and be steps ahead of MK to win the match, and that's why its one of her tougher matchups.

I'm not saying it's a one sided match, I'm saying its one of her tougher matchups since she indeed doesn't have an approach. Most characters she fights she can camp with turnips AND have approaches, making them easier matchups as she has more options.

 

[Dark.Pch]

I let him come to me too, but sometimes they will decide not to come to you. The Metaknight's I face just catch, f-air, up air, or f-tilt the turnips if I decide to turnip without approaching. If I decide to turnip and approach they UP b from the ground and the invincibility frames take care of the turnip and hit me at the same time.

Peach doesn't have more range the MK. MK's retreating back airs and retreating f-airs are wayyyy too much range for Peach to beat unless she predicts him fully. Peach has to predict and be steps ahead of MK to win the match, and that's why its one of her tougher matchups.

I'm not saying it's a one sided match, I'm saying its one of her tougher matchups since she indeed doesn't have an approach. Most characters she fights she can camp with turnips AND have approaches, making them easier matchups as she has more options.

If meta wants to play the "come to me" game, what I do is pinn him to a corner. (won't be hard, he is waiting for you to go to him) Toss a turnip, and wait for him to react to it then take it from there. Or follow up with something good. Or just have him in the corner and move back a lil while you get him with turnips. he has to get you to stop, and how? By going to you.

Also, you do have more Range than him. One thing people don't know that His fair air has invincibility frames or high priority. I would have to ask NinjaLink about this for I forget excatly what is was with his Fair. i forgot but with this, you can't touch meta from the front. his sword nearly covers his whole body. thats why it is hard to compete with his Fair and bair. But I have a few times clap Meta out of his Fair with mines. Its a weird angle you have to hit him. you cant aim straight for it.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

What if he reacts with a short hop up air? (To counteract the turnip) That moves comes out and ends so fast you can't punish him for using it. I do these things that you're saying, but what I'm saying is that because I have to resort to these kind of strategies, I consider it more of a tough matchup than most matchup sin the game where you can use these stategies and way more.

 

[TreK]

Nah it's bc his sword don't clash with any attack and the more ranged always win (and mk is like in 9/10 situations the one who wins <_<)

Vs MK... I switch characters because Peach is my 4th and i play Diddy and Yoshi... Sry i can't help much here xD

 

[Dark.Pch]

Oh don't worry, I agree when you say it is her tuffest fight. What what you have to do to beat meta shows it.

Also if he shirt hops Fair, I try to aim for his head. or wait till the fair is about to end then snipe him. But with his Fair, you are not suppose to aim at the attack and try to beat it onless you run, jump to him and told since fair is one of his most common approaches.

 

[Praxis]

Falco being the worst? No way dude. Cause of those lazors? Just do what I said to do in the other thread about his lazors and its a done deal. Then just fight him like you know how.

Falco is the least of her worries though. Easily gimped and combo'd by Peach.

I disagree- Falco can camp the heck out of Peach, and has ways to beat your approaches that get past the camping.

And Edrees'll back this.

Aggressive Falcos, meanwhile, are cake. You can combo the crap out of them, gimp them the moment they're offstage, and all in all **** them horribly.

Now that I'm thinking about it, though, I think G&W's worse than Falco. So I'd say:
G&W, Falco, Metaknight, Snake, Marth.

The great thing about Peach though is that none of these matchups are bad enough that you can't simply rely on being good enough to overcome them. I know the G&W and Snake matchup very well, and I'm not that scared of them. Marth, on the other hand...I still need work.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Dude you really letting camping get to you. this is how I was when I could not beat falcos, and that reason was due to his camping. Then I learned how to deal with it and now it does not bother me.Run under the air shot and power shield the ground hot to a dash out of your shield to get close.

If you are seriously letting that one thing the to you, then I am gonna assume you can't fight Falco in general. or you let his camping annoy and get to you that you don't think straight. And I would also assume that your ground game is bad since Falco cuts that off. Falco should be ranked low out of all her hard match ups.

 

[Praxis]

You assume way too much, Dark.
A Falco who camps gives me a hard time, but it's not THAT horrible. You'll note that I claim Peach's worst matchup is a 60:40. I don't think it's unwinnable, just that a campy Falco is either her worst or second worst matchup.

Considering Edrees lost to Nyjin recently, I don't think that's an absolutely preposterous claim to make.
I'm also pretty sure that were it Edrees making the statement, you wouldn't be replying to him with assumptions about his game being bad.

 

[Dark.Pch]

I am telling you that the match up is not as bad as you think. And what I think is that you need to work on your ground game or that is your main problem.

Also when you claim a match up is bad, you should should it is bad for YOU. Thats why I commented on you post.

Also this is a debate. I don't care who one is, If I feel something is wrong I will speak on about it. even for edrees when we just talked about Metaknight.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

Actually Praxis, I don't think its as bad as I used to think. I spent 3 hours practicing with multiple Falcos the other day and learned a ton. The camping isn't the be all end all..but it does compromise your approaches and makes them way limited compared to against most characters. I still think it's a tough matchup against really really good Falcos, but I think my loss was due to matchup inexperience more than anything. IT's one of those matchups that seem more one sided than they really are if you don't know the matchup, but knowing it very well closes the gap a lot more than in other matchups.

 

[Praxis]

Unfortunately, I haven't had the opportunity to actually fight a Falco in a couple of months xD WA has two Falco's- a campy one, who is #19 on PR, and an aggressive one (who is also the best MK) who is #1 on PR.

The #19 one would give me more trouble (though, I kill him EVERY TIME I get him offstage, because his recovery is predictable, so I still win xD).

I haven't fought either since...late October? So it's quite possible that it would get a lot easier with matchup experience. I've stuck to the older opinion due to seeing what happened with Nyjin and Edrees, but if you think it's not that bad...I'll concede the debate easily.

So, worst matchup Game & Watch, second worst matchup Metaknight, neither of these worse than 60-40? This sound fair?

 

[Dark.Pch]

For me I would put Meta first then G&W. G&W was a problem for me a month ago when I was losing to him. Then the week I was banned I changed my style.( Which I am still working on but loving it, dammit I need a tournament now!) And I can handle him much better. Then I found out and learned how to DI out of his Nair and bair. I break out of it 90% of the time if I react quick enough. And when I DI out of his bair air, I hit counter him with my bair.

So with those 2 attacks out of the way, this match is less stressful. Also something else I learned the week I was banned. G&W Dsmash. You know how it launches you Up or to the sides? I figured out why. If you are close to him, like in his face, His Dsmash will send you to the sides. If you get hit with the hammer part or the tip of the attack, it will launch you in the air. But you can live longer then you expected from his Dsmash. As soon as you get Dsmash or sense one comming when you are close to him, Hold down. You will hit the floor and slide on it. This will reduce the speed you get launched and you will live longer. And if you have good timing, you can tech his Dsmash when you hit the floor. and you won't die from it or ever slide off the stage.

As for his Fsmash and upsmash......yea, screwed. Just DI like you usually would.

 

[Niko_K]

You suck. Badly.

 

[PrepareYourself]

You suck. Badly.

lol? wtf is with the Peach boards today...

 

[Niko_K]

MK is far from Peach's worst match-up. Praxis is ****** Dark.Pch in this debate and what does he resort to? Ignorantly telling Praxis that his ground game is no good and starts throwing him pointers.

What the hell is wrong with you Dark.Pch? Praxis is the top peach in NW US and you're trying to give him pointers because you think you're superior? Ridiculous.

Peach's Hardest Matchups:

GnW/Marth
Wolf/Kirby
MK/Snake/D3

 

[Praxis]

GnW/Marth
Wolf/Kirby
MK/Snake/D3

Wut?

10wuts

 

[Kamikaze*]

MK.

Shuttle Loop > float

 

[Praxis]

MK.

Shuttle Loop > float

Dair spaced directly above > Shuttle loop.

 

[Niko_K]

Same with Bair and Nair.

 

[PaintedGhost]

Wut?

10wuts

I agree. Wut?

I guess I can sort-of see what you're getting at with Kirby. He has a good Air game, multiple jumps, small. However I can't see him being a hard match-up.

 

[Niko_K]

You live in Toronto? Come down to Niagara and play against Percon

 

[Dark.Pch]

I agree. Wut?

I guess I can sort-of see what you're getting at with Kirby. He has a good Air game, multiple jumps, small. However I can't see him being a hard match-up.

The match up with Peach and kirby are even. When I played Chu Dat in tournamen, I was doing just fine. I got a stock off him then he took one off. after that I was just getting at him and took his stock off. I was at maybe 50 % percent with 2 stocks to his like 30% on his last stock. Then somehow I SD. after that I lost lost it and then I fell for an obvious kirbycide.

Me and chu even talked about this when he was driving me back to the station in VA. Its even and I was doing just fine against chu until I choked. the crap that they can do to each other makes it even.

 

[hiROI]

I dont seem to have a problem with GnW when I am playing as Peach. My friend tends to spam bair and nair, but with correct spacing, I manage to not get hit. and with his smashes, i usually float and fair or dair when he completes launching the attack. but i just might be to used to his play style XD

 

[slikvik]

G&W ***** peach dark pch. sorry...you may have gotten better at the match-up but it doesn't change the fact that peach can't combo G&W or approach him in the air. This is only not true if the G&W sucks or just messes up. As a G&W player, if i see someone SDIing my bairs now, I just pull back. I don't see people SDIing out of nairs though.

 

[Dark.Pch]

G&W ***** peach dark pch. sorry...you may have gotten better at the match-up but it doesn't change the fact that peach can't combo G&W or approach him in the air. This is only not true if the G&W sucks or just messes up. As a G&W player, if i see someone SDIing my bairs now, I just pull back. I don't see people SDIing out of nairs though.

People are getting me confused. I never said G&W does not get at Peach. Also, with his bair, Nair and Fair, why would I try to go head on with him in the air? Its the same concept as Marth.. Though I have clapped him out of His Fair with mine and my Bair.

Also if you Pull back while I SDI out of it, better off for me, you can't follow up with anything and I don't get sent out of the stage and we start all over again on approaching. And those 2 moves are usually his main setups for ****. Now with DI out of this, his set up won't be much affective.

And I have been SDIing out of Nairs now. And he can't follow up with much once I get out, cause he is still in his Nair animation and I have already broken free. Then again I can abuse him nether once I break out. But just as his bair, it's good for me cause you get nothing to follow up out of it and the approaching starts all over.

Also, don't get it twisted. Just because I got better at this match up now, does not mean, its light work. it's just less of a struggle now and that character puts no fear in me what so ever as broken as he is..